Microsoft takes out ad affirming Nokia acquisition, removes logo from the Lumia 520

Although the Microsoft / Nokia deal is still far from being completed, there may be a sign of what the purchase can mean for future Lumia phones. The International Business Times has posted a somewhat dubious example of this in citing a recent full-page advert appearing in a major newspaper.

The ad from the Telegraph, appearing on September 13, is a simple announcement from Microsoft on the planned Nokia purchase. The headline “The Microsoft family will be getting bigger. And smarter.” refers to Nokia’s smart devices and is a standard corporate statement. Companies often make big announcements like this through full page ads and there is nothing extraordinary about it.

There is one curious aspect that caught the eye of IBTimes and that is the elimination of ‘Nokia’ from the Lumia 520 pictured in the ad. Normally the Nokia logo appears at the center-top of the phone, however for the message of the ad, it was digitally removed. The apps have also been replaced, focusing on Microsoft's brands rather than Nokia's.

Ad appearing in the Telegraph via IBTimes (compared to stock image, right)

A sign of things to come? We think IBTimes are making more of this than needs to be. For one, the Lumia 520 and forthcoming devices will continue to feature the Nokia name, at least until the purchase is approved by the various regulatory agencies involved. That process is not expected to be completed until early 2014.

Second, it’s not at all clear what path Microsoft will take with the Nokia / Lumia brand. Outgoing CEO Steve Ballmer remarked that in purchasing Nokia “1 brand, looks better than the "Nokia Lumia Windows Phone 1020" which has been confusing for consumers.” Clearly Microsoft will want to reduce branding redundancy, which is one of the main factors for the $7.2 billion purchase.

Nokia also clarified how Microsoft now owns the ‘Lumia’ brand and can optionally use ‘Nokia’ for non-smartphone devices.  But still, no firm commitments on how a Nokia engineered phone will be labeled by Microsoft going forward.

The conclusion we can reach is that Microsoft simply took some artistic license for the ad. While it is a sign of ownership and Microsoft putting their mark on the Lumia line, we wouldn’t quite take it as a roadmap on re-branding just yet. That part is still to come.

Nevertheless, for one company to remove the logo of another serves as a reminder of just how big of a deal this really is.

Source: IBTimes


Reader comments

Microsoft takes out ad affirming Nokia acquisition, removes logo from the Lumia 520



I like Xfone because nobody uses these as phones anymore. I want an XFone 360 with Cortana AI assistance.

xFone sounds horrible and also like a vague copy of iPhone. They should either go with the already established Lumia brand or come up with something more along the likes of Surface.

xFone sounds like a cheap iPhone knockoff, and xTab sounds like a cheap Galaxy Tab knockoff.

I still think they should seriously reconsider that, obtain the rights to use Nokia on smartphones too, and rebrand the phones using the Nokia name, not the Lumia name:
e.g., Nokia Lumia 928 --> Nokia 928

Car companies do it all the time. They use different brands and most people view them as separate companies. The only car that has GM in the name is GMC. You will never hear Lexus mention toyota. Microsoft is know as a software company (Hence the soft in the name). They could use a separate brand for their hardware division.

You either haven't followed Microsofts recent restructuring plan which aims to shape the company to become like Apple or fail to see that GM doesn't want to be a recognized brand because they already have several successfull brands. Microsoft has Microsoft and in a world where traditional PC sales are hitting the floor hard and Windows is getting competition from all sorts of alternatives, iOS, Android, Chrome, OSX etc they need to act swiftly to not become another Nokia. And that's what this whole purchase is about, to buy itself in to the game where the whole industry is heading and make people associate Microsoft with devices that have fantastic design and are user friendly in a way [traditional] Windows never was or needed to be.

Every country see brand differently. Like here in Australia Lexus mean its an expensive Toyota. Thou that my opinion, and not as say classy.

As Lexus is the luxury brand for Toyota, it is seen as an expensive Toyota worldwide.  They certainly do not hide the fact that Lexus, like Scion, is a Toyota product.

When I was in Japan (2005) there was no Lexus locally. Every model that was a Lexus outside of Japan was a Toyota model in Japan. It's interesting that on their home turf, Toyota didn't need a "luxury" image, as they already had one due to things like the Toyota Century, which isn't available much outside of Japan.
Just an FYI, not really adding to the conversation. :)

That strange because I was in Tokyo Dec 09 - Jan 10 (first time) and I distinctly remember thinking that the only sub-brand I saw there was Lexus, and that was rare. I just thought it was really expensive and a status symbol. But there wasn't anything like infinity or scion and many model names were there that I hadn't heard of. I know this is common practice in other countries as well.

In the cell phone business the Nokia name has much greater market value than Microsoft or windows. Microsoft would be foolish to through away all the value in that name. The idea of stream lining device names appears on surface to be positive, but are consumers really so "confused".

Here in Brazil, the Nokia brand in CellPhones is powerful.
Nokia made for Microsoft things that other OEM's never got since 2003.

The Nokia name is invaluable: it carries a ton of cachet in the cell phone industry across pretty much every market in the world, especially outside of the U.S. Most of Windows Phone growth has been occurring in countries outside of the U.S. where it has double-digit marketshare in severak key markets in Europe, South America, and Asia, and it is pretty much all due to the name cachet that Nokia has. If they take that away, I worry that Windows Phone growth in those markets will stall. Licensing the Nokia name for feature phones and smartphones is worth the price, I say. It's too risky not to do it. If I say the name "Lumia", few people know what I'm talking about. If I say the name "Nokia", everyone does.

I really think people here fail to understand what Microsoft is trying to do. The Nokia name has a ton of cachet. But that doesn't help Microsoft building its brand, Microsoft, in any way. No one outside tech-blogs would even recognize the company as a division of Microsoft if they kept the Nokia name. Everything would continue as before in the laymans view and this would be perfect if this was about buying a successfull company that generates big profits and therefore needs every part, brand, R&D, employees etc left untouched.

No, this is all about getting the brand Microsoft in the court where the game is currently being played and will be for many years to come.

No, we know what they're trying to do, we just think that it's a risky strategy that will backfire. Absorbing the Nokia team to make phones under the Microsoft name is riskier than buying the Nokiea team and having them make phones under the Nokia name, which is much more meaningful and recognizable than Microsoft is in the phone industry. We believe that keeping the Nokia name will still aid Microsoft's strategy (as everyone will see those phones as Windows Phones, which they will be), but will enable faster and more widespread growth than what would happen under a Microsoft-branded name, which lacks cachet in this sector. Building a new brand name is tough. Lots of people trust the Nokia name and when they see it on a phone, they'll be interested in the device. No one knows anything about Microsoft as a phone maker and no one outside of huge niche fans like us, who know MIcrosoft bought Nokia, will even know that Microsof is now making "Nokia-quality" phones. They'll just assume all the phones are Microsoft phones, will dismiss them right away, and search for something else. That is, t he absorption of all that was good about Nokia (innovation, phone quality, etc.) will be completely wasted becasue  most consumers won't recognize it. But they'd recognize it if they kept the Nokia name, which they should absolutely do, and which will absolutely help Microsoft build it's brand ( the real brand here is "windows phone", as there are other OEMs) by making it more widespread.

I'm sorry but you're wrong. It is risky in the short term yes, lots of money at stake (although not that much for Microsoft). Keeping Nokia brand would not be especially risky in the short term but very risky in the long term because Microsoft risks ending up with pants down when all OEMS have switched to Android, Chrome OS, Tizen, bought up BlackBerry OS, Mozilla OS, Sailfish, etc etc. Just look at the latest batch of notebooks with Haswell and Chrome OS from Asus, Acer, Toshiba and HP, who would have thought that some years ago?

No the industry is changing more rapidly than people tend to understand and what can be better example of showing exactly how little the customers of this industry cares about brand recognition when Nokia has lost market share from over 40% to around 4% in a couple of yers when at the same time companies like Huawei, ZTE and Xiaomi are now fighting for the third spot after Samsung and Apple.

No, I'm sorry but you're wrong. It's risky in the short-term and therefore even riskier in the long-term for if it doesnt' catch on, they're screwed. In reverse, using the Nokia name to continue to build the Windows Phone brand in the short-term puts then in a stronger position to change the brand later. This is akin to what happened with the ThinkPad brand of IBM. ThinkPad became a huge, respected brand on their own, so when IBM sold it to Lenovo, Lenovo didn't miss a beat and enjoyed instant brand recognition. If they had simply purchased the ThinkPad product line and then killed the name and called it the LenovoPad or something, they'd not be the #1 PC maker in the world right now. The Lumia name is not there yet, but the Nokia name is. That's why they need to use the Nokia name. They can use it in conjunction with the Microsoft name, as Lenovo did with ThinkPad, but they absolutely need Nokia printed on there too. Nokia lost massive marketshare for a plethora of reasons: a decrease in their name cachet was not one of them.

Nokia has tried to build Nokia, Lumia and Windows Phone for 2 years, the progress is just to slow. Maybe it seems like stuff is happening here at WPcentral but go out in the real world and talk about Windows Phone or Lumia and people will look like question marks. Mention Nokia and everyone will become nostalgic and remember their beloved 3310.
The Lumia trademark is just above it's starting point, not at all comparable to what ThinkPad was when Lenovo bought IBMs PC business, and could be continued or scrapped by Microsoft, it doesn't really matter. Saving the Nokia brand to build the Lumia trademark would be a 5 year wait which probably wouldn't end up successfull given the current track record and result in a Microsoft that has missed its chance of building a strong brand itself as a device company.

Progress is slow, indeed. Now imagine how slow it would be if it weren't for Nokia, who owns like 84% of the Windows Phone market. Just look at the lack of success other OEMs have had. A lot of that is due to Nokia being a better OEM and putting more into Windows Phone, but a lot more of that is due to Nokia's name cachet, which is evident if you look where the growth is happening: Europe, Asia, Latin America (where Nokia is reknowned) vs.  hardly any in USA (where Nokia isn't as reknownded).
Your comment about mentioning Nokia and people becoming nostalgic is precisely the point: it's got name cachet, people recognize it, and now that they know it's back, they become interested in it. Throwing that advantage away is a huge mistake, especially given how much advertising Nokia has done in the past year. All that goes to waste.
Put it this way, if you took any of the curernt Nokia Lumia phones and sold 2 versions, one with Nokia branding and one without, which would sell more? The Nokia one would, which means it would be foolish to not capitalize on that.

But imagine how it could have been if Microsoft did it the Apple way from the beginning?
Instead Microsoft has been doing something between the Apple model and the Windows (traditional) / Android model and this is just not working. OEMs have been locked up to specific hardware and haven't been able to put competetive hardware out on the market.
Of course Nokia has done a better job, they have tried in every way they could whereas Samsung just raised their eyebrows a bit, then turned their attention back at the incredibly successfull Galaxy line and didn't mind putting out a $80 Lumia 520 Windows Phone in the markets you mention. This is what has given Nokia success within the WP world, not their brand, because, and this is my point, no one has really talked about Nokia since the 3310. No one cared about their Symbian phones after Iphone. And just look at the incredible pace and customer adaption we have seen from Xiaomi (founded 2010!), ZTE and Huawei. This industry is literally changing by 6 months and history bears little value.

You are overestimating how easy it is to replicate Apple's success. If they had launched their own phone back in 2007, maybe, but now: it's tough. Really tough. Your comments about no one caring about the Nokia name are only true in the U.S., everywhere else in the world the Nokia name alone was what has been carrying Windows Phone to growth. Samsung rose because there was no other really sexy alternative to the iPhone (again, a missed opportunity for Microsft) until the Galaxy line (which is now stale). Huawei is only rising because 1. they're dirt cheap and 2. they are a Chinese company seeing most of their growth in highly jingoistic China.

Obviously not easy no but if someone could do it it would be Microsoft.

That is funny since i'm located in Scandinavia where nothing else other than Nokia and Ericsson where talked about. Once Samsung and others came with color displays 10 years ago and flip phones became the thing to have, people forgot about Nokia. The only people still asking about Nokia 2 years ago when I worked extra in a phone retailer where old people who wanted phones with physical buttons.

Sorry but you are truly underestimating how quickly the industry changes and how little history is worth.

I agree with you. Here in the Philippines, heck here in my office. Its all about the iPhone and the Nokia brand is just looked on or perceived as like any other China/locally made brand e.g. Cherry Mobile, MyPhone.
Hate to admit it but the Nokia brand has lost its lustre already.
Microsoft brand is also looked on or perceived as = Virus.
Most of the people here though uses Pirated versions of the OS at home desktops.

You clearly have no idea how powerful the Nokia brand is, and how bad of a reputation Microsoft and Windows Phone have worldwide.

All the double-digit market share of Lumia phones comes from the fact, that consumers don't associate "the new Nokia phones" with Microsoft.

The sales will stall and drop when the Nokia brand is dropped.

The double-digit market share of Lumia phones comes from the fact that they have a dirt cheap Lumia 520 in emerging markets.

Lumia 520 is a fresh new thing. The hype started earlier, when Nokia stormed the markets in Europe with the Lumia 610. And people chose a crappy WP7 phone over dirt-cheap Samsung, HTC or LG phones only becase it was a NOKIA phone. Deal with it.

Even ommitting the fact, that Lumias gained over 10% marketshare with WP7 in some European markets, long before WP8 was released, and you are clueless on the subject..
The data you provided clearly states, that more people chose a 610 than a 900. Despite the 900 having been relesed earlier.
Morever, low-end ugly 610 and 620 Lumias did way better than the lovely HTC Windows Phone 8X. Which proves the point, that it's the Nokia brand that sells, not Microsoft or WP.
Deal with it.

You, sir, deserve an award for ignorance. It is the Nokia brand that sells the hardware, not the hardware that sells Nokia. And you have no idea because clearly you are not from a region where Nokia is all-pervasive starting from the lowest income group to the highest income.

@coip...I totally agree. It is going to be interesting to see what the consumer adoption is going to be when they remove the Nokia name from these devices.

I think it's just going to be Windows Lumia.
MS will produce Windows Lumia
Samsung Windows Ativ and etc
HTC Windows 8X and etc
Huawei Windows W1
People already associate Windows with MS anyways and Lumia could be MS line of Phones.
Windows PC, Windows Surface, Windows Lumia.

Except no OEMs agree to put Windows in the name of their products unless they are paid by MS. It isn't the Dell Windows Inspiron or Sony Windows VAIO or Lenovo Windows Yoga.

Only in MS dreams do OEMs agree to brand all of their phones with Windows as part of the name.

It will have a single name such as "Lumia" or "Surface" with the windows logo stamped somewhere on the device I think

It's a Lumia, that's all and that's enough.  Successful brands are short and simple and repeated so that they are a household word.  Nobody says Apple iphone, just iphone.  Just Galaxy.  Just Lumia. 
Now back to drinking my Coca-Cola Company Diet Coke.

I agree. Though for Microsoft it's a bit more complicated: do they try to sell the OS as the brand or the hardware? There are pros and cons to each, mind you.

The problem with only hyping 'Lumia' and not Windows Phone is you make it harder for your OEMs. With Windows Phone, everyone has a common theme to latch onto.

That doesn't make sense for HTC, Samsung and Huawei. They don't make Lumia phones. And if they did, it would dilute the name "Lumia" to mean whatever, so long as it runs WIndows Phone OS.

That should be a concern for MS when HTC/Samsung/Huawei make WP a major priority, when they're all about just recycling hardware with minimal marketing, then who cares? MS has to drive now 90%+ of WP hardware, it can't be worried about others until they show they're all in.

With all do respect, that's not how you run a business. You don't tell your partners to piss off because you have a branding issue to solve.

exactly. I'm all for taking the Windows out of Windows Phone to help branding. Lumia could be the iOS to Apple. So Microsoft would be the company that makes Lumia OS.
HTC 8X..simple but in fine print, running Lumia 9.0. Like the ads of the HTC One that state it is using Android 4.3

You really think rebranding the OS nearly three years after launch is smart?  What evidence do you have that 'Windows Phone' is bad for Microsoft? Gut intuition or actual data?

Also, do you know how hard it would be to go through the UI/Code to remove all references to "Windows Phone"? That'd be a huge undertaking and it'd require an OS update just to make you happy with "Lumia".

Sorry, but you guys are way off on this. It'll never happen and you're just ignoring reality here.

Obviously, its just conjecture for conversation.
In all seriousness I would remove all notions of PHONE from the OS. Windows 8...They will all converge at some point and Windows 8, for non techies anyways, seems to have postive/hip/cool/ connotations.
Windows Phone 9 should come out at about the same time or close to the desktop version so this makes sense to me.

commenting after a long time. Lumia OS is best, people associate themselves with NOKIA not MS.Window phone is bad, too bad. People don't even know it is windows they think Lumia and explicitly Nokia Lumia.Window name doesn't have reputation nor do MS in nokia territories. Asia, Europe, latin America and other parts of world. Either it should be Lumia 920 or phone running on Lumia OS, but plz don't use names like MS Lumia 920 or windows lumia 920.People still have sentiments attached with Nokia, so when they see Lumia 920(and other models), they still think Nokia or Nokia(team) is still working and very much alive.But putting MS or Windows in front of it and removing Nokia name will have huge impact. I am saying once again, we need to understand sentiments of people living worldwide and attached with Nokia, since nokia name will be removed, let it will lumia, just lumia.

But this isn't Windows proper, it's Windows Phone. Microsoft's partners have already decided where their priorities lie, and it is not with Windows Phone. That's the reality. From the get-go it is Microsoft who is now managing 90% of the WP user base, and it is Microsoft who will be pushing the majority of WP handsets at each price point. In effect, it's Microsoft that has the most to lose if it puts the OEM partners above its own interests, and in turn, this will affect Windows Phone as it is MS that's pushing 90% of it.
As I said earlier, Microsoft should worry about it when the OEMs get serious about Windows Phone. Until that becomes the reality, I don't see a need to be worried about how they feel when it comes to Windows Phone.

I agree. It leaves you with options in case of a catastrophic failure. Plus its diplomatic to keep several companies on board.

Daniel, I appreciate you chiming in on these topics. I know you don't know all the machinations regarding MS or Nokia but you make us think about how their actions will affect the overall platform.

I agree with you Daniel. After all, MS has stated publicly that the other OEMs need not worry with this merger.
Besides, the Lumia name is synonymous with MS, WP OS and Nokia only. So with that being said, I think that they should at least leave Lumia in the name. I don't see why saying "Microsoft Lumia (insert number here)" cannot be sufficient. It's like a previous poster said, hardly anyone says Apple Iphone or Samsung Galaxy SX except marketing execs, so Microsoft Lumia would fit right in line. Or they could license the Nokia name and do as Google does with its 'Droid' series and continue to keep the Nokia name until the contract expires.
It is quite the conundrum.

This doesn't make any sense. It's like saying that if Google bought Samsung, the name would have to change to Android Galaxy series??? The difference here is that people buy Galaxies because they have Android while people buy WP because they are NOKIA

Let HTC and Samsung hype their own phones.  People are buying a product, a complete product.  Do Samsung and HTC rely on Google to hype android?  Are people buying an iOS device or an iPhone?  Most people buy products and don't do a detailed dive like tech-junkies do.
If it is much more complicated than a simple brand-name, most people won't know what they're talking about.

I think you'll see something like "Windows Phone 1520" on the phones themselves. They would be smart to add "designed by Nokia" in the advertising, especially in foreign countries, where the Nokia name is so well known...

How often do you see Google or android mentioned in a Galaxy or HTC commercial? They market their brand, not google's os. Even on pc commercials, they might briefly mention windows in the commercial, but really focus on the hardware. You license the os, but sell hardware. The other oems need to market their hardware running windows phone. Since windows phone is still developing and doesn't have as much mindshare as the other 2 OS's, microsoft should run separate commercials that show off the OS and various hardware running the os.

Hm...there's a reason why Google bought Motorola. They are keenly aware that 'Android' is being taken over by Samsung, diluting the brand. And Google actually has plenty of ads that talk about themselves here in the US.

Google also has their secondary 'Nexus' brand.

Regardless, Google AFAIK, are not considered masters of branding by anyone. See Google..Talk, Chat, Voice, Drive, Play, Latitude, Plus, Hangouts, etc. Their ecosystem is an ad-hoc mess.

The money for the forseable future is in the Asha line, not Lumia. Asha has no connection to Microsoft or Windows, so using Nokia there makes sense. Microsoft has traditionally believed in the value of their name, and the Windows brand. I think they're deluded on that score, failing to grasp how their past abuse of Consumers and general lack of 'cool' turn many Consumers off. Nevertheless, in their bubble the 'value' of the brands 'Microsoft' and 'Windows' makes hanging 'Nokia' onto the branding chain just too much.
Their agreement with Nokia must have included their right to manipulate the device branding prior to final conclusion of the deal. This wouldn't have been done casually, there's too much at stake. It is probably the shape of the Brand to come.

(sorrry for my english) I have a feeling that rebranding may affect negetivly cause Nokia is a huge brand itself. Some people ( me too) look only for that Nokia branding as the first thing ,when buying the phone. it would be nice if they can keep different brandings for Hardware and OS. aas basically these are two different things.and MS is not a very big Hardware brand in growing markets. As in India, Microsoft means Windows OS.
Its just my thinking, offcource MS know what they are doing atleast i hope so.

It may have already been said, but I dont feel like reading all the comments or maybe this is what you are implying...Lumia WIndows Phone vs. HTC Windows Phone vs. Samsung Windows Phone etc. No need to add MS in front. Droping Nokia might be tough since there is a lot of brand loyalty there, but its likely the only way to separate Nokia from Lumia.

Not really. There isn't much difference between a tablet and a phone except the screen size. Having the word phone after surface, tells people it has calling capabilities. I think people will get it's a tablet just by the fact that the screen is over 7". The only issue is that there are 2 separate operating systems for the phone and tablet. When the 2 merge, it won't be an issue anymore.

Lumia Phone will be much better.. like the brand name should be labled. LUMIA
And at the back woul be Microsoft.


What I'm getting from this is it's like Lenovo buying out IBM's PC business and the Thinkpad brand came with it.

"Apple iPhone running iOS"
for MS, it should be "Microsoft Lumia running Windows Phone OS or WP OS"

As much as I like Microsoft and dislike iOS & Android, I think that the name Microsoft needs to be dropped from the naming (at least initially for 2-3 years).  The Lumia brand has really built Windows Phone and we don't want any negativity from consumers out there.  We want the platform to keep growing.
Windows Phone is know as the OS therefore stick with Lumia even if it's without the word NOKIA.
That's my thoughts.

They have bought Nokia brand for 10years. they can use it on any phone, but they will use it only on Asha phones cause they always wanted MS branded windows phone hardware and now they got it.

and what stops them from using them on Smart fones ?
"Nokia also clarified how Microsoft now owns the ‘Lumia’ brand and can optionally use ‘Nokia’ for non-smartphone devices "
this does not say that they can "only" use it on non- smartphone. correct me if i am missing somthing, besides this check the below link which clearly tells that they own all three brands for 10 years.
"The Microsoft-Nokia deal transfers the name “Nokia” over for mobile phone use to Microsoft for ten years, along with the ‘Lumia’ and ‘Asha’ brands, which will be owned by Microsoft."

By Daniel Rubino, Wednesday, Sep 4, 2013 at 11:46 am

Official press release

Microsoft has agreed to a 10 year license arrangement with Nokia to use the Nokia brand on current Mobile Phones products. Nokia will continue to own and maintain the Nokia brand. Under the terms of the transaction, Microsoft has agreed to a 10 year license arrangement with Nokia to use the Nokia brand on current and subsequently developed products based on the Series 30 and Series 40 operating systems.

So, basically, Microsoft can use the "Nokia" name for all current phones, and all current and future Asha phones (for up to 10 years), but can't use the Nokia name for any future Windows Phone.

First of all, you're quoting Daniel, and he has misunderstood the deal. Here are the "Terms of the agreement" by MS: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2013/sep13/09-02announcementpr.aspx
"Microsoft is acquiring Nokia’s Smart Devices business unit, including the Lumia brand and products... Microsoft is also acquiring Nokia’s Mobile Phones business unit, which serves hundreds of millions of customers worldwide... Microsoft will acquire the Asha brand and will license the Nokia brand for use with current Nokia mobile phone products. Nokia will continue to own and manage the Nokia brand."
Do you notice how they separate the smart devices from the mobile phones?
And this is from Nokia about the "Deal terms": http://press.nokia.com/2013/09/03/nokia-to-sell-devices-services-business-to-microsoft-in-eur-5-44-billion-all-cash-transaction/
"Nokia will continue to own and maintain the Nokia brand. Under the terms of the transaction, Microsoft has agreed to a 10 year license arrangement with Nokia to use the Nokia brand on current and subsequently developed products based on the Series 30 and Series 40 operating systems."
MS will licence the Nokia brand for 10 years, for the mobile phones only, aka dumbphones aka feature phones. They will NOT be allowed to use the Nokia brand on any other products, because it doesn't belong to them.

Yeah , this is the case i think. agree with you.
They just want "Microsoft Smart phones"... dream come true for them.. lol. just kidding no offence. ;)

Quite sad considering the final decision is up to the shareholders of Nokia, I remember when AT&T released ads claiming how much better there service would be when they aquire t-mobile and that deal didn't go through at all.

Yes but the shareholders have been upset with Elop's leadership since the partnering with windows phone, Their descision still makes a huge impact on this deal.

You are right, and with even more sense think about it, they will agree with this merger the moment they are asked. Nokia corporations will now be streamlined and they will stay with every part of that company that is profitable.

You think those shareholders will have an issue? just look at their stock and how much its gone up.

MS needs to NOT have "Microsoft" branding on the phones.  If Nokia brand has to go away, simply replace with "Lumia".  Lumia may as well become the new brand.

Yeah, I agree. I think they know that as well. They don't say MICROSOFT XBOX or MICROSOFT Surface. Just Surface and XBOX. I think a simpler name like "LUMIA" or whatever will do.

It looks less "special" without the Nokia logo :( almost like what a kirf Chinese knock off would look like

I still think this move is stupid. For example, when I asked my father yesterday what phone he would like to buy, he said, he wants a Nokia. It is the NAME, come on Microsoft, not everyone lives in the US where Nokia does not mean so much. But in Europe, I think it still is a pretty big name.

It seems they will try to use feature phones to introduce customers to MS services. But the problem still lies with the smartphone branding, Nokia is far more popular than MS as a brand outside the US.

The Asha line which was included in the acquisition is a feature phone. It will continue using the Nokia name.

which is not popular at all. I am from india... people call it Nokia "Nirasha" which means HOPELESSNESS lol.

How about you give a guy a break? I was going by the actual deal. And they obviously haven't bought it yet as the picture shows.

Fair enough, I was just pointing out that from the sounds of it Microsoft intends to purchase the rights for Nokia branding if the deal goes through.

Dude stop spreading false hopes. Why don't YOU read thoroughly and realize that they bought the Nokia brand for FEATURE phones. NOT smartphones.

And that's that. And yes Microsoft will continue right where Nokia left off in selling the Asha feature phones. Did you know just last quarter Nokia sold over 50 million+ feature phones? Why would Microsoft deny that profitable market?

How about you read it a little more and focus on the bit where they say that the Nokia logo has been licensed for usage only on featurephones? Which effectively means, not on MS produced smartphones

Honestly it's not the name or the hardware/design patents, its the innovators, If you look at what Nokia use to be back in the flipphone dialpad era they made some very innovative and colorful phones. I mean look at how nice the slide out keyboard on the nokia n97 was compared to all the other slide keyboard phones of that time.

Which is also sad since the Nokia people are coming along as well so effectively nothing has really changed.

Yeah, I can't wait to see how that plays out.  Maybe they'll slap some logo stickers on after the new phones been sitting around on store shelves long enough.

I remember seeing almost the same quote on articles about other OEMs after the acquisition announcement, "Windows Phone can kiss their OEMs goodbye"... now we see Huawei (a company that publicly has been less than supportive) publicly say they intend to continue making WP and we've seen leaks of upcoming phones from Samsung and HTC.
We've also seen multiple reports about WP on the rise in Asia since the announcement.

I believe and still believe a phone is more of a brand than a product. Regardless, I pose this to you:
Hauwei (somehow) buys Apple's mobile devices division. They remove the Apple logo, its no longer an iPhone, but its made by exactly the same people. Do you think these phones will sell as well?

That's a different scenario. Right now Nokia is only making Windows phone in the smartphone market. Everything in the windows market that Nokia makes is Lumia XXX(or XXXX). So if I see an ad for Lumia 2000 even without Nokia stamped on the back somewhere I know 2 things, its WP and its made by Nokia. To answer your question, if Hauwei bought out Apple's mobile division and kept the team together and kept the iOS features the same then in the average consumers eye its an iPhone. Apple has marketed there product so well, people recognize iPhone whether it has an apple logo on it or not. If Hauwei doesn't change anything then people will still see an iPhone. Run this experiment, tape over any Apple logos on an iPhone and any other labels on any smartphone of your choice. Place those phones next to each other and ask people, which phone is an iPhone. Even without logos people will recognize an iPhone.

" if Hauwei bought out Apple's mobile division and kept the team together and kept the iOS features...."

that would be a shocking turn of events :D

I agree it wouldn't change if it is still the iPhone, but as both Nokia and Microsoft have confirmed, Lumia will not be used either, they are looking for a new brand name. In that sense, the iPhone would no longer be called the iPhone (it would probably be called Ascend). Do you still think that won't change anything (again, to the average consumer)?

Maybe you have more data from somewhere else but in this article it says that Microsoft owns the "Lumia" brand. This article also says that Microsoft hasn't made any changes. Now with that said, if Microsoft goes the route of not using the "Lumia" then they better come up with a great advertising campaign to announce the changes. It's not impossible to change names and maintain customers if done right. Comcast cable is now Xfinity, Qwest phone company is now Century Link, Skydrive will eventually be called something else soon. New names doesn't mean the product has changed and if you campaign it right customers will continue being customers as long as the quality is still there.

Of course Nokia is coming off the phones hardware...Nokia is still a company, Microsoft is making the phones, so the name on the phone will soon be Microsoft, which I think will be cool.

First of all, you're quoting Daniel, and he has misunderstood the deal. Here are the "Terms of the agreement" by MS: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2013/sep13/09-02announcementpr...

"Microsoft is acquiring Nokia’s Smart Devices business unit, including the Lumia brand and products... Microsoft is also acquiring Nokia’s Mobile Phones business unit, which serves hundreds of millions of customers worldwide... Microsoft will acquire the Asha brand and will license the Nokia brand for use with current Nokia mobile phone products. Nokia will continue to own and manage the Nokia brand."

Do you notice how they separate the smart devices from the mobile phones?

And this is from Nokia about the "Deal terms": http://press.nokia.com/2013/09/03/nokia-to-sell-devices-services-busines...

"Nokia will continue to own and maintain the Nokia brand. Under the terms of the transaction, Microsoft has agreed to a 10 year license arrangement with Nokia to use the Nokia brand on current and subsequently developed products based on the Series 30 and Series 40 operating systems."

MS will licence the Nokia brand for 10 years, for the mobile phones only, aka dumbphones aka feature phones. They will NOT be allowed to use the Nokia brand on any other products, because it doesn't belong to them.

ohh ok... thanks alot. got the point now. i was quoting based on the post i read here in past.... should have done more research. sry for any confusion i caused.
on the topic, i still hope MS still may think about getting license to use Nokia on the smartphones too... Nokia still has a big brand value in developing markets as well as in europe. and dnt know how much people are ready to see MS branding on a smartfone.

Nokia is the globally recognised brand, not Lumia. We at WPC obviously are aware of Lumia. That doesn't means the others know it. MS will have the license to use Nokia for 10 years. In this light will be pure foolish not to use it. Yes, MS made some big mistakes in the past. Surely not another one.

It's sometimes incredible how ignorant they're allowed to act considering their paycheck.
Take the case with Lenovo's acquisition of IBM's PC division: They were licenced to use IBM's name and logo on their desktops and laptops for some years past the acquisition. Gradually the logo was phased out and quietly replaced by Lenovo's logo. The fact that people are running away from Thinkpads now has more to do with the fact that Lenovo are too stupid to realize the conservative nature of Thinkpad owners, which is a problem when they can't sell their less stellar lowcost line of PCs at the same pace as Apple can.

So sad to see the name Nokia go away like this. They started to make a comeback. From the beginning I didn't buy into this whole "Elop is a Trojan horse" thing, but it seems I was wrong. At this point, I would have preferred Nokia to stick with Symbian or Meego. Nokia has so many loyal customers, and I think Microsoft is going to ruin that. Having had about a dozen Nokia devices, I'm saddened by this deal. :(

Idk I think people are just being nitpicky. Its still Nokia making the phones. Who cares what name they decide to use as long as they keep Lumia branding I have no issue with it.

The name "Lumia" doesn't sell in markets like Europe or India. The name "Nokia" does. Plain and simple.

Sorry I'm a Nokia fan as well as a general fan of tech, but I think this is treated as a bigger issue than it is. I'm sorry if I don't see everything you say as absolute truth but worrying about a name is meaningless. If its still gonna have Nokia quality then who cares.

Actually you are right but some times Brand matters. Like before i bought my L820 , i read lot of reviews (mixed and bad.. no apps n stuff) about WP OS, but then i thought WP can get better with time with updates but hardware will remain what it is. So i bought the Phone with the brand i trust most for mobile , that's "Nokia".
We all are tech freaks we know, we will still get Nokia quality even without branding but normal people dont. Alot of people around me are already disappointed about MS nokia deal as they have doubts about the future device quality and service .with MS cause with Nokia you dont have to care about this.

Right now Nokia and Lumia are the same. In the smartphone market Nokia on makes Lumia. Every smart phone Nokia sells says Lumia on it, whether its in Europe or India. I don't see how Lumia won't be recognized in those markets.

lol...right !! like once i heard.. " Windows Phone....!!!! umm ohhh yeah that software in Nokia Phones. ;)  "