From the Froums

From the Forums: Internet Explorer 90s commercial and Microsoft's potential downfall?

Welcome to another Windows Phone Central From the Forums where we bring you the latest discussions that are happening on our community forum. If you've somehow been too busy in life to be checking the community out on a daily basis, you may find yourself being out of the loop when it comes to discussing the latest news. So what's been happening the past few days?

Forum member AdalLS has brought to the attention a Forbes opinion piece, written by Adam Hartung. The article goes into the negatives surrounding Microsoft and its performance. Taking into account numerous sources, it's a definite downer and is perfect for reading on a rainy day. A short snippet of the opening paragraph:

"Microsoft needed a great Christmas season. After years of product stagnation, and a big market shift toward mobile devices from PCs, Microsoft’s future relied on the company seeing customers demonstrate they were ready to jump in heavily for Windows8 products – including the new Surface tablet. But that did not happen."

Now whatever you may feel about the author, website or sources used in the editorial, it definitely sparks up the debate on "what if?" What if Microsoft did go down a down spiral path of self-destruction? It's a difficult thought to process - a world without Microsoft. An impossibility? 

So is this really the end of Microsoft, or the beginning of the company's downfall? Add your thoughts and opinions in the "Forbes heralds the end of times for Microsoft" thread.

Microsoft needs to watch out for RIM

BlackBerry 10 is shortly upon us and Microsoft is already struggling to gain traction in the industry, so what's going to happen when RIM hits back? Forum member jjmurphy believes Microsoft should focus on improving relations with developers. Both those already established on the platform and who have yet to submit an app.

A number of suggestions on how the company can quickly improve things have been provided:

  1. Make submitting apps free for the rest of 2013, including the tools necessary to build them.
  2. Change the marketplace to hide 1-2 star apps unless the end user requests to see them. (setting a review threshold that apps have to receive before filters kick in.)
  3. Change the marketplace to really promote 4-5 star high quality apps.
  4. Set a monetary pay off system. i.e. If you have an app that stays 4 stars for x-months, give a bonus. Make it a scale so that developers will want to keep adding value to an app.
  5. Fix their own apps. FB, Photosynth, etc. 

Be sure to add your suggestions of what you want to see Microsoft do for developers in the "Microsoft needs to pay attention to RIM in regards to developers" thread.

Miscellaneous: humorous 90s Internet Explorer 10 commercial

Our own Krystea has embedded this pretty humorous Internet Explorer 10 commercial on the forum, which sees Microsoft recap on everything that rocked back in the 90s. It's also a really well put together advertisement. How does one feel about IE now we're on Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8?

You can check out the discussion in the "Nostalgic IE10 commercial" thread. Care to relive your 90s moments and memories?


Reader comments

From the Forums: Internet Explorer 90s commercial and Microsoft's potential downfall?


Only people totally ignorant of how vital Microsoft is to corporate America would think about Microsoft's downfall caused by all this hoopla about Windows 8 devices. Microsoft is pretty much too big to fail.

While that is true, it still doesn't mean they should give up and drop the ball on us and not take care of an essential piece of an everyday device: MUSIC and SYNC.

For some, including my self, it's very important.
I want to eventually stop using my 80GB Zune and be able to play music I bought with my own hard earned cash, on my phone. But that's just completely impossible. And the longer they make me wait, the more I feel that they just don't care for me as a consumer of their products.

I feel betrayed.

How exactly did you do that? And did the music actually play?

I'm on XP @ work and home, There is no way for any of the music to play on my 920 at all. Unless I go and convert everything into mp3, but that just creates 3 copies of each song. That's over 32Gb of music that I would have to convert.

I tried transfering the music manually, although it is saved on my 920, xbox music will not recognize it, and neither would Nokia music.

About Microsoft's downfall. I doubt it will continue because everyday I keep having people tell me that they really want a surface or a windows phone because of its beauty , some are even giving up their iPhones for one

I don't think Android is ever going anywhere, but I do believe Android and WP will be the 2 major players in the mobile world. Apple will fall to a close 3rd unless they really turn things around and pump out something innovative instead of just making evolitionary changes to an aging OS.
RIM might not be completely dead either for that matter, but they will definitely be relegated to a niche market.
Nokia was a great powerhouse, then hit a slump. Now they are turning things around and gaining back some momentum. I truly am looking forward to the future of the mobile world. Right now we are so far ahead of where we were just a few years ago.

I don't think Microsoft will vanish. They are a vital part to businesses around the world. No one is as established and set in stone in the business area than Microsoft.

I don't understand what your telling me. Are you saying Microsoft is too big to go anywhere? Or are you telling me that Microsoft is replaceable, because your. comment kind of contradicts.

I believe the first line was probably sarcasm as no business will (probably ever) be using an android server, makes no sense as they get everything they need from Linux alone and Android would just be malware on top. ... just a guess though

Uh... The majority of servers on the web do run on Linux. Not sure what you're getting at... Parts of MSFT run on Linux servers too.

Not all servers are webservers.  We have file sharing, SharePoint, media, backup, etc. servers.
Also, we do quite a bit of .NET development.  We tried, again, in Q4/2012 running our solutions on Linux with Mono (openSUSE and Ubuntu), but it just wasn't practical from our business standpoint (we are still pondering moving the PostgreSQL databases onto Linux -- but do we want to break up our homongenous environment for two servers?).
Could I find a replacement for each MS product we use?  Sure -- but for our business, the interoptibility between the MS's products we use is unmatched.

I am finding that a lot of people don't know about the /s.  They get all mad until I explain it; then I punch them in the back of their heads to drive the point home.

I've never heard of that either. Try :)

Edit: looks like WPC cuts all HTML tags rather than converting them to entities like they should. I now see why you use /s here.

Lol.  Irony punctuation still hasn't caught on with the masses -- and there are several types of the punctuation, which doesn't help with the uptake.  When I first learned about them, I went to Wikipedia to learn more since the standard seems de facto -- my summary from the wiki:
It is common in online conversation among computer specialists to use a pseudo-HTML element: <sarcasm></sarcasm>. Many times, the opening tag is omitted, due to the HTML tagging often being an afterthought. Similarly, and common in social-news-based sites, is a single /s placed at the end of a comment to indicate a sarcastic tone for the preceding text. "Rolling eyes" and ":P" emoticons are often used as well, particularly in instant messaging, while a Twitter-style hashtag, #sarcasm, is also gaining currency.
I use "/s" since it is short and easy to reach.

Hmm, fortunes changes quickly in the consumer world. Microsoft should focus on enterprise, and they are less likely to fail

Ok... just know that people said very similar shit when the first XBox came out... it couldn't compete, it wasn't selling as well as the PS2 (at the time) Lord knows it couldn't compete with Nintendo, it'll never take off in Japan, etc.
Low-n-behold, what has heppened?
Most people are about as short sighted as the average gold fish and want to see MS fail so they can say, "Iknew it!". But there's a reason you're sitting behind your keyboard typing about them, and they are making billions of dollars.

They said the same thing about Android too. no way could it compete with the iPhone. They said Apple would hold onto number 1 and couldn't see any other company able to compete with it...then cake Samsung. Now carriers don't want to bring in too many ATIV phones from Samsung for fears that one company will hold all the power again, like apple. Microsoft isn't going away, and neither is Windows 8, WP8, XBOX.

The demise of Microsoft is the wishful thinking of those who are trying to steer the weak minded to iAnything products. Why the hell are those who don't like Microsoft keep on commenting on Microsoft. This $*?t is getting old.

"Make submitting apps free for the rest of 2013, including the tools necessary to build them."
^This x 1000000000000.
Also, the tools necessary to build apps are already free (always have been far as I can remember)

Microsoft needs to do a better job at showing how good Windows 8 & Windows Phone 8 really is. Show how everyday people are using the platforms. I hate to see IOS and Android (which is a cheap knock of IOS) commercials showing the different uses of their os. I would do a commercial with some of the more dedicated WP and Surface users using it in everyday functions such as updating Facebook and Twitter, showing how secure Outlook really is for enterprise (similar to the Samsung ATIV commercial) and finally the need to get moving on the apps. Without good apps, then yeah I can see the platforms dying off.

Yes the samsung ATIV commercial is exactly what corporate understand how such product is good for enterprise.

Actually in France, the promotional campaign for WP8 is not as strong than the one Samsung did for the launch of Galaxy SIII.

I agree. Maybe we all should send Microsoft suggestions of our ideas for better marketing. One thing they have done is to use Microsoft products on Hawaii 5-0.

The Cam Newton commercials were pretty good I thought. The Verizon ones also in that they showed how use live tiles.
Would like to know how much response those commercials got.

Get the free Microsoft's YouTube app from the Marketplace. Contrary to popular belief it's not only a "website wrapper". Installing it enables your WP to play youtube videos started from links in the WPCentral app.

Yeah I have that, I watch YouTube videos via the app all the time, this is the first time I haven't been able to watch actually. Also tried to view after launch it through the browser, but that didn't work either.

Everyone that checks out my Surface and 920 love them but act like they've never heard of the devices. I guess they are living in a cave.

I feel older than I already do lol after seeing that. Anyway, MS SQL Server is very dominant in mid-size companies, what would our office do without Excel or Access would be pitiful, the article is a bunch of spin, they are not reliant on just two products for a disproportionate amount of their sales like certain valuable competitors, or even one product like a "Do No Evil" company.

I think it is time to changes Google's slogan... Simply due to the ridiculous attacks against Windows Phone 8 with YouTube, Google maps, calander/ contact support, refusal to build apps, etc... I had serious respect for Google and used their services until this ridiculous hatred against Microsoft.... They are stooping too low for me....

Slick ad my only complaint is that they should of added Windows Phone and Xbox 360 at the end.
About MS downfall... Come on guys Windows 8, Phone 8 are all brand new give it some time not everybody is going to buy into it right away. If MS kills it with the Surface line this year you can expect bigger sales Q4 2013.
WP8 and developers. I agree MS should cough up $$ lets see what happens.

That's my Gen as well and they got so many of the things I remember from my childhood. Pogs, Lisa Frank folders, L.A. Gear light-up shoes, neon fanny packs...sigh, those were good times. Did they show a Trapper Keeper, i can't remember if they did.

Its a very sad state of affairs when people have nothing better to than to try their hardest to destroy a company especially when the company has just freshened all their main products and is building momentum in sales for some of them yes it is taking longer but the figures will show an upward trend of adoption plus people on this forum that have a windows phone maybe
the time is right for windows 8 and surface pro purchases the more successful those are the more successful windows phone will be give Microsoft some of our support like they have for us in the IT industry and also everyone that has a job that uses an ms pc/laptop etc

I LOVE THE 90s THE BEST COMMERCIAL EVER I'm 24 yrs old so the 90s was my life all those things I remember like it was yesterday :D

Cool ad. Does bring back some memories (especially the pogs and trolls). Instagram and Facebook pokes were funny. Though not sure that helps in attracting those apps (more Instagram as we have an "official" FB one).

As for MS, I really hope things work out for their vision. I think they are on the right track. But there does seem to be something that isn't clicking with the masses (and I'm committed to this WP for the next two years). I just know there have been other brands entrenched in the culture in the past and due to changing times, that didn't matter and no longer exist.

I think MS is on the cusp of a new golden era, like when Win95 first came out. So people I know love the gear.... If you build it they will come

I actually had the pog maker. Made a s#$t load of them. Got them taken away by my social studies teacher. He never gave them back

Google- Microsoft. Because No F'ing way you searched for anything on a Mac In the 90's(up until '07 for that matter)
Games- Microsoft
Flight Sim- Microsoft

Forbes- Is....RETARDED

Superbowl commercial guarenteed. This + Superbowl means a lot of attention for Microsoft from the most important generation for their products.

Microsoft May remain but they're making ridiculous decisions, e.g. overpricing their products wwhen Google sells inexpensive products MS will be putting up the price of Win 8 soon... Customer loyalty is not very important to them either (killing WinMobile without upgrading it and doing the same basically to WinPhone 7, denying the newest DirectX, MS Office and IE to those who run their older OS's). They seem to forget that a happy customer is a returning customer and look at that meagre 2.5% marketshare in smartphones... They did all they could to be so insignificant in that sector and will probably keep on making similar mistakes - look at the ridiculous 1 gran for a toy that is aging fast, namely their beefed up surface tablet...

Same old song and dance with you my friend, Hit The Lights, Breathing Underwater or whatever you're calling yourself this month.

It's only overpriced to you and others because so many people expect everything to be free. They charged $40 bucks to upgrade to Windows 8 and $70 to buy the physical copy which included 5 licenses for the past few months, what more do you want? And please stop the endless whining about upgrades to your phone. Apple gets away with it with it because they keep putting out the same OS with software tweaks every year. Google is a joke about upgrades unless it's a Nexus, and being able to flash your phone doesn't count because because the average consumer doesn't understand the concept. And MS just did two major shifts in their phone OS in the past 2-3 years that would have required them to completely reset everyone's phones to get a new OS on them which I guarantee you would not be a fun time for most people.

That's a great promotional video...really fantastic and beautifully made. It really has potential to just "connect" with people in a way that Microsoft has not been able to do with previous marketing; I hope they turn it into an actual TV commercial and air it widely.

I am a devoted Microsoft fan and throughout the past few years I showed my devotion to the company and the brands by buying MS products, using MS services, ditching Gmail for Hotmail just to name a few.
Yet, at the end of this month, I HAVE TO buy a tablet computer. I'm a teacher and in order to continue my self education and to meet the needs of the children I educate I simply have to buy an affordable tablet computer. I stretched it out as long as I could, hoping the surface will somehow magically appear here in my country (Hungary) or nearby or perhaps a future release date announcment will be made at least... and this is not about legal issues, it is simply marketing. So I am sad to say, that the end of this month, I will be forced to buy an iPad.
Let noone be fooled, I am an Xbox Ambassador, a proud Lumia 820 owner, a heavy gamer and a long time Windows Beta Tester. But if Microsoft continues its attitude towards marketing and cunsumer relations, its going to start losing people. People as dedicated and as worried about the future of the ecosystem as myself.

Apple have the education market wrapped up with the iPad. Their interactive educational textbooks are leagues ahead of anyone else. It's not about specs and features sometimes. The iPad has a much better screen than the surface anyway. I would like both of course :)

Why in the world would you buy an ipad? Its true that is hard to get hold of a surface but surely you can get another windows 8/windows rt tablet in hungary?And they will be much more usefull to you as a teacher than an ipad ever will

Can't see a reason why wouldn't there be any resellers in Hungary being able to sell you a Surface shipped from UK or imported from the US. The only problem may be limited touch cover availability. Here in Poland you can only get a black one bundled with the Surface, nobody seems to import the coloured ones which MS sells seperately. My US-layout Surface with Touch Cover cost over $800 with taxes, but it's still cheaper and better than an ipad.

If you want a decent tablet how about the Asus Vivotab (not the rt one)? My parents just got two and I played around with it, it's a pretty good tablet and it runs $499, has NFC, a decent back camera (better than my Surface), I believe it has about 64 gigs, and a host of other goodies.

Hey, you raised several excellent points there, so let me just reply to these one by one in a few sentences:
@gilesjuk Apple's education programme is definitely something to watch out for, but I mostly want to create cross platform experiences in HTML 5 and for this a Surface tablet would be an excellent option. But I guess Safari would work just fine as well.
@Dare2Blink Both iPad and Windows 8 tablets have their advantages, but for now the only tablet available here is the ASUS Vivo Tab. Despite my hopes I have found this tablet too expensive for my current budget, it costs roughtly $860 whereas the iPad is $630. Take this and the occasional performance issues the ASUS is suffering from (several reviews mentioned this and I have also experienced it myself) and iPad seems to be winning. We are not talking of course about hardware compatibility and the delightful UI of Windows 8 here, in which it is obviously the winner. But if you have a limited budget, something has to give in.
@ladydias The VivoTab RT costs roughly $860 here, and the Windows 8 Pro version is not available here.
@Tomasz S. I am also quite puzzled about my difficulties obtaining a Surface, I looked everywhere in the country. Honestly, if Microsoft offered shipping to my residence here I would have ordered one on day 1. A friend of mine in Germany tried to order one for me from the German Microsoft Store, but he could not, the website simply refused the purchase for some reason. Anyway it seems the situation is better in Poland then.
-- All in all I have been thinking about this quite a bit and I am still not 100% sure about what to do. The VivoTab was a great disappointment for me, especially for that high price. Surface is the dream. But ordering it from Ebay would mean a shaky if not disfunctional warranty, not to mention that I do not trust the Hungarian Postal Service to deliver it undameged. I'm definitely waiting until the end of the month, and see if anything promisable comes up.

Microsoft needs to drop the use of the Windows name on anything that isn't Windows. For the phone platform it just makes some people think Windows phone is a rebrand of Windows mobile.

microsoft needs to improve its relationship with everybody, users and developers

rather than shitting in our faces at every opportunity, then charging us for it
they have some great ideas, tehn all the hard work is ruined by very poor customer relations & even worse support for developers, and the £20,000 per patch thing is ridiculous, what are small devs supposed to do...
...and they're not helped by the blatant lying they keep doing in the media, MS say that the devs are given a fully working XBL enviroment to test game functionality in, when we've heard from multiple dev's this isn't the case..
..and they're no different when it comes to answering customers questions, on x360a, someone had tweeted them about the releases, they replied saying there are frequent, which was later proven wrong, with it being over a month since the last WP7 release

i for one am tired of their lies, and am considering not buying anymore products by them

I don't know about the rest of the world but in my little piece Windows 8 desktops are getting purchased but not a lot of buzz about them... People ask me if it's ok to buy them and I just say if you liked 7 you'll like 8 just the same but with an app front with improved security...
As for the commercial I remember buying my oldest daughter pogs back in the day... If I remember correctly their popularity was vanquished in about a year...
As far as RIM goes they are ahead of the MS as far as the mobile enterprise phone game but as far as enterprise goes in general a lot of companies are now allowing their employees to bring their own smart phones to work! All Microsoft needs to really do is show they can have some kind of secure company load of security and that they have a lot net tools to connect to networks and that Microsoft is actively screening the apps in the market place!! I think even the slightest bit of malware related issues could kill a device or OEM's integrity...

Microsoft isn't going anywhere unless:

A. Apple slashes prices on all their computers.
B. Linux isn't painful for your average user and doesn't scare the hell out of them.
C. ChromeOS gains many more features and stops being the My First Sony of operating systems.

I don't see any of this happening. Apple loves charging a premium, Linux has been around for ages and has gained zero traction with home users. Google has a chance but ChromeOS will probably must end up like Google+, and decent product that no one cares about.

I think MS is on the right track for being ahead of the curve on creating a consistent OS experience across all device. Windows 8 is just growing pains.

I agree 100% just I think for this topic it's more or less headed to pushing on the mobile enterprise more so then the desktop... And I do not think there is any mobile enterprise for MS anymore other then laptops...
I do think ChromeOS is a wash they should keep developing on it but as far as it becoming anything I do not see it unless Google locks it down and really digs in and focuses on developing a real OS and not a App blender!
Linux is boring to common users and I can almost see people leaving jobs to work at places that do not use it for office use...
I do not see Apple being in common work places for buisness do to the fact it's just to pretty and neat! :p Just my opinion...

Don't think MS is going anywhere. I like the windows phone 8. It's Always good to put another dog in the hunt. Apple is severely over priced. The Nokia Lumia 920 a solid phone just needs os and app improvement.

Microsoft isn't going anywhere anytime soon, no matter what people think about the company. There are too many businesses, too many infrastructures built around their products, and their world isn't just Windows.
You have Office, for starters, that has no functional competitor. Sure, there's OpenOffice, but that's just archaic. There's iWorks, but that's about as useful as Microsoft Works used to be. But even if you want to challenge me on my statements, let me direct you to Exchange, Lync, and SharePoint which are used by everyone and genuinely don't have real world competitors. And then there's System Center which admins like myself use to manage their enterprises. Windows Server powers far more servers than Linux, and don't expect that to change anytime soon.
The point is, Windows has to die in the enterprise for Microsoft to die. Now, it happened to IBM. It happened to Lotus, and countless others along the way. It's possible Microsoft will eventually fade away to obscurity, but it's not gonna be overnight. In 2020, we might be able to have this discussion. Before that? No chance.
It's a shame that people have the reaction they do to Windows 8. It's absolutely fantastic as an OS, even on laptops and desktops. I don't need a mother f-ing start menu. In fact, I haven't needed one since Windows 7, and that's the whole point. Pin your apps and shut up already, lol. Sure it was a silly thing to "force" on users, but it's done, so let's move on and accept that you don't need it. The sooner you stop whining about it, the sooner you can adapt the change and join the rest of us in using a much faster version of Windows 7. And that metro stuff? Meh, it floats in the background without you even knowing it if you wish it to be that way. I literally only see it when I hit the Windows key by choice. You could literally video tape my computer usage for 24 hours and never see the metro interface except when I lock/unlock the computer... no custom apps required.
It's a shame people have such kneejerk reactions to things without even bothering to understand them.

The general reaction I see from regular, non techies I know is that they just don't see any "ah hah" reason to jump to Win 8. I actually went from Vista on my home PCs to W8 because of the $40 upgrading deal. I only recently started using Windows 7 because of my work computers upgrading from XP. I can see why people are hesitant or just don't care to upgrade. Win 7 is pretty darn good.

The video is fine, but I think that it is a waste of money.  It is long (which is costlier) and it doesn't say much.  The new windows 8 and surface commercials are much better; they are shorter, flashier and more exciting.  Show the new browser doing cool things.

Windows may be finished in the smart phone game. Nokia lost it's market when it refused to listen to it's innovators, and instead, the fat cats ran the company into the ground. Now it is just a dinosaur with good hardware, teamed with a software giant that is out of touch with the trending market.

I think ms should be spending more time trying to fix the sync issues they have with music. Most people who have a w8 phone did so because they were 7 or Zune owners like myself. I have gone back to using my Zune for the time being as I've spent far to long trying to sort out my w8 problems to no avail.