Microsoft, Nokia & AT&T had high hopes for the Lumia 900 back in January
Microsoft with the help of Nokia has stemmed the bleeding of market share over the last two years as the new comScore number just published reveal.
The number of mobile subscribers is up 0.1% to 4.0% ending at the end of May, 2012. That means those numbers include the launch of Nokia’s much hyped Lumia 900 on AT&T and softer launches of the admirable Samsung Focus 2 and HTC Titan 2.
That’s the good news because Microsoft has been losing market share to Android and the iPhone for a very long time now. If we look back to the same period in May 2011, you can see Microsoft had 5.8% of the market and continued to slide up until the end of May this year.
The bad news is multifaceted. For one, these numbers include Microsoft’s legacy Windows Mobile devices, which presumably have now mostly died off. Number two should be obvious. Although stopping the hemorrhage and gaining some market share for the first time in years, a 0.1% increase is hardly anything to be excited about—especially if you’re Nokia.
comScore's latest numbers show Microsoft doing slightly better
The Nokia Lumia 900 on AT&T is hands down the most visible and well promoted Windows Phone to date. The marketing campaign was quite solid, presence was high and it was being heavily discussed in the press. Despite those efforts, Microsoft and Nokia have barely been able to squeak by and if anything, we can read the 900’s sales as being mediocre, at best. We're also curious to see how Nokia's stock will respond, though our guess is not well (currently it's still at the very low $2.14, up slightly).
That certainly has to be disappointing, especially for those of us who had pinned high hopes on this AT&T flagship device. And although June may also bring in some more numbers, our bet is sales of dropped slightly and not increased making 4.1% by the end of the summer the likely market share for Microsoft.
comScore of course is not the only numbers house around, so take these numbers with a grain of salt until they can be corroborated with other market indicators.
Source: comScore
Reader comments
Microsoft has stopped the market share bleeding with the Lumia 900, but still has a lot to gain
Wow, really? It was the most promoted Windows Phone? I'll admit it was, but seriously, I RARELY saw any tv advertisements showing off what it can do, but rather how the light blue casing would maybe catch a girls attention, oh it runs on AT&Ts LTE network (is that even really a Windows Phone features?, more like AT&T advertising there), it isn't a beta phone even though in reality, it is. Compare this with the first Motorola Droid ads. The pre-ads built up the hype, then when it was released, I remember I would hear my roommates tv playing the commercial playing "Droid" like every ad spot! What did AT&T do? It broadcasted a girl and guy traveling together using a Lumia with an Android interface (as far as I can tell, the taskbar looks more like Android than anything on WP7), getting lost and using AT&T's coverage to find their way around, not because of WP, but because of AT&T. Marketing is still the hurdle. When I start hearing Microsoft Window Phone commercials to the point that it is annoying me that's when I'll admit that marketing has done its best, but right now, my parents still don't even know the name of my phone, every AT&T store I've seen has only one posted of the Lumia posted, with only two accessories for it. I think marketing still is not enough. I want to see the level of what Verizon did with the Droid than what AT&T has done with any device.
Like most things with the merge of comscore windows mobile and windows phone numbers, it is difficult to tell exactly how many windows phones there are out there. Therefore, this entire article is bunk and useless considering it is coming to conclusions that are based on very little information.
* It may be that Nokia has sold a lot of phones, many of them may be upgrades from prior Windows Phone phones and other manufacturers as well as windows mobile phones.
* We know that the Nokia Lumia sold very well as it was not only sold out but also Nokia couldn't keep up the volume shipped to the US so they had to delay releases in other countries.
* AT&T and Nokia have come out saying that the Nokia Lumia has sold beyond expectations.
As Microsoft has put it, its a marathon and not a sprint. I think they have the right idea. Nokia's success will lean more towards how they run their company. Windows Phone will be a success because it is a wonderful product and sometimes it only takes some time for that to gain traction.
The biggest hurdle we've faced is getting people to get over the "Ugh... a phone from microsoft? Yech!" mentality, but nowdays, microsoft is becoming "cool" again. ...and this bodes well for Microsoft, Nokia, and Windows Phone.
Daniel- I disagree with you slightly about this news being bad of Nokia. Looking at the carriers in the US (where this data is from), you can probably ignore Verizon since many locations do not even have them in stock anymore. While I have not been to a Sprint store in years, I can only imagine they do not care about the HTC phone they have, given the iPhone contract they signed. That leaves us with T-Mobile and AT&T. We already know the Lumia 900 is one of the best selling phones at AT&T. Similarly, we have heard from many people in the know at T-Mobile that the Lumia 710 is selling quite well, too. I remember hearing that Nokia had taken the majority of Windows Phones back a few months ago and would think that number has only grown since then.
So while I totally agree that Nokia can't be pleased with its marketshare, the majority of CURRENT WP 7 users are sporting a Nokia-branded phone. We know that the most powerful source of marketing is word of mouth... although friends are likely showing off their phone to their friends (I know I do!), which can only reinforce the Nokia brand that much more. People that aren't initially in WP at least acknowledge that Nokia is a good brand from years ago so they perk up ever so slightly.
I realize that businesses need cash flow in order to keep their doors open. That said, by the time the Lumia 900 came out, one would think they knew all the new hardware features coming out that the Lumia 610/710/800/900 were the appetitizers for the real show, that being WP8.
Carrier support will make or break any phone/phone OS. I think Nokia has caught the attention of Verizon, which, if the rumors are true, will birth us a flagship phone for Big Red. The fact all the big carriers, outside of Sprint, are pledging to push WP8, I think Nokia has a leg up on Samsung, HTC, ZTE, etc.
IDC vice president already said in an interview that the Lumia sales in Q2 in the US were really disappointing. So it is not only comscore that is reporting these numbers.
And yet the lumia was the top selling phone on Amazon and the 710 was in the T-mobile top 3 for 2 months straight. Try again troll.
It's not just Marketing. It's carrier support. You can market the hell out of something, but if the product is not available to me within my current carrier that I'm tied with, then what's the point?
I think Nokia and WP will kick off once Pureview Technology and WP8 are presented and supported by Verizon and other carriers with each of them having slight modifications to these things.
Also, I see future success not only from carriers, but from the media and tech sites. Right now it's just mediocre support.
Today I was driving to the beach on Long Island and was listening to the radio. Then comes a commercial of a company that does something with radio and video. They say "...Now you can download our app for iOS and Android... blah blah" No one is considering Windows, but once you get the recipe out like I explained above, I think it will slowly change.
One last thing, Microsoft needs to get more big boys involved in making Apps. People don't just want to go on facebook, they want to run their lives. We need apps like TD Bank for banking, Ameritrade for buying stocks, etc... We need big boys.
That's all for now. Thanks!
Buy Nokia stock now!
The reason here in the UK is because of awareness and carriers steer people away from WP. I and my family are the only people I've ever even seen with a WP. I pushed to a couple of people i know, only for carriers to steer them away from it when they asked. They both ended up with android phones that the rep recommended to them.
How about not limiting your flagship phone to a single carrier, given that AT&T is loathed in much the same way as the Martells loathe the Lannisters?
Well, its been said, but here goes:
1) Android devices far outnumber WP7
2) The variety of Android phones offered at very different price points and payment plans and carriers far out number any option for a WP7 would-be-adoptee
3) Vendor supoort and enthusiam - its not there, yet
4) iPhone is not remarkable - anymore. The reason it does so well, still, is because it is still viewed as exclusive and cool. Once trend setters find something else to love, the others will follow. This is called, "keeping up with the Jone's."
5) Microsoft no doubt has a fight ahead, but like with XBOX, they have the resources to see it through. And there is no doubt they are working on a master plan as we can see with W8 roadmap.
6) Apps? Except for one bank of mine, everything I ever used on iPhone is available as WP7 and the implementation is often better. I think. Still, people mention the big numbers as if they personally have installed and need the thousands and thousands of apps available in competing platforms. To me its like my personal preference to shop at a place with more options, not because I want everything, but what if I did?
7) All we can do is spread the word. Of course, I didn't buy into the ecosystem just so that others would follow. I could care less if others use it if it weren't for the fact that its populatiry ties into the underlying success of the product. For purely selfish reasons do I preach WP7 strengths to my friends and family :) I don't want to go back to the other platforms.
I like to have an exclusive Phone, hope WP never get to as mainstream as iPhone and droid, ffs my cleaning lady has an iPhone, my 70 yo boss has an iPhone... boring.
The thing that drives me nuts is they don't advertise one of wp7's best features, the Zune pass. $10 a month for all you can eat music, with the ability to stream on your Xbox or PC is the #1 reason I have a WP.
MS needs a catch to pull people away from the other ecosystems. With Xbox 360 they had both live and gears of war. They created hype by promoting exclusive features or IPs. They need to do something similar with WP. To me Zune pass is this feature.
Agreed. Zune pass and Nokia drive come on now :(
Microsoft has put zero effort in showcasing any of the unique and amazing features of Windows Phone. While apple showcases only one.
Agreed. Verizon is needed to bring more market share. One 18 month old phone does not help
We seem to have been invaded by iPhone and android groupies. Good lord.
Oops I meant *hear* windows when I said here windows.
The problem is this: Microsoft needs to change the way people feel about Windows. When average people here Windows, they think of computers freezing and virus issues. When they here Windows Phone, all they can think about is back in the how horrible the Windows Mobile experience was. They dont understand that WP7/WP8 is a completely revamped platform than "Windows Mobile"...Microsoft knows all of this, and that's why they are working on rebranding everything. When Windows 8 is ready for prime time, I bet we will see a major Rebranding marketing campaign. Microsoft and Windows has to be seen as COOL in the average consumers eyes before Windows Phone ever takes off. That's the problem.
What about all the free phones Microsoft gave away with the Windows Phone Challenge? Are those counted? I bet they gave away at least 10,000.
"Do you guys know how to post videos to facebook?"
Sure! Drive home, connect your windows phone to your computer, download the video you want from your phone to your computer after syncing it to Zune, log into facebook, and upload the video!
"I don't have a windows phone, I have an Android phone."
Oh, well then just hit 'share'....
This issue, lack of customization & removable storage are the main reasons Windows Phone is not selling well. Blame it on advertising all you want. The smart phone beta test may be over, but not for Nokia.
When my wife can't send me video messages of my 3 month old learning to hold himself up, there's a fu(king problem with that. Our old feature phones could have. It's a step in the wrong direction, and as soon as I can, I'm saying to heck with AT&T, going back to Verizon, and getting an Android phone. I want to see his first steps, and don't want to have to wait til I get home to watch the video!
That said, if MS gets their heads out of their rears and fixes these issues, and Verizon gets a proper WP8 device, I would consider switching back when I'm due to renew. I like the interface and the way things run, but the shortcomings have had me regretting this phone for over a year now.
Call me a troll all you want, but if I'm wrong, why is MS so far behind?
its one feature there are tons of features on WP that make it seamless compared to competitor devices.
100.000 apps, should be thankful, tons of features...yes, yes, yes.
obviously there is a lot of crap going on in the marketplace.
nobody wants 20 different Twitter apps or 100 RSS readers.
outside the US there are even things like local scout as a native os feature missing.
there is a really sad thing going on. i love my wp with its beautiful ui a lot, but there are so many essential things to be done...
I listed more than just that one feature. And even if I had just listed one, if you don't offer everything that people expect a smartphone to do, don't expect them to buy it.
I highly doubt its because of the lack of customization and removable storage. If it was customer reviews wouldn't be this high.
That's false, you can do it right from the camera or picture hub. Learn to use the phone before posting nonsense.
okay, I was actually wrong on that ONE, I'll admit it. When did that change? My wife tried back when we got our phones, and it wouldn't let her. I actually didn't get Facebook myself until just last night, and I checked after seeing your post. I can admit when I'm wrong. Am I wrong on any of the other issues? Oh, and since I lost that one, can you still not post pictures when creating a Craigslist ad? Been a while since I tried, and haven't seen anything on here saying that was added. And YouTube? I know video messaging is still out.
BTW, these numbers are for Feb and May. The Lumia 900 was launched March 18th. The only Lumia in the US at that time was the Lumia 710 on T-Mobile, not what I would call a unit mover, especially on a struggling carrier. We will have to wait another few months for comScore to release their numbers. Or, Microsoft and/or Nokia should just come out and say how many units they have shipped, and get from the carriers how many they have sold.
With no answer if these phones would get the windows 8 treatment and people are surprised the Lumina, Titan 2 or Focus 2 didnt really do that well? I'd get a white Lumina right now if MS said it would get a full Windows 8 upgrade. But that aint happening and people like me stayed away from them.
Yep. Friend just bought a 350 dollar Nexus, rather than a 710. For pretty obvious reasons.
meh would rather have a Lumia
Really? Your friend shelled out $350 for a Nexus, and they 'were' going to get a Nokia 710, which has no front facing camera and only 8 GB of memory with no expandable storage?
Sounds unbelievable to me - the part where your friend was considering a Nokia 710 given that they purchased a higher specced, more expensive device, not to mention all of that app availability with the Galaxy Nexus. But whatever.
The major problem is "app development". MS really needs to develop more popular apps instead "saying" we now have over 100,000 apps available. Users don't care how many apps you have if they can't use apps that are in demand or popular.
Continue to market. You cannot stop marketing. I work in marketing and its neverending. It has to be a priority. Also WP8 is going to have to really knock socks off. So when you pull the device out people are in awe at what can be done with it. Looks like it will have at least a few of those features. Marketing still counts though!
They need to have flagship Windows phones on every carrier (even the regional ones) every single quarter. I don't understand the hardware strategy on WP7. Verizon and Sprint til this day have only had 1 phone released for them (more than a year ago) and Tmobile only gets table scraps. For all intents and purposes in the U.S. Windows Phone has been exclusive to AT&T like the iPhone was. Windows Phone 8 better see a massive expansion of hardware to all carriers consistently released throughout the entire year.
They need to create commercials like what apple did... Show the os.. Show how elegant fast WP is.
Can't copy Apple.
Creating commercials that show off what a product can do isn't copying Apple, as that has been around for a long time. Apple just happens to be good at making commercials that show off their OS features in real situations. Even I was a bit jealous of Siri when I saw a commercial the other day. This kind of marketing is something MS could benefit from if they adopted it.
I would defiently look at it at a different direction. I would compare Windows products to things people use on a daily basis like newspaper. WP7.5 is pretty much your own personalized news paper it gives you whats important without having to flip through pages. Stuff like that... I might have to drop a post down later with some marketing ideas.
Bring halo to windows phone!!!
I agree with this. Let's start seeing some major software exclusives on WP8. It's not good enough to go chasing the exclusives on other platforms a year or two later. Windows Phone needs to become known as the platform with the best exclusive apps and games. Hopefully with native code support, DX support and easy portability from Windows they can start making WP8 a lustworthy platform.
If Halo Waypoint and Kinectimals are any indication, Halo wont be a WP exclusive.
But you have to look at the markets for Halo Waypoint and Kinectimals. Kinectimals is for kids and those kids probably have iPod touches there is no way your going to pass up on that and it helps sell the game. But for exclusive WP games like Skulls of the Shogun you have to keep that as an exclsive.
apps, apps, apps. i'm tired of beeing the last one... :-/
Be thankful you have 100,000 apps out there with strong developer support even with 4% marketshare. I don't think Meego could of achieve that.
US isn't the whole world. In many countries WP7 has more than 4% market share.
Even better :)
While that is true you also have to look in the development of these numbers. Like it was reported that WP now already has about 6% share in Germany! Problem is: one year ago WP7 had 7% market share there...
Just overtake RIM and get us to no. 3 by 2013 and we'll be fine.
In the US at least, Windows Phone completely missed last Christmas. Currently, anyone who walks into a phone store that has not already decided to get a Windows Phone isn't coming out of the store with one, because the carriers are not only not suggesting it but actively discouraging it. Verizon still only has the aging HTC Trophy. And the app situation just isn't there - finally getting Words with Friends real soon now, but there are many cool apps that just aren't available on Windows Phone. 100,000 apps is great, but are the apps people want there? Not hardly.
This holiday season, things have the chance to be different. All major US carriers will have Windows Phones this Christmas, and may even be pushing them. Windows Phone 8 will be the new cool phone OS. And with Windows 8, Microsoft can now start to leverage the ecosystem. Microsoft is going to have a hard time being best-of-breed. They kind of have to focus on being end-to-end - the whole Desktop + Tablet + XBox + Phone tie-in. And that's going to be a slow grind.
It's not just marketing. It's product + apps + ecosystem + marketing. Being third (or fourth if you count RIM) mover in this market means Microsoft has to nail all four of those things. They have a chance to be close to that this fall.
Eric
Lumia 900 has been the 2nd best selling phone at AT&T for the past 3 months so what you're saying is simply not true. T-Mobile also says that WP is selling really well at their stores. People aren't leaving Verizon and Sprint and MetroPCS and US Cellular with Windows Phone because they don't exist there. You need to release phones on all carriers on a regular basis if you expect to gain market share. Even iPhone which is the most popular phone of all time with more marketing than God himself can't keep up with Android's ubiquity and cheap hardware when it comes to pure market share.
Thats what you get when you are 3 years late to the market. Even with WP8 it will be a long slow grind to a 2 digit marketshare - i doubt there will be explosive growth. It doesnt matter if the product is good, the competitors are dug in and had years to fortify their position. People wont just suddenly throw their phones away and get a WP8 - on the contrary, tech inertia will make most people buy what they already know since years.
I just hope MSFT doesnt pull the plug on a good product prematurely (again), when WP8 sales dont skyrocket.
Xbox was late to the game as well.
There are 3 strong areas WP8 can excel in and that is enough to skyrocket Marketshare. 1 is Enterprise 2. is Gaming and 3. is low-end. WP7.5 did not have a strong market it was a phone to try because it was something new and refreshing.
Carrier buy in is key, and the only thing that matters at this point. Use the Lumia 900 as a flagship for all carriers and market via carrier pipeline. Without it, WP will continue to suffer.
Remember carriers have alot to play around with now. They can incorporate their own voice services, wallet, datasmart technology, apps. The more carrier flexability the more likely they will market WP8 as their flagship device.
MS has got to get WP8 out the door before all we hear is the iPhone5 for months on end. If they cant get the momentum up we are doomed. We cant expect any rise in market share when the tech media is jumping all over the no update to WP8 even though no one knows exactly what will be in 7.8. MS should have just called it 8 and left out the features. WHen MS does it the press jumps all over it but when Apple calls it the same and just leaves out features for older phones no one cares. I am in it for the long haul with WP but they need to get their act together and get moving faster to get it out the door now while they can get some press before the Apple obsessed starts the conversation.
Atleast iPhone 5 did not release in the summer that would of been bad news bears. Its fine if the release close to each other remember WP8 is being marketed with Windows 8 as well. I wonder what would of happened if WP7 launched with Windows 7?
I think the reason isn't marketing but mainly obsolete hardware. Granted the hardware is fine for Mango but when you consider the 900 launched just before the One Series and the Galaxy S3, it's hard to convince people not to go for these (even if specs aren't everything).
Also having your flagship device available on only one carrier can't help. They should have had a 910 on Verizon, 920 on Sprint and 930 on T-Mobile. Samsung has flooded the market with the Galaxy S3, that can only make sales more important.
Not everyone is tech savy. Not everybody needs a dual core. I think the affordable price point that works is greater than specs. Now unforutnately Galaxy Nexus is the best phone in the market if you look at it by price and features.
350 bucks for a Galaxy Nexus vs. 450 for a crippled, unupdatable Lumia? Pretty easy decision.
How can you say its crippled if it was it wouldnt be on the top 10 Amazon top rated phones.
That's some tortured logic right there.
I'd say being unable to put new apps on a phone when WP8 is released is crippled. But that's just me.
WP8 native apps wont work on 7.5 but what makes you think everybody will develop only WP8 apps. WP7.5 has more marketshare I am sure WP7.5 apps will contnue for the next 2 - 3 years until people move to WP8/9.
Yes, you're right, WP7.5 has more marketshare than a product that hasn't been released yet. How insightful.
Are people still writing new Windows Mobile apps? Thought not. How quickly did people stop writing Windows Mobile apps after Windows Phone came out? How many people still write WebOS apps? Yeah, about as many as you'd expect. When WP8 comes out, WP7.5 is deader than a doornail.
Think about it logically. If you're a developer, are you going to devote time and money to coding software for an OS that will see zero new growth, which is what will happen to WP7, or will you code for WP8? Seems pretty obvious how you'd allocate your time, doesn't it?
WP7.8 still shares the same common languages as WP8 right? Developer support wont stop thats rubbish MS and Nokia are still commited to the platform but if you wanted the high end apps buy a Windows Phone 8 it doesn't mean the next version of ESPN is only for WIndows Phone 8 devices.
You're just a pathetic troll and have no place on a site like this
Until MS starts losing the big partners I'm not worried. If Nokia starts executing its plan B and HTC and Samsung stop making devices, then it will be time to call it a day on WP. We should know by the end of 1Q2013 I would guess.
Marketing won't work and didn't work. What they need to do is bring multi core processors, sd cards, HD screens and many phones to choose from just like Android. WP8 should take care of all of that. I'm sure that is what people want. I mean I would love to have an HD screen on my windows phone, dual core and sd card slot. Also they need to bring those toggles from the pull down menu like Android, be able to rent movies from Zune on your phone, stuff like that you know, eh.
None of that stuff matters if nobody knows about it.
They will know about it when they walk into an AT&T store and the reps tell them about that. I mean I would be sold with that start screen and those specs if a rep would tell me about it.
True.
well the good new is that android started just like that. the second good news is that msft can just keep trying until they win and if the xbox is any indication, they are in this for the long run and they will succeed sooner or later. it is inevitable.
Yeah, that's how I feel.. Never give up!
No, its not. There's a huge difference with what android did and what MS needs to do. WP is good but no one at MS seems to have figured out how to make the average consumer want it. Apple does that by building good hardware and offering a seamless experience with their products. android sells because its available cheaply and also available with the latest and greatest hardware to more affluent buyers. WP offers what? That question needs to be answered before WP becomes a success.
Lol, no, that's not how Android started. Android started in a vastly different mobile landscape. WP8 is in serious trouble if it doesn't launch before the iPhone 5. The biggest marketing push to date can barely make a dent in the market--that should tell you everything you need to know about the difference between where Android and WP stand. The "Droid" campaign on Verizon moved Android solidly into the mainstream. The "beta test" campaign turned out to have been a Nokia beta test, and Lumia 900 buyers got screwed. Pretty big difference.
The biggest obstacle is how Windows Phone is the carriers. Virtually no presence on Verizon, Sprint, and U.S. Cellular. None on Boost or Virgin. None on Metro PCS or Cricket. Some love from T-Mobile. WP has the solid backing of AT&T but remember that they're the carrier with the double-whammy reputation of expensive and bad service. When Sony announced the Vita would have 3G support from, pause, AT&T, the crowd booed! At an E3 press expo where they cheer anything.
This is correct, hardware availability (and cost) are the two biggest issues. Being AT&T exclusive is not good enough and even on AT&T there is not a steady enough stream of Windows Phone releases. They don't all have to be flagship phones like Lumia 900, but we need to see ubiquity of Windows Phone on all carriers. The other issue at play is software. Windows Phone has spent too much time chasing exclusive software on other platforms instead of creating it's own exclusive software that everyone wants. Windows Phone 7 is Xbox 1 without Halo. You need that impressive software and exclusive technological abilities that drive consumers to the platform. It's going to be an uphill climb, since they're running from behind, but if you create a reputation as the platform with the best software and coolest abilities eventually you will breakthrough. I think enterprise software compatibility is a major factor as well, which they seem to have addressed with WP8. Now if they can get WP8 available on every carrier they can make a dent in market share.
Windows Phone did have exclusives that people wanted: My Xbox, Halo Waypoint, Xbox Companion. Then they ported them to other phones. Imagine if Microsoft had ported Halo to the PS2 when the Xbox was struggling for exclusives. One of the dumbest moves they made.
I love my WP Lumia 900. You have to think about all the bells and whistles that may come with WP8. In my area, the NFC stuff is not even used except for a small few locations.
dual core would be nice, but not really needed that I have noticed.
I have had and Android, iPhone, iPod devices and much prefer my Lumia.
Not as much as I would have liked but hey it beats losing market right
At this point I've succumb to realization that WP is dead in the water. You can say wait for windows 8 and windows phone 8 but the sad fact is that they will be utterly trampled on by the release of the iPhone 5 which will be around the same time. I for one am very tired of not having apps that I would really use on windows phone. My Samsung Focus has been good to me but im not coming back.
Build WP9 on top of Android and release a custom Microsoft phone. Boom, problem solved.
Troll, market share is increasing
If I'm an android troll, then we are all doomed. :) twitter.com/penetronn
If they can get carriers on board in a serious way like AT&T, then I think they have a good chance at reaching critical mass. I also think that native code and DX support in WP8 will make a big difference in getting exclusive top tier software on WP8. Also see the enterprise features in WP8 as giving them a leg up over iPhone and especially Android. So far with Verizon, Tmo, AT&T, and US Cellular pledging big support for Windows Phone I think it's a good sign. Also the complete collapse of BlackBerry and Symbian clears the way for Windows Phone OS. Seeing those huge market share drops every month from RIM is perhaps the most encouraging sign thus far. WP8 sounds great on paper, now we have to see if they can execute effectively on the plan and get the carriers seriously invested in Windows Phone like AT&T is. I think the developer story with Windows Phone is really strong. What MS achieved with such small market share is nothing short of remarkable. If WP8 reaches critical mass (10% or more) the platform has a good shot at eventually dominating by leveraging Windows, enterprise, DirectX and Xbox developers.
So what if WP8 gets released before iPhone 5 does that automatically mean crazy sales.. Personally I dont care if it gets released shortly after but that needs to happen is a HUGE Windows 8 ecosystem presentation from Microsoft. MS needs to make it clear that if you have a Windows PC which 1.4 billion people in this planet have and a Xbox 360 which 44 million people have YOU Need to have a WINDOWS PHONE.
I like this!
Marketing is fine. The next move is to up carrier support and presentation. Lets get Windows a seperate section similar to how an iPhone is represented. AT&T is doing a great job, T-mobile is doing a good job now lets get Verion and other low-end carriers to put the support in for the marketshare to really take off.
Thats true!
Does anyone really expect any significant increases in marketshare, especially in the U.S., when essentially only one U.S. carrier is actively carrying more than two Windows Phone devices?
Until Verizon, at the very least, is on board, Windows Phone devices aren't going to be as ubiquitous as many would like.
Yup you get it my friend :)
Agree
That's a great point. I think that people have become so wedded to platform that it's tough to convince them to change. It was an arduous and expensive change from all apple to Microsoft mobile platforms for my family. We had to essentially give up two years and hundreds of dollars worth of accessories, apps, movies and music for the switch.
Shouldn't have to give up music and movies, iTunes is DRM-Free no?
Yes except I had a lot of leftover drm-ed music, not to mention the drm-free iTunes AAC still can't play on Xbox natively. It's a real pissed.
+1
Hey Daniel.. Maybe you guys should have a poll, and let us vote on 5 areas which we think are the reason WP market share is low.. How about it??
Lol serves Nokia right for hoisting the obsolete lumia 900 on us with 24 month contracts. Bet you the One X gets jellybean officially or via xda
As long as the Lumia 900 outsells the HTC/Samsung devices on ATT, I say it is a success.
Lumia 900 has outsold every Android phone on AT&T for the past 3 months. Can't complain about that, but they need to get to a point where Lumia is outselling iPhone also. And a point where there are so many inexpensive Windows Phones that they can successfully compete with Android market share.
agreed
The One X had the most disastrous launch in the history of smartphones. It's not selling very well and I understand why. The "obselete" Lumia 900 is selling better than the One X on AT&T. Go figure. Get some facts before making stupid statements.
What a useless comment
Nah its passed martketing...
Theres only so much you can do with marketing..WP7 just isn't ready...
Its a step back in software and i keep noticing it on daily bases..
Like today when everybody was laughinh how my 600€ phone can't do a VPN connection.
For that much money i can buy a laptop for fuk sake...
And now im a troll, but those numbers are pritty much expected..
I'll count marketing out when I see consistent, effective ads on TV that run longer than 60days! The problem is the television ads always stop. No new ads after 8 weeks. We need relentless marketing! This is the root cause.... Think about the average user... VPN? They dont give a flip. They need to be marketed to,, thats it!
So what your saying is the worse software can be a best seller because people are so stupid that enaugh marketing is all you need.
It sounds wrong...and it is wrong.
I don't know where you come frome but people in my country have an IQ above temperature.
No, they are uninformed! This is what marketing does. I know that sounds funny, but its true. People want what's popular! Oh, I live in Dallas, TX.. We only ride horses for fun now. Lol..
You might be right about people beeing uniformed but once they buy the devices and realize how low it is on features and how limited they are using it the word gets out.
People talk, marketing is good to start with but after some time it all depends on whether its good or bad. I think after a while the market turns and people buy whats best.
I might be wrong because my point of view cannot be generalized for a population but this i the way i see it. Next phone will defently not be a WP7 unless WP8 changes the game BIG TIME.
And from what I've seen it will not happen.
Sorry for the trolling, just dissapointed.
What is wp7 or 8 lacking? I have an android phone and an iPad. The huge difference is the applications
Actually thats very true. Maybe not in your country, but it is in many others. Look at Android, most popular device by marketshare, yet it's users aren't smitten on it like iOS and Windows Phone users.
Obviously, you need more than just marketing to sell a product. You need the right sales channels and retail support, but the marketing is what drives people to go out and buy it, whether it be tv ads, billboards, or word-of-mouth.
What exactly is WP7 lacking? I do just about as much as I did with my TP2.
Marketing!
AT&T marketed the hell out of the device.
When you call AT&T, their automated recording mentions it, stores have a wall dedicated to it, there are commercials, banners, urban promotion in subways, fliers sent to houses...they did a lot, it didn't work.
It's time to move beyond the "marketing!" crutch that Windows Phone fans have been relying on to explain its market failure.
Essentially we're screwed til Windows 8 comes out and even then maybe we'll end up like this... :(
It depends on pricing and how hard the carriers push it. AT&T will still push the Lumia the only competition right now is the Galaxy S3 the One X apparently is having a hard time gaining ground.
I agree that it's not marketing. It's the lack of hardware availability on carriers and lack of exclusive must have software. Verizon and Sprint don't have Windows Phone. Regional carriers don't have WP. There has to be a steady release of new phones all the time on all carriers. Microsoft needs to start using native code and DX compatibility to bring a ton of top tier exclusive titles to WP8. They need to get a consistent roll of new hardware into every carrier national & regional. They need to have cheaper hardware options for consumers, Android is winning market share because there are so many dirt cheap Android phones on every carrier. Ubiquity is key here. Marketing works great for flagship phones like the Lumia, but there are other factors at play with respect to pure market share. Lumia 900 did very well and that's thanks to marketing, but that's not enough to carry the entire platform against Android.
Agreed. One phone getting all the marketing on one network will not help right away. You can say tmobile has the 710, but that doesnt compare to an iphone or a samsung galaxy. They are late to the party with comparable devices. Verizon and sprint are needed and more phones like the titan being pushed too. I see a new HTC phone on mobile, Verizon every week!
This is exactly it. The Lumia 900 did very well on AT&T because they marketed it as aggresively as they normally would the newest iPhone or any other "latest and greatest" Android phone-of-the-week. T-Mobile was selling the 710 (which based solely on seeing quite a few random people out "on the street" with it, it did alright).
The problem is that while AT&T ran their promotion of their exclusive flagship smartphone, Verizon was still hiding the HTC Trophy in the corner of their stores, as they have been since its launch; and Sprint is still sustaining their presence on the Windows Phone platform solely by the first-generation HTC Arrive. While I'm happy Verizon has finally committed to Windows Phone 8, that does nothing for the platform until at least October or November at the earliest. Worse yet, Sprint has offered no public showing of support for Windows Phone since the Arrive launch in early 2011.
The issue with Verizon and Sprint is that while AT&T and T-Mobile have current-generation Windows Phones to sell and a sales force that is ready to promote them, Verizon and Sprint continue to operate stores where their employees' only understanding of Windows Phone came from the Windows Mobile 6.x devices that they used to sell 3+ years ago. I'd say it's more than likely most Verizon salespeople have never even used a Windows Phone before. Convincing those employees to get behind a product they're unfamiliar with next year is going to be the toughest task for Microsoft (and Nokia) to accomplish. Those employees (especially at Verizon) are used to moving Android phones like nobody's business. Getting them behind Windows Phone 8 will not be easy, and I worry that unless Microsoft and Nokia throw some serious money behind it that they may see the equivalent of AT&T's pre-Lumia 900 sales levels of Windows Phone at Verizon when WP8 launches.
Marketing by at&t is not enough though. Microsoft has tv ads for Bing and IE but it doesn't bother to market their ecosystem or the uniqueness of Win 7.5. MS needs to be more aggressive with marketing, and btw, why does the iPhone have its own space and display area but the lukia does not at places like WalMart, best buy, Sam's club, etc... They make it seem like the only one worthy of attention is the silly Iphone
Exactly thats why I'm not even going to compare sales until presentation is equal. Soon these carriers will understand and have a section specfically for IOS, Android and Windows
I agree. Those "family" ads they were running showed the ecosystem (like WP7 interacting with OneNote on the PC through SkyDrive), but those ads were corny and unrealistic. I'd really love to see a true Microsoft ecosystem ad in the style of the IE9 ad. That commercial pretty much brought Alex Clare's song out of obscurity and into the mainstream, now seeing radio airplay.
When the Windows 8 launch nears, I want to see an ad series that goes through multiple Microsoft products showing how they interact in real world scenarios. I want them to demo what will be Xbox Music playing through the Xbox, but being controlled via a Windows Phone with SmartGlass. I want them to show the social networking integration and aggregation afforded by the People Hub, and how Live Tiles work on Windows Phone and Windows 8. Unfortunately, people are obsessed with apps, so they should probably show apps on the Windows platform; though ideally they would show a few apps that are available on Windows 8 and Windows Phone and how they are similar.
There are so many possibilities, really. It's a shame that their marketing department/consultants choose to squander their budget on ineffective ads that just don't resonate with anyone. I see Microsoft making a comeback someday, but convincing consumers that Microsoft products are products you want to use, rather than have to use is a huge part of that. That's what Apple does, and it enables them to charge far more than anything they sell is worth. Microsoft needs to use their marketing to show ordinary people that they have reliable and easy-to-use products that do everything the Apple ecosystem offers, but without paying the Apple tax.
Dude whoever you are, flyers and banners don't do shit. While I'm a WP user, ATT nor any of the other carriers show WP7 commercials like they do for Android or Apple. The commercials make a bigger impact than any other form of advertisement. Lets face it, many of us are only aware of the articles, events, or you commercials if we wouldn't visit these forums.
Good points Daniel. The very average devices that have born the wp label so far don't cut it. You want powerful hardware and specs with lots of customization, on every carrier at every price point, Android has you covered.
You want easy to use, smooth experience, great support and an enormous ecosystem, its right there with the purchase of an iPhone.
Where is the jaw-dropping superphone? Why on earth announce Surface, Win8 and WP8 months in advance? Announce it and get it in the stores, don't let the hype fizzle, and crash the sales of current devices.
Market whats different and better, not just" we got that too"! (If indeed there is anything different and better to market).
I'll preface it like this, this is my favorite site to get WP news! It's the best! But I for one believe there are many factors why a phone like the Lumia 900 didn't sell much better although I believe it did well.
First, most people are most likely in plans and aren't willing to pay extra for a new plan or to purchase a new phone outright.
Secondly, sites like these that provide speculation of upcoming devices - aka WP8. I think if consumers believe something better is coming right around the corner they question why would they want to invest in a phone now when all they have to do is wait six to eight more months and get a much better device.
And thirdly, if a phone like the Lumia 900 is not sold on your preferred network then sales will not be as rubust. And truthfully I fall in all three camps. But had the Lumia 900 been released on TMo I would be a proud owner today. Unfortunately, I'm not going to leave my network to go to AT&T or any other network for any phone. Just my thoughts anyway - It's not all about marketing as you stated.
WP success lies in marketing... Television commercials, not concerts and flash mobs. Billboard ads, not unnecessary stunts. Keep it simple! Just come up with a great ad campaign, and stick to it!
Apple, and Google get it!
You're confusing launch events with the sustained ad campaign. It's all over NYC. I've seen the commercials and I don't even have cable.
I seriously think you're delusional if you think it's the marketing at this point.
What sustained campaign??? Lol.
I live in Dallas, a huge market, and the ads have stopped!
Dude shut up
Saw very few Lumia ads in Northern California.
It's still a marketing problem. Getting a push from one carrier is great but until WP is as ubiquitous as Android on every carrier, then heavy marketing has its limits.
That and the Windows name is the anti-sale when it comes to phones. MS has a stigma that it must either overcome or get a new name because nobody is impressed when they hear Windows paired with Phone.
You gotta push Windows Phone not Nokia. Simple as that. And that has NOT been done to any measurable degree by Microsoft.
Well everyone isn't in NY! Apple and Android success isnt because the commercials are isolate to NY. The shown nationwide and wp7 doesn't get 1/3 the expose any of the
other platform gets.
You forgot inferior OS with features missing that the other platforms have, inferior specs (doesnt matter if it is needed or not, but consumers are spec whores), and also playing catchup on apps. People are highly invested in apps for their respecitve platforms so feel no need t move to another, especially if it is lacking.
Marketing alone wont fix that.