AT&T removed Qi wireless charging in the Lumia 1520 to make room for PMA
We recently reported on AT&T's launch page for the Nokia Lumia 1520 and how built-in wireless charging was absent. We noted how this decision would have not been to save cost or a few milometers on the device, but possibly affected by AT&T's involvement with Qi rival PMA (Power Matters Alliance). The company appears to have opted for wireless charging shells instead.
While the PMA group itself sounds like a group of superheroes from a Duracell advertisement, it's saddening to see the US mobile operator go down the route of removing the established Qi standard. Especially since it's the standard Nokia has adopted. Here's what Don Mooers, Director of Device Product Marketing at AT&T had to say in an email response to a Windows Phone Central reader:
The AT&T Lumia 1520 product page
That's essentially the situation wrapped up in a nutshell. AT&T removed the built-in Qi wireless charging in favour of PMA with optional accessories. AT&T does note that they're working with device suppliers to embed PMA capabilities into the hardware beginning in 2014, but until then you'll be stuck with a PMA solution should you pick up a Lumia 1520 on AT&T.
So what does this mean for consumers? Qi and PMA will continue to battle it out and compete for world dominance. Until then, consumers will be stuck in the middle deciding which bandwagon they'd like to hop onto. Both continue to drum up support for either side of the fence. Think VHS versus Betamax all over again.
Head on over to our forum to join in the discussion. Thanks, darth_furious, for the heads up!
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Rich Edmonds was formerly a Senior Editor of PC hardware at Windows Central, covering everything related to PC components and NAS. He's been involved in technology for more than a decade and knows a thing or two about the magic inside a PC chassis. You can follow him on Twitter at @RichEdmonds.
then maybe nokia and microsoft will chose better partners or have stricter rules regarding AT&T leaving the features the phone has.
I am so pissed that if i would get this phone from at&t it would not be able to fully utilize all its capabilities
ATT is 100% focused on profits and 0% focused on customer service and it reflects in all of their decisions/policies.
I will say their service was definitely better for me, and I don't feel like I'm saving any money at AT&T.
Come on, MS. Just a little code tweak. Not hard.
Very sad especcially those ugly logo's ...
Luckily the only logo on my 1020 is NOKIA :)
Why can't USA telecomunication companies be like every other company in the world ? They always have to have special phones for them, special specifications.. Such a mess.
I just don't like the precident being set here.
But thanks for making snap judgements with no information and being a jerk and all.
Telstra - TLS: 62.95B
SingTel - SGT: 50.18B
Deutsche (T-Mo): 49.15B
So if the rest of the world have similar market cap, how come the competition landscape is different? Also, the market-cap is only one measure, but if you look at earnings ... it's even more of a level playing field.
Zeitgeist: The Movie (first release)
Zeitgeist: Addendum (second release)
Zeitgeist: Moving Forward (latest release) Watch them all, or at least one of them.
Looks like Im buying the international version... Hmm Whats the eta for that?
Nebraska is just an example. Kansas, South Dakota, North Dakota, Wyoming, Montana, Colorado, Nevada, Utah, etc., etc. are much the same. Even some states in the relatively populous "East" and "South East" like Kentucky and Tennessee have terrible coverage for large stretches.
HA! HA! HA! It sounds really crap. Your government needs to step in and regulate. The market isn't working for you there. Unbridled market forces isn't always the correct way forward and regulation doesn't have to mean Marxism. The problem is your 'Public Servants'; they serve big business, not the public. Governments allowed global corporations to make massive profits thinking they'd be able to take a cut in taxes, but those corporations just hived it all off into off-shore accounts. This is why we have a global fuel crisis and inflation out-stripping wage increases too. It's the same in nearly every 'democracy' these days. We did it to ourselves.
I don't believe Corporations are Citizens, and should have protected free speech. They don't even exist, just try to touch one. You have to touch a building, or an employee, but you can't touch a corporation. Maybe the closest you can get is touching the paperwork that describes them.
That said too, they should not pay taxes either. They have no production, can make no money, and it is impossible for them to pay taxes. People, and only ever people, pay taxes. If you try and charge taxes to a corporation (literally a legal figment), either the share holders pay the taxes (people), or the people that buy their services pay the taxes (people). Why? Because something that doesn't exist can't pay taxes.
Additionally, then I'm off my soapbox, corporations can't be evil, greedy, good, bad or indifferent. Again, they are a legal figment. Their leaders can be, but to say Big Oil is greedy is like saying Santa is good. Both are impossible. (I hope that didn't burst anyones bubble).
We should all stop trying to anthropomorphize corporations.
Finally, and lastly, AT&T is evil, greedy, and sucks. :)
If you're a carrier and you don't have the existing infrastructure to cover a large geographic area, the cost of entry is prohibitive. Verizon & AT&T have existing infrastructures and lots of money to expand them based off their historical businesses. TMobile does not. TMo focuses on covering as many actual people though by improving their infrastructure in large urban areas. If you live in one of these areas, for the most part, TMo is great. If you don't, you probably aren't going to be using TMo any time soon.
I mean, yes, it cost a lot to put up infrustructure in areas where there might not be much demand, but if you amortized the cost including urban areas,
Another thing to consider is if T-Mobile did manage to grab more spectrum and had to raise prices to expand, a lot of people on a low budget would move to prepaid options on AT&T (or Aio Wireless) or other carriers.
People in other countries assume AT&T has the best coverage though. It does in some areas and is tied with Verizon on others, but overall in the country, Verizon has more extensive coverage than AT&T, especially in rural areas.
The sooner a standard is adopted, the better. Hopefully this is a move in that direction.
First, who is "Don Moorers". I Binged him and there is no such person with a LinkedIn account or any search results with that name from that location for Microsoft. There is a Don Moorers who is a politician in the Maryland area, but that was about it. Even if I Bing/Google my name I will find several hits. So that's red flag #1
Second, why in the world would "Don" reveal such a backroom strategy like that to a customer who was sending a complaint letter. I think, if AT&T wanted to admit such a position, they would do it in a more formal way. I suppose Don could just be an employee who went rogue and decided to talk straight to a total stranger via email, but highly unlikely. Flag #2
Third, why in the world would AT&T even take such a position. Why would they care what inductive power strategy was adopted. Why would they want to alienate one of the top 3 phone manufacturers in the world, soon to be part of Microsoft. Why? Flag #3
I am still pretty sure they are stripping it out for the same reasons they are stripping out RAM. Cost. Unless there is a conspiracy to cause a colapse of memory chip manufacturers too :)
I still find it hard to believe this info would come out this way at this time. It's just my opinion, but I'm sure all the angry attacks will come questiioning my inteligence, and mothers character. :)
I'm on my 3rd windows phone (a Lumia 1020 because of the camera), but I carry an HTC One around because I truly prefer the way the apps run (the selection of good apps is key too) and how much better of a job it does on my WiFi than my Lumia...an HTC One based windows phone would be just about the best thing ever.
I too was totally excited about the 1520 until I saw how AT&T gimped it. I guess they did me a favor. I'll just stick to my 1020/HTC One wonder twin combo!
PMA devices more-or-less don't really exist. It's a standard with almost no products using it. It seems more like a bunch of companies trying to get together to create a brand new standard rather than adopt the one that the most consumers are actually using.
Qi has been available, at least as an option, if not included out of the box, on many high end phones for at least a couple of years. As far as I know PMA hasn't actually been included in any phones to date. So at this point it is more of a theoretical standard rather than a practical one.
My guess is that PMA is gaining partners because industry heavyweight Duracell is behind it. Qi, on the other hand, is backed by a much smaller organization. So even though Qi had appeared to have emerged as a common standard that was being used by real devices by real consumers, Duracell has somehow managed to convince manufacturers and carriers that their standard is better even though nobody is actually using it.
Can someone explain if this is even legal what ATT is doing?
At least they could make the battery removable and have the battery cover be the part that can be optionally replaced for wireless charging. I miss removable batteries...
I have the charging shell for my 1020 and hate the way the phone feels with this jacket on it. If there had been a charging sticker option like how they do for the Galaxy phones, then that would be fine because it is added internally to to the phone.
But what kind of respect does a company like AT&T have for the environment when people like me already have 5 wireless charging pads laying around the house for our various Qi charging phones and then they want to force some other standard. Either put the "standard" into the phone or leave Nokia's design alone.
It makes it impossible for companies like Nokia to even build an ecosystem of accessories because they designed them assuming wireless charging baked into the phone and now I can't use them and charge my phone wirelessly at the same time.
I also seem to have more trouble with my wireless charging on my 1020 than I did my 920 that had it baked in.
PMA vs Qi stands to repeat this and will cripple adoption. Imagine someone having a PMA device (which is unicorn right now) and going into Corporate Coffee Cafe and feeling like a a-hole because the Cafe has Qi.
Imagine someone buying a new car with a PMA charger but has a Qi phone. How pissed would they be?
Unless someone decides to be able to make a single charger that could have both standards... if that's possible, then maybe not so dire.
In all seriousness who cares! It seems a majority of the public could care less about the wireless charging! Everyone or everything I read people say it doesn't charge all the way through or you have to lay the phone a certain way. Plus with that battery it shouldn't be a huge issue! My LG g2 can lost a whole day on heavy use and that's android! People relax.... My o e gripe is us carriers like att delaying updates! Ugh!
And you have a gripe of AT&T delaying updates eventhough you know you'll never get them but have no gripe with a hardware feature being removed?
I would recommend that NO ONE BUYS THIS PHONE FROM THEM! This will also teach nokia not to partner with such and @$$hole company.
at&t is not a true partner when will companies like nokia and microsoft realize this???
This company water down their products and sell them to a few gullible people. Microsoft and Nokia WAKE UP!!!
Do you ever pull your collective heads out of your asses for a moment to see that your products are not selling as well. HEY IDIOTS, this is the reason why... AT&T screws up your product by taking out things that people want and leaves the S#!t that is not unique... and give you things that everybody has and nobody wants. Things thats so F...ing yesterday.
My recomendation is DO NOT BUY THIS PHONE FROM AT&T... let it flop, until they leave the features in the phone that most people want...
We as consumers need to dictate this... not f...ing AT&f...ing T
That's most likely the future. The precident is the Sprint HTC 7 Pro disaster. Sprint gets HTC to create a subpar device and when very few buy it, Sprint declares WP to be a failure and wait 3 years before they get a new one in the Ativ Neo.
AT&T has us by the balls.
For now, I'm sticking with my 920. I've got wireless charging pads on my desk at work and by my bedside, and I've got a wireless charging stand hooked up to my car. (Which, by the way, is really sweet to hop in the car, drop the car in the holder, let it connect to the stereo via Bluetooth, stream audio books during my commute, offer great up-to-date GPS, etc. -- all without any wires dangling about! Woot!)
Oh, AT&T. If you keep this up, you'll make me choose between my sweet "grandfathered" data plan or jumping ship to get the phones that I want without your interference.
ATT YOU SUCK!!!!!!!!!!
We can't sell you more crap with Qi because you don't actually have to by something else to make wireless charging work. We didn't like that idea so we changed it to sell you more crap.
My interpretation of this is that somewhere inside AT&T the following conversation occurred:
Person 1: "If we take this out of the phone, we can sell 2 different $50 accessories to give people choice. Choice is good, right? (evil laughter)."
Darth Person 2: "Consumers should accept this. They already accept our use of the Death Star as our logo - we've warned them."
Personally, I think this is bad for them as they are pushing away a lot of people who are upgrading from other Nokia phones!
I just think some people like to have excuses to complain.
There is no way most of us will ever scrap our current wireless charging investment to satisfy AT&T. Nokia customers bought those chargers with the expectation that they would work on future generations of Nokia phones. Nokia would be wise to issue a Qi shell for the 1520 even if it doesn't make independent business sense because the alternative would be a betrayal of the customer base they have cultivated for their Lumia phones. Unfortunately, I don't trust anyone involved in this at this point. The week of the big Nokia event is ending and we are still waiting for some straight answers.
Just give us our missing 16GB back AT&T, you rat bastards.
One should be able to buy phones in any eletronics store, unlocked and unbranded and the go to the carrier for a line or just buy a SIM card in the first newsstand one stubles upon. Or use the SIM from the old phone, logically.
That's what I do here in Brasil. But Nokia keeps delaying everything here. I'm still waiting to be able to buy a yellow 1020...
You buy ur phone sim free, take it to Tmo, get the $10 nanosim kit, and choose ur data plan. You have all the features of the phone and you get rid of ATT.
I know that this is not as simple as it sounds because of difference of call quality and range of service between Tmo and ATT.
If this happens, its going to be a slap in the face to Att and Nokia might just offer more devices through Tmo in the future.
August 24, 2013
"Each of these standards is approaching adoption of their format differently. Qi has been utilizing a push strategy and trying to get as many manufacturers to adopt their standard. Simply getting numerous devices in the market place will leader to greater adoption of the standard. They have been quite successful at this approach compared to the other two. If we had to place a bet on a single standard winning, we would choose Qi at this stage.
PMA on the other hand has been focusing on branding and developing a pull strategy by trying to build momentum through consumers. They recently gained significant traction when they partnered with Starbucks on launching a test for PMA chargers in numerous stores. With virtually no devices actually developed that will work on PMA chargers, we're not sure how successful this will be. There are some limited offerings of cell phone cases that work with PMA. In addition, most major manufacturers such as Samsung have joined all the standards boards to cover themselves. They have yet to launch product offering with PMA though. Starbucks also serves on the board so this relationship should likely grow.
We haven't ruled out A4WP yet but they are well behind Qi and PMA in terms of adoption. Intel recently joined which gives the organization body significant credibility and greater resources."
On the other hand Nokia has lost my respect for selling out to a fucking carrier like this. Elop should be ashamed for allowing someone to cripple his devices like this.
And then stick the other 16GB back in the phone. That's the change that has me really pissed.
I think the 16GB issue is all about money. Maybe they couldn't sell them to AT&T at the right price (which translates to profits) so they both agreed to go with 16GB instead of 32GB. They both get more profit and consumers get screwed over! Perfect scenario?
There isn't much Nokia or MS can do at this time. Nokia and MS really have to establish more marketshare so they are no longer at the mercy of ATT ruining their flagship devices. The other option would be to go the Nexus Phone route. But even then, ATT could and probably would try to punish them for it.
This may help as I mentioned in my previous comment.
This carrier segregation is only detrimental to consumers. Here in Brasil we have been in Europe like freedom for like 5 to 10 years, everybody is GSM and most phones sold are pays as you go, so no difference in the prices for branded vs unbranded handsets.
Isn't Verizon with like Qi instead of PMA.
Huh, only if Verizon carried WPs like ATT does.
I've been looking forward to buying the 1520 to finally replace my outdated iPhone.My iPhone has 64GB memory and I'm almost always at about 9GB free memory so I didn't buy the 1020 because it only has 32GB memory and no SD slot.
I usually don't get emotional about things like this but I have to admit that I'm frustrated and angry. At the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter to AT&T if some of us actually follow thru and switch carriers, even if the number was in the thousands.
I will just wait and see how this plays out. Timing is probably not favorable and who knows what the contractual situation is but if Microsoft decided to sell the full featured version thru its store I'd buy.
We live in a global market. You can buy the international version from Ebay.
It is now the perfect time for a new phone company to come on the scene and clean up the market.
Seriously folks, hit them hard on social media, let them know you're not happy.