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Belfiore: Nokia deal will cause fewer secrets with Microsoft, faster production

A few days ago, Microsoft announced their plans to purchase Nokia’s Devices and Services division (along with some patent deals) for 7.2 billion dollars. The deal was both expected and somewhat of a surprise since the last we heard a deal was off. Since the announcement we’ve heard stories trickle out to the public. Like the inside story of how the deal came to be.

Tearing down the symbolic walls between the Windows Phone software team and Nokia’s hardware team has been cited as the biggest boost for consumers. Recent statements by Microsoft’s Joe Belfiore echo that idea.

Besides having a great head of hair, Joe Belfiore is also known for being a VP on the Windows Phone team. At most major events, he’s there on stage presenting new features. He recently talked with CNET about the deal between Microsoft and Nokia.

Since the 2011 deal, Microsoft and Nokia have been working closely together. But apparently, not close enough. Here’s what Joe says about the partnership before the deal:

“There are real-world examples of situations where Nokia was building a phone and keeping information about it secret from us. We would make changes in the software, or prioritize things in the software, unaware of the work that they're doing. And then late in the cycle we'd find out and say, 'If we had known that we would have done this other thing differently and it would have turned out better!'"

This is a scenario that most OEMs might be familiar with when it comes to working with any company that provides their software, like Microsoft’s Windows or Google’s Android. Once Nokia’s Devices and Services team has been integrated into Microsoft we should expect to see even better phones at a faster pace says Joe Belfiore.

Microsoft and Nokia have had a fairly close relationship, which become tighter over the years. In fact, the Lumia 1020 wouldn’t exist if it wasn’t for changes Microsoft made to Windows Phone with the GDR2 update. Now with the walls becoming nonexistent between the two companies, in the future, we should see devices that only a vertically integrated company could produce. Devices where software and hardware coexist in perfect harmony.

Source: CNET

Thanks for the tip Jason M!

  • Good news.
  • Belfiore For CEO❗
  • I second that
  • Not unless he gets rid of the Liza Minnelli hair style.  I would prefer Elop but either are good candidates.
  • Kurt DelBene should be CEO. Elop should be VP in charge of devices, and Belfiore of VP of Windows Phone
    Keep those who are strong and proven on something they are strong and proven with... That way Kurt (who has experience as Office CEO and Business at Microsoft) can cater to striking the best deals for Microsoft when needed.
  • I really hope Elop won't be CEO. Sorry, but I just don't want him. I want Joe for sure though.
  • Joe for CEO of MS? He is a great guy and I think his work is excellent, but MS is a hell of a lot more than phones.
  • This.
  • Yeah, he's great for PR but I don't think he'd suit CEO.
  • totally agree. He is also an okay presenter. Not CEO material.
  • He also worked for Zune and Devices, had a hand in the Xbox 360 UI from NXE forward, and also worked on the Windows XP team, he created the taskbar/start menu.
    My pick for CEO is J Allard
  • This. So much of THIS.
    But it would really be up to Allard on if he's really willing to come back to Microsoft or not.
  • Steven Sinofski would be great as the ceo
  • Wasn't he fired?  Dunno, but I'd personally not choose someone for top position after I fired him.  
  • Lol❕ I know,, but it sounds funny.. I don't really think Joe is qualified for that..
  • Well, it leaked today that ford is discussing a CEO succession plan..and since balmer modeled the reorganization after fords....i wouldn't be surprised if he is on the short list
  • No offence to Joe but he seems like to much of a pansy to be a tough business mided CEO. He just seems to nice.
  • Elop gets my vote. He was already in line at MS before moving to Nokia. He almost single-handedly kept WP alive and where it is. All respects to Belfiore but he is better suited as the talking head of WP.
  • At least Elop has better presentation skills. I never liked Ballmer with his sweaty ogre, loud-mouthed, used-car salesman look
  • LOL!!!
  • Elop gets my vote too. That guy can and will change Microsoft's reputation for the better. I'll go for Joe once Elop is ready to retire
  • Looking forward to what improvements this will bring. If he's right, this is what WP needs to become a greater OS.
  • What WP needs is for Belfiore and his team to get off their fucking asses, or turn over the OS to the real Windows teams. You know, the one's who are moving in ultra rapid.
  • That's a lot strain on one team then,
  • It was a point, that's all. Nokia shouldn't have to ask to get their camera app as the default app; Nokia shouldn't have to create a ringtone maker; Nokia shouldn't have to create a network fixing app; Nokia shou...on and on and on (they probably asked for 2 GB of RAM support and support for higher MP camera, who knows). I love Windows 8 and that is why I got a WP, but it is clear that Belfiore's team has not yet lived up to the Windows brand. Just look at what has happend to Windows 8 in 10 months, 8.1 is a huge accomplishment in that time. WP is great, but not great enough, and the only way to prove everyone wrong is to make a huge feat with WP 8.1. Belfiore should stop trying to be Apple and just do what made Windows great to begin with, which is doing everything, not being a controlled experience. Windows managed to be open yet not fragmented, unlike Hemodroid, and that is what they should aspire for.
  • +1000
  • 100% this.
  • In a couple of years the hardware will run full Windows in our pockets anyway. Foldable PC-Tablet-devices will finally save us from this discussion and Belfiore will be doing smartwatches. :)
  • Argh....., still can't believe there are people blaming Joe Belfiore and his team for Windows Phone's slowness.
    Rockartisten, can you please blame Steve Ballmer instead of Belfiore? Ballmer's the departing CEO of Microsoft and he can control the WP Team the way he wants to, including rejecting Belfiore's proposals if he wants to and the whole WP Team can do nothing about it but do what Ballmer instructs Belfiore to do.
    I also know WP8 GDR2 is a flop because the "Other" fix is a auto-fix but I already guessed Ballmer had a hand in GDR2's final phases even before we consumers can see the updates.
  • I don't think the Windows Phone team is actually very large. I suspect it is well under 100 people in software design, development and testing. The issue isn't so much that it needs handing over to the 'real' Windows team as that they need more people and more resources - and now, possibly, a different type of people. Microsoft just have not been taking it seriously enough.
    I tend to think that for the last couple of years, the team has been utterly focused on work behind the scenes rather than up front. Shifting the technology over from Windows CE to Windows NT, and from .NET Compact Framework to CoreCLR, while keeping compatibility with was hard. For the last year I suspect they've been focusing on getting the newer Windows Runtime's feature set in sync with Windows 8.1. The GDR releases feel like they've been in the hands of a Sustained Engineering team rather than the main product development team.
    It's very difficult to be making changes to the user-visible parts of a system when the internals are changing so fundamentally, and are not stable. You're always questioning whether any instability is down to what you're doing, or down to problems in the back end. This level of instability ultimately caused the cancellation of Windows "Longhorn" and its replacement with Windows Vista (search for Longhorn Reset). Microsoft are trying so hard not to make that mistake again that they have swung far too far the other way, seemingly not wanting to even start any user-visible changes until the APIs and underlying platform have stabilised. This is why Windows 8's PC Settings 'Metro' control panel was missing so many features of the legacy control panel, and why the Mail, Calendar, People and Messaging app was so minimal in the Windows 8 Developer Preview and even still pretty poor at Windows 8 RTM.
    Once the SDKs and user experiences are properly in sync between Windows Phone and Windows 'immersive' mode - and changes made to the development groups to keep them that way - Windows Phone will need different skill-sets to enhance the user experience. Moving Terry Myerson from leading Windows Phone to being in charge of Operating Systems as a whole may make it easier to keep Windows and Windows Phone in sync.
  • How about updates? I'm tired of waiting for those.
  • Once Windows Phone becomes bigger they can demand that
  • No, it's once Steve Ballmer leaves Microsoft, the Windows Phone Team can demand at Android-pace updates for Windows Phone.
  • 4% market share...
  • Belfiore does indeed have awesome hair.  I'm so jealous.
  • That's why he was always "hair" to the throne....................*a tumbleweed dynamic wallpaper appears*
  • I agree.  He has Rockstar hair.
  • Not just rockstar hair. Steve Perry hair. (Bing it youngsters)
  • I'm almost sad that I don't have to Bing
  • Who? ;)
  • what if it is wig :) lol
  • This is irrelevant. Much like WP in few years.
  • Yep it is....
  • Always good news❕
  • Nevertheless, I am still feeling moody when thinking about the possibility of not having Nokia-branded smartphones anymore in the future. Please, please, please do not let this happen.
  • It's already happened.. It's time to move forward...
  • The unicorn phone is coming
  • Not today NIST.
  • Things can always change. Microsoft could license the Nokia name for smartphones too, as they did with feature phones. Personally I think they should, as the name-brand recognition of Nokia in all markets is very valuable, more so than Lumia. I'd call the next Windows Phones "Nokia ###". I am worried that not licensing the Nokia name for smartphones will hurt their grown potential.
  • What's the point of worrying❔... Has Microkia failed us yet❔... Keep in mind that Microsoft didn't take Nokia away. Microsoft didn't kill Nokia, and Microsoft didn't take over Nokia by winning a bloody war.. This was a decision made by both MS, and Nokia, and obviously has been in the works for some time now.. I seriously doubt that part of the plan was for MS to slaughter Nokia's name, kill the Lumia brand, and keep WP from becoming successful.. With all the good that's come from Microkia why would you not think the opposite❔
  • MS should take a cue from Prince and refer to this as The Phone Formerly Known As Nokia. OK...go ahead and laugh...but is that really any worse than the other namings MS has come up with to date? Right? Forget Katy Perry and give me some Prince endorsement. No wait...didn't he just send his first Tweet last week? Oh, never mind. Just Prince babes then!
  • Nokia, though widely unpopular in the US, is still a well-known brand outside of US. So, once the Nokia brand is removed, there is that brand recognition issue that MSFT will need to overcome. I think this is one valid reason to be concerned about.
  • Well Nokia branded phone cannot be there since the whole unit is going to be MS devices and services unit from Jan 2014. So I don't think they will do that.. or Nokia has other plans.. may be when they are out of this ditch they dug and get enough money, they may start releasing smart phones.. with Graphene.:)
  • No Nokia name on the phone but does it matter if same people build it and quality is great? Don't be too obsessed with a name or a logo. Leave that to the Apple fanatics.
  • ^This.....!
  • ⬆his❕
  • Not being too obsessed. Just feeling a little bit sentimental. With time, I am pretty sure it will fade away into wonderful memories. Now, I may never sell away my Nokia Lumia 920 haha.
  • Not obsessed at all, just uncertain. Nokia has proved itself to be quick on the uptake with changes in the phone industry. I'm not sure about microsoft though. But having Elop as the head of the devices section allays some of my fears. That's what's driving my concern about the name. Will the nokia team operate independently and be their usual bombastic quirky self? Or will they be forced into microsoft's cautious, stackranked, over-focus grouped culture?
  • Tell that to Verizon!!!!
  • Nokia can sell phones under the Nokia name starting 2016 if they want to. They just need to get a phone division started again, I suppose.
  • And that's exactly why I don't think it's a good idea for MS to use Nokia if they could not buy the name completely. Could you imagine if later on Nokia uses the name to put out an Android phone, after MS had been using it for several years to market WP?!!
  • Have to agree with you, Hans. Its kind of sad.
  • Looking at it sentimentally I find it sad as well, but that doesn't mean that great times for WP aren't to come... It's time for some of you to make a decision about what's most important for WP.. Are you going to choose your emotional attachment to the Nokia name, or move forward with the new WP devices that we are used to Nokia developing, but with more synergy with the OS❔
  • Oh, I am totally ready for what is to come! But hey, it is not that I can totally avoid myself feeling like this, you know. From how it looks, the newly acquired Nokia team will indeed be the driving force of Windows Phone. Even when they are two separate entities, MSFT is already willing to perform special tweaks to keep up with Nokia's extraordinary hardware requirements. If the rumored Nokia Lumia 1520 is true, it is yet another example of Nokia pushing MSFT over the limit (because 1080p display is not supposed to be available until GDR3). I truly believe things will only get better now.
  • Here is my thoughts about this new shift in smartphone industry.  I wish WP good luck and hope Microsoft could make good use of Nokia's phone assets; even though history is against it.  I love underdogs and that's why I was supporting WPs and of course Nokia was one of the reasons.  I am also a shareholder of Nokia and I didn't buy Nokia shares because they were cheap or something.  I bought them because I wanted to support a company I have always loved and I felt a certain connection with Nokia.  Almost everyone in my family has used a Nokia phone and I was buying Nokia phones and almost distributing them to family members so they don't move to phones from Samsung/LG/Micromax/Lava or whatever.  I even converted few strangers to Lumia phones in past couple of years.  Now, you will call me crazy after hearing this story.  I bought two Lumia 521's for one of my neighbor and I was willing to give him for FREE so he doesn't get into android/iOS.  He was a feature phone user, I spent hours to set his phone up and move his number from other carrier to t-Mobile. Luckily he liked the phone and he paid me back.  Why did I do all this?  The reason was: I wanted to support Nokia because it was struggling.  I had little selfish reason as a shareholder too but it was more of an emotional connection.  I didn't want Nokia to die and get out of phone business.  You guys can call me whatever you want.  I don't think that I will feel the same emotion for Microsoft phones.  Maybe I will keep buying phones made from Microsoft but I don't think that I will be willing to buy phones for others.  I don't think that I will feel the same emotion to convert strangers to WP users.
    There is another reason I hate this transaction.  All these years, I supported Stephan Elop and admired his clear and bold leadership.  I loved him while others called him MS's mole.  I had faith in him and lost a ton of money on his promise.  People fleed but I held my shares and I kept believing him just to find out that "this was the plan all along".  This deal made me rich finally but I would have loved if Microsoft just found a way to lend Nokia enough money so they could produce phones without cash constraint and let them be independent.  I wouldn't mind if MS bought them once Nokia proved to the WORLD that they turned around and showed the world they are leaders.  Now, Nokia's image is completely torn and Nokia supporters feel betrayed.  We can debate all day long that Symbian was dying and bleeding but I can bet that Nokia's phone business would have been in Nokia's hand if MS-Nokia deal was not made in 2011 and Symbian was not called a "burning platform".  With this deal, Microsoft becomes even bigger evil and Elop becomes the worse CEO in the history of any corporation that I have known (not claiming that I know all corporations). Even HTC is alive but Nokia is dead.  Who will believe that?  It will become a text book story.  I still have this notion that someone will oppose this deal and shareholders will revolt.  Sorry guys! I had to let it out.  I know people are going to bomb me with their comments.
  • Behind you 100% aykaykc
  • Ajaykc
    I understand but we all saw this coming.
    Elop is my Hero and because of Nokia's support to WP I remained loyal to Nokia as well.
    I wish Microsoft could've bought everything instead of just the phone division so that the Nokia brand would remain but I'm still a happy camper and Nokia shareholder.
  • my dear friend, i share your emotions towards the company, but do not be upset. try to understand the deal. MS has purchased the devices business, not the devices! maning MS will be responsible for selling and making sure their availability. Nokia creates a device with Microsoft's money as it is low on cash, and MS sells the device. 10 year deal that is clearly a sign that both companies are rising as tru friends. And also, there will be nothing like Microsoft Lumia, maybe Microsoft Surface but Lumia will always remain Nokia Lumia as it s a device, not business.
  • I'm a "if you build it I will come" kind of guy.
  • Rodney, the worst emotional speaker ever.
  • Ahhh....shhh shhh shhh...there there now. Sounds like someone needs a biiiig hug!
  • Let it go.
  • Don't worry about it unless you start cramping dear.
  • Hope other OEM's get the same treatment.
  • Exactly, if you intend to have other players involved with WP you will have to give them the same access. They can't be playing catch up all the time
  • 'other' OEMs??
    SInce MSFT bought the D&S division from Nokia they do not need 'other' OEMs anymore. They have >80% of marketshare. I would expect some great hardware coming from MSFT with OEMs basically on their own. We'll see the Nokia specific apps merge into the base OS though.
  • Nope. Wrong, wrong. WP BADLY need other players, most notably Samsung and Sony. Companies with proven track of susses. Sadly with Android OS.
  • think waterproof windows phone by Sony, or a sexy HTC, but I'm not sure Samsung will go Windows.
  • Ummmm......... I think Sony will only agree to use Windows Phone if they can retain use of PlayStation mobile services along with getting Xbox mobile services just like how Nokia requested for Ovi and HERE services be used in Android along with Google mobile services.
    But if Microsoft says no to such a request like how Google said no to retaining Nokia's services for Android, then Sony will stick with Android till the day Microsoft says yes to Sony retaining PS services for WP and at the same time get Xbox services.
    As for HTC, I think their new WP phones will be still have Nokia copycat colors but I would like see their hardware format change if they want to extend the One series to WP.
    Samsung will still support Windows as it still dominates the PC market than Linux or Android for Mini PCs, but as for Windows Phone all we consumers can do is wait for both Microsoft and Samsung's announcements on news outlets and the internet on what's gonna happen to their WP agreement in the future.
  • I think htc might have a come back. Microsoft will not agree to sony but there might be less than 1% chance that they do.
    I think samsung will try to stick to Android unless WP grows stronget.
  • meh...give me Nokia branded smartphones or GTFO. ok ?
  • Are you nuts❔.. These new phones are going to be even better,, whatever they are called❕
  • I still remember when the Zune HD would be better than the iPod Touch.....
    He and you can talk whatever you both want.... they are in 3rd place and will continue to be in 3rd place if they continue talking and not EXECUTING !!!!
  • Zune was better than the iPod. A lot better.
    It just didn't sell.
  • Exactly. I am really tired of the Zune bashing around here, especially when it's used as some sort of example of how MS produced inferior products. The Zune HD was a fantastic product. If apple had produced it, it would have been on the usual Apple altar for their fans.
  • I only reason I gave my Zune HD up to my wife was because MS stopped allowing Zune HD purchases. I now use a 620 as a dedicated music device. The Zune HD is awesome! Zune name alone is better than XBOX Music. Lame.
  • So you call the Lumia 520, 620, 625, 720, 820, 920, 925, 928, 1020, and 1520 not executing❔... Some of you guys act like MS, and Nokia are new to working together... So, tell me something,,, what are you sure about is going to change❔ What is going to change that is going to lessen the user experience of the devices❔
  • I think he was referring to Software execution which they currently lack, and dont seem too bothered by it judging at the non existent pace the OS is getting refined and features added.  Windows Phone is good, it could be great.  All these phones pretty much have the same hardware, as far as coding and writing goes, it doesnt get much better than that.  With how much this OS lacks, they should be churning out features bi-monthly if they hope to catch up within the next handful of years.  MS has everything going for it, they're just in no hurry to get anywhere.
  • Don't bother, some people need a specific logo on their phones.
    I thought it was only an iPhone disease, apparently it's spreading.
  • Apparently it is when people are already ready to jump to iPhone, Galaxy or other phones before even waiting to see what future brings for MS labeled phones.
  • Sounds like a bunch of Apple fans.. Refusing to buy, or try, anything not made by Apple.. Sad thing is the only thing different about devices in the future will be a PARTIAL name change, and more features, and innovation... WP fans are no different,,, just a bunch of sheep as well....
  • People who came from WinMo probably wouldn't complain about a logo or a name. It's the Android/iPhone group that joined in. Same mentality, even with the Nokia (non WP) crowd.
  • :).. well they can have all the speed and close ness.. it is all up to the small 5 letter word which brings confidence in a phone.. I agree. I am not sure i will buy a MS branded phone... I may.. But before that i would get a few Nokia lumias and that should get me till 2016 to see what is going to happen then.
    Who knows MS might sell the unit back to Nokia by end of 2014 at a discount.. Or MS will be super successful with Nokia unit. either way it will be interesting to see what is in store.
  • Have you ever seem the movie "Tommy Boy"?
  • Classic. And fitting.
  • That is so closed minded.. You sound like a Apple fan.. Sad❕
  • There are no Microsoft branded products. They don't exist!! Xbox is just Xbox not Microsoft Xbox. Surface is Surface not Microsoft Surface,Even though some people call it that. Lumia will be just Lumia. Instead of the Nokia logo in the corner it will probably be just Lumia.
  • I agree about the phone, but keyboards and mice have always been Microsoft branded.
  • That's what I'm talking about❕❕❕❕
  • They do exist...just without MS's name always printed with the product name. Logos are often used instead of the name. Try to find Xbox or Surface in any printed mass media that doesn't show the MS logo. Everyone knows who makes it. Does anyone not know who makes the iPad? iPhone?
  • All of the Microsoft hardware I've owned has been quality from my first MS mouse to the Surface Pro I own now. If you're going to bash MS at least bash them on legitimate weaknesses.
  • Taking a wait and see mentality here. Too many past promises.
  • So sad to see how microsoft used nokia to promote its os and then killed it
  • So sad to see so many so called WP fans with Zero perspective...
  • It is.
    Me and you bro, it's just me and you.
  • I second this comment!
  • One have to wonder why they even have WP when they dislike Microsoft so much.
  • I've asked the same thing. Only thing I can figure is that they are just that big of Nokia fanboys... which would also explain their fanatic response to this acquisition.
  • I agree. These are old Nokia fanboys. They will be happy if you gave them a shiny brick with a Nokia logo.
  • Its abit offensive to be insulting Nokia owners isn't it?
  • These same guys are the ones who would buy a Android based Nokia device.... They don't really care about WP.... They need to remember that even the best hardware ain't $hit without good software... So, it's really WP that shines here.. I mean, Sony makes some very nice devices, and could've gave Nokia a run for its money if they were smart. So, its is possible for WP to survive without Nokia labeled hardware, but if Nokia makes a smartphone then they are going to have to use some type of software, which ain't gonna be as good as WP....
  • I would say, in the case of MSFT and NOK, it is Nokia's advanced hardware that actually pushed MSFT to improvise their software. I am actually with WP because of NOK, and I think I can say many people are in the same boat as me. And although I wouldn't mind Android-based Nokia, thankfully, after using WP for almost a year, I am never dying to own Anroid-based Nokia.
    We have to admit, there are still so many aspects of WP that need to be improved. But so far, I am quite content with WP.
  • Right❕
  • You see...the problem is...many people that you would brand as "WP fans" (me included) aren't REALLY "WP fans". We're Nokia fans who gave Windows Phone a shot BECAUSE OF NOKIA. We don't hate WP nor Microsoft, but we didn't come to the platform FOR the platform. We came because of Nokia.
    WPfans never really understood this apparently an apparently refuse to respect that.
  • You gonna be ok?
  • I am on the same boat there.
  • Same here. I use WP because of Nokia hardware, and use Nokia back because it have WP os. Should WP remains with HTC and Samsung only, and Nokia sticking with Symbian and Meego...I guess I'll still be using Nexus 4 right now.
  • I didn't get anything out of that..
  • No one is mistaking you for WP fan... which begs the question, why are you constantly on WPCentral? Shouldn't you be on some Nokia site/board?
  • So, if Nokia made Android devices you would buy one❔
  • @DJCBS - I think this is the second time I've totally agreed with you :)
    I've always like the look of WP, ever since Joshua Topolsky demoed it when he was at Engadget; but there was NEVER any compelling hardware or a brand that I felt was worthy of my money until Nokia came on board.
    Yes I will be taking extra care of my Nokia Lumia's, for posterity. 
  • u have perspective?? good for u !
  • I wonder how the other OEM's feel about this? Not that any if them made huge efforts to make the OS shine (except HTC with the 8X, I thought the phone looked great), but how can they compete against that? That'd be like Samsung getting access to IOS and trying to compete against the IPhone or the IPad. Interesting to watch indeed. I'll get the popcorn.
  • Google bought Motorola. Samsung doesn't seem worried. Granted, it's a reverse situation, but also similar in some ways. I think MS is less concerned over it, plus HTC and Samsung I believe are obligated to make Windows Phones (or at least, there's financial incentive for them to do so), even if barely trying, due to those patent license agreements with MS.
  • Yeah, this is going to be very interesting.. But, I have to admit that I'm tired of WP always being in some sort of transition, and always leaving us thinking how things are going to play out... We need this to work this time.. Nevertheless, I'm more positive about the situation than anything, and although it's going to be weird without the Nokia name, I'm sure we'll adjust in due time....
  • It will pass. Of all the women you've boinked, how many can you even remember let alone their names? OK...lesson learned today, phones are like women and buses....there's a new one by every 20 minutes!
  • How about a bus full of women!
  • As with many things in life Grasshopper, this would no doubt prove to be something more enjoyable in thought than in actual experience.
  • It's not time to worry about other OEMs. There is no other OEMs. Those assholes like HTC and Samsung have no intention to promote the platform. They produce Windows Phone because they don't want to break relationship with MS. They do this with no effort at all.
    If WP grow to double digits, they will come along. You don't have to ask them.
    To your question, who care what they think!
  • He can talk whatever he wants... I still remember Zune ... in fact I still own a Zune 80 device. Even w/o walls your hardware/software endeavours will fail if you don't iterate and develop at the same pace or faster than your main competitor....
    Give us the features that the main competition have and much more then talk back to us. Thanks.
    and whoever goes to reply back will be a photo a my Zune 80 from my NOKIA Lumia 822... to remember you and Belfiore that even without walls you can still FAIL!!!
  • I'm sorry, but what do you mean 'walls'?
  • He is referring to the mention of walls in the article.
  • Yeah, I think he edited the post, it makes a little more sense now.
  • Dude... Zune is DEAD❗❗ Quit living in the past❗..... Just make your next device the Lumia 832 and get over it❗
  • You still don't get this. Zune is just wrong market to get in. With smartphone, who need a mp3 player? MS realize it a bit late. They stopped development and marketing very early. That's whole reason.
  • Considering that smartphone weren't in high use when Zune came out and none of them had much memory... lots of people were using MP3 players at the time.
  • I think noting that the 1020 wouldn't have existed without Nokia is kind of a negative thing to point out. It shows that there have been times where Microsoft hasn't been getting the ball rolling fast enough and a third party has come in and pretty much tell them to do it. Isn't it the same with GDR3 and the 1080 display?
  • I'm pretty sure he said the 1020 would not exist if it were not for the cooperation between Nokia and Microsoft. Also that the 1020 would not be possible without Microsoft's GDR2 update to WP8. He is using that as an example because the 1020 is amazing and because it is a great example of the potential of the groundbreaking tech that will come out of the two working synonymously.
  • This moron should talk less and work more.
  • +920
  • +822
    I think you mean the whole Windows Phone team.
    Where is GDR2 for those ppl @ ATT?
    Go talk to ATT, Microsoft. WTF with that ?
  • The GDR2 update for AT&T has nothing to with Nokia or Microsoft so quit your arguing its MS's fault
  • Something tells me that if MS really gave them a nudge, at&t would listen. You don't just ignore a huge company like Microsoft.
  • That Belfiore is full of b*llshit. Lamest excuse for his teams laziness
  • Come on man, we have no idea what's going on at MS & Nokia.
  • Do you really believe that it's Nokia's fault that the OS lacks improvements just because they didn't tell Microsoft what they were doing? Be honest.
  • DJCBS, that Ballmer is full of bullsh*t, not Belfiore.
    If he and his Windows Phone Team are lazy, WP was gone for even before Nokia stepped in. Belfiore and his team already tried their best to give what we WP users want but it's Ballmer that's keep pushing them back, rejecting parts of Belfiore's proposals and delaying improvements made to the OS.
    I also can guess the GDR3 that most tech sites get is just a "Developer's Preview" and Ballmer can instruct Belfiore and his team to remove that feature and replace it with another feature that will be in Nokia Bittersweet Shimmer and the same can be for WP Blue.
  • I think this is the right move.
  • Read ⬆hat up there.. It's funny $hit❕
  • Are you Ke$ha now Rodney?
  • You guys crack me up!
  • Lol❕... Oh, so now you want a black transvestite❔... You're a sick bastard NIST:-):-):-):-)
  • That also means that Microsoft is ready to let go other OEM partners when it comes to building Windows Phone. These OEM were not doing a good job anyway on the first place.
  • The other OEMs don't need WP. They rule together on Android. Microsoft does need them for they alone (if Nokias destruction goes forward) can't do it alone. If MS is left alone producing WPs, then you can count the days until they shut down the project
  • You work at MS or something❔ Because you seem to know exactly what the future holds...
  • Haven't you heard? I'm the second coming of Jesus. I know everything. Who's ever heard of the use of logic to draw empirical conclusions, right? ;P
  • Logic should tell you that this isn't the first time Microsoft and Nokia have worked together... Why doubt them now❔ Are you sure you're even a Nokia fan❔❔... Ok, maybe that wasn't fair for me to say, but I just wish some of you would be more positive, and take this one step at a time... Lets just hope for the best because that's all we can do at this point.. Right❔
  • "If MS is left alone producing WPs, then you can count the days until they shut down the project." I think there is little bit too much assumption in your statement there.
    Although I have to say, I am strongly hoping, the newly-acquired Nokia team will always be the driving force for the whole WP team. They need to whip the rest of WP team's ass to force them to keep pushing over the limit. And now that they belong to the same team, the "ass-whipping" can happen much more easily. This is what the current Nokia has been doing. And hopefully, the development pace will only get faster afterwards.
  • I honestly share your hope that such whipping happens. I've said it before, I only believe this acquisition could be good IF there's a 180º shift in the way the WP team works.
    But the thing is, the chances of Nokia people replacing Microsoft people as heads of the WP development are very very very very very thin. And so, it will be hard for Nokia teams to do anything if their bosses have a different modus operandi.
  • Isn't Elop going to lead the new team? So, there you go, a "Nokia person" heading the WP development lol.
  • Nevertheless, I do respect your opinion, and you do have some good points.. You actually opened my eyes about some WP fans, and the background they came from... In the end, whether it be a Samsung, HTC, or Nokia, they all are WP devices... And, anyone who uses a WP device I can respect... I hate that this news has split the WP community in two, and I can't wait until we all get back on track, which I have tremendous hope that we will... It'll be alright❗❗
  • All this Fanboy Battle is quite boring and tiring to read... Can someone just tell me whether this means, once the deal is done, existing nokia phones will get updates sooner now??
  • Nobody can answer questions like that right now.. Those are the kind if questions that make this whole thing difficult...
  • Well, who will then stir Microsoft to take the initiative? His statement makes me feel a bit uneasy.
  • Us, the market.
  • Daniel accept this advice.....don't talk with CNET again they are android and ios fanboys and I think they hate windows phone .
  • The fact that people only came to Windows phone for the OEM brand is ridiculous. Furthermore, What part of "the same people from nokia are still going to be making windows phones" do you not understand? Stop bashing the deal when we're still unaware of what will come from it.
  • I don't know how many more times & how many more ways it has to be said.
    Fact is, there are Nokia fans and they are upset - no amount of reason will console them.
  • I actually grew up on Nokia phones so I kind of understand, but to go so far as to switching platforms just because their name will no longer be on the phone is completely silly to me. I guess you're right though.
  • I'm a Nokia fan boy,, but I'm not a complete idiot.. I mean these guys literally see the Nokia name as something religious, or like it's kin to them or something... I admit that I like to see the Nokia name on my 920, but I can live with it saying Lumia... They need to seriously get a life..
  • That is exactly my point❕ You said it right, my man..
  • What I find amusing is that some of these supposed Nokia fans, have decided the best way to keep that going, is by changing platforms and to new OEM's. My question are: How does buying a Samsung, Apple, HTC etc. allay your disappointment over this deal? Are you now more loyal to Nokia by supporting the competitors who helped put them in this position? Would you rather now switch your loyalty to another company, instead of supporting, at least, 32k ex Nokia employees who move over with the acquisition (before even seeing what this new venture brings)?
    I'm sorry, but I don't see the loyalty that many of you claim to have for Nokia. Maybe, the purchase of the D&S division by MSFT, is not only a move to develop WP at a quicker pace, but also a way to bring the more consumer minded thinking of Nokia to a Microsoft that is in transition itself. This melding of 2 companies, that were once the giants of their industries, could be very beneficial to the survival of each; not just because of the products that they produce, but also because of the unique ways of thinking and doing business that once made them the influence that they were. They've both failed to keep up with where the market was headed and made their mistakes. This collaboration of ideas, thought processes, business styles, engineering concepts, customer service skills, lessons learned, etc. could be what they both needed to make the necessary changes, that both obviously needed to make, to become a driving force once again.
    I look forward to seeing how this impacts MSFT, not just in their devices division, but company wide. This may just end up being the new energy and consumer driven kind of thinking that MSFT needed to change the image that some people have of the company. I'm not saying that MSFT will utilize all of what a Nokia acquisition could bring to the table for them, but I certainly believe that they should and I'm hopeful that they will. Time, as the old adage states, will tell the story.
  • Look, you guys are getting all snarky about this. Why is it difficult for you to accept that some of us here got to be introduced to WP only because of NOKIA? I am an out and out Nokia fanboy, and like so many of us here would definitely have the Nokia logo on my phone. Having said that I have grown so much in love with WP, that I am not switching to another OS, unless by way of having a secondary phone or something. But WP is going to be my first choice, and the erstwhile-Nokia developed phones are going to be my primary devices going into the future. But you guys still need to understand, the Nokia love is unlike any Apple-love. A very crude generalization made by me would  be - the Apple love comes out of star-struckedness, but the Nokia love is more earthy. As an analogy, being an Apple fan is like being fans of movie stars, while being a Nokia fan is like being a fan of people who walk among us and make a difference in our lives, someone, say like, Mother Teresa. Hope the personal and emotional connect is understood by those who are berating Nokia fans.
  • I call foul on the play. I think they bought Nokia to actually slow down the development and R&D that Nokia was putting into WP8 in order to catch up...Think about what MS had to do to accommodate them for the 1020
  • What? No. 
  • Well...they may not intend to slow down...but I'm pretty sure they weren't that happy about the fast pace at which Nokia was bossing them around to provide updates =P
  • LOL
    That has to be the worst theory I've heard.
  • Hence....theory, not reality.
  • I like this, you think that MS are trying to sabotage themselves.....Smart!! Oh no, idiot!!
  • Yes, and one big conglomerate usually means they can shove there junk down our throats. MS should supply the network Nokia needs to make phones...period.
  • Day by day I become more and more convinced that this partnership is a really good thing
  • There is no partnership anymore.. it is done.. it is MS only now..
  • Lol that's what I meant just said it wrong!
  • One thing is for sure is that they need to get away from the Windows labeling, make it its own brand. Because unfortunately windows and Microsoft have a negative connotation in people’s minds. And get away from ridiculously long product names.
    I think this is one of the reasons XBOX is as popular as it is. It’s not the Microsoft Windows 9 Gaming Console!
    And another thing, stick to and continue to flesh things out and perfect them. MS had a tablet many years ago and a smart watch and many others things that were ahead of their time. stick to it MS and don't give up on good ideas.
  • For whatever reason, I can't completely trust him. So many promises have already been made, but let's hope for the best.
  • Promises, promises, promises. After what  was promised last year at Windows Phone summit, and literally NOTHING being delivered I will be skeptical as fuck. If Windows 8.1 dont blow me away, or at least be a significant improvement im jumping platform to a vanilla android device as much as it pains me to say and as much as i hate Google.
    I LOVE Windows Phone, and really want to stay on (I was literally the first adopter with WIndows Series/Phone 7), but its getting harder and harder when I keep hearing "Dont worry, its coming".
  • I agree, but what were the promises you speak of? I'm not always up on the news.
  • 1. OTA updates with no carrier interuptions.
    2. A program for "beta testers" on the OS.
    3. Promising WP8 SDK in the summer, didnt come to Fall.
    4. Wallet integration with carriers.
    5. Lots of end user features that never came or even annouced since Summit.
  • I was being a bit harsh when I said literally nothing been delivered. Obviously that is not true...
  • No no, I see where you're coming from, as I too am frustrated that such a large software company can't seem to get this stuff done. Mine was a genuine question, and I thank you for the reply. :)
  • Yeah, it really feels like, with WP, it is always "the next update will make it all better", and then we are disappointed, time and time again.
  • The only secrets that remain are how long windows phone 8 support will last
  • Will be interesting to see the first device.
  • Nokia please buy your headquater back. I will always love you.
  • Will it also increase the speed of WP development?
  • Hopefully, yes.
    Realistically...doubt it.
  • Let's keep our hopes up, man!
  • If the apps situation is any indication, slower development is on the horizon. Nokia's hardware is actually forcing Microsoft to innovate.
  • You realize that MS can't force devs to bring their apps to WP right?
    Also realize that no other OS has put a tenth of the effort into apps as Microsoft has. They pay developers for their apps, they make it as easy as possible to make WP apps and in some cases they even make the apps themselves.
    I don't think they could put that much more effort into it.
  • I'll be surprised if they are putting any effort to combat android and iOS. They love to spend money and without any clue.
  • I'm not going to crab any more about this. I've got my Lumia 920 for one more year .with that said I have to give wp8 a chance till then . Then if wp8 doesn't deliver oh well .most of us on contract will probably be Making decisions hopefully towards wp8 but if the don't deliver to many will switch and that wont be good so I do hope for the best but I am expecting the worst!
  • I expect updates to my 920 for the length of my contract (gdr 2 we're still waiting on, then 3 then someday wp9) and if by Nov 2014 I'm in a situation where my expectations weren't met (with regards to updates) then I'll have some choices to make, too.
  • Paul, I can respect that.
    I'm not going sit around waiting on a couple of things I see as important forever either (notification center [coming with 8.1] and fixes to the music app).
    Can I ask what you are expecting/hoping for?
  • They say that all os do the same its all what works for you well bull s#!% ! When car makers design the next new car do they design they to be like the rest or better? I would be looking for the best product for me and all around so what do I expect? I expect Ms come thru with something better than the rest period the nokias we buy today we know there built by Nokia. But next year yeah Ms says they'll still be nokias but there's alot about this deal that we don't know about and probably won't say so now we're in a wait and see situation.when I bought my Lumia 920 there was no wait and see I knew what I was buying its more than just the name its the history behind that name .a history of quality like Toyotas and Hondas!
  • But like I said half of me has to stick around and the other wants to stick around because on one side there's alot of wishful thinking and it consist of sweet new phones and os updates because if it ends up some what good I don't want to miss out.i will be buying a Xbox one and would love to see what Ms does with wp8 and Xbox one integration
  • Now ship GDR3 and WP 8.1 Joe, enough dithering.
  • Fewer secrets = more fights/disagreements.
  • I want elop to be the president of WINDOWSPHONE!!
  • Till the unit is sold to Google.
  • He basically will be, when Microsoft takes over Nokia officially. I don't remember his title, but he'll be head of something to do with WP.
  • Could the name "Lumia" replace the lame OS moniker of "Windows Phone?" Lots of people don't think twice about WP because of its association with windows. It's just not sexy, and to many it's a huge negative.
  • Keep shipping WINDOWSPHONE
  • Joe is an idiot. Use $7billion to fix your OS and apps first.
  • +1. The OS is lacking in many ways.. and Joe's team is so slow.. and Nokia has put their best.. it is a big let down from the OS team.. lets see how it goes now.
    They brought down Nokia.
  • I'll believe it when I see it
  • Joe... I hope it's not another promise. This is what I hope after the deal. Nokia team will join the WP software development. So, the OS update will be faster and better.
  • Maybe Sprint will finally get some new Nokia phones, or what ever their gonna be called
  • I must be missing something in this windows deal! Other than maybe Elop, I am not sure how the rest of the Nokia board can not see they have Microsoft over a barrel and have allot to bargain with. We are told that it is good for both sides, but the only real winner is Microsoft as they are getting exactly what they want for a nocked down price. I do not see any other OEM or even MS if they by blackberry eating away at Nokia's 80+ market share. So why can't Nokia turn this deal on it's head and demand more money from MS and maybe drop license fee, in exchange for producing more phones. This can then be looked at in the future and more money requested from MS not to make any other os. This should give Nokia stability and guaranteed income over the next few years. The current deal only appears to help MS Long term goals. May look good to Nokia share holders in the short term but may reduce the overall value of the company in the long run.
  • I think Nokia is in, and has been in, much worse shape financially than most know and really didn't have much choice.
  • What i Have to say something really important. . . .
  • Now all they have to do is buy AT&T and customers might be able to use their Operating System update in the same YEAR that they release them.
  • Faster updates be nice, especially on ATT.
  • So about that Other Storage.....
  • It's really not a problem anymore with Nokias running GDR2.
  • Nah, my other storage is taking up 7.7 GB and I'm on GDR2 with my Lumia 928.
  • Dern, that's crazy. Have you tried those shrink apps?
    At one point, my 'other' was up to about 8 gigs but after using the shrink app and then GDR2, it's less than 2 GB.
    Do you use auto upload to SkyDrive for picture? I know that was a source of the problem at one point. Or maybe you have a lot music?
  • I had auto upload to skydrive enabled for awhile but just disabled it like 4 days ago. I haven't tried the shrink app just yet; I'm resetting my phone now to see if that helps.
  • Which shrinker, I have storage shrinker but it can't keep pace w/ updates!
  • I was hoping the same too. But apparently it's still there. To be fair, it seems to improve for some users but it doesn't do a thing to other users as well. 
  •    I just hope that they continue to push the boundaries as far are camera technology and that they adopt Nokia's philosophy instead of Microsoft's as far as updates
  • I don't know what you think Microsoft's philosophy is, but they are all in. I'm sure of it and I take this acquisition as another sign of that.
    If they don't continue to improve and innovate, they'll never make it and WP8 will be a multi-billion dollar mistake... and as some MS execs have said, it's not just WP, if they can't get the 3 screen project going it could be detrimental to Microsoft as a whole.
  • Wait wait... His statements imply that his team actually does stuff to the windows phone software....
  • eagerly waiting to see the next new releases from MiKia but have to admit, being a fan of espoo since 1999 and all, a part of me is sad that nokia as a standalone company, won't be bringing any nokia branded mobile phones to the market after this merger has been completed.
    will treasure my still perfectly functional Nokia 8210, Nokia 3200, Nokia C5 and Nokia Lumia 800.
  • I reply
  • At first I thought Nokia bought me, and that made sense to me. I don't want a Ms phone, I'd like a better network, a nice dependable phone, wait I have one its called Lumia, interchangeable memory and bigger screens. That's all.
  • Doesn't "Devices where software and hardware coexist in harmony" sound too good to anyone of you ??
  • I honestly don't know why so many people think this is the end for Nokia. As if Microsoft has some sinister plan. Why do people have this impression that Microsoft is this big evil corporate company? Sorry, but that title belongs to another company I won't mention with sheep for customers. Can't people see Microsoft are trying to innovate and push forward, giving us superior products? And that's frustrating, because they are going against the grain, never giving up. I am grateful that they decided to stand up and not just go with android. That wouldve been the easy way. Instead, they had a vision and higher standards. Popular does not equate good. I know so many people who have a load of malware on their androids because the google store is filled with malicious apps. Yet, they take pride in the size of their store. Quantity over quality, I suppose. Android feels retrograde and I hate using it on other people's devices.
    I for one would love to own a Microsoft branded phone (I'm pretty sure I read that they will still brand it Nokia for 10 more years, though). I am a Nokia fan, but I am also a WP fan. This new merge is good news and that's that.
  • Windows Phone... RULES!!!
  • Bout time. That seamlessness has been an advantage of Apple's for a long time. Now lets see what this new look Microsoft can do
  • Joe looks like Steve Perry in the 80's.
  • In other words, a giant awakens to rival Apple! and probably match Android???
  • In Joe we trust. Belfiore for Microsoft CEO! And not just cause he got great hair. 
  • While im not looking forward at all to no more Nokia branding on phones (I can live without the Lumia name but Nokia id another story). But I am looking to the awesomeness that comes from this new giant
  • Yeah Nokia was slowing Microsoft down. :D