HTC plans for Apollo and the Titan II

With the way MS regulates the hardware, it's pointless for manufactures to constantly churn out more and more devices.  With Android there is always new hardware and they constantly churn out new devices.  With Apple, you get one new device per year.  Just as WP is in between iOS and Android in terms of openness the hardware life cycle seems to be trending in between the 2.  We get several choices kinda like Android but not nearly as many and all phones meet a certain standard.  Coming from the Android world I actually like this.  I love having the latest and greatest and get a bit annoyed in the Android world constantly wanting a new device.  If I was happy in the Apple world, I would only have the urge to upgrade every year unless the continue the streak of just adding an S to the models in which I could actually wait the 2 years in contract.  With Windows phone, I expect to want a new device each year but I also expect the temptation of a new device to be lower since they all have very similar specs.  I enjoy waiting for a software update that I know I should get around the same time as everyone else instead of the next 2 major versions coming out before getting an upgrade and then wondering if I will ever get another upgrade.  WP may not be on cutting edge hardware but as we have seen from the financials, Samsung and HTC nearly killed themselves last year doing that with Android.  They were thier own terrible competition release a new device almost every freaking month and making the price $300 for the latest greatest.

I agree w most of what you said but Microsoft isn't in the same position that apple is in when it comes to market demand. They've got an amazing operating system, the beat imo, but they still barely have their foot in the door so they aren't in the position to force customers into a yearly update type situation. At least not yet.

Woot! Australia! Woot! :D

Like like Nokia will be the main oem with HTC and Samsung showing little interest. No real reason to purchase a WP if it isn't a Nokia handset.
If Nokia will be the only oem MS may as well get the purchase over with and control it all similar to Apple.

Have thought and felt the same thing for a while.

I personally believe there's room for only one big OEM in every platform, and maybe another one playing 2nd fiddle. Of course for iOS, there's only Apple. For Android there's Samsung, with HTC playing 2nd fiddle. I think it will be the same with WP, except Nokia this time will play top dog, and maybe HTC again playing no. 2. Although I'm using an HTC Radar for my new and initial foray into the WP platform, I'm happy that Nokia will be playing top dog in the WP world because my Apollo handset will definitely be a Nokia!

6 months without a new device or any promotion is hardly what i would call "firmly on board". Lets hope Nokia turns up the heat and takes even firmer control as the top WP OEM.

So will Windows Phone 7 get the Apollo update?

Yes it will, only limitations are whatever if any features Apollo brings that the current hardware can't handle.

What he said.

I don't think that M$ would let do that fragmentation between earlier and newer handsets like Android does.

What is with all the hate towards HTC on this site?

I don't think people hate them.  Just disappointed by their on-again/off-again commitment to the platform.

They've always been committed to WP and they release phones with every iteration of the software, the radar is selling more than the lumia, what more do u want them to do?

they release phones with every iteration of the software
They're not planning on releasing a Tango phone, so that's not really true.
the radar is selling more than the lumia
Not true.  Nokia outsold HTC by a significant margin last quarter.
what more do u want them to do?
Commit to the platform.  Release as extensive a series of options for Windows as for Android.  Launch phones on prepay and postpay carriers.  Bring their best phones to all the major carriers.  Heck, bring their entire range of phones to all the major carriers.  Advertise Windows Phone handsets with the same amount of commitment that they advertise Android handsets.
They're not doing any of this.  Nokia is.  That's why Nokia is pushing them into a distant second place in the Windows race after just one quarter.

I know. The Titan II hasn't even landed yet and these guys already want more.

It's hard seeing Android get all the love but the way MS limits hardware is probably more to blame than HTC.  HTC has devices our for each level, 1 gen and 1.5 gen.  They have committed now to 2nd gen. It's great to see they are keeping positive and staying on board. The manufacturers have admitted they screwed up last year with all the freaking droids.  This year device churn should be less and we should have a more stable phone platform to compete with.  With Tango rumored to hit low end devices, HTC probably feels the Radar is low enough and they will let Nokia take the low end phones to the countries Nokia already deals with.  Play smart.

I don't think it's unreasonable for customers to want HTC to be as committed to the platform as Nokia.

Did MS give HTC billions in cash? I think HTC jumped in with both feet knowing it was a risk, and I'm grateful for it. Sometimes we forget that there are a lot of other manufacturers that haven't released a single windows phone.

No they did not. They gave it to Nokia instead, FOR A REASON! While Nokia brings everything they've got to the table, HTC will always look at WP as that other platform. They'll never look at the WP OS on equal footing with Android. They give everything they've got to Android first and second only to WP. I don't blame them for that but please don't blame MS also for directing their attention more to Nokia than any other OEM. Although I'm using the HTC Radar as my initial foray into WP7, I'm happy though that Nokia is playing top dog in the platform because my Apollo upgrade will definitly and absolutely be a Nokia! 

That was my point.  If MS had also given them billions I'm sure we'd have seen even more from HTC.  As it is they've already put out a lot of WP7 devices with little guarantee of the platform skyrocketing to success.  They did make a ton of windows mobile devices though remember, so don't think they're only all about Android.  They have to be smart as a company and try new things but also keep a steady cashflow.  The better WP7 does the more they'll embrace it I believe.  The Titan II is one hell of a phone for "that other platform".  I agree that Nokia is the flagship designer though, HTC will have to change it up to compete with them.

But even if MS gave money to these other OEMs, they would never give up Android! so why would MS give money to them! On the other hand, Nokia from the get go said they will make WP their primary OS. I'm sure giving the money to Nokia was not an arbitrary action. I'm sure it was a well thought-out decision. If I were MS, I would do the same thing, give my $250M to Nokia who I know will devote everything they've got to my OS rather than to someone else who I know will only give a half-hearted attempt because there is always Android to fall back on.

Nokia all the way baby. Forget about Samsung (no upgrades) and HTC (same old). Just way for the Finns bringing the HEAT!!!

Same old same old? How do u think a phone should be designed? Just put a case on it or maybe u should apply to their design team till then cállate el pinche hocico

HTC has publically admitted that they released WAY too many phones last year and are paring down their offerings (Android mostly). They have already released or will release 3 Windows Phones that have been updated. A high end phone, a lower end phone and another high end phone to supplant the high end phone. So now they have a high, mid, and semi-low end phone. I think this is just part of being able to focus on a few quality products rather than a flood of confusing products that cannot differentiate themselves from one another (mostly on the Android side).

Exactly

I'm more worried about the fact there most likely won't be any announcements of any WP dual core phones. I'm all for the fact that WP doesn't need dual core to run smoothly, it runs awesome on a single core as the OS is built for it, but man when I read this morning HTC and other manufacturers are releasing quad core you can't help but think that is awesome. Even if it's on a mud OS like Android just imagine how quick web pages and games will load compared to our phones. I just think if there's no increase technology wise for WP it may another downfall for our awesome OS.

Try running the standard Android webkit browser on a dual-core Android phone, and compare it to IE9 on a Focus S or Lumia 710.
IE is MUCH faster and smoother.  Even with twin 1.5 GHz cores, the Android browser stutters, freezes and crashes.

That may be true but tech heads love a good arms race. It'll take clever marketing to get people to overlook that fact

Well, before the year ends, I'm sure we'll have dual-core Apollo phones in the market. Although my first foray into the WP platform is an HTC Radar, I myself am personally looking at Nokia for my Apollo upgrade. I'm sure it'll be amazingly smooth and fast while Android will still stutter on some tasks on quad-core because of the way the OS is designed.

Agreed.  I used to think Android was fast enough but I'm spoiled on WP7 now.  It's made me not like my android tablet anymore. :(

I'm just stoked that Australia is finally getting some WP7 love... I was getting sick of buying all my devices from the USA...

What? There are 4 or 5 WP7 devices in Australia. Some are discontinued a year later, but each carrier still has 1 on offer. I got my HD7 from Telstra. But it's always good to see more on offer.

And lemme call a little "bull puckey" on people who claim HTC's "hands are tied" and "they're out of options until Apollo."
Here are just a few examples of some phones they could launch with tech they have today:
1) Beats-based handsets (in conjunction with Zune, this would be a very interesting play);
2) High-end HSPA+ unit for T-Mobile USA;
3) Higher-capacity RAM handsets (with 32 or 64 GB of RAM to appeal to the "not enough storage" people);
4) Ruggedized versions with extended battery life and water/shock resistance;
5) A low-end prepaid version for Virgin Mobile (similar to the Android handsets they're producing for that carrier).
All of them would be unique devices that nobody else is making.  HTC could make them if they took the WP market seriously... unfortunately, they don't take the WP market seriously.  "No new phones for a year" demonstrates that.

I think it is a mistake to be so harsh on HTC which has shown more support for WP7 than any other OEM to date including Nokia (with respect to producing the broadest line of handsets).  Clearly, Nokia is going to take the number one spot among WP7 OEMs.  With the Titan, HTC has the biggest screen of any phone period.  Nokia is doing more advertising but they are also getting $250 million from Microsft in platform support.  That makes a huge difference in a low margin business.  Apple is the only phone maker getting premiums on the hardware, for everyone else it is a volume game.  
HTC does not exists to commit to platforms that have not shown overwhelming consumer adoption rates.  HTC operates with finite resources and has shareholders to answer to.  Don't take it wrong, I am a huge WP7 fan and we have three in my household.  I believe WP7 is going to become a dominant ecosystem.  But business is business and the deployment of capital is goverened by net present values and internal rates of return based on  risk adjusted / discounted cash flows.  That is the bottom line.  
It is not fair to paint HTC with the same brush as Nokia because HTC did not paint themselves into the same corner that Nokia did.  And I have much respect for Nokia and what Stephen Elop is doing there.  When Apollo hits, all will be well.  

Well, I don't believe MS just woke up one morning and decided to give Nokia $250M. I'm sure it was a well thought-out and deeply considered decision. I think you'll have a glimpse of what that reason/s was/were by the way Nokia and HTC (or Samsung or LG for that matter) approach WP. To Nokia, they're committed to making it their number one OS while to HTC it's Android that's number one with WP a far second. Nokia gives everything they've got to the WP table while HTC will always give their first priority to Android and won't look at WP on equal footing. I don't blame HTC, in fact my first foray into WP is by way of the Radar. Of course, my next Apollo upgrade will be a Nokia! If I were MS, I'd also give my $250M to Nokia!

Great news. HTC are a big hitter and I look forward to seeing what they can bring to the table with their Apollo handsets.

So no Apollo update for the original HTC Titan?

The Titan, is a solid piece of kit, and apparently the Radar, and even the Surround, and HD7, have some life let in them. HTC can afford to wait through much of the 1st half of 2012, before announcing anything beyond the Titan II, without losing out summarily, to Nokia. I love my Titan, and I know many others who won't buy much else, beside and HTC rig. I think that HTC is going to try some outer design changes, that will take time to implement, and so this is a pragmatic course. Plus, the Titan II, will be a 1st Gen, LTE device, without the benefit of the better battery technology, and processor power-consumption tweeks, that are inevitably coming soon. All in all, I think it's a good decision. Coming out with a new phone every two weeks, is a rookie Android move, that they already have some experience, with the repercussions, of.

HTC has admitted that they release too many devices and have maybe not given each one the attention to detail it deserves. They said as a result they would introduce less but better phones. This sounds like part of that plan.