Nokia EOS Windows Phone

More pics on the Nokia EOS Windows Phone find the light of day [Updated: new images]

Update: We've added some new shots of the EOS below that have been published over on GSMArena.

Earlier today we shared some leaked images of what is reported to be Nokia's EOS Windows Phone. It didn't take long and a few more pictures have surfaced highlighting the 41MP camera.

ViziLeaks posted two images on their Twitter page showing the backside of the phone and the Pureview Camera. If these photos are accurate, the camera will have a huge (by smartphone standards) flash, what looks like a focus assist light and maybe a retractable lens cover.  

Or is that just glare hiding the lens?.

Nokia EOS Windows Phone

Still no word on when we'll see more of the Nokia EOS, Codenamed Elvis, but rumors still have the Windows Phone with AT&T for testing. July is currently the rumored, odds on favorite, launch window.

And based on these photos, the Elvis can't get here quick enough.

Update - here are the new shots, published over at GSMArena:

Lumia EOS

Lumia EOS

Lumia EOS

Update: One more image from Vizileaks has been posted to Twitter. The Lumia EOS is lounging in the grass below. 

EOS Lumia in Grass

Source: @Vizileaks; Thanks, everyone, for the tips!


Reader comments

More pics on the Nokia EOS Windows Phone find the light of day [Updated: new images]



Highly doubt it's 41Mpx, more like 20 for now. Current SoC does not support >20MPx and I do not yet see Nokia using the S800 SoC which supports upto 50MPx.

The original Pureview also relied on an extra dedicated graphics chip, so why wouldn't this baby use the same setup? The SOC does not necessarily have to do all the imaging numbercrunching right? :)

Because the WP hardware design does not allow for additinal/dedicated processors in current hardware.
That and the fact that it says XX (=20 in roman numerals)

Yeah, and 'XX' also gets used on prototypes when the final details aren't wanting to be revealed too early!  The 808 PureView prototype had 'XX' on it, so I think you're jumping to unfounded conclusions.

Actually its sensor is so much bigger then a normal point and shoot a zoom lenses would be way bigger (as in the distance from the sensor it would have to be for a telephoto effect on the telephoto side of the zoom). They could have gone with a p&s sized sensor and a zoom but I prefer better then p&s quality prime personally.

Nokia has already done this with the N93. I had that phone and the optical quality was amazing, but low light noise characteristics weren't great. It had a 3X optical zoom lens, and you can also zoom it in and out DURING video recording. It was amazing. But it was also big. I'm guessing that's why they stopped trying.

Hmmm, I wonder if this will have built in Neutral Density Filters like my N8 does.  That is actually a useful feature!

It is just a tinted piece of glass that darkens the entire photo.  Most cameras have aperture blades that allow you to reduce the exposure of a photo, but phones do not.  (except I think the N93 may have)  Once you reach the fastest shutter speed possible and still need to darken the photo, the ND filters activate and come to the rescue.  It also slows down the shutter speed during video recording in bright conditions, to help capture more fluid movement characteristics, instead of the stuttering effect all phones suffer from.  
The N8's ND filter was on a motorized wheel that would drop down in front of the camera lens when conditions got too bright.  And when you were finished using the camera, it would drop a lens cover over the camera to protect it.  

Even N73 had that when ever i pointed it towards a light source a black cover used to immediately fall from up over the lens

^This.  I still have mine - in mint condtion - and will use it when I want to take better shots than what my L900 can give me.  Otherwise, it sits in a drawer...

ND filter was built in from the start in the 808 pureview, I see no reason to omit it in this beauty.

I'd actually love to know why the bump is that big.... I mean area not height... its a good bit bigger than the 808... It'd be nice if they had a cd-changer style lens swap system... 1x, 3x, 5x or 1x, 1.5x, 3x..... i know that'd be overkill  on a lossless zoom pureview camera but it'd add to the greatness none the less

I believe the X's are symbols of unknown values. They knew the mega pixel count was going to be more than 9, and designed taking that into account.

They usually put "XX Megapixel" on all phones that are in the prototype/test phase. To hide the true capabilities until it is officially announced.

I think the 2 connecter points are for a case with wireless charging, I don't think it will come with it, like the 925

I wonder if this will be their strategy going forward to reduce bulk as well as to ensure that they are not setting themselves for failure if Qi does not become the defacto standard for wireless charging now that a competitor exists.

How can that phone have built in wireless charging with a bump that big? It wouldn't sit flush on the charging pad.

Would have to be a fairly serious photographer to want this. Then again, if your are a fairly serious photographer, cramming a decent sensor into your phone is not a huge priority as you already have a decent camera.

No, but would i take my huge phone instead?
Besides, with compact apsc sensors cameras becoming more and more availbile...i don't know what catagory this would fill.

The phone is about the same size as the Lumia 920 which I take with me every where, so that is a yes.

I dunno, based on the picts i've seen, the hump does protrude fairly significantly. Making it a lot less pocket friendly. My 920 is bare able to fit in my pockets as is.
Which quite frankly would be fine if this camera was able to truly compete with other compact system cameras. But it doesn't. As other has said, its a 41 megapixel sensor...but still a small sensor. Just can't compete with even old micro 4/3rds or new class apsc compacts. 
Don't get me wrong, i'm sure it will blow other camera phones away. But if it's really about getting the "picture", why wouldn't you go just a little further for an image that is significantly better than any camera phone could produce?
That all being said, i've found the lumia 920 images to be really really good.

have you even read about N8 and 808? They have a larger than compact cam's sensor. The only thing is behind is probably a deticated picture processor and a big lens.

Compact APSC? That' an oxymoron right there. The best point and shoot period on the market is the Sony Rx100 with a 1" sensor, and it is over 40mm thick. The 808 and EOS have a comjparable 1/1.2" sensor and stacks up pretty well against the best in the P&S market. This is probably 14-15mm at the most, and it is a full-fledged smartphone. You are stupid if you think there's no place for something like this. A similar sensor to a $600 P&S camera in a smartphone that is still relatively thin. It's only been a few years since there were 25mm flip phones and 20mm candybar phones, and yet you think this thing is impossibly thick? There are lots of photographers who have said screw it and are using pocketable and smaller cameras like the LX7 and RX100, because portability and speed are far more important than marginal image quality improvement. No one had a problem with the 14mm-18mm thick 808 Pureview, and this one is way thinner, and packs the same punch of a camera, with OIS most likely too.

I have a serious camera, but even when it is with me my L900 is still more convenient to take photo's with rather then take it out of the camera bag, switch on, take off lens cap and take the shot.
A Lumia EOS phone would be awesome for 90% of casual photo's, and as a video camera, but like my serious camera I don't want to be watching the used space constantly on holiday when I can just swap in SDCard #2 and carry on instead (or choose a 64Gb SDCard and probably never have to swap).
This phone, especially without its charging case is nothing great in the looks department, for that reason I really hope they have the SDCard there as there are no real looks to spoil!  Otherwise I'll probably wait for EOS #2...
I would seriously splash down £550 right now though if this had a SDCard instead of waiting.

I am a parent. My Lumia 920 (like everyone else's) takes just awful, awful pictures of my kids most of the time. However, the PureView 808 takes great pics. If I can get an 808 running a supported OS, color me happy.

Anyone wanna buy a heavily used 920 in July?

I'm in the same boat. Video capabilities are great but would love to take decent photos with 920 for a change.

Do you have the Pro Shot app? I have an active ten-month-old and have managed to get some excellent pictures tweaking the settings on the app and using the Blink app as well.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic but the 920 takes some stunning pics. I am parent too and i have taken some of my best pics on this phone. As i said if you are being sarcastic, then bravo if not, then get phone checked out.

Same here, I have a few complaints about the camera on my L920... but it is a camera on a PHONE, and it takes better pics than any point and shoot I have ever owned.  It does not fit in the same category of the pics that my video camera can take, but that thing has 3 CCDs and a fairly powerful processor to take fast pics even in changing lighting conditions.  It also gets terrible battery life, and doesn't fit in my pocket.
Meanwhile the 920 is on my person at all times, and does a great job in my poorly lit house, and a phenominal job outside.  Still stoked about the prospect of my next phone having an even more stellar camera, but in the mean time I am not complaining about what I have got.

In bright light, when they hold still, it can take some decent pics. My wife has an 8X and her camera almost always takes better ones, though.  There is a severe bug in focusing on the 920 where you can actually watch the phone auto-un-focus when you half-press the shutter or tap the target on the screen.  Sometimes, a reboot fixes it.  This happens on all four 920s "in my circle" so it's not just my phone.
This unfocus problem does not happen while video is running, which results sometimes in clearer single frames from a video than a snapshot.  Video in the 920 is truly excellent.  Thus, the problem is probably at least as much the software's fault as the hardware.  But firmware revisions haven't really improved quality much, so Nokia don't seem to know how to fix it.
There's a great review of how bad the 920's camera is on allaboutwindowsphone, which takes cellphone photography more seriously than any other blog I know.  Check it out and see how badly it performs under nearly all conditions compared not only to the PureView 808 (which crushes all comers) but even the aged classic Nokia N95.
Of "big time" phones on the market, the 920 almost unequivocally has the worst camera "on average" although in certain cases, as you say, it does take the cake.  It's just not often that I have bunch of kids holding totally still in dim light to make the 920 "shine."
That said, the PureView 808 is a wonder.  It takes better pictures than my Lumix.  If Nokia can pack an 808 into WP8, I'm definitly interested

regarding the auto unfocus, I would like to recommend for you to use app called ProShot. This apps inludes many manual setting including manual focus so I can focus a really close object now.

Some people have different standards. I'm guessing you are one of the ones who still think the 3GS takes amazing pictures.

I'm also a parent and mine and my wife's 920 take incredible pic. No matter what time of day it is and what environment. U sure its a 920 or are u using the LG thrill.

Why would it be an LG Thrill? Unless you are trying to be insulting? The 920 gets plenty of complaints about soft image quality, even after updates. Maybe your standards are just low. I know plenty of people who can't tell the difference between their old tube television and a new HDTV.

A serious photographer wouldn't want this, no matter how many MP it says it is the lens is still really small.  Is the 41 MP achieved through software or is the sensor actually 41 MP?

Nope, it's really a 41mp sensor. The magic however, is in the software. The 808 used over sampling in order to create great low light shots, and uses the extra pixels to allow for lossless zoom.

Phone Guy... you gotta do your homework. The top serious photographer sites cover the 41MP sensor very well.

Yes, those sites do cover the sensor very well..........for a PHONE.
No site i've seen that has matched the pureview against at least a micro 4/3rds (and up) sensor and came away believing this was a serious replacement for a larger sensor camera. And believe me i wish it was so, i would LOVE to leave the camera at home. I would LOVE to have one device do it all. But it's just not their yet. At least based on Nokia's 808 sensor. Who knows, maybe Nokia has significantly improved the sensor size since then, but that is unlikely.
If you really think you can replace your compact camera with the pureview, then your drinking Nokia's Kool-aid.

That just means you haven't read the articles. And I'm not talking about theverge, cnet, etc.

If you actually read them you would see that NO ONE believes this is a serious replacement for a larger sensor camera.

However, they do all share the sentiment that the tech is seriously close!

Remember when our phones didn't browse the web very well and had only WAP service and slow processors? Heck remember when they had no cameras at all?

Look at this tech as iterative processes instead of one thing taking over all or nothing.

And for the record, I drink Technology Kool-aid! Not Nokia.

I've been very happy with the quality of my 920's photos and video.  What trumps it for me is the conveneince of not only always having the camera with me, but with the fact that it's part of my phone.  That means I can instantly share, post, etc.  Oh, and my pics get automatically backed up to SkyDrive.  And that's not even getting into the constant innovation we are seeing in software like the Lens apps for panoramas, best-shot, and so on.
The fact that the 808 even gets close to a serious camera means that this Lumia EOS is going to be a serious contender.  Coming close to serious camera AND the instant cenvenience?  That's a win win in my book.

Yes yes yes,  the pureview (and i am talking about the 808) is GREAT for what it is, but let's not delude ourselves into making it something it is not.
Even years old micro 4/3rd cameras destroy the pureview 808.The reason being sensor size and optics.That is something that no amount of software can emulate or correct for. The only way for a camera phone to achieve similar results is to have a larger sensor in the body, something the 808 did. It is however still a very small sensor comp aired to even micro4/3rds (it's about half the size). Add in that even m4/3 sensors themselves are half the size of full frame (35mm) sensors and you get a better idea of how small that sensor still is.
Because of this you will never see a large sensor a phone.  It would take up too much space in the body, and even harder to rectify, a large sensor requires much larger optics to be able to cover the whole sensor. It's a problem with how we still take photos. A pedicel of glass projecting light on to a film or sensor plane. Until that changes, don't expect much from small devices.
Shoot, if they can find a way to have the 808 sensor and mount it on a stabilizer like the 920, that would be amazing...........for a camera phone.

Never say never with technology. Just think. Just about anything with a LCD screen these days are more powerful than any of the earliest mainframes! They also had vast power/space/cooling requirements...the storage media wouldn't fit into today's refrigerator.

Nobody here is fooled into thinking it out paces your precious "4/3" camera. But guess what? It's getting close because technology companies are caring more and more about mobile optics and photography.

At the current pace I anticipate your points raised will be relics in a few short years.

Nah, I can say never in this instance. Your thinking about this as a problem to be solve by technology and are forgetting this is about physics and light.

Your forgeting that technology can overcome restrictions made by previous technologys with regards to physics and light. For example look at graphene and how that would affect the amount of light absorbed by a lens. You can have a much smaller graphene lens with the same amount of light intake from a large lens.
I don't expect it to happen now, but in the near future.

I believe the same discussion occurred when we first started seeing digitial cameras and look how that turned out. The practicality lured many in before the cameras themselves could perform or outperform the traditional SLR. Then look at how serious photographers use small point and shoot cameras to capture certain moments then think how this would merge. Nobody from what I can tell is suggesting the EOS will take over heavy lifting but it will take over some of the casual work for some who use point and shoot. Taking pictures is as much about the creativity as it is about the technology being used.

Well I'm not a serious photographer so all my pics are with a camera phone so Nokia's Kool-Aid is definitely being drunk up by me. Lol

You are too hung up on sensor size. While important, its not the ONLY factor. Oversampling essentially means each pixel of the final image is essentially 4x the size of the physical pixel and arguably with better noise resistance. You dont understand the tech and yet have the temerity to bash it openly?
Go read up more. The only reason I'd not ditch my DSLR for this is the grip and zoom. Agreed, I give up a little bit of image quality, but I personally find it acceptable since its ALSO a phone, which I am bound to have with me, nearly at all times.
Also, GSMArena had a blind test not very long ago where the 808 got the better of an Olympus 4/3. Whats your argument now?
Like I pointed out earlier, you dont have much info about the 808. If you really think you can get away with half-baked claims here, then you are probably drunk.

Sensor size is 2nd only to lens optics. If you can't grasp that, then you've gone too far into the hype bubble. You do realize the 41 megapixel image is DOWN SAMPLED right? The opposite of what you've stated so check your math on that one bro. The amped up megapixels helps with noise reduction and pseudo zoom functions. It DOES not simulate a sensor 4 times its size. Where you came up with that, I don't know.

Listen if your can accuse someone of being drunk or bashing technology he doesn't better be damn sure you know what you are talking about.

What do I think about the 808 getting the better of an Olympus? Well I call BS. That's what I think. That was judged online by instagram loving simpletons. By people that can't tell the difference between aperture and shutter. Its pretty clear (if you care to look) that the Olympus is better in noise and rendering.

You know what I think? If SLR zealots have to bring up SLR Camera X and SLR Spec Y in the same breath as the 808, then Nokia has succeeded into bringing something very advanced to the table as far as mobile devices go.

Yes effective PR, but not much PR was there for the 808. Heck, Nokia made it hard to buy.

What is out there are tens of thousands of pics taken with the 808 (some of them mine) that are posted on Flickr. Proof that it is as good as hyped, is out there for anyone to see.

Nokia has pushed pureview as a brand. This has been a focus for them, even back with the 808 and to be clear, I think the 808 is a great camera for a phone. My issue with people perpetuating the myth that this is a pocketable replacement for a more dedicated camera. That simply isn't true.

Well it simply isn't a myth. Maybe you just would rather keep your head in the sand. There is a large enough contingent of folks who use the 808 as their DEDICATED camera. It simply IS true that it can be a replacement camera. Are you OK? Is this a cry for help??

If you feel that you just HAVE to lug around 20 lbs. of camera+stuff to best the pics in that link then Nokia has got it right! Proof is in the pictures there, and not some comment post on WPC.

Guess what, I own a sigma dp2m and that's it. Was never arguing for SLRs, or even against the 808. I sold my gear years ago and have been on a compact high quality camera quest for years. Both digital and film. You name it, I have bought and sold it. Both With the exception if the 808. Though it was in my list for sometime. After looking at countless photos on Flickr I decided that the dynamic range was lacking and the lens a little soft. For what I shoot anyways, it might be totally fine for what you do.

I am just trying to temper the over the top enthusiasm for this technology cause quite frankly they way people are amped up for it, they will only be disappointed.

Ok I understand your position, but why are you trying to temper people's enthusiasm for this camera phone? It's already proven to deliver in that area better than any other phone.
It's a year later and we have companies (including Nokia) are still trying to best the 808.

I should say I have a Lumia 920 and love it. I think the 808 is one of the first real advancement in hybrid camera/phone. But I have to think there are other people like me that thought it was the holy grail and then saw that yes, its pretty good especially compared to what else is out there, but not good enough for me to sell off my one remaining camera. I don't see what's wrong with moderating expectations....shoot, I hope I am wrong. I want the EOS to have the 808 sensor with the stabilization of the 920 and if Nokia can also find a way to bring real narrow depth of field to a smaller sensor, I will be the first in line to buy it and will eat my words. There are just fundamental rules of physics and light and optics that make that really unlikely if impossible.

Cool. Well I have both the 808 and 920 (I have a nice thread in the forums discussing one over the other). So, what I'm saying about expectations is that, assuming this new phone gets the same or better sensor as the 808 then there is no need to moderate expectations since the technology has already been released and consumed.

IT IS A PERFECT REPLACEMENT FOR DEDICATED PONT'N'SHOOTS for a majority of the people. About time you agree to it. 

I'm talking about compact system cameras. Ricoh GRD, Nikon V1/2, Sony rx100, Olympus series, even the canon s100 or pentax q's out there. Most point and shoots you get at the local bestbuy are junk.
I don't care about the majority of people. The majority of the people out there are happy with their crummy android phone cameras.

Okay. Fair enough.
Do note the comparison here: a phone camera versus a dedicated mini-dslr (thats how I like to call them :D). Doesnt the rx100 cost several times the price of the 808?
While I can perfectly understand your point of view (I have a 600D and love it and its never going to be replaced by any phone camera as far as I can see) But I dont have it with me all the time for simple reasons of practicality. Thats why I am excited. The 808 was known to deliver very similar results as DSLRs in most general cases (like when you go out with your friends, like when you want to photograph your little cousin or your cat) and costs less and is way more portable, not to mention that I like WP and this is going to be WP8 phone. 
So essentially, now I can have my phone and a very good camera for the price of one of them and most probably have it at hand in the random moments when I would have otherwise wished "Damn! I wish I had my Canon with me". Thats why we are excited. While it may not cater to your very specific use case, it catters perfectly to a lot of people including me and if this is going to be what the rumors indicate, this is very well my next phone .

The rx100 is the cheaper one. The rx1 is the $3k one, which is way way out of my range. But even the Sony can indeed still be a little pricey though.

I get your point, your going to have a phone on you anyways, why not have the very best in class because your not one to have the camera no matter how small on you at all times. For me, I don't mind carrying a smaller camera as well as in the end of worry about being disappointed with the image quality of the phone later. So I guess for me I saw this phone as aiming for intense photographers, but thought wouldn't those people be carrying something already that is better quality? But I guess that wouldn't always be the case and it would be nice to have a EOS then

The way I've always looked at it as an amateur photographer is that the camera is just the tool for capturing the image. You could have a 60MP sensor and still get crappy pictures compared to someone with an 8MP camera phone. It's the photographer, not the camera that gets great looking images.

Before you call BS on what I say, check this out for yourself. See for yourself how the 808 and the Olympus are neck and neck in terms of IQ:
You have got it wrong. The 38mp image is the full resolution image, whereas the 5mp result is the UPSAMPLED one. Essentially, when you capture 4 pixels worth of data for a final pixel, you are UPSAMPLING, not downsampling.
Also note that when you do capture 4 pixels worth of light info for one final pixel, the effective light is 4x that of one pixel should you choose to use it (the 808 doesnt do this by what i see). So, the sensor element size CAN be physically as much as 4x that of a single pixel.

Nah. Its digital zoom. If its not done thru optics, I call it fake. Though I will admit to being a snob about that....

Its digital zoom, but not the one you think it to be. Each pixel of that image still corresponds to ONE PHYSICAL PIXEL. The digital zoom here uses the ridculous resolution of the 41mp sensor to 'zoom' in from the 4:1 mode to 1:1. Note that 1:1 mode (sensor pixel to image pixel ratio) is what you have in any other camera anyways, and that includes every single DSLR as well. This is not optical zoom, but this is not pixel blowup. I suppose its clear to you now. :)

It's closer than you think. There is a law of diminishing returns that limits how good pictures can be, and the gap is between an SLR and an 808 is quite a bit smaller than you might guess.

I have tried your suggestion and put my slr in my jeans pocket and it would seem that women find me more attractive now. Thanks!

Sure it does not, but as a wise man once said "the best camera is the one you have with you" and when I don't have my canon 5d mark II this thing will do. And it will do much, much better than a regular phone camera which would be the only option at most times. Besides even if I have my SLR I will still take another photo with my phone just because I can instantly share to social networks and to individual's by email.  

You shouldn't be defining what a serious photographer is. There are news organizations that have fired their entire photography team and trained their reporters to use iPhones. Like the Chicago Times.

Wrong. First off it's the Chicago Sun-Times, not the Chicago Times. 2nd, it's being widely misreported that the newspaper is switching to iphone photography. That is not true, yes they are having some of their reporters learn how to take better photos on their phones, but that's for when they are in a pinch. The real story is the Sun-Times has laid off their internal staff and are now using freelancers who, guess what, will still be using pro gear. But i guess that's not as sexy a headline.

They did that in low light photography because of optical stabilization in the 92X Lumias. But, in daylight, some Android phones and iphone 5 can compete. With a sensor like that, Nokia will have a clear edge over all.

Not only the 92X .. I've got my Lumia 720's camera shot some awesome low light photos, for any other competitor in the same price, this camera f**ks them so hard !!

The verdict on the Sony Honami is still out. I trust their photography cred more than Nokia. They have the best P&S camera on the market after all. I wouldn't discount the Samsung S4 Zoom as well. It actually has a zoom lens, something no amount of megapixels can compete with.

Relatively speaking, this is significatly thinner than I thought it would be. Can't wait for the refined models of all these devices next year. I'm gonna have some great options.

Sorry, but that device is just plain ugly. It packs some awesome Nokia camera tech, which will destroy any smartphone camera, but it's ugly nonetheless... :(

It's not gonna be a slim attactive model with a large camera hump. What do you espect,a skinny super model?? Get real 

Really! Can't get a big booty with big tits on a skinny model. skinny models(S4,HTC) is great to look at but the big booty& tits chick(Lumia EOS) is much more fun to play with. Lol.

I agree with the other comments here. Remember the 925 leaked images? They made the 925 look awful and something no one would want with a super large bump. When they revealed it at their event however, it looked stunning.

Glad to see it in another color other than yellow.

Gonna be upgrading in July so this may work out nicely!

Probably just get them running their photocopiers full throttle, actually. HTC too judging by their attempt at OIS and "Ultrapixels".

It is. Nokia has used xx or C00 for ages on its smartphone prototypes.
Also some of the old E series phones featured XX on the back of the camera module.

I heard a rumour before that Nokia was scaling EOS down to 20 MP.  I hope it is not true.  It would be a great disappoint if EOS is anything less than 41MP.  Sony is working on a 20MP camera for their next phone.  That would take the thunder out of EOS.  Nokia could build a 20MP camera into their future phablet or tablet, but certainly not the EOS.  That would be a big screw up.

I think he makes sense. The 41MP beast is impossible to be used on the current Qualcomm chip. The new 800 Qualcomm chip to support such a high pixel count won't come until Windows Phone 8.1. Windows Phone 8.1 won't be released until Fall / next year. Houston, we got a problem..

Why couldn't Nokia add a separate addtional DSP processor to support the 41MP?  HTC added a custom chip to do the camera processing on the 8X....

From what I heard before is that when the 800 Qualcomm chip will come in the EOS2 a second chip will be added to support the low powered state, but the 800 will be the main chip for the heavy tasks. Tha's when we will see 41MP. I do hope not too many people get their hope up too much and then are dissapointed on the reveal.

That's what I was basing my guess off of.  Seems legit in a way, but as always at this point it is just speculation.

It is. who knows, you might actually see the 41MP chip. looking at the hump, there should be enough space for the chip used in the 808.

Yes, haven't you heard: the new standard is to use Roman numerals to confuse consumers even more! /s. C'mon man, brain on.

Why would it not be? The surface area of that circle is even BIGGER than the one on the 808 Pureview. If you are talking about thickness, the 808 was just a thick phone PERIOD, sensor or no sensor. Nokia wasn't good at making thin phones, and they are still experimenting. The move from Lumia 920 to 925 shaved off 2.2mm while keeping all the same components. The 808 is even fatter with thicker plastic than the 920, an indictment of Nokia's poor engineering in making things skinny only just a year ago. It can definitely lose a lot of weight without much effort.

It's just ugly. Instead of redesigning a whole new shell to accomodate the very large camera, they went the lazy route and just gave the Lumia 920 a hunchback. Even all the specs are the exact same as the 920. At least with the 925, they actually bothered to try making a new design from scratch, which allowed it to achieve the 8.5mm thinness. Apparently we know where all the R&D has gone to over the last 9 months. It's definitely not to build a new shell and new phone to match the epicness of the pureview camera, that's for sure. Same pathetic 4.5" screen and 1.5ghz dual core.

Its a 41. The XX is there just for show. Rumor has it there is a built in shutter door that protects the lens. This is so my next phone

Happy birthday Bob! Hows Judy and the kids? It was nice catching up with you last week. I hope the gonorrhea I gave Judy has not flared up. Anyway, see you around!