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Poll results - Majority of Windows Phone users happy with proposed 7.8 update

Certainly the most controversial issue for Microsoft and Windows Phone users right now is the 7.8 update which will bring the new Start screen to current devices. This update is in lieu of getting Windows Phone 8 proper which is reliant on advanced hardware for most of its new features.

Some in the tech media are portraying this as a fiasco though the majority see the light at the end of the tunnel, recognizing that Microsoft had to switch the kernel from CE to NT if it wanted the platform to move forward. Combined with the difficulty in providing direct-upgrades to Windows Phone 8 (it's not a simple "update" but rather requires wiping the device, backing update data and re-writing aspects for current hardware) we can sympathize with Microsoft in not spending invaluable time and resources on making WP8 backwards compatible. 

We put the question to you though to get your feedback. On the original article, you folks left an astounding 500+ comments. On the poll, a massive 6,500+ of you left a response. While the data may not be perfect we do get a rough idea of how you are feeling.

Certainly we can say the results are mixed but a majority of you (54%) are okay with Microsoft choosing this path for current Windows Phone users. The clear "no" category had 19.61%  thinking Microsoft could and should do more while another 20% were on the fence, perhaps waiting to see how it actually looks and feel. A tiny percentage (6%) claimed they are finished with Microsoft and are leaving the platform.

For those 20% who are unsure they may want to see exactly what the update entails. Microsoft has strongly hinted that as of now, it is just the new Start screen. The reason for that is many of the additional new features, like Wallet or voice, requires access to the core of the OS since they use new APIs not available in Windows Phone 7. In other words, if you code an app that uses the WP8 SDK with new WP8 APIs for WinRT/NT it is not clear how that can be back-ported to a CE device.

Of course we have to remember that what Microsoft showed this week technically was not for consumers. The Windows Phone team team will be having more events this summer where they show off new, not-previously mentioned features including some UI changes. In other words, there may yet still be more to Windows Phone 7.8 but Microsoft is waiting to reveal those in tandem with the consumer preview of Apollo.

In fact, Nokia US on Twitter yesterday noted that besides the new Start screen "Other elements aren't being disclosed at this time" which leads us to believe there may be yet more to come for Windows Phone 7.8.

Looks like we'll just have to wait and see but so far, Microsoft may have done enough to ameliorate the issue with users.

Daniel Rubino is the Executive Editor of Windows Central, head reviewer, podcast co-host, and analyst. He has been covering Microsoft here since 2007, back when this site was called WMExperts (and later Windows Phone Central). His interests include Windows, Microsoft Surface, laptops, next-gen computing, and arguing with people on the internet.

  • Are those who are fine with the situation the same who laughed about the Android update problems?
  • Not sure how it's the same.  The is a technical hardware issue not carrier/OEM related. The latest Android update *can* run on current hardware but users cannot get it due to OEMs and Carriers taking forever. That is truly frustrating. Windows Phone 8 is a platform shift requiring new hardware. Wha'ts more, Microsoft is providing users a way to bypass carriers for updates and a guaranteeing updates for 18 months after a device is released. Once again, how is that similar to Android?
  • If windows 8 can run on my six year old laptop fine, and it does, then WP8 should be able to to run on my three month old 900. My phone is a computer, carriers should not say whether or not I get an update as my monthly fees don't change whether or not if I'm a contract. Obviously I can't use new hardware of I don't have it same on a PC....oh well xda do what everyone else don't.
  • Sorry CJ, but you're just completely wrong on this. I mean, you just gloss over so much complexity in the matter like it's no big deal.  Answer me this: how do you update a Windows 95 (DOS) computer to Windows 2000 (NT)? Or to phrase it differently, how come Microsoft never released something to migrate users to Windows 2000 if they were on '95? (Forgetting the Enterprise angle for a moment). This isn't an "update". It's an upgrade. It requires literally zeroing out your device of all information and installing new booloader, firmware, an entire OS and then a backup of info. Do you have any idea the dangers in permanently "bricking" a device that entails? Or do you just not care? That is not the same as going from Mango to Tango and if you make the two equivalent, you're really not understanding what is at issue here. Further more, a lot of WP8's new features requires new hardware: NFC, new display resolutions and dual cores...
  • Yeah, you can't even do an in-place upgrade between 32- and 64-bit versions of the same OS, so the WP lack of upgrade is not unprecedented.
  • +1 That's another good example and analogous to this situation.
  • I know this fact, it is comparable to when the 360 came out. Change of chipsets loss of old games, emulation was the only answer. Same on the OS, but it's compatibility mode. The problem here is they just did this two years ago from 6.5 to 7.0. They could do it as the hardware is not different arm vs. X86. It is more like x86 to x64. I am fine with 7.8, I read the Gizmodo article about screwing over older users to further the Metro cause I get it. The point is its possible. I am more upset about the broken promises of keeping carriers out of the update cycle. I'm a huge MS...fanboy...the enthusiast program better be easy to join...
  • It's possible to upgrade users to the new OS, but MS would have to directly support the operation and that would be a tremendous undertaking. There's simply far too much that can go wrong, and too many device variations out there to deal with. Choosing not to upgrade existing users, and instead delivering a stop-gap that they know will work for everyone, lets them prevent having to deal with that nightmare, and allocate those resources instead to ensuring WP8 has the most successful launch possible.
    So, yeah, it's possible, it's just not practical.
  • dude, think of it this way, we're still getting 7.8 which means they are still trying to give us the support we seek, though it's less feature rich as 8, they didn't just leave us behind in the dust
    the issue like Dan said is not exactly hardware related, but the way upgrades work, heck, if you let a non-techie user do a format on the computer and reinstall everything something will screw up most of the time, and this is exactly what happening except its worse, a phone that fails to install it's software successfully will be paper weight for those that attempts it
    im going ot bet some one from XDA will get a rom that works and let us do that kind of flashing though, but we're techies
    (another interesting suggestion was to ask users to pay techs from carrier stores to do it for them, but i can see ppl calling foul on that too)
  • That would be too much for carrier store techs to handle. It might even be riskier than attempting to automate it since most of those guys are not qualified.
  • I think you're wrong about this Daniel, and are too acepting of the fact that Microsoft are screwing over their customers.
    Your 95 / NT comparison definitely holds true in the case of an upgrade, but there was nothing to stop you from getting a win2k CD and reinstalling it onto your win95 machine using the CDROM
    In place of the CDROM, Windows Phone has a Zune and a USB connector. In fact, many of the updates we've already received were installed whilst the phone was in an 'off state'. So, what's to stop Microsoft from installing WP8 on existing WP7 devices? Yes, it's not a simple update, but it's no more complex than updating your desktop operating system.
    If you'd just spent $500 on a lumia handset in a 24 month contract, I think you'd see things differently.
    p.s. I'm actually an Omnia 7 owner and I'll be upgrading to win8 as soon as theyr're out, so I'm not biased.
  • I totaly agree with you on the Lumia 900 issue. I've been begging for Verizon to get one but, at this point, I am glad they didn't. I would of grabbed one right away. I would feel screwed if I just picked up Luima 900 or any 2nd gen device right now (and I was 31 days out).
    If people really feel that the Lumia 900/titan 2 should be able to handle WP8, then all I can say is watch XDA, maybe one of the top hackers will release it for 2nd gen devices. Those guys are crafty, so I would not put it passed one of them to put the first gen chipset drivers into the code to make support for it. Not sure on performance tho, and that is why MS didn't do it.
    You wont see that for a while after release tho...
    It would be interesting to see.
  • Yep, without doubt the XDA guys will put WP8 on a WP7 device.
    I'm a Windows kernel programmer, and although I obviously haven't yet seen the WP8 OS, I can say with some confidence that I haven't seen anytihng that would lead me to believe that the WP8 OS can't be installed on WP7 devices.
  • This doesn't make sense, if someone payed 500 for their lumia, they are not on contract!! If they are on contract, they paid anywhere from free to 99 bucks and isn't that budget range? If you got a free android would you expect ics on it? Come on people , if you upgraded, you know what you were getting into, and unless you hate your phone, who cares about tomorrow? Enjoy your lumia today!!
  • You've clearly forgotten the insane pain of trying to find Win2K drivers for everything. That didn't improve until XP. The WinCE and Win8 driver models are night and day. Maybe some of the OEMs would have agreed to write a full set of new chipset drivers for some of their most recent devices, but you STILL wouldn't get any features that require new hardware. So Microsoft would basically have to take on a ton of work to make this a reality that would partially benefit only a fraction of fielded devices. It sucks, but the cost:benefit ratio is just totally out of whack. I think it's pretty awesome that Microsoft is doing anything at all for legacy customers, all things considered.
  • My thoughts on this
    1. "a lot of WP8's new features requires new hardware: NFC, new display resolutions and dual cores."
    Its like saying "Since you do not have a cd rom we are not allowing you to use windows8". Come on, the OS will support only features of the hardware it has, so if my phone has NFC it will support. and the WP8 supports "multi-core" devices. So I think it should also support single core ones.
    2. It requires literally zeroing out your device of all information and installing new booloader, firmware, an entire OS and then a backup of info. Do you have any idea the dangers in permanently "bricking" a device that entails? Or do you just not care? 
        Ok, agreed. But I personally think it would have been better if MS / Nokia released a s/w for the process which the user can take the risk of.
    MS is definitely planning to launch cheap wp devices. So tomorrow there is a possibility that they may launch devices running WP8 which does not have NFC, dual cores (and may be even less memory / processing power). If that happens, I will definitely be out of WP and MS / Nokia.
  • Another issue everyone overrrent gen chipsets cannoBoot and bitlocker in WP8, something that the current gen chipsets cannot handle.
    You are right, everyone is viewing this as a simple upgrade when its so much more then that. The shared kernal is designed for muiltcore SoC's, again our singlecores just wont cut it.
  • You are approaching this as if Microsoft is denying you the update.  They aren't offering it to those with older phones because it won't work on older hardware.  If they had decided to stay with the CE platform, then there wouldn't be anything decent to upgrade to later on.  Microsoft has learned the hard way that building on top of something old and outdated just introduces more problems.  The fact that they are making a watered down version to allow the rest of us to enjoy some of the improvements is great!  They could have decided to scrap development for the rest of us and focused solely on the new hardware.
  • I wish it were that simple, but it isn't.
  • Not exactly...also your old laptop is still alot faster than current Gen 2/ 1.4ghz Need speed and memory and more bandwidth to do what w8 has
  • One question to daniel. After wp7.8 do we get future OS Updates?
  • I think. they will have long support for Wp7 devices. because microsoft says a phone support is 18 months or over. So I suspect wp9 or Wp8.5 to be the final update for Wp7.5 devices
  • im betting they do for one more generation too, but im also betting the name will be 7.9 :P
  • Yea I want contractual proof they have an 18 month update cycle agreement with carriers.  He who controls the network, controls what goes on it. 
  • They don't need to, they are going OTA, and like the 7.8 update, are going to push updates to everyone. This bypasses carriers, much like Apple's update system.
  • Couldn't agree more.. ^_~ @Cyruss1989 you wanna say something more?! lol - peace :-P
  • I still don't buy Daniels argument. Android folks install new versions and kernels all the time, without any problems, why shouldn't it work for WP8....
  • Without problems?  Are you high?  No, that is completely false and ignorant to believe it.  There are plenty of problems with "cooked ROMs."  One of which is that driver support is hit or miss, and these "ROM cookers" do not have access to the driver source code to compile a new version (either for the kernel or to fix bugs.)
    I for one remember the WinMo 6.x days and cooked ROMs.  While the brought new OS features, they were buggy as hell, and not worth the time or effort.  Consumers DO NOT CARE about cooked ROMs, or even know who XDA is.
    While I am a bit peeved that both of my Lumia's will only get WP7.8, I'm still waiting on final judgement of what WP7.8 brings to the table.
  • Lol screw android :) wp is better
  • Also this is like saying I want Direct TV channels on my Dish Network satellite. Not gonna happen. Or why can't my diesel car run on gasoline. I'm glad they went with just an upgrade. It sets it apart from the (older) WPs. Everyone who bought a new windows phone. Why didn't you wait. You knew WP8 was coming out. Would it have hurt to wait another 6-8 months.
  • Because my iPhone 3GS was falling apart.  Buttons wouldn't work and the speaker had died.  I needed a new phone and held out as long as I could.  That said, I'm perfectly fine with the 7.8 update.  I may have hoped for 8.0, but I knew it was probably a longshot. 
  • The "let's not waste time and resources" bit is a real shocker - how about not providing any upgrades to MS Office 2010 and developing a new MS Office suite etc., etc. Microsoft listen - your resources were once ours. You won't see much more of my resources - you save on me, I'll save on you - simple, isn't it?
  • 100% of WP users are eligible or are already on 7.5. I'm almost positive the same 100% will get 7.8. Android can't boast those same stats.
  • While I would like my current phone to get WP8, I'm fine with the situation because it won't really matter. Primarily because I can't wait to have more than a paltry 16 GB storage. I want 32 GB minimum onboard + microSD, and there's no way I can get that with my current phone. In 3-6 months my mobile will be 18-24 months old, so it will be a good time to upgrade with WP8.
  • That may be another issue, the size of the wp8 may be quite larger than wp7.5
  • No, I don't give a shit about android update issue.
  • Yes but they better give us VoIP integration and a Daly deal tile and every other thing that doesn't require new hardware .......
  • Question: what makes you sure that VOIP doesn't require new hardware?  Or rather, it's the same problem. Integratd VOIP requires the NT kenel so how do you propose they make WP8 backwards compatible for the new VOIP APIs to hook into CE?  Or rather, it's the same problem of wiping a device and putting on a whole new OS.
  • Regardless, this is a step backwards from competing with iPhone. The time to move to NT was when they dropped WinMo 6.5.
    I like metro on my phone, but even 8.0 doesn't promise things like being able to run Waze and Glympse in the background. I didn't realize hoe much I would miss that until I got my Windows Phone.
    The way they are handling this OS does not give me enough faith to stay on the platform. Unless something drastic changes, I'm heading back to Apple, even though everything else I have is Microsoft. :(
  • Yes it was, but they weren't ready.  That was the bottom line.  Should they have stayed out of the game entirely for 1.5-2 more years until they were able to get the shared core vision of W8/WP8 to reality?  MS would have virtually no chance to get in the game then, they are having a hard enough time the way they did go.
    Don't get me wrong, I would be excited about it had I bought a new phone 6 months ago or less, but I try to be a realist too and feel they are doing what they can for most people, and had to make the tough choice in the situation.
  • I agree with you, the problem here is that a lot of them doesn't see it that way.
  • Honestly, yes, they should have stayed out.
    They are burning bridges right now with some of the people that switched. How many people abandoned other smartphones to get a Nokia, and then will be stuck with a device that can't get the full SOFTWARE benefits of the next OS?
    I find it funny that Nokia's ad campaign is based on "The Beta test is over", but the OS they are using the those commercials is being abandoned by Microsoft.
  • "but even 8.0 doesn't promise things like being able to run Waze and Glympse in the background"
    Let me clear: GPS apps can maintain and update our location in WP8. This is 100% fact.
  • I missed that from the presentation. Does that include 7.8?
    My iPhone 3GS is went from iOS 3 to iOS 5, which had some very big improvements.
    There is no technical reason why CE can't do background tasks like VoIP and GPS updates, I know because I had Windows Mobile phones that could do it.
    If the reason we can't have 8.0 on current devices is because lack of OEM support, that still isn't a reason to stay on this platform, that is another reason to leave. 
    Had Microsoft created their own phone like they did for Surface, I could see the rationale behind abandoning the current devices. The OS would be programed for one type of hardware, like the iPhone, and that would have been a reason to stay.
    However, to abandon the current products, even products sold just weeks before the release, does not make me want to spend my money on a device that could be abandoned a second time.
  • The reason is you have a 60% or so chance to "Brick" your phone. Even if it did work, you would lose everything on your phone. Both would result in major complaints...
  • lol, how did you make up this number?
    It's a disgrace, that after two years WP7 still doesn't support backups like the other platforms.
  • I totaly agree with that...
    They cannot tell everyone that they changed the Kernel blah blah blah... Customer support is always a customer support. In thier slogan they have: Windows Phone, Put People First. If you really follow that, then you need to support your current users.
    Their senior marketing manager told a reporter that it is not impossible to port WIndows Phone 8 to current device. They don't want to port it because it is EXPENSIVE! Did we get our Lumia phones for free???!!
    Please don't blame the Hardware, since it was MS decision to limit the hardware specs of  WIndows Phone 7...
    Bottom line, MS is aware of the number of winpho users, specs and base codes, they just made a decision to abondone it to play catch up with Android phones and iPhones...
    You know Lumia is a great phone... I've been promoting it to my friends and trying to prove them that Windows Phone is the future... Now they are all laughing at me...
    Nokia - Great Phone, Great Customer and After Sales support!
    MS - Great OS; Worst Customer and After Sales support!
  • Talk about misinformed
  • It's nit being misinformed. Its TRUE, you still can't backup your SMSes! That sucks when U need to do a hard reset!
  • And, yes you will be able to run things like Waze and Glympse in the background on 8.
  • How is this a step backwards? This is EXACTLY what Apple does with its upgrades, except they pull one over on their consumers by calling it iOS5, when in fact it is iOS5 without a bunch of features.
  • You still get all APIs and therefore can use all new apps, with 7.8 you can't. Good bye.
  • Well at least they should give us the Nokia maps replacement for Bing. I mean come on, Nokia maps doesn't require the new Kernel...
  • well, wait for the summer announcement, they are not done yet
  • So you think the only feature that does not require new hardware is the start screen? I find this highly unlikely. They should have backported everything that is not dependent on hardware to save face. As a owner I don't feel too bad but I can't recommend WP to other people and can't argue in favor of WP now.
  • We don't currently know what will and will not be a part of the 7.8 update. For all we know, aside from the Start Screen, 7.8 may get 75% of all the new features, it may get only 25%. Fact is, WE don't know.
  • @Wyn6 you really need to stop with this we don't know. We do know. Microsoft told us. Start screen and customization for 7.8. That is it. If they had more they would have told us.
  • u may want to check the presentation again, Joe specifically said this is a platform preview concerning devs, feature will be unveiled in a later conferece, and that other guy...(forgot his name) when he talked about 7.8 he also mentione that there are other features as well, but it just wasn't the right time to talk about it
  • Do you honestly think they are going to even discuss 7.8. They are moving forward and want to discuss Windows Phone 8. They announced what you are getting with it. Nokia is adding applications and calling them features. Do not read so much into what they don't say.
  • They will talk about 7.8 because while WP8 is going to be for all the high-end phones, 7.8 will become the new tango for for future low-end phones in emerging markets.
  • You mean like they told us about the fact we were getting an update at all? We do NOT know. Microsoft has been quiet. We may just get the start screen. But, there are still several months for them to put anything else they can in it and it is always subject to change. It isn't written in stone until it is released. Time will tell.
  • They didn't announce anything of Windows Phone 8 (software) other than the new screen either...
  • ..
  • I don't understand all those NO and "leaving WP". Windows 8 is NOT supported by actual hardware, this is a fact. Microsoft could simply have moved one, leaving everyone who bought a WP7.5 with the actual version, instead they decided to do a 7.8 update, for free, trying to give them a taste of WP8, for what's possible with the current phones. I think we should thank MS, they took a great choice for us. Imho
  • +1
  • Agree 100% just hoping we get 7.8 sooner than the windows 8 devices launch.. But still, can't wait for t-mobiles first windows 8 device.. Not sure what manufacturer, but probably whoever launches one first (hoping for HTC, since the past 5 phones I've had have been HTC and I am completely satisfied with the company)
  • Couldn't agree more and it's good to know that most of us are ok with thus even though alot more negative comments by the ungrateful are on these articles
  • A lot of people has miniscule brain they expect a model T car to have the same specs as a Lamborghini or Anzo Ferrari and expect it to run the same.
  • @procen I can clearly lay the blame at the foot of Microsoft for making OEM's use Model T parts. I also blame myself for buying into this you don't need current hardware to have a robust fluid OS. It just wasn't true. But hey i learned a valuable lesson. Don't buy into hype , bloggers, fanboys, and read microsoft emlpoyee comments carefully.
  • @fogel35 I understand your frustration but the two systems, the first Gen phones is not setup to accommodate everything that the new system "Windows Phone 8" has. I have an HTC Radar and i'm very happy with it. I used to have a Samsung Galaxy Vibrant and my experience with it is horrible, it lags, freezes, apps crashes , and the gps is useless and this is a $500.00 phone. I'm thankful that I'm getting an upgrade with some of the features of WinPhone 8. When Nokia Lumia 900 came out I want one but I don't have the funds. Just relax and wait till MS release the right information of what the 7.8 contain.
  • @procen I am not frustrated more disappointed than anything because Microsoft couldn't or wouldn't spend the resources to allow people to flash the new kernel.  It isn't technical some technical reason at all.  That is another PR spin job.  I have had 3 versions of Windows on my laptop and 3 versions of Linux on it as well.  They didn't want to spend the resources to make it happen.  If they don't want to spend the resources on that, then what on earth do any people think they are going to get some of the Windows 8 features.  
    From what they have said, it is just going to be the start screen and customization.  If they had more it would be leaked by Nokia asap because they are tight rope walking right into non existance.  Nokia is going to try to app there way to little features like the camera extras app, playto, etc.   Not sure if you have the Nokia but the camera extras kind of builds itself into the camera function of the OS but still launches as a seperate app within the camera.  It is kind of wonky but I do appreciate it.  But then it made me realize more, more features are not coming down from Windows Phone 8.  Don't get your hopes up like us schlubs that bought into the Lumia hype that it had some bright future.  It is still boxed in courtesy of Microsoft's inability to push out a total wipe of the device and reflashing it with the new kernel. 
    p.s. can't imagine the dread the people that got the Titan 2 or that Samsung LTE phone will feel when 7.8 isn't what they think it is going to be (yippe skippe a new home screen and customization colors).  HTC and Samsung won't be app'ing their way to new little features like insolvent Nokia is.  
  • Dead on. I'm thrilled with the news. People could be even more pissed had we got nothing. Can't please everyone 100% of the time ya know.
  • You're right. The Samsung galaxy S was not eligible to receive ics and Samsung gave the gs1 users a "feature update". So this move by MS is great. I just hope there's more than just the start screen. At least nokia maps replacement for Bing.
  • Windows 8 is NOT supported by actual hardware, this is a fact. Then MS can just make WP8 work with single core ARM CPUs. Without the additional hardware like NFC and TPM chips. I think we should thank MS, they took a great choice for us. I think MS should reconsider and be more respectful of people who just bought months old Windows Phones. This move is simply unacceptable. Btw I don't expect much in 7.8
  • I've never bought a phone with the expectation of getting any more than bug/security fixes.  I do feel sorry for Nokia, their sales are likely to tank at the worst possible time for them.
  • I suspect that the 7.8 update will have alot more in it then people think.  All in all I think it is a fair compromise.
  • There are going to be more elements of WP8 put into WP7.8 that they have not announced. We will have to wait until they publish it.
    I am glad I am getting any kind of upgrade for free. Most Androids are never given an upgrade. iPhone does the the same as MS or even worse. Apple lets you upgrade your phone to a snail because it lacks the horsepower to run it smoothly.
    I do not know why people think they buy something today that it should be upgraded in the future. That is how technology is, new today-obsolete tomorrow.
    I bought my car a couple of years ago and took it to the dealer yesterday and told them I should get a upgrade. You know what they told me, "sure for $14,000 we will upgrade it."
  • Lol
  • The "car" analogy is so entirely wrong on multiple levels! If you want to compare the current situation to the purchase of a car, you have to see it from a different perspective: Let's say I bought me a new car to get my shoppings home (apps download). Everything fits nicely into my trunk. Now, all of a sudden, stores and suppliers decide that it would be better if they pack things differently, so, that it doesn't fits in cureent car's trunks anymore (new apps developed for WP8). I, who just bought a new car, can no longer go shopping with it since I can't get my stuff home anymore. For the time being, stores and suppliers are asuring me that they will keep the current sized items along with the new larger items. I shall be happy but we all know how such things work: in a short time, stores (developers) will just get rid of the "my-trunk-sized" items in favor of the "not-in-my-trunk-fitting" items and I will be stuck with a car that functions beautifully but has been rendered useless ... The above is a more accurate comparison of the WP7.x / WP8 problem to a car purchase!
  • Yes, except the sole purpose of your car (WP) is not just to go shopping (buy new apps). You still have a lot of nice things that fit in the boot (and will fit forever), you can go for nice drives, use the gps, listen to music etc.
  • Guys (whiners) we need to calm down. there shouldn't even be complaining. we are peaceful. Microsoft clearly stated they'll bring the features possible. like skype intergration maybe. give it some time. let Joe show us all the features firist. then make a opinion 
  • Let all the disappointed user leave I will always support WP.
  • All these questions of frustration and uncertainty towards Microsoft for requiring new hardware...I don't understand. The new platform and devices aren't coming out tomorrow, so I say kudos to Microsoft for giving me the heads up on what I'm going to start saving up for, and thanks for the update to 7.8, if I fail to save up enough in time for 8's release.
  • 99% of those who say they're unsatisfied do not understand what's going on here.
  • I kind of agree with you
  • Yup. Given the physical realities of WP8's hardware requirements I see 7.8 as a huge gift MS had no obligation to provide. Even if all 7.8 is is a new start screen I'll count myself as very satisfied (and the hints make it sound like we'll get more than just that).
  • I wonder what the average users age is of windows phones. I have the sense most people just react quickly without thinking and think about why Microsoft did it this way.
  • I think thats true of all users, regardless of age. Chances are the average user won't care either way. The majority of buyers will buy a phone for it can do for them when they buy it, not what it can do in 6 months, or that it will upgraded to the latest and greatest software. Many consumers just want something that works and makes phone calls.
  • I also believe that WP8 not supporting existing phones was more of a decision by the OEM's and carriers. AT&T can't even invest the time to release updates for Gen 1 phones so why does anyone expect them to support a new OS. As for everyone saying they are going back to apple, the iPhone has gone through the same issues. How many old iPhone models support IOS 5?
  • Neither do 99% of those that are ok with it... The people I feel bad for are the Canadian 800/900 owners. They are locked in until 2015.
  • You don't evne know what features WP 7.8 will bring, other than a new start screen.
    Waste of time
  • As a day one adopter I am ok with the situation. I can, however, sympathise with lumia 900 buyers a bit. Did I read somewhere that the 900 had a NFC chip in it? Probably not...
  • You also sympathize with Titan (I/II), Samsung Focus S, Flash, and other 1.5 gen device owners, yes?
  • I'm a day one adopter who also got the Lumia 900 and you know what, I love what Microsoft has done here because I now know Windows Phone going forward will be the best smartphone OS hands down.
  • I've said it once, and ill say it again. No complaints.
  • I've never heard of this poll, but I am SO okay with it. I'm getting a new Windows Phone, even tho I have an HTC Titan. Some Windows Phones may just have come out, but everyone knows the hardware is from November 2011 (2nd Gen release). And the operating system is already awesome. If 7.8 has enough new "fixes" and additional features, it's okay.
  • PEOPLE BITCHING ABOUT EVERYTHING" WP8 WONT BE ON WP7 THEN IM LEAVIN"! well so long bitchy people im satisfied with my lumia with r without WP8 on it its a fuckn phone people damn !
  • I am good with it on my OG Focus until HTC Zenith drops :-)
  • Same... Zenith looks to be my Focus replacement.
  • It does looke pretty sweet, but I am going to also keep my eyes open for Nokia's WP8 offering
  • What the hell is the big deal? We get updated sweet! And when our contracts are up we can get the second Gen (probably better) wp8 phones. We can't upgrade something that our phones dont have. Its ok everyone just breath lol
  • Better than nothing if you ask me.
  • Honestly Honestly I don't mind. I do have my old ancient HTC HD7 that I bought in November 2010 and guess what? I'm ready to upgrade my T-Mobile plan with a new Windows Phone 8!!! Ouuuhhhh Yeahhh!
  • Same here and my Radar wifey will have it. weeeeeee
  • They need to find a way for people to backup their app data, so that we can move on to WP8 without loosing our in-game progress etc. I hope they implement that in 7.8
  • Achevement points will move but, you have a good point...
  • +100. SMS data too
  • Nokia Lumia 900 came out in April just 2 months later we see no WP8 for us.
    Its like you buy a ticket to watch an Imax movie and all you get to see is a trailer of Imax experience. 
    Customers will soon lose their trust with Nokia if WP 7.8 is just a start screen update.
    They claim its the best WP so far and they screw it.
    Hope some white-hat hackers bring out wp8 to all and do what Nokia and Microsoft should do in the first place.
  • No, it's like you bought a ticket to an IMAX movie, got to see an IMAX movie, and then, 2 months later the movie theater announces that in 4 more months they'll have a new JMAX technology - so you go complain to the theater manager that you deserve a free ticket because.... Well, because damnit, YOU WANT ONE!!!!
  • So true Baka.
  • LOL!
  • Not quite the case because Lumia 900 was one the best WP phones the time it was released (and still is until WP8 devices get released). There was no misleading about what you were getting. @Baka's scenario is actually a lot closer in comparision.
  • Prerak, did u get the $100 credit when the network issues were happening? I'm a bit disappointed but given all that Nokia has done for its 900 users, it'll be fine. My larger concern, though, is how the hell will Nokia sell any more Lumias until the new WP8 phones drop? I'm very concerned for this company... :'(
  • MS wants to buy Nokia for cheap. Though now I feel like the ultimate beta tester.
  • It's true... I have 2 friends interested in the Lumia 900 that only came out last week in Australia. I've told both those people not to bother wasting their money and to wait 3 months for WP8 models (more like 6 months in Australia though).
  • I have a sister who likes my Lumia and wants to get one to replace her aging Galaxy. I told her to wait now because of WP8, but I really feel the anger from many Lumia owners about the announcement this week. While I still believe, or rather hope that more announcements will be forthcoming, is this any way to treat the owners of Microsoft's flagship phone? And to read Steve Elop's response to a disgruntled 900 buyer who is thinking of returning the phone that at least existing owners will get a new skin.........I felt like punching that smile off his mug. If Microsoft does not show ALL current WP7 owners bit more love, they will face a rain of critical ruin from former customers.
  • i'm okay. with it. So I think Nokia will give maybe a discount for their Wp8 devices for exsisting Wp7.5 owners. 
  • Either way there would've been complaints,people just love to complain rather than enjoy what they got.
  • You're sooooo true!
  • What blows my mind is all the people that love windows phone so much that they are furious about not upgrading to WP8, and will now leave for a platform they don't love that has the same or worse upgrade policies? Impeccable logic!
  • A lot of people is not capable of logic and we're seeing that now.
  • One of the things I noticed from peoples comments that they will be left behind with apps. I watched the entire presentation video and what I got out of it is that any app, isn't requiring WP8 hardware, can easily be ported over for WP7.8. Sounds great to me.
  • If it's built specifically for the WP8 API then there's no way it will work on 7.8. I have had an app idea for 2 years that is not possible on WP7. I already know I can do it on WP8. It will never come out for WP7.8
  • I'd be stoked to get the new navigation with WP 7.8. That probably doesn't rely on the new hardware or APIs, does it?
  • Doesn't seem too though GPS apps can update in the background on WP8. Perhaps they could omit that part, not sure.
  • I am somewhere between happy and uncertain. I will certainly not leave windows phone, but I am very curious before I can express a definite opinion. I hope it will be more than the startscreen, but we will see.
  • Ok, after reading more messages, I just want to clarify, I'm very happy with 7.8, I just hope that there will be more but just out of optimism, not because I am unhappy
  • I don't understand why people are upset at all, WP8 is 4 months or so away and we ARE getting an update.  I had the Galaxy S and it took FOREVER to get the 2.3 update and by that time it was old news, at least MSFT is trying to keep phones current and I don't blame them for not overhauling the OS when they could dedicate those resources to supporting the future rather than carrying the past.
    As with any technology, if you plan on using your contract to upgrade, you need to make sure you are going to be happy with the device for 2 years after the first thirty days (if not, return it).  Everything moves so fast that it is completely unsurprising that the landscape is totally different 6 months down the road, let alone 2 years.  This is not an excuse for Microsoft, it is a reality that should leave no one caught off guard because it has been this way a long time.  I think the most important thing though is that no one is forcing these people not to buy a WP8, it is that they will have to pay the unsubsidized price of around 500-900 dollars.  I bought a Lumia 710 outright because I knew WP8 was coming, but I wanted one of the newer isn't a surprise at all that WP8 is coming, no one forced you to buy your phone and you shouldn't have bought it on the premise of an upgrade because one was never guaranteed.
  • Those polled are the same people who only have a smartphone to play games. Lets be serious 7.8 is a slap in the face to Gen 1.5 user i.e. FocusS/2, Lumias & Titan2 we should get full WP8 minus NFC support
  • It's not what you deserve that is at issue here. It's the actual ability to re-flash a device, at home, with a whole new OS (kernel, firmware, bootloader) etc. while loosing all your data. MS isn't offering WP8 because you don't deserve it, it's just a very complicated technical issue.
  • Do we know as of today that the "Start Screen" will be the only updated feature in WP 7.8? I hope not....pretty sure more features can be added not requiring the hardware change. Either way I will be buying a Nokia WP8 device as soon as they come out just like I bought my L900 out right. Just really curious...
  • I see what you mean, and it would be nice if that were to happen (remember, we still don't know what 7.8 will fully entail). But, what if the current phones' hardware truly cannot support these new developments? I still think whatever comes with 7.8 would be a good compromise considering the alternative - getting nothing at all!
  • Personally, I like the way the updates are. I understand the hardware differences and software differences. What I DONT understand is why ppl are acting like this is the first time in the history of TECHNOLOGY that something like this has happened. If they were so, we'd still be using Atari's, Commodore Computers and who knows what kinda "mobile" devices.
  • Yep, happens even today.  I put together a new computer with an AMD Radeon 6970, 3 months later the HD 7970 was announced and it trounces the performance of the 6970 I JUST bought...Am I unsatisfied? No, because I know that I will be able to use the 6970 for 2 years and be satisfied with it, it is all I need.  If I thought the 6970 wasn't enough I would have returned it in 30 days.
  • I agree
  • I'm satisfied with the 7.8 update! Right now I'm really excited about the dual and quadcore phones with powerful gpu's!!! The games will have amazing graphics along with the power to push them!!! Android and IOS can suck it! ;-)
  • It's also worth noting that all 3 colours of the Lumia 900 have risen on Amazon's AT&T Best Seller list today. The black was as low as 7th 2 days ago and it has been creeping up steadily and is in 3rd right now.
    I'm hoping my current phone will last a few more months now but if I had to buy a phone right away it would definitely be a Lumia 900. The 7.8 version is a nice gesture beyond anything Google has ever done for their non-upgradeable Android phones and on par what Apple does.
  • Do you guys think the people at xda developers might somehow bring an unofficial WP 8 onto current devices? They did accomplish bringing WP 7 to HD 2.
  • If it's POSSABLE yes but, I would not expect it for months after release...if ever
    HD2 got lucky, as it is really a HD7 so they shared some tech with WP7 devices that made it a little easier to put WP7 on it. HD2 came out a few months before WP7 hit.
    Think about it this way, with all the hackers out there, is there ANY WP7 device that can run Anrdroid or is there ANY Android device that can run Windows Phone 7 ? No, so they can't fix everything.
    It might not just be possable but, no one knows till the hackers get their hands on a few devices.
  • When we bought this phone, we bought it as is. We were never promised anything else with it. Just the contents in the package. We are lucky to get any form of update.
  • Exactly
  • Microsoft should have just called 7.8, 8.0 to shut everyone up. They are clearly trying very hard to give us what they can considering the hardware restrictions. Its really common sense here. Keep up the good work Microsoft!
  • MS should have called it WP 9.0 so the people will be creaming in their pants.
  • Jaja good point
  • You know what would really make thus update better for all of us that devoted our money to WP7.x? Give us something exclusive that WP8 Won't get at all, or at least for awhile. That would make the crushing announcement somewhat bittersweet.
  • Yeah, developer-unlock my Windows Phone 7.x devices for free, so, I can cook up my own apps and put them on there. This, I could live with. :)
  • THIS would keep me from going back to iPhone.
    The notion that with the limited information provided during the Developer Summit Keynote it can be concluded that all Windows Phone 7.x devices are not being supported beyond the 7.8 update is at best presumptuous. There is nothing in any official announcement to indicate that.
    When a generation change in a device or software takes place, previous products will see an impact from this. One choice is to provide a scaled down support system which will often impact the user experience, the other is to optimize the current user experience while introducing a full scale improvement for the next generation of products.
    Apple choose the first, MSFT the latter. I am with the latter. In fact, what MSFT is doing would basically compare to putting Mountain Lion on iPhone.. Good luck with that..;)
    I am pretty sure it would be possible to run WP8 on current hardware, but it would be a horrible user experience. When you strip away all the stuff causing the horror you will pretty much end up with what will become WP7.8 is what I think..
  • All I want to know is that the 7,8 update will include some form of backup mode, allowing users to backup SMS, MMS, Settings etc. 
    Also if the Omnia 7 will get the 7,8 update
  • MS stated that ALL phones will get wp7.8. And those features you want will have to wait. And those features wren't even close to the complete features for wp8 and wp7.8. I suspect there would be w8 features included. Like the things you want and picture password. I think ms should a code converter. Like when you download a wp8 app for your wp7 phone. They should convert the code to make it work. But that doesn't exist yet. But it would be super cool :)
  • They had to move from CE to NT. Why the F did they do that in the begining? That's terrible, how are you suppose to catch up if your business plan isnt even though out 5 years ahead. That's so BS, As an owner of the Lumia 900 I wouldnt mind havent an update to WP8 if I  had to format my phone to get the new kernal. I am still peeved that MS did something like this. Phone is only 3 months old and yet and they pull this BS.
    People who own the Lumia 900 shouldnt put up with this. They should voice their opinion otherwise companies will continue to do this later on.
  • You lack logic
  • Can you explain at least?
    Forgot to quote "Microsoft had to switch the kernel from CE to NT"
  • Hmmm, I could even be fine with the 7.8 update, but why no IE10? And what about the apps? Now developers will have to make two versions of the same app, if so I bet they'll drop 7.8 real quick and we'll be left with no apps nor updates...this is very unclear and sounds quite scary to me.
  • No wp8 apps can be ported to wp7 very easily. They will do this because they want to raise awareness for their app and make money. Honestly I think they'll rather make more money than sticking to just wp8. So I think the developers will do it or Microsoft will.
  • Awareness for their apps? Have a look around you and see where the WP7.x marketshare is right now. Then take into account that only a fraction of all current WP7.x users will ever even look at your app, so, if you're lucky, 1 out of 1000 people may download your app for testing. That ain't worth it to most developers to consider porting their apps over to Windows Phone 7.x. And no, apps can't be easily ported. Watch the developer event video again!
  • No wp8 apps can be ported to wp7 very easily. They will do this because they want to raise awareness for their app and make money. Honestly I think they'll rather make more money than sticking to just wp8. So I think the developers will do it or Microsoft will.
  • No wp8 apps can be ported to wp7 very easily. They will do this because they want to raise awareness for their app and make money. Honestly I think they'll rather make more money than sticking to just wp8. So I think the developers will do it or Microsoft will.
  • Daniel,
    In the phonearena article about new Windows Phone 8 features
    It says All of this is also coming to WP Mango devices.
    Is this not true? Would be neat to have on my 900
  • I understand that we won't get support for NFC/Wallet and the native code apps, but here's my three main questions about 7.8
    1) Is IE10 a part of the update? HTML5 support is huge, especially in the enterprise. If current WP7.5 handsets aren't getting that update, that's a big deal
    2) Devs will most certainly make net new apps (and potentially update existing ones) so that they will be exclusive to WP8 only as WP8 handsets will be the only ones capable of running them. That's true fragmentation right there.
    3) What's stopping MSFT from swiching kernels AGAIN in the next few years when Windows 9/WP9 comes out. Is this going to screw over WP8 users? Most likely not since they've committed Windows 8 to the WinRT platform and they'd be screwing over a much more sizeable portion of their users, but who knows sometimes with Redmond. They've made worse decisions in the past...
  • They'll likely bring you the software side of wp8
  • They're not switching kernels again anytime soon. Even the Xbox 720 is based of Windows 8 and that's not out till 2013 and will last 10+ years.
  • I'm inclined to believe you simply because it would be catastrophic for Windows and XBox users, but this is a company that said "we are committed to licensing our server products on a per-processor basis" four years ago and are now in the midst of switching all their server licensing to a per-processor model to a per-core basis.
  • Windows Phone 8 looks amazing and I can't wait for it, but the one thing that is really bothering me and making me mad is will users with non WP8 devices get all the same software features that WP8 users will have, because I just got the Lumia 900 and I don't want to find out that now all I'm gonna get with the WP8 update is a new start screen and no WP8 app compatibility. I know I wouldn't be able to get the new wallet app and other apps requiring new phone hardware, but what about all the WP8 software features that don't require a WP8 device. Will older devices get the new features without having to get a WP8 device or will we just get things like the new start screen and new settings?
  • Like I said above they'll bring the software side of wp8. Like what you stated. And apps can be port easily between wp8 and 7. They will give you some or most of the features. But I suspect most like what they did to mango. And you'll more maybe
  • Was part of the 6% but now part of the 54%, WP has a way of growing on you. Sorry Cupertino, caught the WP bug.
  • Doesn't bother me. I was an early adopter, so I won't have to wait long anyway. :P
  • I delayed my upgrade for wp8 ;)
  • Ok, I've been reading everything about windows phone since I got my lumia. Now with MSs summit, the bubble of frustration has exploded in the community. Ignorance. Pure and sad ignorance. I've got a wp7 phone, as I said, my girlfriend's got a Samsung galaxy ace, and a friend the IPhone 4. what do you think it happens to them when a new android OS or a new IOS comes out? The first one can't even upgrade, unless they go to cianogenmod, such isn't exactly the best thing to do, and the second and most loved? He upgrades, but knowing that he'll miss the best staff, because backwards compatibility isn't possible through the phones entire life. Hat happens with my friends iphone and IOS 6? No 3d maps. And with his iPad 2?(yes he's got one as well) he can't get siri. Because comrades, lets face it. They want us to buy the new gadgets, and they want to innovate with this purpose. At least we are getting the windows phone 7.8, wich is more than what my girlfriend is getting. Is not called windows phone 8, but that just'd be hypocrisy. Lets wait and see the new OS. Then judge, and if you don like it, buy a jelly bean. Peace
  • I understand why you might say it's ok at least we're getting something. Yeah A 7.8 update is fine, but you have to understand that Microsoft talked a big game about fragmentation, talked about updating. Your agrument make sense for older gen phones, but many are complaining about the Lumia 900. If i owned a Samsung Focus, and maybe a focus S or a HTC Titan I (Titan II) I wouldnt be complaining or disappointed. It's the fact that many who bought Lumia 900 and HTC Titan II or Samsung Focus 2, which was introduced 3 months ago. It's the idea that these phones are relatively new, still in it's infancy and are denied the latest update. If you owned a Samsung Focus from 2010 and got the 7.8 update, yes be very fortunate. I like many who bought the Lumia 900 are denied the WP8 which we clearly know MS can make happen. I know MS is out to make money but to do it like this is very discouraging for future buyers.
    Keep in mind poeple are complainning because of the new update or the lack of for the this year Models.....THIS YEAR's MODELS!
    The way google is doing it is terrible I know and I really dont want to go into it, but to compare it to the iPhone 4 which is 2 years old right about now is still getting the latest iOS6 some feature drawbacks and the iPhone 4s, which is about 8 months old is getting a full update with no limitation. The Lumia 900, three months old, with no full update. no skype intergration, no true multitasking, no new Bing map 2.0 and probably a lot more. That idea is there shouldnt be any drawback unless it's hardware limitation.
  • So you haven't had those features for 3 months... We haven't had them for 18 months and somehow we survived :P
  • I actually had the opportunity of returning my 900 today because of a defect, but I just exchanged it for a new one instead. Thinking back to all the things MS announced, one thing people aren't taking into consideration that while all those features are neat and exciting, battery technology really just isn't up to par when it comes to mobile devices. 
    when we consider the fact that WP7 has one of the best battery lives out of all the other phones out there you have to consider the fact that: 
    1) it's single core. the more cpu's the more power it drains
    2) the background processes are purposely limited to prevent poorly written code from drianing your battery. once MS opens this up, there will be battery drains from poorly written code all over the place.
    3) Running graphically intensive games will again just be another drain on the battery.
    so when considering all of these things, I really just end up using my phone for general media consumption and wasting time on stupid games like fruit ninjas. If I really want to do any major gaming, I'll do it on my PC (or possibly Surface Tablet when it's out). And given the option of going back to another Android phone where I have to charge it ten times a day, I'll stick with my 900 regardless of the lack of WP8 update. And unless there is some major breakthrough in battery tech, I'm guessing WP8 phones will either have to be more bulky and heavy, or will have significantly worse battery life than similar WP7 phones.
  • They will run will a different chips/processors so wp8 will be battery efficient
  • no matter how much more battery efficient they make it. at the end of the day an idle dual core will still drain more than an idle single core. and besides the battery efficiency, everything else they're introducing is geared towards running more powerful apps and running more apps in the background. that will undoubtedly kill your battery...
  • True... Battery tech is seriously lacking. If I play games I get around 3-4 hours out of my HD7 at best.
  • I have no problem with this... I expected some kind of fragmentation ever since Nokia became a not replacing my lumia anytime soon.. Just please give me new UI so can slap people with it.. Hahaha thank you nokia/msft
  • Go ahead and rationalize/justify this situation any way you like, but it still sucks to be a current Gen hardware owner right now. Many of you say you're just fine with the it, but I'm willing to bet that a number of you will be singing a different tune in a few months when you're reading about these cool updates and features that you're not gonna get because your stuck in a contract for the next year and however many months. MS and Nokia pulled a fast one when they were pushing out new hardware and yelling "Buy, buy, buy!" knowing full well what was coming, and that's a fact. They don't have enough of a user base as it is to treat customers this way, and a bunch of the fence sitters who pay attention to the tech blogs will almost certainly stay away now. Way to sabotage your owning marketing, guys. And to all you people saying "Just buy the nee hardware if you want it", it must be really nice to have that kind of disposable income. Most of us don't.
  • I totally agree with you, It's just upsetting owning a phone only 3 months old and knowing It would not get the latest update.
  • don't get me wrong. i'm actually thoroughly disappointed that they're not upgrading us. my point is not to say that they are correct in what they're doing. if anything I'd just prefer a single core (maybe dual core) phone with WP8 on it. Definitely not 4 core processors like some are being announced. All my friends with phones that have dual and quad core processors have to charge their phones like 10 times a day. At the end of the day, you can't have the thinnest, lightest, most powerful phone that lasts for a week without charging. The more stuff you cram on there, the shorter the battery life is. So to me I wouldn't go back to a dumb phone with a week long battery life, but I definitely enjoy being able to use my phone all day only needing to charge it at night. 
    I posted this a couple days ago, but think this applies now more than ever:
    "I remember this: many of you are too young to realize but Apple did EXACTLY THE SAME THING in the mid 90s. When they switched from PowerPC chips to Intel an OSX, they basically threw the finger to their ENTIRE USER BASE (no iPod or iPad at the time) and said "Switch or Die". They lost some market share, but they were losing anyway. They had to do SOMETHING to move ahead. Now look at them. This was the perfect time for Microsoft to do this. They proved they had a viable platform worth investing in (WP7 and WP7.5) to themselves AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, their partners. They did it at the time when the viable base was at it's absolute smallest (to avoid pissing off the least amount of people) and before trying to deeply integrate with a dissimilar core architecture (W8). They did this BEFORE everyone switched to W8 (in the next 2-3 years) and to complete their "3 screen" objective. If they did this anytime before this, it would have been questionable if all the resources required would have been worth the tiny marketshare they had before Nokia started spreading like a virus. Anytime after this time, they would have potentially pissed off A LOT more people and done some REAL damage. The change to a W8 core fixes many problems that would have been difficult to counter on other platforms (after all, it's basically a handheld PC with a smaller screen) and gives unique advantages (security, management, develop one codebase, etc.) If you remember, Microsoft rushed WP7 to market because they simply couldn't wait any longer to have even a prayer at getting any marketshare from Apple and Google (hence the new strategy of announcing things to keep people from buying other products even though they are not even close to finishing it for release). People need to stop getting their feelings hurt and realize that this is a business and sometimes hard decisions have to be made. They would have loved to keep dragging us along, but, in many ways, that is what is wrong with Windows as it is. The only difference between Microsoft and Apple is that Apple did it first (because it had to). There will probably be similar results (Apple has 5-6% of PC market, but owns tablets (if it stays true to form), and Microsoft will probably have <20% of phone market, but owns PCs). The difference is, the phone market is much bigger (not many people have more than one or two PCs in their home or at work, but every single person on the planet will soon have a phone), so Microsoft is pushing forward to try to capture that market. Everyone who makes a tool in this age will have to do something to this degree at some time (Look at Adobe Flash, Adobe is moving on and making tools for HTML5 now. The web is a constantly changing animal, more than any of this. What used to be done with .jpegs and .gifs is now done in CSS with code). There are casualties and people left out anytime this happens (Flash developers need new skills to be sure). Now is Microsoft's time.
    A Lumia 900 owner"
  • If they Nokia knew all along that WP8 can only reside on dual core or higher then they should have shipped present day Lumias with that kind of hardware.
    Dual core are now existing for almost atleast a year now
  • It's not just about the hardware.  It's about the core.  First, they would have to completely wipe everyones phone to install the new core and new OS.  On top of that OEMs wouild have had to rewrite all of their device drivers for the new core.  Second, it is likely that the S1 and S2 snapdragon processors in the the first and second gen devices would not have handled the NT core well.  In other words if they could have did it they would have did it.  It just wasn't practicle.
  • I am in Canada and recently signed 3 year contract on a 900. I did so knowing that common core would mean no WP8 for me, but I was ok with that, in fact I was hoping for common core. I don't want to jump on WP8 until 2nd Gen hardware comes out, and at that point i will buy out the remainder of my contract. My 900 will find new life paired with an Xbox, or streaming music to my stereo, etc. When I bought my 900, I did not feel that Microsoft owed me an upgrade to WP8, but the do owe me something. they need to do everything in their power to make sure that my 900 can participate in as much of their ecosystem as possible, because that is really what I bought into. I want smart glass, Xbox music and video, sky drive improvements like accessing SkyDrive music from Xbox music, etc, and anything else that they have not told me about yet,and I am pretty confident I will get most of these items. If i miss out on too many of the ecosystem improvements that are coming with W8, then I might start to complain. Until then I will continue to enjoy using this beautiful piece of technology that I have in my hands right now.
  • Those people who are happy with WP7.8 do not know that once WP8 and W8 are released WP7 app development is dead. 
  • Of course it's not dead. Most developers will develop wp8 and wp7 apps. Wp8 apps can be easily ported to ep7. Doesn't even take long. They'll rather get $$$$ than to just develop for wp8
  • Exactly.  Developers will be putting out WP7.8/8.x Apps for awhile.
  • I dont think company's are going to waste time and money on WP7 when WP8 comes out.The support will be their in the beginning but won't last long.
  • You better watch the developer summit again and, this time, please watch it completely! There is no "easily ported" of WP8 apps and, frankly, developers couldn't care less about the handful of WP7.x user interested in their app! You keep insisting that developers will do it, yet, the reality is that developers will have to rewrite their WP8 app for the Windows7 platform. This requires time and resources - and both oth those requirements can be expressed in real world money. No developer will bother!
  • Says you.  I disagree.
  • Porting apps to WP8 will be easier not for WP7.That's been the big issue with why we don't have some of the most popular apps on WP7 because their was way to much coding involved to bring them over from IOS or Android.
  • Like i said before, im completely fine with this. A lot of people seem to be freaking out about something that hasn't even been released yet. 1st Gen people should just, well should I say pipe down. Your going to get an upgrade and have all your apps to boot. While I know it's tougher for us 1.5 and 2nd Gen people, I have a feeling if you squeal enough at ATT they might just work with you. I plan on going that route, and if because made the decision to get a lumia, and I have to pay full pricedor a new phone, well that's my problem. I like my lumia, have had multiple strangers come up to me and ask me about. They didn't ask me if was dual core, had NFC, etc. They asked me how I liked it. I told them its an awesome phone, with great features. There are so few of us in relation to android and iPhone users that it wouldn't cost ATT that much to make the squealers happy. We should be celebrating the fact that we now have a more more robust up to date option on its way from MS.
  • I believe the poll just shows how great of a platform Windows Phone 7.5 is.  It is more than fine for the average person.  Everything that Windows Phone 8 brings to the table will be wounderful and improve the user experience.  But WP7.5 definitely gets the job done.   WP7.8 is going to be great.  I think I would be really upset if they did not give me the new start screen becuase the heart and soul of Windows Phone are the live tiles.  So I applaud Microsoft for letting us upgrade to 7.8 and experiencing the new start screen.  It is what makes Windows Phone unique.  Eventually all of us Windows Phone 7.8 users will be able to upgrade to WP8 (me in Oct 2013.)  By then there will just be more WP8 to choose from! 
  • Microsoft should have backported more stuff (the VoIP API or at least hardcoded equivallent Skype integration comes to mind). As a WP owner I don't feel very bad but I don't see many WP7 sales in the following months unless they slash the prices.
  • Whoever said their leaving is a bunch of morons. If u have a 3gs, try running ios 5 on it. Runs like shit. Try running ice cream sandwich on 1st Gen android or even some second Gen hardware. Runs like shit. Os's eveolve and so does hardware. Its the natural evolution of technology. Microsoft is doing this to up the ante and compete with the big dogs. We know we have the best Os that's about to get a whole lot better, now we need the hardware to run it. If they went ahead and gave us wp8 on our lumias and focuses, titans and such, then we would bitch if the experience was pour. People are complaining but they seem to forget the same thing happens on ios and android. I understand we just got our phones some of us, but if we wanna stay in this fight and take our choice to the top, then deal :-)
  • I'm happy! I have a Focus and my device is to week to take advantage of WP8. I figured this back in December. The l900 users who keep up with this stuff are a minority. We have to remember that the average 900 user has no idea about this whole WP8 news right now. We must look at things realistically. This decision won't hurt temporarily to much. Its going to be OK.
    But, if I just bought a 900 I would be kind of pissed! Lol.
  • Who knows, maybe MS will have a subsequent update, maybe 7.9????????
  • Who knows, maybe MS will have a subsequent update, maybe 7.9????????
  • I think people will be pleasently suprised and happy once all the new features for WP8 are revealed and they find that many of those features will indeed make it over to WP7.8.  It's not just going to be the start screen people.
  • You know something we don't?
  • These cock suckers knew they were going to use the windows 8 kernel quite awhile back.  They chose to release ver 7 on an entirely different framework knowing it would have to be scrapped.  Way to go buttholes.  So glad my 'ancient' iPhone 4 can run the latest apps...unlike my windows phone come this fall.  
  • So your gonna troll articles now and never buy wp again?
  • I would still like to know if they have added a notification manager.
  • Didn't Nokia say on their twitter account last week or so that there is no reason why wp8 can't run on the 900?
  • Okay.. So hard/software aside: if WP8 is called "Apollo", what is WP7.8 called? (If it's been asked/answered, I haven't seen it)
  • I think it "lolololollo"
  • #Fail
  • hmmm... "Trollololo" ?
  • People should've bought phones for what they can do now, now what they can do in the future. Be happy with what you have now!
  • I'll gladly welcome 7.8 on to my Focus. I have until next fall(2013) until I can upgrade, so this will quell me for another year :-) Better than getting nothing.
  • Just hook me up with the new IE10 browser experience, the new start screen, and still give us a fee good apps and I'm straight. I'm easy to satisfy.
  • Part of me is a little disapointed but, 7.8 is ok as long as we get it a month or so BEFORE the release of Windows Phone 8.  I would think of it as a big perk to be able to live with how my next phone will be before getting it.
    I had a hard time getting the tiles that I want on my homescreen, some had to go so it's not too much. Now I can have a crazy busy one ?
    I hope we can get this in a few weeks, not a few months. 7.8 would be fine with me for now.
    WIth how games will be on it, no question, I am getting a WIndows Phone 8 model, depends on what my carrier offers...
  • While most people seem to be happy about what they have how will you feel about the lack of continued app development when developers (especially commercial endeavors - think Banks, Hotels, Airlines, etc) develop Windows 8 apps (think 300 million plus desktops) that won't work on your phone and you're once again on the outside looking in at the "I wish we had _____ app".  It also kills Nokia (and any other hardware partners) sales for the next 3-4 months until WP8 is out.  This may be the final nail in the coffin for Nokia - who can't wait another 6-12 months for profit margins to pick up.  Hate to be the Negative Nelly here - someone has to.
  • Yeah, I doubt most of that is true.  As far as sales go those of us that read these forums are but a small minorty of total users.  Most potential buyers won't know or care.  They will buy the phone they want now because it does what they want it to do now.
  • Most people buy their phones from stores whose employees will most certainly warn them not buy wp7 with wp8 coming in a few months.  This will really hurt Nokia.
  • By the time there is enough WP8 apps most users will have a WP8 device by then.
  • Honestly what needs to happen is AT&T should just step up and give current Windows Phone owners early upgrades after 12 months. I'd buy a wp8 device and renew my contract...
  • This!
  • thank you Microsoft for not forgetting current windows phone 7.5 users. Having 7.8 is fine to upgrade. Compare to Apple who did not give upgrade to current iPhone 4 users to upgrade to iPhone 4s. They had to buy a new iPhone 4s to get the features. Also iPhone looks still butt ugly and cluttered with there dead icons hahhahha
  • Win8 will be a significant jump from win7.5
  • Hd7 owner! No complaints here! I cant wait for 7.8
  • People that follow WP7 understand why 7.8 is separate than 8. But I heard coworkers mock MS for their decision to "fragment" and "screw" existing customers. The fact is it wasn't explained/ sold well. Plus people are used to the apple paradigm of universal backwards compatibility even when some versions of IOS simply would offers some features on some devices. The idea is that MS should have sold the 8 update for existing phones with caveats explaining what features won't be available on older pre-WP8 devices simply due to technical capabilities of older phones. People focus on numbers too much and 8 > 7.8. I like the honest approach but it can be confusing for newcomers.
  • I got the hd7 first day. Got the radar a month ago and no regrets. The phone works just fine right now and that's why I bought it. I knew Apollo was not to far off and I still bought the radar not knowing what the update status would be. If a phone comes out on mobile that has some really nice specs I'm gonna buy that one the day it comes out and keep my radar on the side cuz its still gonna do what i bought it for. Stop complaining folks
  • Well, since I already planned to buy a brand new windows phone 8 handset to replace my 2-year-old HD7 sometime between February and April next year, no matter if WP8 will be available for my HD7, I don't quite really care about WP 7.8 update for existing handsets........Although it's nice to see there's still updates available for my old handset......
  • Well MS planned that from the beginning. But they needed some stupid sheep because they knew if they wait with their true PhoneOS until 2013 then there won't Brant market left. So they built WP7 to gain a lil market share until they have WP8 out. As a side effect the sheep actually believed in the platform and developed 100k apps that now will run on MS' true PhoneOS. Now the sheep can go yo a butcher. MS doesn't need them anymore.
    That's why MS only spent 2 mins in a 90 mins keynote on WP7.8. Because they don't care about it. Heck until early June they didn't even want to have something like WP7.8 according to a poster here who attended a WP partner NDA meeting on Jube 1st.
  • There's also the issue with future low-end devices.  It's been said that these will still be using wp7.x as wp8 won't run on single core?  So I guess there will be updates for wp7.x in the short term.
    But introducing "legacy" devices when wp8 is out will be a strange situation...
  •   Lets support another people to succeed. If you wish an entrepreneur who needs a small push to start.   In any case. It's a great website to support anyone you want.
  • Like I have said before I think the people expressing their frustrations are probably people who bought a titan, titan 2, or a lumia 900. And too be honest I completely understand. While a lot of people regularly peruse sites like wpcentral, a while lot more don't. And here is MS touting the latest and greatest and there you go signing up for a brand new windows phone that will lock you in until wp9. Only one problem you won't even be getting wp8. I have a trophy so I don't really care, but if you can't empathize for those people I think you need to lay off the cool aid. All this talk about 'buy the phone for the moment,' and 'how did you think your phone was going to get upgraded to dual-core' is dumb. Most people don't know anything about their phones when they buy them. All that aside this has bee terrible pr for MS. WP 7.8 has been seen so negatively because of the push MS made with the lumia only to make it obsolete. It is a sneaky, sly, business move but they just pissed off a bunch of people. I keep seeing comparisons to apple and older iPhones not being able to run newer versions of ios, the only thing is those phones were out for a year or two years already not 2-3 months.
  • If AT&T, MS, or OEM... comes forward an gives a discounted upgrade i.e. no cancellation fees for gen-2 devices like Titan, NL900 etc... it would keep the existing customers happy and helps the WP ecosystem to retain the customers for another two years
  • I'm actually glad Microsoft did this brave move. Now we will move with technology not follow it. I am ok with the 7.8 and I'm sure it will bring more than just a new start screen. Microsoft had to make this move, it is for the best of Windows Phone. All though I think the should have done this since the beginning.
  • I have no problem with this decision. Just have Nokia credit us the cost for upgrading the Lumina 900 to their new device running Windows phone 8 and I will be happy.
  • I think that Nokia will give big discounts on existing lumia owners
  • For those who leaving wp, definitely will regret when they hands on so yesterday iOS and android :) good luck to them
  • I only got my Lumia 710 a few months ago. I still love it and I can't wait to get the 7.8 update (still has yet to receive the Tango update). I know I will have to upgrade to a WP8 phone later but I would wait a few months after they are released before I switch. I rather use an already proven working device with proven working apps on a stable OS. App support may be an issue but I believe developers will be still be releasing hybrid WP7/WP8 apps for some time so I can wait. I can also make a better choice when all the major WP8 devices have been released, reviewed and tested. I guess by this time I would have gotten a year's worth of usage on my Lumia so it will be ok for me. I bought it at retail and not bundled with any data plan that would force me to  wait 1+ year before I can upgrade my phone. However even if I have to wait that long, its not a big issue for me as my phone serves most all my needs by then. Hell I only switched from WinXP to Win7 at the start of this year. Anyway if the price of a new WP8 phone is not much different from a Surface RT tablet, then I'll buy the tablet first and upgrade my phone later at a cheaper price.
  • I dont need wp8.i just need my wp 7.5 should get flash supported,bluetooth file transfer,auto rotation option,brightness adjustment by a bar.thats alll iwant
  • This is good for the future of Windows Phone. Games and apps can be optimized for the new Snapdragon chipset. The current Adreno 205 GPU is kind of weak. As long as my Lumia 900 is smooth, I am ok with this. Lumia 900 is still an excellent phone. New update is just a bonus. Though I will get a Windows Phone 8 later. I like what Microsoft is doing by sticking with Snapdragon SoC only, kind of like Apple with their love for PowerVR SGX GPUs. Android is a mess with so many different graphics chips. Check EA or Gameloft's games on Google Play, you will see many complaints about crashing, not supported, won't launch, freezes etc....
  • I'm certainly happy with what we're getting. Especially being a first gen phone user still, I'm happier now that I haven't upgraded my plan and get the Lumia phones just yet, I think it's great that I can just wait for WP8 to arrive and get a WP8 device.
    Don't know how long my Focus will last though... WP8 better come out soon!
  • I just got a Lumia 900 on a 24 month and I'm perfectly fine with it. Why? Because I expected it to happen. To anyone who was aware that there were rumours it wouldn't get to upgrade WP8 and still went out and bought one I say its your own damn stupidity. Harsh but true. You can't go out and buy a product hoping for the best when there is also talk of the worst is also a possibility, that's foolishness. Expect the worse and you'll never be let down. For those who went out and bought the phone having no idea about updates and such (people that don't follow the tech industry like we do or first time smartphone buyers), they most likely went out and bought the phone because they genuinely liked what it offered at the time of purchase. They'll also be pleasantly surprised when they get the 7.8 update with whatever other new features it comes with (its probably going to be more than just a new start screen) and will accept that when WP8 arrives they they can't get it because the new phone will have greater specs and newer hardware than theirs (NFC and dual core for example) and go about their lives. I'll be buying a WP8 phone come Autumn (Fall) as well as a Surface and it'll be all good because I expected and planned for this to happen. Use your mind when making decisions people. Don't expect everything to be all sunshine and daisies in situations like this and you won't be let down =] DK_BaNaaH has spoken!
  • What about the normal non-techie? Not everyone is a techie man
  • I covered the non-techie in the second half of my post, or at least what I'd call a non-techie
  • Agree 100%!
  • Correct me if I'm wrong, but the ONLY thing that 7.8 users are thus far announced to be receiving for certain is the updated start screen and other things that seem required based on WP8, such as OTA updates. Given it was stated that tons of new features are yet to be announced, it would lead me to believe 7.8 AND 8.0 are still going to be getting plenty of updates. My guess is they have Windows 8 with all the improvements the new hardware allows and 7.8 with all the improvements the singlecore, non-NFC hardware allow.
    In my eyes, the only thing someone can get pissed about is the potential a developer makes a Windows 8.0 app and there is no existing app that is similar to it.
    And why people think Microsoft is in the wrong here for doing this, go jump ship. Be an Android where 3/4th of your users are stuck in 2.X while 4.1 will be out relatively soon. Or be an iPhone user where only the iPhone 4S/iPhone 5 will receive the FULL version of iOS 6. Or be a Windows Phone user where your exisiting hardware gets an iPhone-esque software update or a new phone with significant hardware improvements. No other one is going to see more new toys than Windows Phone simply because the "lack" of hardware on 7.0/7.5 devices.
  • Personally, I'm ok about getting 7.8 on my HD7.... I knew MS would be coming out with something based around Win8 for WP, so I didn't bother getting a Lumia as like most things these days, tech advances; so why get bogged down getting a WP7 when Win8 and a new WP on the horizon? I totally understand that WP7 doesn't have the hardware so we can't get the kernel of Win8 on my nearly 2yr old phone....
  • This happens all the time, simply put if you don't like what Microsoft is doing then go get an iPhone or Android device. But stop complaining.
  • @Daniel thank you people don't understand that windows phone 8 is a completely new platform I got hd7 when it first came out and I told my self am not changing this phone until wp8 because I knew wp8 would be a major update over mango and certainly it is am not mad and even if I just bought a new phone I wouldn't b mad neither because am happy with the direction wp8 is going the can compete even more and with its integration with w8 make it even more amazing I can't wait to get my hands on a wp8 Nokia device for get HTC
  • I just can't wait to get my wp8 from Nokia even if I have to get it unlock tmobile better not let mi down
  • If anyone that has followed Windows Phone for any length of time bought a 2nd Gen device hoping it would get wp8 is a fool! All the experts said they wouldn't, Microsoft never said they would...its your fault. I have 2 WP 7.5s, going to trade in the focus s when I can upgrade to a wp8 device and giving my wife the lumia 900. The lumia is a great phone, but I figured it would have a shorter than expected life.
  • I chose 'Uncertain' in that poll, but I do hold out hope that WP7.8 will have most of WP8's features, except those related to NFCs and its dual-core processors. Well, just have to wait and see.
    To me, huge OS upgrades are welcome, but don't find it a big deal if it isn't available. What I'm more concerned about are patches which fix bugs, and in the case of the Lumia 800, update its camera's software.
  • I just wanna say I'll be laughing at everyone defending MS in that matter when brand new phones will come out with WP8 with simmilar or even lower specs than existing ones. The fact is, there is nothing that could stop especially Lumia 800 and 900 from getting it. And I'm pretty sure there will be low/mid end devices with WP8 sporting specs comparable to the phones above. Don't even tell me that all the WP8 devices will be top notch with quad core processors, NFC and other bells and whistles.  I'd love to see the look upon your face when it happens. It will suck to be you. I think MS wants to make money the way they're used to on each and every system they make and it's more greedy than even Apple. At Apple iPhones get free upgrades from 3.0 to 6.0 and OSX upgrade costs only $20. Have u seen MS offering upgrade options for Windows for that money?
  • The hardware needed for WP8 is not compatible with WP7.It has already been well documented on these posts.Ive already seen older Android and IPhones running the newer OS,s and its not pretty even some I've seen have bricked because of it.
  • OK, so lower specs WP8 phones will have some special thingie that makes them compatible with WP8? I don't even care that much cause I bought Lumia 800 about a month ago whilst waiting for BB10 as soon as the physical keyboard becomes available. I had android but it was too clumpy for me and I actually like WP better in that matter but still can't believe multitasking is non existant even comparing to old BB OS6. WhatsApp for example works super slow and has to fully load everytime I wanna check something else. All in all I like Lumia better than my Motorola RAZR.
    The bottom line is MS says F*** Off to all the users who inversted in their system even though it's market share is small and these people gave MS a huge credit of trust just to be told. Get a new device if you don't wanna be kicked out of the WP circle. I know most of us here change phones at least every 2 years. But most of people like to stay with their phones much longer.
  • Lower priced WP8 devices will be running the same hardware as the higher end devices.The lower end devices will have less ram and won't be supporting high res LCD screens or duel core or 4.7 screens.
  • "Ive already seen older Android and IPhones running the newer OS,s and its not pretty even some I've seen have bricked because of it."
    To support that point, my colleague have his SGS 2 upgraded to ICS few weeks ago through the OTA method, and while it installed without any problems (not to mention bringing in performance improvements), it did start to randomly freeze two weeks after updating it. Happens either when accessing a random app, browsing contacts or using the camera. He was forced to restart it when that happens. Not frequent and only happens once in a while, but at the same time, I felt bad for recommending that update to him in the first place.
  • uh...wpc's results may be inaccurate. i voted and don't use a wp device. o_o
  • I was told my phone, Samsungi917 cannot be upgraded to 7.5, so I'm stuck@ 7.0, any rumors on 7.0 -> 7.8?
  • wouldnt it have been nice if they said that they would give you a money off a new handset if you had only just upgraded like they have previous with windows desktops and laptops?
  • Nobody has commented on the fact that Microsoft COULD HAVE allowed OEMs to build phones that would have been upgradable - it's not like the technology was not available - dual core, WVGA (800x480), NFC - all the Lumia 900 would have needed was a dual core and it would have been upgradable.  Certainly, there are a lot of high end phones (HTC One X, GS3) that easily meet the specs of Windows Phone 8.  In fact, I wouldn't be surprised (given the R&D involved) if the first Windows Phone 8's from HTC looks almost exactly like the One X (high), One S (middle) and One V (low) and the first Samsung is a GS3 look alike.  Nothing wrong with that it's just those phones could have been released with WP7 the first of the year and been upgradable (even if it required wiping the phone) to WP8.
  • There will be plenty more features especially that they disclosed that there not mentioning anything else. Also representatives only played with the sizing of tiles and did not want to access any other features on the phone
  • I'm glad i waited for WP8, rather than upgrading to a Lumia 900. I'd be seething if i had just brought one on a 2 year contract.
    Still don't understand why some of the software features of WP8 can't be backported to WP7. Surely doing that enables WP7 to stay alive for another year or 2, allowing Nokia, et al, to keep selling low spec WP7 devices to developing countries, as a stepping stone to WP8.
    Don't think WP7 owners are ever going to be 100% happy, but theres certainly some big steps Microsoft could be taking to appease them.
  • I know that its pretty split on being a good or bad thing but for me I think its a huge kick in the teeth for WP7 owners.. well at least for me. 
    I've had the Lumia 800 for about 2 weeks and I admit its a great handset, could do with some better apps but as a former Android user Im well aware it can take a bit of time to pick up speed.
    That said, its a two week old handset that wasnt released that long ago and as such youd expect it to be supported in terms of software for a 'decent' period of time and comparing it to the likes of android and iOS theres no reason it shouldnt.  Looking at the iPhone 3gs, its got about half the power of the Lumia and was released 3 years ago but it still gets updated and still gets iOS 6 in the Autumn. 
    While the plan to release 7.8 might appease some and for me at least my handset will last a bit longer but overall it feels like a cheap cop out when they should just give us the full windows 8 experience.
  • What about IE10 nobody wants IE10? Faster and better than IE9 and more compliant to HTML5.
  • sorry... but is this a propaganda???