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Nokia to launch 4-inch Lumia 610 successor with Windows Phone 7.8?

Lumia 610

The Lumia 610 low-end Nokia Windows Phone

Rum'o'meter

As we closely approach Nokia's rave party, which is to be held this coming Wednesday in New York, reports of potential Nokia Windows Phones are surely to be coming in hot for the next few days. The Verge has learned from a source familiar with Nokia's Windows Phone plans that the manufacturer plans to release a Lumia 610 successor, powered by Windows Phone 7.8, codenamed "Glory".

As well as the two Windows Phones Nokia is expected to be unveiling, this new low-end entry will ensure the manufacturer continues to target markets where it can offer smartphones at competitive prices to snap up consumers. Running Windows Phone 7.8, the "Glory" is reported to feature a 4" display, 800mhz processor and 256MB of RAM.

It's understood the handset will not be unveiled next week alongside the Lumia 820 and 920 Windows Phones, but will likely be launched in time for the holiday season. What do you make of a new low-end Windows Phone from Nokia? Be sure to sound off in the comments.

Source: The Verge; thanks, Roger, for the heads up!

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Reader comments

Nokia to launch 4-inch Lumia 610 successor with Windows Phone 7.8?

78 Comments

It's always be their main target audience in my opinion. And it looks like a great phone for those markets where low end smart phones are the norm. I really hope T-Mobile gets a high end Lumia this time around.

I guess for low-end markets it will be okay to release 7.8 devices. Do you think this means Nokia will continue to develop apps 7.8.? I'm sure they will as their product support is great

256MB again... Will they ever learn?? Another fail handset, shit like thus makes Windows Phone look, well, shit. Another fine app-restricted mess for the IOS and droid chaps to sink their teeth into.

I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I agree the phone should have had at least 512MB ram so it could run as many apps as possible. But I disagree with not having a low end phone. I believe low end phones are very important for some markets, maybe not US. We in USA are very spoiled with availability of technology at lower / subsidized prices. But in Asian and south Asian countries, this will be an affordable hot phone.

Adding more ram increases price. This is a low end entry phone. Ignore it and buy the high end devices. Stop trolling. Besides, why would you needlessly add more ram to an OS that doesn't need it to run..

Having a larger screen increases price? 256MB RAM is pennies for an OEM. It's not about how many apps can run, its about being able to actually run apps that other phones on the platform can. You just know that WP8 handsets will launch, and all the news will be negative about how crap the "new" Nokia 610 is with its obsolete OS, its inability to run key apps, and its pathetic amount of memory. The OS requires 512MB as a spec standard... Tango or no Tango, that's what the platform and apps were built for from day one. As for trolling?? Fook off if you dont like discussion.

MattLFC, i strongly disagree, this phone is talking to market where the consumer doesn't buy any apps. They only install free apps, but would love to have a good looking phone. I m talking about India and Africa here.

I couldn't agree with you more,,,this is such a let down from Nokia. 512 RAM and Apollo should be the bare minimum for a WP8 device.

I think they know more about their target market for this device then you do, so calling it a fail is a fai in itself.

Yeah, because shipping 4 million Lumia's is hitting their competitors where it hurts, they certainly know their target market /sarcasm.

I agree Micfur. I have the 710 which in my opinion is a really decent phone. But having a high end option would be a plus. I think both Nokia and Tmoble would benefit.

Nokia also has a huge market of Symbian phones in many countries. Any Windows Phone with a similar price tag will work there. They can also be sold like Go phones in the USA.

Sounds like a waste of time, that phones just gonna piss people off and make people say bad stuff about windows phone

Its not true, I tried a 610, and the speed of UI is quite the same of my 900. Not bad for a 150€ phone (off contract).
Display, cam, games and heavy apps run little slower, but, I repeat, not bad at all for an entry level wp !! With a 4" display it will be unbeatable on lower end zone.

Its not about the speed of the OS, its about the fact its not a true Windows Phine device, and the pro-Apple/Google media had a field day when the original 610 launched, telling the world this wonderful new Nokia running Windows Phone, couldn't even handle Skype, Microsofts own effin company, or a simple game like Angry Birds etc... Key titles that can make of break a consumers interest in a platform/device. I dont want to see a round two, overshadowing what should be an exciting launch of WP8 devices. Way to kill a new product? Relaunch an already tarnished handset, running the former and now obsolete OS.

WP7 is no more obsolete than Android 2.x. Market share is won through the cheap low end phones. Windows phone needs a lot more phones like this to succeed. Hopefully companies like ZTE, Huawei, Nokia, and Acer will bring enough low end phones to market so that WP can begin competing with Android for real.

So you think that we should anger and frustrate the consumer, by launching new WP7 devices, after WP8 devices are on the market. The difference with Android is the apps are cross-compatible, most of the major apps will run on 2, and any that arnt developed to, will usually run with lower performance. Lets hate a resurgence of WM6.5 devices whilst were at it hey?? WM6.5 devices can launch on even cheaper hardware, in fact I had 6.1 running on a Universal, with all its 48MB RAM... Yeah, it wasn't the fastest thing out of the box, but I managed just fine with it, once I go to grips with the expectations of slowdowns every now and again. In fact, some features on WM would actually put WP to shame, so yeah, lets just hit the market eight low-end devices running WM (rebadged as Windows Phone 6.5 of course, since 2009), low-mid range phones running 7.5 or 7.8, maybe even 7.0 if it hits some strange WP die-hards fancy, and then we can leave all the WP8 devices, with the only future-proof platform, for the high end, simply because the OEM's and Microsoft were so short-sighted, they couldn't see that 90% of the world, dont want to pay iPhone 5 and Galaxy SIII prices for a phone...

You seem really butt hurt about a phone that hasn't come out, may not even exist, and that you don't have to buy.  Major (all?) apps run across all Windows Phones beyond the 610 as far as I know.  The same cannot be said for Android, where screen sizes and a range of hardware lead to phones still being released with Android 2.x, not working with a number of apps, and flat out lagging within the operating system while not even running apps.  One thing this 610 successor will have going for it is that at least the OS is fluid on 256 MB of RAM (assuming they don't muck that up with 7.8.)
When Windows Phone 7 came out Microsoft said they'd continue to support 6.5 and release hardware, software, updates etc.  This is the exact same thing.  6.5 and 7 co-existed for a brief time too you know?  Instead of 6.5 and 7 we'll have 7.8 and 8.  I really think Nokia is the only one we'll see 7.8 devices from after Windows 8 launches, but who knows.
Your comment stops making sense at the end so I don't know what to say about it.  No one thinks the world wants to pay iPhone prices every time they get a new phone except Apple, which is exactly why we get so much choice, from the rock bottom 7.8 610 successor to the $600 Phis and iPhones and GSIIIs.
You can do plenty with 256 MB on Windows Phone 7.  This will be good for whatever consumers find a need for it.  An OEM saving "pennies" on 256 MB of RAM probably translates to dollars for the consumer.  

Yeah, I mean, look at how selling the 3GS has hurt the reputation of Apple. No front facing camera, low specs, low res screen, incompatible with apps requiring Siri or iOS high end features. Nobody will buy an iPhone now! /sarcasm

Agreed. How about we just have someone come up on the stage and fart the whole time? That would sound better.

Dear Nokia, why release a new phone with the same specs, 800 MHz CPU, 256 MB RAM, as the Lumia 610 (just a bigger new 4' inch screen this time) and with the same Win CE based WP7.8 (which will anyhow make it to Lumia 610 some day)??!!

I remember in an interview Stephen Elop said that WP8 will pave the way for even cheaper low-end Lumia devices than the WP7.5... so what is going on now??

Its like Dell releasing a new low end computer running Windows XP at the Windows 8 launch.

The vast majority of Android phones sold today are Android 2.x phones which will probably never be upgraded to Android 4.x. Android is winning because of 2.x phones

No.  That situation would be a WM 6.5 device coming out for the WP8 launch.  For a direct back comparison you need to compare to Vista, and machines were still shipping with Vista when Windows 7 came out, let's get real.  Take your +1s back to the playground. 
Your situation is more like saying Android 2.0 devices are coming out when Android 4.0 is available.  Oh wait...

We'll keep our +1 where they are. But thank you for additional comparisons. Don't forget to tip your waitress.

No, it is more like Apple continuing to sell and update the 3GS even as the 5 is coming. Hey, wait, they do! And they sell millions of them too!

Yeah, Windows Phone 7 should have been all but killed off at the announcement that WP8 will be NT based, and 7 devices will nit get an upgrade. Continue selling existing 7 models until the launch of 8 by all means, but once 8 arrives, forget about 7, it's history, and I say this with a heavy heart, typing on my 710, but it's true. The only way forward is WP8 now, anything else merely adds confusion, and as you say, leads to fragmentation, one of the key problems that Android (and to a lesser degree, Apple) so often gets slated for by we WP fans. If Nokia are unable to produce a low-end WP8 device, then they should have considered that prior to the launch of WP8, and used Symbian handsets as a quiet interlude, until such a time as they can produce WP8 devices for budget users. They should also be questioning their entire strategical partnership with MS if so, as Microsoft should have repsonded to Nokia's need to be able to produce WP8 devices for budget users. Lets hope this rumor proves to be only that, a rumor.

I don't think this is fragmentation anymore than iOS is fragmented or Windows PC is fragmented. Developers can and still will primarily make apps for WP7 which also run on WP8. Eventually though it is healthy to have a cut off point and say this new software and APIs only run on the new platform. Both iOS and Windows do this. Android fragmentation is a little bit more complicated as the use of different ARM chips and the dozens of different releases of Android make it very difficult for developers to create apps for Android compared to iOS and Windows.

You obviously are too young to recall the demise of Windows 9x and WM6.5. Whilst I admire your faith, history teaches us a vital lesson. I'm sure devs will continue to support 7 for a while, it has an established userbase to tap into. However, once 8 takes a hold, 7 will be forgotten by most devs, just like WebOS and Symbian were. Sell off the existing stock of 7 devices by all means, but the days of new WP7 handset announcements should be confined to history.

I'm just wondering how you sell or pitch a new end of life device from a salesperson perspective. What the heck do you say? The price better be very low to sell something like this. This needs yo be a very stripped down device just so not to piss off anyone

Just check how the apps submission rate has dropped; developers are waiting for WP8 and they will target the new OS.......Same happened for WM 6.5

This is very good news if true. It means that the old devices will not be ditched and that we may get the features that should be standard. My so called old device is 5 months old, fingers crossed. :-)

On point that hasn't been raised yet... What exactly is wrong with the current 3.7' 610 (forgetting RAM limitations and obsolete OS). Surely they dont need to launch a new device and overshadow the launch of 8, just to capture the low-end market? A 4' screen isn't a priority for most users, and won't suddenly make everyone flock to WP...

It might be that its components are starting to increase price because they are getting old... Many times sustaining manufacturing of EoL products get more expensive than a never generation... Without the need to get to the very latest and greatest...

I'm so conflicted here !!! In my mind this creates fragmentation in Windows phone (it's like selling a Android 2.3 device next to a 4.5 device, that you see a lot of).
 
The reasons why I really am conflicted...
1. With this release, it should extend the WP 7.X life a little longer, at least 2-3 years where devs will make apps for WP7.X. It's good for current phones and people who have no plans on going WP8. I can see devs holding back on WP8 apps due to being compatable with 7.X, resulting in a WP8 device with more apps designed for 7.X than WP8
1.If every new model goes to WP8, then over a year or 2, most all apps will be designed for WP8, no more 7.5 apps. This means better WP8 apps and more of the games that we want. Devs can go nuts making the best apps they could and not worry as much about compatablity on past versions (I can understand lower level games but, the high end stuff can come out with out worry). .... BUT...with the loss of 7.X devices in the process, they still will work but, no more new apps.
 
See why I am conflicted here ?
 
It's kind of like when I got a blu-ray player (or even HD-DVD back when), I would no longer buy a movie on DVD because, the quality is not there, I would rather pay a little extra to get what I really want and I we can all see the apps and games when having better hardware and the software support (look at top iOS and Android games)

Whilst your analogy is good, did the studios keep making movies for those peeps with HD-DVD players after Toshiba announces the discontinuation of the format? ;-)

Yea, I know, I guess it's time to let it go... I was a HD-DVD follower when released... I was stepped back by another format standard that Sony came out with. Oh, well, I still have about 40 HD-dvd movies (and my HTPC will play them back).... :(
 
anyway back on the discussion....

Apps for 7.x will work on WP8, so apps that don't explicitly use WP8 features can be made to work. That will help avoid fragmentation.

I know this and that was not exactly my point.
 
If no WP 7.X devices were to come out, devs would move to WP8 programmers sooner, meaning better quality apps in the long run.
 
That was my point...

I saw this phone. It's quite compact. It was put among HTC One variants and 710. I thought they are going east. Making it bigger certainly reduces desirability without adding more size variation or better design. In the end, it's for communication. The better it fits to the pocket the better it will sell.

Lets not forget the diversity of the Smartphone market. People walk into AT&T looking for an Android handset based in the ads for the latest Model, but most walk out with a much more limited, "obsolete" device. This is the reality of much of Android's success. Why shouldn't WinPhone offer something similar to their Customers.
The key will be to ensure that Carriers have both a high end and a low and device, not just the bottom end units like TMobile and obsolete models like Verizon. Add the necessity of the Sales staff to apply the same logic as they do when selling Droids - show the high end unit and if they shrink at the price switch to the nearly look-alike lower cost alternatives - Sold!

 It's not new if it's outdated even before it hits the shelves, WP 7.8 is in the past if new apps won't be made, forgetting the missing features like IE10, encryption, multitasking etc. (and of course future updates) no more additional apps is a deal breaker. They should try to release as many Windows 8 phones as they can at the begining if they want to reach lots of new customers hands.

 

 

Who is we and who are you people? I think that just having MORE handsets, regardless of whether it's 7.8/8 and simply having greater presence or choice is a good thing. DESPITE your own ridiculous misgivings, having these options is amazing and ALL of these phones work great for different things compared to all of your other favorites (which SUCK by the way). U_U

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Exactly, add 512MB RAM and release a great low end budget 4" inch phone with Windows 8, no 7.8 bullshit.

 

 

Actually, I think that WP7 can adequately serve 90% of all the potential smartphone users based on the functions it provides.  Not everybody are chasing specs.  I'm totally satisfied with my cyan L900.  I don't feel any shortage of cores, pixels or apps.  It is fast and reliable. I have no problem finding apps on the Marketpalce.  My wife has a white L900.  She has no intention to upgrade to WP8 before the contract is over.  If not for the PureView technology, I have no intention to upgrade to L920 either.  The WP8 apps, NFC functions will take some time to develop.  There is no rush.
Nokia needs 'Glory' bridge the gap between Asha phones and WP phones.  Asha phones are selling really well right now in India, China.  WP7 runs well in 256M ram.  Nokia needs price Glory way down to compete fiercely with Chinese ZTE, Huawei and Xiaomi low end phones.

Think Nokia is wasiting their time trying to cover for MS with this. WP8 has that advantage of scaling up and down, they made this a big deal during the summit, hence allowing removable storage, so OEMs like Nokia can stick like 4GB of storage, and allow the user to choose if they want more space by supplying removable storage. However, if Nokia were to release a low end successor to the 610, which would have lower specs than the current standard WP7.5 devices, it would cause more complaints, because it would bring up that question of why WP7.5 devices couldn't get WP8, even though WP8 scales both up and down in terms of hardware. For current 7.5 owners, this is a good thing because it shows Nokia giving the 7.x platform more support even after WP8 is out. The problem with this is, they're slowing down the transition from 7.x to 8.x.

I don't think it's a bad idea...If this device allows for affordability, especially for Virgin Mobile, Cricket, Boost Mobile, etc. to carry them, then it's a win.  The only device on Virgin Mobile >$300 is the iPhone; so a WP7.8 device, contract free, competively priced < / = $300 would really allow for Microsoft/WP to gain substantial marketshare.
 
I say, why not; it's only one device and they can at least try this approach - if it doesn't produce the sales/marketshare that they anticipate, then they can try something else :)

You know what's funny, android can release cheap devices running 2 full versions behind the current Os with low specs making them incapable of running alot of heavy games/apps and they still sell!! Windows wants to offer something similar and people are up in arms over it? Its going to "tarnish" the brand? I couldn't disagree more, it's going to spread awareness to those who can't afford 500 dollars for a phone and in the end they are still getting to use this amazing UI that even with those lower specs, runs smooth and most important, is extremely stable!! So stop complaining about a device that is not even being targeted to YOU! Like any good company selling you something, they want to have something to offer everyone! If you were in the market for a corvette, are you honestly going to check specs on a cobalt and complain about how it compared, and "tarnishes" the Chevy brand? I doubt it...

While you have valid points, I must contend that Microsoft needs to press very hard to get their current system into the mainstream.  Allowing ill-fated versions of an O/S that is barely recognizable to the general populace is a questionable tactic. 
We want Windows Phone 8 development to grow and that will only occur with increased sales numbers.  Even if Nokia sells ~100,000 (doubtful) additional phones with 7.8, it steals from version 8.0 (long-term) app customers.

The low-end market is Nokia's strength and often untold story about its successes. I'm happy that it continues to serve this segment of the market. Thanks Nokia.

So, because it is 4 inches and smaller than all the other gargantuan rumored phones out there, that qualifies this to have super low end specs? I'm convinced that the days are gone where good phones could be pocketable.

I don't know why people are so wrapped up in high end devices that they forget the need of low priced, decent looking, stable phone that can serve 50-70% of the market. Not everyone needs a $600 phone and replace it every year or every other year.
In countries like India, Africa, China, and other South Asian countries, everyone can't afford high end phones so if Nokia is willing to offer a decent phone at low price, it serves well to the needs of a lot of population. Think about it, a lot of students in those countries who earn nothing and go to school (financially supported by their parents not student loans), they can't afford to buy a $600-900 phone, they would love to have something <$300. A lot of small businesses don't make a whole lot of money and definitely don't have time to pay "angry birds", they want a phone that simply works and provides internet capabilities.
Why is Nokia doing well with some Asha devices? Its definitely not about what OS it is running but the features it brings on the table and PRICE point. PRICE matters my friends. The whole world is not as fortunate as US to have 0% APR credit card and swap it 10 times before my eyes can blink and keep paying minimum payments and not worrying how much they ended up paying in total.
I think a lot of folks here, have no idea about real life in developing world.

I didn't spend anywhere near $500 on my Lumia 710, just months after it launched... £129 does not equate to $500. If WP8 can't run on such cheap hardware, which is getting cheaper by the day, then Microsoft have screwed up big-time with it, and Nokia may have made one of the biggest strategical mistakes in corporate history. Any subsidy Microsoft happens to be pumping into Nokia is irrelevant, if they can't compete with handset sales. Like it or not, WP8 is make or break for Nokia in the smartphone market, they are already on the backfoot, and have been for some years now, if they can't hammer the market with WP8 devices, then they are out of the smartphone market for good, or may end up going down the dreaded droid route. If WP8 requires $300+ hardware to run, then both Microsoft and Nokia have completely lost sight of the market. As for those people living in a dreamworld, who think devs are somehow going to support WP7 apps, wake up and smell the coffee, devs are already ditching WP7 for WP8, they dont seen interested in developing for 7 with the knowledge that 8 can run apps, its cheaper and easier to develop for NT-only, thus targetting Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8, if CE-based WP7 had a significant userbase, then maybe, but it hasn't, and how many devs kept developing for Symbian after the "burning platform" leak, in fact how many kept developing for it when iOS and droid began to show signs of leaving it for dead (remember until last year, Symbian was still the second biggest smartphone OS, and devs had already dropped it in thier droves), how many devs still develop for WebOS despite hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions, of devices being out there, and how many devs still develop for WM, or even did in its final days? The only reason MS still support WM6 is because they have ongoing contractual obligations to do so, to their corporate users, not for any other reason, and certainly not because some oddball consumers like myself, still use it. Devs lost interest in WM the day it was announced that Photon had been cancelled and the platform looked to be in an eternal mess.

It's good to see entry level phones from Nokia, it will be a hit in emerging markets like India IMO.

Pathetic. Just pathetic. I have high hopes for WP8 but things like this are just tarnishing the WP name. The 610 and this simply should have had the full RAM amount. From day 1 the requirement was 512MB, why decrease to 256MB TWO YEARS later? Every app was designed for 512MB, and 512MB has become dirt cheap, yet they now release the first devices with 256MB RAM? Just plain stupid, really.

Don't forget that even after the launch of Android ICS OEMs have continued to churn out Gingerbread handsets for the emerging markets .... A successor to Lumia 610 means atleast Nokia will still keep supporting WP 7.8 Handsets for another year ... and it will make a very good entry level handset in the coming years.

The different ICS from Gingerbread/Froyo etc, was that the OS itself did not use a totally different and incompatible kernel like CE vs NT.

I wouldn't be so sure about that support for 7.8 especially if new apps won't work on it. A new 620 phone that is outdated even before it hits the stores doesn't inspire me with confidence, WP 7.8 is a one time necessary evil but releasing a new phone when WP8 is available is simply inexcusable. Microsoft should try to release as many Windows 8 phones as they can at the beginning if they want to reach lots of new customers hands.

 

Why is everyone getting all wound up, here? This phone is being marketed, to emerging markets/low-end users. If you need Pureview, and NFC, then buy a 710, or 820, 920. I just don't get all the bellyaching.

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People want WP8 because that gives them hope that next year they'll be flooded with missing apps and their phone will gain something. With 7.8 the fact that you don't have anything to wait for and nothing new to look for in the marketplace isn't very exciting, this update is (for those with current devices) like getting a bandage for a poison that's slowly killing you.