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Google’s problem with Windows Phone and does it matter?

In a recent interview Google stated they will not devote any resources to making apps for either Windows 8 or Windows Phone 8. They have also now ceased consumer support for ActiveSync.  Some are calling it ‘war’ while others passionately question if Windows Phone can survive without Google products and services.

The relationship between Google and Microsoft has always been somewhat hostile. In many ways the battle they engage in now can be seen as a kind of echo from a distant technological past. Google have dug in their heels and to some degree shown their true colours by declaring zero support for Microsoft’s newest operating systems, Windows Phone and Windows 8.

But does it matter and has anything really changed?

Core Microsoft Services

I mentioned an echo of previous battles past as it is by looking back that we get a good measure of the forces that have shaped the Google of today. It is impossible to talk of Google’s plans and current product line up without talking about Eric Schmidt. He has been at war with Microsoft for most of his long career, manning the defiant guns at both Sun Microsystems and Novell, two of Microsoft’s previously biggest competitors. Both of those companies have fallen by the wayside but Eric Schmidt has perhaps never stopped fighting that war, he is a true veteran of this on-going conflict.

"They [Google] realised long ago that it was not enough to exist as a semi-parasitic add-on for Microsoft Windows or to only live in a browser.."

Eric Schmidt was put in charge of Google to guide the young company through the painful early years and during that time he has moulded the company into what it is today. This is a company that matches Microsoft product-for-product in almost every category. Even though Google is a search company at its core it has invested time and money into developing its own operating system (Android, Chrome) and even a productivity suite. So transfixed with competing with Microsoft often they are happy to dump them in the marketplace for free, Google Docs is a perfect example of this.

There are of course many reasons why Google has chosen to make its own operating systems, they realised long ago that it was not enough to exist as a semi-parasitic add-on for Microsoft Windows or to only live in a browser.  As an advertising company it is their goal to know as much about you as possible. When it came to Desktop Windows, users didn’t feel too comfortable with Google Search riffling through their files on the hard drive. No, they needed to build their own OS and bake in this data collection from the get go. A new delivery system to ensure their supply of user information is never cut off or restricted was required, hello Android OS.

The recent ‘news’ announcement on not committing time or resources to developing for Windows Phone is somewhat disingenuous. Google has no presence on Windows Phone at all (save for a lousy search "app") they have not committed any resources since the platform launched. Google search on Windows Phone is one of the most basic apps available, barely enough to call itself a real app. Perhaps just a placeholder on the Windows Phone Store in case someone else takes their name? Google on Windows Phone is not an app, not by any stretch of the imagination. Why would they bother?

"Does Windows Phone need Google and its services to be successful, no."

So we often hear how Google make apps for Apples iOS devices and that example is held high by many who wish to make something of the lack of Google apps for Windows Phone. Often they fail to explore the real reasons why. The reason why Google is present on iOS is two–fold, it has sufficient numbers of users to data mine and it has a weak collection of service offerings. It is easy for Google to provide alternative search, maps and even mail on Apple’s iOS devices because Apple is either missing entirely some services or doesn’t have the same level of depth in some offerings. It is something Apple has been working hard to rectify but after their maps fiasco backfired so publicly they might be feeling too burnt to try that again. For now, Google will benefit from all the data points that iPhone users will provide as they trundle about using their Google maps platform. Google for the time being have a place on iOS because they can offer Apples users something which Apple cannot itself.

In many ways Microsoft and Google seemingly have something to compete with the other in almost every product field. Both companies by their own endeavours now look staggeringly similar, Search, Mail, Operating Systems, Productivity Software, Mobile and Mapping. Google roll most of their products into the Android platform, this is their delivery system and if you are invested in Google products and services this is where you can find them all. 

On the Microsoft side there is currently no better place to experience the full gamut of Microsoft’s services line-up than what you find Windows Phone. Is it here more than anywhere else that the future betting and eco system play can be seen clearly, Microsoft like Google owns the full stack.

Some Google Services

Google Web Apps

The question has to be asked, where would Google fit onto a device that has Bing search hardwired into a dedicated search button? By integrating Bing into Windows Phone by way of a dedicated physical button Microsoft has clearly determined there is no place for Google search on their newest platform. It’s possible this early first move may have been sufficient to keep Google away from Windows Phone.

"It simply doesn’t leave much wiggle room for Google to offer a compelling set of apps"

Microsoft has invested countless millions into building out an entire web platform to compete with Google, much in the same way Google built its own OS to do the same. As a result Microsoft has a fully realised web eco system, SkyDrive, Office on the Web, Outlook, Bing and MSN to name a few headliners. In many cases they offer a far better experience to Google’s offerings both on the web and on their Android devices.

Two services which get the most attention are Gmail and Google Docs. Does it damage the Windows Phone platform to have to ‘settle’ with Outlook and Office as alternatives? I think not, what Microsoft offers here are both best in class, thanks in no small part to the success of Google Docs and Gmail.

Windows Phone Microsoft Apps and Services

Microsoft apps and services Windows Phone 8

There is no question that Google doesn’t produce fantastic products: search, mail and maps are held high as good examples. At present both companies offer pretty much the same services, in some cases they are better; in some cases they are worse. The problem for Windows Phone is that Microsoft has done such a good job of integrating all their offerings into one device. It simply doesn’t leave much wiggle room for Google to offer a compelling set of apps.

We are moving to a world where these eco systems will finally close, Google is rapidly reaching an inflection point where it may finally be able to shake off Microsoft and Apple. All three tech giants are moving to a place where they simply offer it all, similar to the mega supermarket chains that offer everything from Groceries to Insurance plans.

In time we’ll figure out which one we like best, get the loyalty card and for the most part choose which one we prefer, maybe stray occasionally for a touch of variety. The situation we see with Google and its stance with Windows 8 and Windows Phone could at some point be mirrored when Apple does what Microsoft have and close the gaps in their services.

SkyDrive + Eco System Sync

Eco System Sync - SkyDrive connecting the dots..

The war of course doesn’t end with Windows Phone, Microsoft have far bigger guns to bring into play in this skirmish. Windows 8 has just launched, with that comes an operating system built from the ground up to be the embodiment of Microsoft’s vast eco system.  All of its main services are built right in, Maps, Cloud Storage, Online Store, Xbox, Mail and Bing search. Where is the space for Google to offer something Microsoft cannot?  There is also the highly successful proxy war that Microsoft is holding behind closed doors to secure revenue from device makers selling Android devices.

"Microsoft itself holds the key to Windows Phone becoming a successful platform.."

It is fair for Google to choose to not develop for a platform that doesn’t really need it but suggesting this is because it a lack of users is just hot air. Adding more fuel to the fire Google has now removed the ability to use ActiveSync with its services for consumers (paid Google Apps subscribers can still have access). It is clear they are willing to alienate a huge tract of their user base to drawn the line in the sand with their eco system, if you want to use their stuff you’ll need to go directly to them. Will they use the same strong-arm tactics with Apple when the time comes?  By proxy iOS users are all already loyal Google fans, look at the return of the maps to see how much so.

To hear Google reject Windows 8 is something new. Only time will tell if they have to eat a serious portion of humble pie and build out their offering there.

Does Windows Phone need Google and its services to be successful? No. The fate of Windows Phone and its adoption in the marketplace does not rest in the hands of Google. Microsoft itself holds the key to Windows Phone becoming a successful platform, rapid evolution of its cloud services and integration with the rest of the MS eco system. 

  • I don't think WP succes depends on Google, or Google success depends on supporting WP. But when these companies start being aholes with each other, only the consumer loses in the end. Do I was a better youtube/gmail app, sure. I wont dump WP due to not having it though. But if they played together nicely, we would be better off.
  • Thing is, Google's apps aren't best in class anyway. MetroTube is superior to any Google-made YouTube app on Android or iOS. Only since Google adopted (copied?) the Metro UI style for all their offerings have their apps actually become usable. And the Play store is an absolute mess. If only Google didn't own YouTube, I for one could be completely free of Google all together.
  • Yup:
    MS need an answer to YouTube
    MS need "search by date" in BING
    Then I would be rid of the spy in the sky Google.
    MS needs an alternative to iTunes Match
    Then I would be rid of Apple too :)
    Microsoft have released some great products recently, Windows Phone 8, Windows 8 and Windows Surface.
    They just need to polish the heck out of them.
    The phone needs custom sounds for email, sort order for Inbox, and lots of other small customisations (like do not disturb etc)
    They always seem to get soooo close. I'm hoping they get the job done, as I trust MS more than I trust Google and Apple just cannot do cloud services well.
  • Microsoft has xbox musix which is better than iTunes. You can get a music pass that lets you download unlimited music (can only be played if you have a WP, xbox or Windows Computer) or you can just buy the music and use it any where.
  • Except the Xbox Music app in Windows 8 is even worse than iTunes.
  • How do you figure? I was an iTunes user for years, and I've had nothing but ease with the Xbox Music app in Windows 8 and on Windows Phone 8 :)
  • you can stream music on Xbox Music for W8 for free. Does iTunes do that?
  • WRONG! In theory the way the app works it may be better than itunes and other music services but if you compare the Xbox music app to Zune it is an abortion gone bad in the sun, and i am being kind here. I am a long time Zuner and imo, the Xbox music app is crap. It is slow, it is hard to buy music on, there is no related tab. Heres an idea MS, take zune, rebrand it Xbox music and release that then youll have an awesome music app. Or get to fixing this broken piece of crap you call a music app. Oh yea, and why not allow Zune ztyle SS on the WP8 if it is charging? And where is my zune colored theme on my wp8....i could go on but you get the picture.
  • MrDeezus is totally on point. I have been an early adopter for WinPhone7, WP8, Windows 8 (from the first consumer preview) and the first thing I have done on any PC I've owned is install the Zune Software. It was the holy grail for MS because it didn't "just work", it worked flawlessly. It was a fantastic piece of software and I waved goodbye to iTunes and only ever used WMP to watch movies in unusual video formats.  When I bought my Lumia 920 I plugged it straight in to my PC and expected Zune to did not and there has been nothing acceptable by way of a replacement from Microsoft in the 12 months since WP8 launched. The desktop "app" is like something from the last century and while the Windows 8 Phone app works fine, it's not a complete solution like Zune was.  Zune needs to be running on 8.1 RT and 8.1 x86/x64. Rename it if you want, but make it happen. Xbox Music on Win 8.1 is a massive improvement, no question, but i'd still rather use WMP. On the Surface2 I'm trying to get MediaMonkey to place nicely but I really do miss Zune. 
  • Well, this may be true compared to iTunes Match. But after all both are pretty weak. I'm a rdio subscriber and I expect my music streaming service to be available everywhere: Browser, desktop, smartphone, iPad, on the big living room stereo via Airplay (seriously MS, where is DLNA for WP8?). Neither iTunes nor Xbox music can offer that.
  • IDK about WP in general but Nokia has an official release for DLNA Q1 2013. This is what a developer working on the application said over at Nokia Beta Labs.
    He said that some dependancies needed to be updated before the Nokia DLNA app would support the higher resolution screens on the new devices. He also said these were Nokia deliverables not MS so I imagine they will get it done as Nokia has really great support for its devices.
  • Agreed.  I was just thinking the same thing about video.  MS needs to own controlling intrest in Vevo and offer it as a compettitor to Youtube.  I simply do not care for Google and its IOS ways.
  • As much as I'd like to kick Google out of my life, I don't see anything being competition to youtube for a while. It's entrenched as "the" online video site. There are others, but nothing that can hold a candle to youtube. If Microsoft bought another company and poured money into it, it would be another Bing...a service that doesn't quite compare for the average user, and a massive money sink for MSFT.
  • Personally to me gmail is not the best and even is not user friendly app of mail exisdtent on the world, nobody have used gtalk or even  hangouts and google calendar and   docs thing is not that great, youtube  just gained relevance because people use it like what has happened with what apps but    microsoft could made their own unlimited service of video on the cloud like youtube,  and we the users of  windows phone can demmand more efforts to microsoft because they do software from more of 20 years and could make it more efforts if they wanted to do it or  will to do it,  i find a ridiculous thing that somes features of windows phone and in special of bing  be just avalaible in north america and certain  countries of Europe, that restriction do not do any well to the users that do not want to  depend of google services.   i find even riduculous that   services like yahoo or AOL  do not create apps for windows phone  i  use mostly msn and yahoo services and i find exceptionally good their services, already exist an gap to fill up behind just google  ecosystems   we have to put something in clear google only is known by google search and Android  nothing else, if you do an survey and ask who use the entire service og g mail will see that  less of 30 percent use it and many uses hotmail or aka outlook and etc, if you ask by google the first thing that come to people is search stuffs on the web, if ask by windows or microsoft many will say windows of  inmediate way.
  • Dude WTH are you talking about? MS needs an alternative to iTunes? XBox Music. The phone needs custom sounds for email? You can DO THAT yourself. 
  • That's a opinion. I prefered the android app to metrotube and supertube.
  • Isn't the YouTube app just an extension of the mobile site?
  • Yes... Takes you to
  • Does the Android google app allow downloading?
  • Then I'll add my opinion: MetroTube is better than other YouTube apps on any smartphone platform...IMO.
  • You`ve got my vote. I HAD an android and switched to WP8. Was discouraged by the youtube app but the METROTUBE app wich i have on trial is EXCELENT and definitly worth the 99 cents. Im buyin it. 
  • if Google thinks that this will make anyone switch to the vomit mess called Android, they're dreaming.
    I just finished transferring all my emails from my old Gmail account to my brand new (and shiny) Outlook using Microsoft’s TrueSwitch. It took about a day to transfer all my emails.
    Bye bye suckers!
  • MetroTube is Brilliant. I have never seen a better YouTube app, and I never even knew it existed until I read this post. Just bought it for WP8 for a dollar.
  • MetroTube? no offence, but i've never heard of it.
  • great piece
  • At this point, I agree that Google does not need both WP8 and W8 because the market share is too inconsequential to be useful to them. But as soon as userbase increases to near 20%, Google will be there in a sec. Google is a snoop by nature and they won't sit still until they "know" exactly what W8 & WP8 users are doing when there are enough of them.
  • I think you have it half right, Google's success doesn't depend on Windows Phone, but I'm not buying another Windows Phone because I'm sick of not having access to even a tiny fraction of the great apps available on IOS and Android. I've lobbied several companies to port the apps I need to Windows Phone over the last 2 years and they have shown zero interest in the platform. At this point sticking with Windows Phone feels about as productive as throwing away a vote on a 3rd party candidate.
  • Except that apparently Nokia and HTC have sold more Windows Phones now than they have over the past two years, and interest in the platform is finally gaining momentum. Over the next year or two, I believe we'll finally see some momentum.
    Microsoft is finally marketing the way they should have two years ago, companies are releasing great hardware, and customers are taking note that there's more out there.
  • You nor anyone else has seen any numbers. So you're pretty much just talking out ur....
  • I have not used Xbox music, but Zune was far superior to iTunes, so if Xbox music is different I am sad. @spd- you were making valid points until you tossed in the throwing away your vote for a 3rd party candidate. A person never "throws" away a vote. I'll leave it at that. Did not want to go off topic.
  • I`ve ditched android for WP8 and i can not remeber ONE app i had on android that i miss in WP8. I`ve got all that i need and then some (mind you i´m not a instagram user nor plan on being anytime soon). Maybe you`re feeling left out cause of instagram, is it?
  • the only thing that I use that's google is youtube, so google can F*** off!!!!
  • Yep!!!!
  • +1
  • Exactly.
  • +1
  • Funny how you say f*** google then you go ahead and use youtube. Hyprotical MS fanboy is hypocritical.
  • He's not being hypocritical. Who's being the fan boy here??
  • YouTube is a worthwhile property of Google. I have to like Google as a whole in order to like using YouTube to avoid being a hypocrite in your world? If so, call me a hypocrite and like you alter the definition to suit your perspective, I'll consider the source of the attempted insult.
  • No. At one point you go 'fuck Google' and stuff like 'i hate google' and then you chug along using YouTube all day. Not you specifically but the general trend here. And yes that is precisely what a hypocrite is.
  • Actually, a hypocrate is someone who tells others one thing and then does the opposite.  So, if he had said "Everyone should stop using all Google services" but then he continuted to use google services, he would then be a hipocrate.  By stating he doesn't like google but continues to use a google service does not make him a hypocrate.  So no, that is NOT precisely what a hypocrite is.
  • I believe YouTube wasn't originally a google feature. Didn't Google buy out YouTube? Bunch of idea stealing, money sucking selfish... You finish the line.
  • Your point is stupid. I hate Google. I tolerate YouTube for content viewing, but make no mistake I use AdBlocking to prevent the aspects that displease me. I find Chinese slave labor to be offensive, and I can advocate and support initiatives to stop it, but I still have to buy products that probably came from FoxConn. That doesn't make someone a hypocrite no matter how you want to twist the word to suit your moronic point.
  • Same here. If Adblock was unable to block ads on YouTube I would not use that site.
  • Good point dalydose. I used YOUTUBE long before it became the property of google and with that, F google.
  • This comment. . . . This is why we can't have nice things!
  • Guess what? I was a religious Youtube user before Google came and pissed all over the walls with their ads. Its the only Google service I use. I also say F Google. See ya! You won't be missed!
  • Google Video was a fail, so they bought Youtube. Since they bought it, they have ruined it. Every new layout they have made is unusable. Fuck Google!
  • google is threaten by microsoft because it can put its os on any device, cheap phones and expensive phones, they also have bing, and bing is getting really good, they also have office.....if micosoft buys htc or nokia or makes there own phone then google is really going to feel is making smartglass for android, and making office for android, if people get use to that, one day android users will just say hey i should just buy an orginal windows phone...this is microsoft, google trying to not make maps and email for windows phone is not good because, people can live without there services.... you can always search google on windows ie, and youtube, the rest means nothing...
  • Microsoft will not buy HTC. They are too invested in Android to just give all that up. I can easily see Microsoft buying Nokia, since they are Microsoft's main Windows Phone partner, and the entire future of the company hinges on its success.
  • Yepper. Me 2.
  • This.
  • +1, no more tracking me, deleting everything google from my devices
  • Yep, I could care less about Google's other services. If Google blocked YouTube services from the Windows Platforms, then I'd angry.
  • +1
  • Glad I got all my contacts and calendar on my Hotmail account.
  • Hear, hear.
  • I switched from hotmail because I had so many problems with spoofing on hotmail.
    Not really pleased I may have to switch again
  • You should look again:
  • Bravo, well said,  if I could only get these trolls from Engadget to see this....
  • Meh. Who cares about them?
  • Yea, that article Darren wrote was an editorial but it was so one sided if Microsoft's future wholly depends on google. This is just competition folks. This article, being on WPcentral is obviously one sided too, but it's a lot more objective than engadget.
  • I don't know much about engadget. But if this site is one sided it's acceptable, IMO. According to the site's title.
  • People still read Engadget??
  • +1
  • Unfortunely, it is hard to find good tech blogs these days that are not one sided.  One good thing about engadget is that I will always know they are apple fanboi's so when I look and read through their articles, I can read some new things about technology and be able to filter through the fanboi crap.
  • The Verge is even worse. Their hate for Microsoft is so obvious that they make Engadget seem unbiased.
  • exactly this. The Verge is even worse than Engadget
  • I don't...
  • +1
  • Engadget is one of the biggest tech blogs out there, along with Gizmodo and Wired.
  • Ohh ya.. There used to be Engadget app on my WP. Can't even remember if I had that app after my reset.
  • The Verge is even worse. Their hate for Microsoft is so obvious that they make Engadget seem unbiased.
  • why is verge and endgadget so bias? Who owns, runs the sites? I stopped reading both sites because the articles were bad. What did MS do piss in their soup?
  • Engadget is owned by AOL.
  • My biggest annoyance is the junk mobile Google website I always get
  • Exactly. When I first got a wp7 a year earlier, the google website looked just like it did on an iPhone or android. Now it's just the crappy wap version. They also used to maintain a public transit directions site for wap browsers that functioned well with wp7. Not anymore though. Google news also recently switched from the touch mobile layout to the wap version (on IE9 with a wp7). Gmail on IE9 is terrible as well. In fact the entire google experience on WP is pathetic. Looks like they're doing this on purpose to alienate WP users and get them to switch to android.
  • It's true. They do intentionally make the experience terrible. The question remains: at what point is Google alienating itself instead of WP users?
  • When the average user sees that Google's services are poor on WP, but great on iOS and Android, Microsoft will be blamed, not Google. As long as the general public doesn't know better, Google isn't alienating itself at all.
  • But it will likely have the opposite effect. WP users won't switch to Android, but stop using Google services all together.
  • It's strange because mobile YouTube works well as well as Google Reader but Gmail looks like total shit. Google is obviously threatened by WP, have you noticed how tech blogs are slowly starting to mention WP now? Even if its offhand its something we've never had before.
  • That's because by default IE will show you the mobile version of the site.
    Go to the settings and change it to the desktop site and you will get the same experience as with Windows on desktop.
    I for once have switched to Bing and not looking back.
    Note: You can also change the default search provider in WP8 to Google in the settings so you don't have to load the site first but just enter your query in the IE address bar.
  • I have IE set to show the full site and Google is just about the only site I've found that bypasses that. In my experience I've found that Bing isn't quite as good.
  • I used to think google was better, I cannot say that now. Especially when I read google will alter searches based on $$$ from companies. I only Bing search now...
  • That's only in Google Shopper where they do that. And if they don't do it now, Bing will eventually, if only to stop bleeding out cash.
  • I'd disagree, the built in Bing search tool is far ahead of a browser search.
  • Once again , why u guys keep talking about google , What is that ? Imma look it up on Bing on my Lumia 920 :)
  • Hahaha!
  • He he he :D
  • Nice!
  • Zing
  • +1
  • Everything matters, we will see how much.
  • I think the ecosystem is actually what makes WP so compelling. Of course, ecosystem in this case means more than just 'apps,' it's consistent user experience across platforms and form factors, interoperability with services and ease of transition in between. The Google EAS drama is nothing to worry about - if people are Google centric and feel Android is a better platform for the day-to-day, they're probably already on it.
  • Why is there a need for google apps on windows 8. Before windows 8 we were all just using google through website and it was the whole experience and imo the best.
  • This is a very well written story. It hit all the facts. Microsoft depends totally on itself. That being said its, up to Microsoft to get the apps amd features wanted by the people to keep the ecosystem going.
  • MS could and should go the route of building out all of the apps that people complain are missing. Even though some are un-needed. MS should really go all out as Apple and Google has for their own ecosystem. Great user name BTW
  • Big Brother is watching Master Chief...
  • Rather unfortunate. How in the world people don't notice that Microsoft has changed its ways? Google is becoming the old, anti-competitive Microsoft.
  • YES! at what point will it be held accountable for its shady practices? microsoft got torn to shreds for practicing things like this, why does a company like google get away with this?
  • The world has changed radically since then, people do not care about privacy, tracking, rights. Google and Apple could both do with a dose of anti-competitive investigation. Both are certainly in a few organizations headlights right now. In its quest to be number one Google has built a house of cards, there are so many areas where it can be knocked down. Copyright infringements, Patent infringements, dumping in the market. If someone doesn't have the balls to pull them up for some of this it sets a dangerous path for the future. RB
  • That makes me sad for the future of all things tech.
  • Well said, Robert!
  • Nice article, always good to look at the history of all this stuff rather than just the most recent bit....helps put some perspective on it. Have to say that I think MS can live without google, not sure if it would work the other way around yet.....might be just a bit too early, especially if W8 takes off well
  • A very thoughtful piece, Mr. Brand. Thank you.
  • Why, thank you kindly. :) RB
  • Does Microsoft have an equivalent of Google Voice anyone?
  • Skype?
  • Skype on consumer side. Exchange and Lync on Enterprise, and I'd argue they're more robust, overall... especially for enterprise.
    And if you really want Google Voice on WP, there's MetroTalk.
  • Microsoft should buy HULU. That will kick some video!
  •   Hulu is owned by the big content companies as a joint venture. I don’t think they will be giving up their rights on that for the time being. NBC/COMCAST/FOX/DISNEY+ a few others... :) If you’re concerned about MS owning a Video service, don’t be. Much of the content on Google's YouTube service is screened and taken down if it violates copyright laws. The site is now riddled with ads, I am quite happy to see Microsoft use YouTube for its own announcements and videos, why waste your own bandwidth when you can use a competitors for free? :) RB
  • That is an EXCELLENT point! :)
  • Mmm...Skype? ;)
  • No, unfortunately. I've fully depended on gvoice for years now...thanks to metrotalk though, the WP experience in my 920 is solid. I do miss that seamless integration in android though. I'm hoping the API in wp opens up the dialer in a future release. Or better yet, Skype offers a gvoice like service.
  • Skype now has more features then google voice these days,better quality service too, prefer it any day, goodbye google
  • the only feature I care about is voicemail and forwarding my gvoice numer. Can Skype do that?
  • Skype supports a voicemail service, call forwarding and changing caller ID, but I don't think it can ring multiple numbers like GVoice does and it requires you to have a subscription and/or credit.
  • In the eyes of the average iPhone and Android users, their biggest issues are apps. If Microsoft can concentrate on even writing their own apps for popular apps needed like instagram asap then they are set. The apps issue is the it factor for many.....not Google services BC Microsoft does have good alternatives for that, but not for the apps people want. Solve the app issue and I think windows will take off.
  • Totally agree. couldn't say it better.
  • Unfortunately they can only do so much to garner dev support. Its up to the devs in the end to write for W8P
  • Then Microsoft should hire their own dev team whose only purpose is to make great apps like metrotube. They really can't afford to sit back and WAIT for devs, but they sure can afford to put devs on their payroll. That to me is their only option right now.
  • Microsoft already makes many of the apps for Windows Phone : Facebook is one of them. RB
  • Yes, I know they do, but they should make much more apps for the ones people are crying about. Maybe make a deal with instagram (and other companies) that they will foot the bill until they reach a certain amount of users that is deemed profitable by instagram, then instagram takes over maintenance of the app. And as for those devs of other popular apps, just pay them to do it if they don't think it's profitable for them right now and then have a contract that payment stops when a certain number of users deemed profitable has been reached. Microsoft needs to know that profit margins should take a second seat until you have accumulated the large user numbers. They are charging way too much for certain things like the surface rt and making it harder for themselves to compete with apple just so they can make a larger profit. Sorry for the rant, but I really want to see windows and Nokia take off.... Quickly haha
  • The attitude of "we'll wait until they have the numbers" that has been adopted by developers is what kills the WP* platform. I quite like Windows Phone 8 and would buy one if all the apps I use daily were available. How is Windows Phone 8 ever going to take off if developers don't support it... Developers: We'll wait until they have the numbers... Consumers: We'll wait until they have the apps
  • LOL
  • absolutely ive been saying this for as long as ive owned a windows phone.
  • The platform is now in its second major release, Nokia and Microsoft have shown that the devices are great and the industry as a whole can see it is not going away. Many of the top name apps are now present and as each one gets ticked off the list it gives less cover to those that hold out. It is up to Nokia and Microsoft to keep pushing, lower end devices, and partnerships with companies to release key apps. Being late the market means that they have to work harder but so far a steady course has been navigated. I do not think Windows Phone is in need of any apps from Google as I stated, there are far more pressing needs. RB
  • is this a response to the engadget editorial by chance?
  • Not at all, its been brewing for a while with these two. I was trying to write this the other day but was swamped with app updates. RB
  • ok, i just read the engadget one a day before and then seen this and was like "whoe its a war!" nice editorial though
  • Really glad you read and enjoyed it, this was written off the back of the apps and ActiveSync stories and the general news between Google and MS. Their relationship is something of a concern, at some point these two might really come to blows and it could be very damaging for them. I'd personally like to see them both meet somewhere and sort some things out. I fear though Android is such a huge issue this will never happen. Which is a shame. RB
  • I'm worried about the relationship too. I'm more invested in Google services, that I have been using for a good few years, than Windows Phone. It would probably be enough to force me and my family off the platform. Mailed Stephen Elop and apparently MS and Nokia are considering a response.
  • I think Microsoft should pull all of their Apps from the Android marketplace.
  • Microsoft doesn't make any money on the apps, but doing so would only frustrate users. If anything it makes having apps on multiple platforms even more valuable now... users want to use services that follow them, which is why they've left Microsoft over the years... but now, Microsoft is actually the shining star in all of this.
  • Nah. It makes since that they keep them there. It gets people used to the Metro interface.
  • Haha Ike the android is so cute! Don't kick,the baby! Kick the baby!
  • Is there any alternative for google reader? If any, do they also have a Windows Phone App? I'm using Flux for the time being. Once I get rid of google reader, there is nothing more Google has to offer to me. ... besides YouTube.. Doh!
  • Not to knowledge, no. RB
  • Try Nextgen reader,
  • Think was asking if Google had a google reader service, rather than an app?
  • Try Fuse. Love The minimalist design.
  • I've been using Wonder Reader and FeedWorm.  FeedWorm also provides a free version with Ads, but the ad is small and not distracting, i almost forget its there most of the time.  
    Edit: After re-reading, I may of misunderstood the question.
  • Tell me about it. I encounter these people saying "Uh oh, Google isn't making apps for even Windows 8 anymore!" as if Google lived in somewhere other than Firefox on my laptop before! Google wasn't in this from the beginning, and now they are telling us they won't be from now on either.
    I will keep using my browser if I ever wanted to search using Google. Big whoop.
  • I'll be dropping my Gmail soon and will start utilizing my hotmail account as my primary. No big deal.
  • Make sure you use instead of hotmail to get full metro experience
  • I used to love the way I ported my stuff easily scross platforms with Google Sync. I've synced the same data across OS X, Linux, Android, iOS, WebOS and Windows phone over the years but now, it looks like it won't be an option going forward.
    I'm currently usng Android and iOS and am lacking any Windows Phone hardware at the moment  (which i salways subject to change) but the decision from Google has made it that bit more of a pain in the arse to keep everything in sync.
    I refuse to use the likes of iCloud from Apple as I have a real distaste with the way that data won't play nice with rival platforms. It's my data and I would like the choice to use it as and where I please.
    This decision is not cool at all but won't affect my choice weather or not to get a new Windows Phone 8 device in future.
  • Get WP8 and use SkyDrive. 7GB free and they play nice on all platforms by offering apps.
  • If u are a long time hotmail user, I believe you can get up to 25gb free on Skydrive
  • True but they cut down to 7 if you didn't use 5 GB of the 25 I wasn't warned about so I lost that on 2 accounts I had before they released SkyDrive
  • Bing and Nokia provide apps for other platforms. Google tried to suffocate Apple by limiting their uses( ie Navigation). They made it only available on Android.
    Apple gave them the big finger and created their Apple Maps. I applauded this. Just recently, Google reneged on that course and released Nav and Map apps for Apple.
    Now they're trying to follow the same course of action on Windows Phone. I equate it to picking on the smaller kid at the playground. Considering that I use Nokia Drive and the rest of the Windows Phones have at least Nokia sourced maps, I find it amusing. I was very happy when MetroTube resumed their development.
    Google isn't doing their shareholders any service by fooling themselves into thinking they can get an Android Phone in everyone's hands.
  • Folks don't be religious about companies; read this article and compare:
  • Read it. Didn't make sense to me then not going to now. I can't think of anything google makes that is more attractive to me than Microsoft. I like Youtube but MetroTube fills that spot amazingly. People who say Microsoft will fail with out google is laughable. Google would fail without Microsoft. Wouldn't even exist today.
  • MetroTube is still YouTube, duh.
  • LoL
  • Google is out of their ever-loving mind, but it's only going to hurt consumers and Google. If anything, Microsoft's cross-platform efforts for these services make them all the more appealing. If Google starts charging for these services, who do they think is going to buy into it when everyone else is still free?
  • You are correct, that's why I got rid of all Google services. Google is simply a company I cannot rely on.
  • It's fact that everyone uses youtube and windows phone doesn't have even one decent app for youtube.
    It's a fact that chrome is way better than IE and I cannot have it on my windows phone.
    It's a fact that Google Maps is by far the best map service out there and I cannot use it on my windows phone. (don't mention GMapPro cause it sucks)
    Why do you try to change facts?
  • What about MetroTube?
    What about IE10?
    What about Nokia Maps, Drive, Transit, City Lens?
  • If you call metrotube a decent app you have probably not used youtube app on iPhone.
    About IE10 I'm trying to get used to it but I had a far better experience with Chrome.
    Transit app is so dumb in finding the right choice of buses in the city I live in so it is completely useless.
  • What's the difference really? Do you think everyone is a Youtube power user I use Metrotube to watch and search Youtube and that's about it.
    What's so good about the native Youtube app on IOS or on Android its probably the same but with 1 or 2 better features but at the end of the day can you watch Youtube on a Windows Phone and the answer is yes.
    IE10 is a bit different but non the less its a good browser is it as feature rich as Chrome on iOS and Android probably not but can you browse, search web pages absoultely is it fast absolutley.
    Transit needs some work but lets not act like if MS had no mapping services available. Transit, Maps, Drive, City Lens are all good mapping services and will only get better over time. Sure IOS Google Maps are better right now well maybe thats because Maps, Drive etc haven't been updated on WP8. Nokia's next update can put them above Google maps its a consistant battle between the two.
  • I own a Lumia 920 for personal use and an iPhone 4 for work and Metrotube is a brilliant app, I think far better than the iOS version. The looks of each app are subjective (I prefer Metrotube), but I find more functionality in Metrotube also. You can't download videos to watch later on the iOS version like you can with Metrotube.
    Not sure what your reference point on Chrome is given you are comparing the iOS version of Youtube, so if that is the platform you are using then Chrome is only Safari's rendering engine with a skin on top of it, hardly a compelling reason to use Chrome on iOS. I have no issues using IE10 and use it my laptop also, I have downloaded Chrome as my 2nd browser, but only use it occasionally.
  • Metro Tube isn't just a "Decent App". Its a great app. It syncs to your subscriptions, you can comment, like and dislike, it has a cool Live Tile Feature, it is one of the best Metro styled app that gets the design and it is fast and stable. Please tell me why it is just "decent".
  • Wow, "fact"... I do not think the word means what you think it means.
  • Nice Princess Bride reference. :)
  • Haha. Exactly.
  • Umm, both MetroTube and SuperTube are great YouTube apps (more full featured than the Google ones on other platforms). The browser bit totally depends on the person - I'm happy using IE10 on my phone, for example and the maps depend hugely on where you live.
    Point being, if you really think Google offers better services, I suggest you move to Android. You won't be missed, I promise.
  • No need to make it personal! I won't be missed by when a lot of users like me leave windows phone or don't even consider switcing, then that would affect microsft and you as a user.
    I love my windows phone but it is a shame that iPhone users have the choice between shitty apple maps vs google maps and safari vs chrome and ios mail app vs gmail app and so on...
    So it does affect the people's choices that google has totally ignored windows phone and it makes a difference.
  • Based on your comments bashing WP and your love for Google products, I find it very hard to believe you actually own a Windows Phone.
  • I'm not bashing WP.
    I switched from iPhone two weeks ago and find some things frustrating.
    My problem is not google+, google reader, google docs, google drive or any other google products.
    I prefer to chose google maps, search and youtube! and I'm perfectly fine with skydrive, hotmail, office, onenote, translater, skype and so on.
    You people are so religious.
  • RezaMoghtader...You knew exactly what Wp had to offer BEFORE you purchased it but you get the device anyway? You'll go back to iPhone and/or Android and then continue to criticize it 'legitimately' while having 'real world' usage of WP. It seems you don't value your time since you knew what WP offered and that you would be unhappy.
  • Really, you switched from iPhone to WP and you love all thing Google. Really
  • Nokias map set is way better than Googles offerings. And MetroTube is a ton better than anything I ever had on my iPhone. IE10 got ratest the fastest browser to date if I recall correctly. Hmmm..
  • Isn't Nokia the world leader in mapping? And Youtube on android and iPhone are quite lacking in comparison to Supertube and Metrotube.
  • Reza, you seem to fail to understand that you are in a place where nearly every user is pro-wp. Its great to be unbiased when speaking about various products but its unrealistic in most cases. If Robert's article is as accurate as I believe it to be, then I think Google has made a poor choice by alienating wp users.
  • I think users, instead of taking a company's side, should be able to discuss their needs and expectations to make the companies provide better service. Why does Google provide apps for IOS and not WP? WP isn't worth the investment. (According to Google) Who is losing? I think everybody
    1- Users: because they are losing their options
    2- Microsoft: because some users may not switch because of this
    3- Google: They are loosing WP users
  • i actually agree with reza. as much as i dislike google, whatever problems google as a company has with microsoft as a company, giving a big old ef you to the consumers does not create ideal situations in where users can buy whatever product they want whilst still being able to decide whatever services to use.
  • In principle, Reza is quite right, but that assumes all companies are all the same; but with Google, we can't afford to be that naive.
    If you own an Android device, you are basically under surveillance from Google, even to the extent that they track your movements. Google use this to build a profile of you which they use to target advertising, but where does it say they won't become more pro-active or invasive when it suits them?
    Traditionally when people talk about Big Brother, they mean the state, but why should large corporations be any different? After all, with the state the danger is megalomania, but with corporations there are genuine conflicts of interest.
    I think smart people are moving away from Google products because of privacy concerns and that's my advice: Move away from Google. Remember its your information, not theirs.
  • Definitely agree with you there
  • +1000
  • I'm sorry but the only Google product worth anything is YouTube, and they didn't even invent. You must be comparing the Map feature on Android vs WP because I like the maps and directions I get on Bing way better than Google. IT gives you more details such as "there is a BP on the right" or " you went to far if you reach X street." Also, I've had plenty of times I searched Maps on google and it will tell me to make a right then another right, but it won't say the name of the street for those two rights. As for browsers, I almost never use Chrome. IE just like Windows will still be the browser of choice for long-time users, schools, and businesses. A lot of them will only use another browser on sites that are more optimized for other browsers. But Microsoft is adopting more and more web standards with each version of IE. There is nothing will will miss on a WP or even if something went down with iOS other than youtube, and too be honest the youtube app isn't that great. Even when I use an iPad, I find myself going to either the mobile site or full youtube site instead of using the app. If Microsoft were to purchase the right company and develop a good YouTube alternative a lot of people who flock to the new, hot video site
  • Microsoft does not need Google. Yes you can still use YouTube using the desktop version on WP8 and use YouTube on internet explorer. Who cares about a dedicated app. Everything else from Google is not needed. I don't use Gmail, I don't use their active sync, I don't care for their mapping system, Bing is a much better search engine. So all the other non secure garbage the google makes do nothing for me. I frankly don't even care for Android. It crashes, freezes, you always have to manage your phone, its a mess. Google can try to get into this market, but for all the years they been around, they have never taken over this market. This has been years and years of chasing. Yea, they have a great IPO, yet, I think its all wall street feeding into the garbage spewed by Google. Microsoft is solid. They are about a quality search engine, quality cloud system, quality office suite, quality email, quality mapping system, quality gaming system with a quality online gaming service. Its about quality. Google is about quantity, and it shows lack of quality with many security hole problems, adware, malware, viruses and so on. One day, it will catch up to Google is a huge way. I think Google is doing Microsoft a favor. Leave your garbage out..
  • Plus the apps for YouTube are complete s*** anyways
  • You know google can block non android/ chromeos devices from even opeing Youtube. Then Facebook falls as it has those mini video shortcuts to youtube.
  • After I started using WP I began to like the Bing search and IE9...i really used to hate the IE and Bing but if u get used to it then Bing gives mostly relevant results now I no more use google for search
    I love Windows phone eco system
  • Still don't like IE but I prefer Bing to Google
  • Scroogled.
  • I lol'd
  • ?
  • The only google product I use is YouTube and there's not even good app for it so im not loosing anything if google doesn't like Microsoft. Everything I use is Microsoft so google doesn't affect me one bit. I think this is just plain stupid. Windows phone is growing, google and apple know it so they're going to try to stop it.
  • Metrotube
  • Excuse me, while the author wants to kiss - better yet, slobber - over MSFT's hind end. It should be noted that MSFT kicked Google to the curb first when they hardwired Bing to the search button. You guys are getting to be the Fox news of smart phones...
  • The author said as much right in the article.
  • The site is called windows phone central. It's their job to be on the side of the platform.
  • LOL
  • Yeah, that was mentioned in the article.
    I don't know if I agree though. That would be the case if Bing was as good as Google (outside the U.S.) but it isn't. I find myself repeatedly going over to Google in my browser for searches so I *really* would use an app instead of the dedicated search button.
    And really, it is Google not making apps for Microsoft's products and not the other way around so the Fox news analogy doesn't quite fly here.
  • The author DOES mention it. Did you read the article.
  • As if WINDOWS PHONE CENTRAL doesn't give that away anyways. Get over yourself and your crappy google services.
  • ALRIGHT!!! no Youtube for you.
  • You don't get it. The reason Bing is hard wired is because MS is incorporating their services into their OS. You can change this for the browser though in settings. If you want Google search get an App just like you can get a Bing App or Widget in Android.
  • I'm sorry, please clarify... on Android, what are my search options? Oh yeah, Google. So when I press the Search button, it goes to who's that? Yeah, that's right, Google. Their phone OS, their search. Seems fair.
  • You mean like how Google included that annoying Google search widget on the homescreen of every Android ICS and JB OS? That you cannot get rid of no matter what?
  • I only need google search and access to my gmail
  • And youtube :D
  • Does google make a PC media player? If they do its gotta be smaller than Zune / Xbox music. I wouldn't want to purchase stuff from google play if im gonna lose it if I lose my phone
  • They have Google Music, which has a desktop client, but it sucks.
  • I disagree... Google Music is great. Xbox's Music Match comes nowhere close to compensating for being able to upload 20,000 songs to Google Music. Especially when Xbox Music doesn't allow you to choose that it matches "explicit" versions of your music. Pretty terrible IMO.
  • First. I think people using the term war need to get a grip and calm down. Second, I think as some pointed out, MS has other things in regards to Win 8 and WP8 to worry about. I'm sure they and users will get by.
  • I must say, the lack of Google support on Windows Phone 8 greatly influenced the phone purchase I made last week. If there was better integration with Google services, official or not, it would've been that much more difficult to click the 'Buy' button next to the green Android.
    (That, and the crazy price difference between the various flag ship phones on either platform)
    I really wanted my next phone to be a Windows one, but too many things were stacked up against it - with Google support/integration being a major one.
  • But, you're posting on a WP article? Not having a pop, but it seems WP still has you very interested. . .
  • Of course... I'll need a new phone when this one dies won't I? :)
    Like I mentioned, I really wanted to get a WP8, just wasn't in the cards this time,
  • You should try weening yourself off google products. You wouldn't believe how much better the alternatives are. Especially navigation and YouTube.
  • Very informative.
  • I would LOVE to see Microsoft launch their own video service to directly go up against Youtube. I can't help it but I'm so bitter that Google bought-out Youtube. Why 'oh why did that ad agency buy it and then force me into having a crappy Gmail account?! Eff you Google. Eff you.
  • I know, man. Sucks.
  • So true - I love MSN Video, but having over half the videos on it say "the owner of this content does not allow embedded video" is a total deal breaker.
  • they should make a brand new Video service. they should just call it Xbox Video. and intergrate it into the Xbox Video hub in Windows 8
  • After posting my reply, I just saw your comment. :D That's it Danny - totally agree. :) It could be seamlessly integrated across all devices.
  • Its sad to say, but I don't think the MSN brand will cut it long-term (even if it was supremely superior to all). Its just 'yesterday' to a lot of people. Just look at MySpace... even with a snazzy makeover, its still lonely. Maybe they could create a video capture app for Xbox that allows users to record gameplay and share with others. It would be uploaded to "X-TV" (for example) where anyone can view and comment. It would be a sound platform to build on.
  • Completely agree.
  • I know just how you feel.
    They made me make a Google+ account as well.
  • Yes, Windows Phone absolutely needs Google.  I am personally willing to explore and accept all the Live services, and I recognize where it's better (Skydrive) and where it falls short (calendar) but let's be honest - most people do not do that.  Fanboyism is endemic, it penetrates ever single market, including mobile.  Not having a decent Youtube app or Calendar app is absolutely a deal breaker for most consumers.  There are shit-tons of people out there for whom Google IS THE INTERNET.  Microsoft needs to find a way to fix this if they want a true breakthrough moment.
  • But there are a couple of decent Youtube apps to chose from...
  • I disasgree.  I've used Metrotube and Supertube and what not, and neither of them remotely compare to the Android Youtube app.  In a lot of ways, that's the big rub about trying to use Google apps on a WIndows phone- you just have to settle. it's not that bad. You can't sell a platform like that and not expect to be niche.  Google changes the API and bam, everything breaks.  Google is the elephant on your face for Microsoft right now, and they need a solution imho.
  • I say this as a huge WP booster - I love Windows Phone, I use a Focus every day, I have a Titan, and I just got my son the HTC 8X, and my daughter uses a Focus.  I'm not a fanboy by any stretch of the imagination, I'm just capable of seeing that the horse is a horse.
  • Except that Google is behaving the way Microsoft did 15 years ago... and it's anti-competitive. It WILL bite them in the ass.
  • OK, be specific then... what does the Android app do that MetroTube doesn't?
  • I would like metrotube to do closed captions. that would be nice.
  • I'm sorry, I didn't realise the Youtube app on Android allowed you to download content for an offline playlist....
  • Im amazed by the number of people who think YouTube app is essential. Honestly amazed. As if it matters even in the least.
  • It's not just the YouTube app though.  You can't search your Windows Live Hotmail Calendar.  Really?  The web version of Word doesn't let you access the headers or footers.  There is no Google Voice equivelent for Windows, and THEY OWN SKYPE!!!!
    I love me some Windows Phone, but the Google ecosystem is just better, they own productivity on the web, and Microsoft needs to catch up. I'm all about the Windows Phone environment, but blindly calling it better than Google's is just silly.  If they can't get Google to make apps for them, they need to step up thier game.  I would point to Zune as an excellent example - it's the best media player and music purchasing system extant.  Make that the standard, Microsoft. 
  • It's too bad their phones suck, lol.
  • "There is no Google Voice equivelent for Windows, and THEY OWN SKYPE!!!!" I think you mean Microsoft owns Skype.
  • Almost all the stuff people are complaining about Microsoft not having compared to google with the exception of a Youtube alternative is basically stuff that can be tweaked in existing products. Whether Google is better is a matter of opinion, but in the end if people get a Windows Phone and like it, they're going to accept whatever apps come with it. Are people going to stop buying iPhones is Google and Apple have a falling out? I'd imagine Skype is more popular than Voice. When was the last time you had a conversation or had an interview or watched a movie where someone mentioned Google Voice? I can't remember, but I sure hear about skype a lot. On Twitter and Facebook I definitely see more people mentioning Skype(though sometimes ooVoo) in thier statuses. I've used Andriod, but I have yet to find one app that would make it say "because of this app or Google's version of the app, I'll only get Google products." There is nothing really about it that will make me say "there is no way I'm getting a Windows Phone, iPhone, or Blackberry when I can have this."
  • I seem to recall that ms offers a way for you to block those sorts of things, at least on WP8. Still, I have to ask why your 20 old had your phone in hand in the first place? Why are you blaming MS for not being vigilant about how you let your child play with your phone?
  • Youtube app not everybody is a Youtube power user we have MetroTube, PrimeTube and a bunch of other Tubes to choose from I don't see any problem watching, searching Youtube videos on a Windows Phone. Calendar is good I don't see the problem sure there is no weekly view but is it that hard to view your weekly appointments. Calendar works just fine for 95% of the people that use it.
  • Google is the internet? I wouldn't say all that. A lot of people use Google because it's been around a while. But Bing is getting more and more popular every year. Some ISP's don't even use Google as their default search engine if they have a customized IE. Look at This is Microsoft? Does anyone really think they won't have a decent calendar app. Windows 8 and WP8 will connect to your live account, and hotmail has been replaced with Outlook web. Heck even with my work iPad, I find myself going back to Outlook on my PC to make changes to calendar dates, appointments, and reminders. The only reason google is the internet for a lot of people is because you have two browsers that not only use it for the default search engine but also the default home page, and you have a lot of consumers out there who somehow got used to typing addresses in search rather than the address bar. They think Google is the internet because it's their homepage. But as tablets and phones become more and more popular, people will see google more for that it is, just search. With more and more focus on apps, the distinction is being realized now. People who posted on websites like this might be swayed by lack of chrome or the calendar, but not the average consumer. Everyone knows what Internet Explorer is. Everyone knows the "Blue E." Microsoft doesn't need chrome. All Microsoft needs is a youtube competitor. Anything else people would be willing to overlook not having it.
  • If for nothing else the main reason everyone should stop using google is for privacy reasons. If you want you data private and secure use Microsoft, if you want your emails read and activity monitored go ahead and use google.
  • R.I.P Google?...............:-) 
  • Google still have the best search engine. Bing is useless to me without the option to narrow the results by day/week/month etc
  • Bing or yahoo search is just fine. No matter what, you'll always find what you need. Google search or search in general is just a fad.
  • Not if you are only interested in recent results, which was my point.
  • lol...wth do u need that for?
  • Google is a better search engine. Coming from a diehard MS fanboy, that's not easy to admit. It has better results, more relevant results in my opinion, it has instant search, and the UI is a lot nicer (since they have updated it and got rid of the underlines on the blue links) I love Bing on Windows 8.1, but on IE11, I'm forced to use Google for the time being.
  • What would google be today without Microsoft ? ...
  • On does not simply survive without google, one can only PROSPER without google. Good Call google, keep your insecurities.
  • Here's the reality... nearly all of Google's services are easily replaced, and the handful that aren't are easily accomodated by using third-party apps that are already as good or better than what Google could bring to Windows Phone. I submit the follow for consideration:
    Gmail and Calendar -- is already superior to Gmail and Calendar (btw, a Calendar update is overdue for Microsoft, but I understand it to be coming in the coming month or so). They don't sell your inbox content to marketing, and the feature set is not only comparable but sometimes exceeds that of Gmail. Plus ActiveSync support makes it fully available natively without apps on practically every smartphone on the market. However, keep in mind that any third-party (including Microsoft) is able to implement their own app support for IMAP/cardDAV/calDAV, and I expect that Microsoft will in a future OS update.
    Docs -- SkyDrive / Office Web Apps, like, are already vastly superior to Google Docs. Moreover, paying for Office 365 subscription makes Google Apps a complete and total joke. It's cheaper AND more functional than anything offered by anyone. I seriously don't know anybody that use this. The folks who don't use SkyDrive use Dropbox.
    Google+ -- People use this? No, really... You've gotta be joking to even suggest it. Facebook and Twitter already fill this need just fine.
    Photos -- SkyDrive, Flickr, Camera Lenses, any one of a dozen solutions make Picasa and Photos irrelevant.
    Maps -- Bing Maps are every bit as good, especially now that it's backed by the navigation expertise of Nokia. Even Apple decided Google wasn't needed, and although their first effort wasn't all that great, c'mon-- this is Apple... you know they'll get it right.
    Translate -- Bing Translator is already as good, perhaps better. There's also Babelfish and other alternatives.
    Voice -- Skype already offers many features and no doubt will offer more, but Microsoft Lync on Office 365 makes Google Voice look like a Speak-n-Spell. In the meantime, MetroTalk is already better than anything Google would release.
    Offers -- Don't be ridiculous, nobody likes being Scroogled. Amazon, Groupon, Bing, and Deals all make this irrelevant.
    YouTube -- No real competitor except Vimeo, which may be tempting since Google has screwed the pooch with so many ads on the service. It really is hard to avoid YouTube unless Microsoft, Apple, and others collectively promoted Vimeo. Microsoft dissolved Soapbox, and I doubt they'd launch another option like it. In the meantime, Metrotube is freaking amazing.
    News / Reader -- No real competitor, but dozens of RSS feed readers and aggregators out there, and it wouldn't be hard to implement a service. In the meantime, there's Nextgen Reader on Windows Phone.
        So tell me, really... what do we need Google to do for us? Spy on us? Advertise deals that aren't really deals to us?
  • Great post +1
  • #THIS# Thanks for the contribution. RB :)
  • I use Google Docs/Drive all the time, but after getting my Windows Phone (Nokia Lumia 810), I've been using the Office app more. The integration with SkyDrive is a great feature.
    I don't want to pay to use Skype, so I have Google Voice as my backup number in case anything happens to my phone (or I forget to pay my T-Mobile account).
    I use Gmail as my "professional" email (for job searches), because my Hotmail/Outlook account doesn't have a professional-sounding name.
    Google Calendar is easier to use than the Windows Live Calendar, but it doesn't integrate well with Windows Phone.
  • What it kind of comes down to is would WP8 be a success if it was well supported by Google and the top iOS and Android app programmers?  Hell yes!  Will WP8 be a success without?  Can't say for sure.  That uncertanty will drive away a lot of possible new users.
    I'm a new Nokia 920 user and I really miss what I call comfort apps.  There might be better WP8 apps out there but it takes time to find them.  When I jump platforms its nice to have those "comfort apps" to make the transition to go smoother.
    Just my 2 cents...
  • Check out It lets you search for apps on Windows Phone that are the same or similar to iPhone and Android.
  • I think I'll begin the full migration of all my info from Google to Windows Phone,....FUCK YOU GOOGLE!!!
  • Why the need for Google in the first place. MS and WP has everything u need and better.
  • safghrtjrttr
  • Something to lighten the subject: Google +.... Remember that?! Haha!! Google, you suck!! :D
  • Very well written article. I have to say you've addressed pretty much every point that would relate to the Microsoft/Google relationship. And I agree that their success doesn't really depend on each other, but rather how they compete against one another.
  • I have so much stuffed linked to my Gmail account that now I can't make the full switch, I guess I'll always have to sign in using my Gmail account :(
  • i am concerned about this news yes, and angered. 
    Maps, who uses maps daily?c
    Chrome OS, flop.
    This has changed my relationship with google. Bing is nolonger a curiosity and im now using it and making it a habit, more now learning this.
    wealthy people dont buy android.
    there is no google os on desktops or servers or embedded devices.
    the parts of google i like work with a browser.
  • I don't think this is ware. Honestly, WP8 has yet to prove itself a worthwhile investment for a company as large as Google. I am sure people will be upset by me saying that, but it's true. Look at what Google has done for the Apple crowd. Took them YEARS, but they are getting the Google services that have long been on Android out to iOS users. If/when more people adopt WP platform, we will see Google support. They are in it for the money and will go where the money is, guaranteed.
  • Did you read the article?
  • My only gripe is YouTube. Google has a monopoly over it. I think it should be stopped!
  • I think that if Microsoft and Apple Block Google from everything, Google will only shine in the Phone market and How long will that last.
  • After reading the article, I had one thought.  There was mention of the reason that Google has a number of apps available for Apple because there are services that are either not provided or not as polished as those that google has.  I think that the only reason that Microsoft would want or need google apps in their eco system is to prevent future posturing by google/android.  Users who are completely invested in gmail, google voice, etc. will ultimately be discouraged from buying anything else on the premise that all of those contacts, gmails, etc. wont be able to be ported over from once platform to another in the future.  The google apps enable this carryover to occur from platfom to platform, thus muddying the "productivity" waters.
    I've been an android user for 5 years but am watching the growth of the WP ecosystem.  I use gmail, calendar, etc. but don't find that I am so dedicated to any of those services that I wouldn't be able to switch.  This morning I went through and transfered gmail, contacts, calendar events, and files from Drive to SkyDrive rather easily.  I have a separate email that I use for work so the transition for me would be rather painless if/when I decided to change OS's.
  • The only Google service I want is Google Goggles....or if Microsoft make an equlivant thing!
  • They already do something similar with Bing Vision.
  • Bing Vision at the moment can only read Barcodes, Microsoft Tags & QR Codes (which admitivly are probably the most important) It doesn't solve Suduko Puzzles or tell me what random things that I take a picture of are; the only time I ever use Google these days is for how you can upload a picture into images and it tells you what it is and for math (mainly for currency coversions & working out percentages lol), Bing can do some math but it doest always get it, I has to be written perfectly for it to understand where as Google is a bit more user friendly. Apart from that Bing is fine for its Maps & Search.
  • Random things -- Ah, yes, you are holding a box of Kleenex. That's a bag of Lifesavers. Things you already know.
    Sudoku puzzles -- Isn't half the fun of the game solving it on your own? I believe they call this cheating.
    Math -- I can do those things with a calculator and conversion apps too.
    Not picking on you, just pointing out that Goggles is pretty gimmicky. I tried it back in the day on the EVO, and never found much use for it.
  • That's what I believe alot of people overlook. Yeah goggles has those things but just how practical are those things?
  • The only thing I need is a good YouTube app. I use both Gmail and Outlook so that doesn't matter to me. And as long as i can access Google + through the browser I have no problems not having a Google + app. Google products are cool to have and have nice features but tend to be buggy and completely slow.. I love Google and their products but I also demand quality like Apple has with their products - except Apple Maps. xD
  • "though Google is a search company at its core"
    Correction: Google is an advertisement company at its core.
  • + all of the internets
  • No he is right. Google is primarily a search company that makes its revenue on ads.
  • I'm in both camps, I love Microsoft but use YouTube (alot) and use Chrome and their search engine. If Bing was nearly as good as Google then maybe I could recommend it. Microsoft needs to buy Vimeo or Hulu if they want to compete with YouTube. I agree Metrotube is great, however nothing like the pure experience and after years of crappy a** IE, considered me scorned. Never will try that junk.
  • IE10 is legit. Coming from a fellow Chrome fanatic.
  • Hulu is owned by the big content providers (Disney, Fox, etc.), so Microsoft can't buy that out. Plus it has nothing in common with YouTube, which is a community-based video service where users upload their videos. Hulu and YouTube are two completely different things.
  • I agree with most of what the author has to say.  I used to use Android and was all in with google.  Gmail, GDocs, GVoice, the whole nine yards.  I switched to Windows Phone in late 2010/early 2011 and now have a Winodws RT tab.  I have nearly completely weind myself from google services.  My old Gmail forwards to outlook, I've migrated my contacts and calander, I use the Office Web apps (and now RT apps) instead of google docs, but there is an elephant in the room that need adressing.  YouTube.  Sure, Windows 8 and RT don't need apps as you can just use the browser and that is a perfectly acceptable solution.  What about Windows Phone though?  Sure the movile site is alright, and there are some well made 3rd party apps for Windows Phone, but a realy Google blessed YouTube app is a big hole.  YouTUbe on Android and iOS just works better than the website or 3rd party apps.  For me, its not a deal breaker, but for people who do a lot of YouTubing, it certainly could be.
  • I doubt Google can create one better than MetroTube. I've tried the native YouTube apps on Android and iOS and neither are as good or feature rich as MetroTube. I am an avid youtuber and it is all that and a bag of chips.
  • Microsoft has all the means to improve it services to the point that all it's services will be better  than anything that google could offer we are talking about probably the biggest company of software and that at least 50% of the people uses it OS which is the biggest advantage 'cause you can use that to improve even more the experience of a user and make a complete experience.
  • Yes please .. one example: google search againgst bing search. Bing is still in beta in my country - since forever (Since 2009, to be more precise). I mean, come on, Microsoft, take bing out of beta already. Are you asleep?
    I can't, for example, narrow my search results by date. In google, I can. And I guess, in non-beta bing versions, I could too (correct me if I'm wrong). So, no reason for me to switch from google search to bing search unless for "political" reasons, unfortunately ...  I could search another alternative, but unfortunately haven't found one that delivers the same good search results as google. So, whether I like it or not, google is, where I live, still the best option for me to search something on the internet. 
    gmail is another story for me. I don't have any reason to use it, so I can easily avoid it.
  • YouTube is a monopoly. Microsoft should make an alternative or will buy Vimeo.
  • They already did... it was called MSN Soapbox. It failed, and they killed it off a while back.
  • The above should have been a reply to Lightmoonwolf
  • Backfired in my case. Fact is WP is the superior experience to android in almost every aspect. There are a handful of things Google's offering does better, but the gap is closing fast. I've played around with my wife's Android phone and iPad (first retina one) enough to know that for me it's WP or dumbphone. And last night I used trueswitch to cut the Gmail cord. Once MS builds out Bing Videos I'll be permanently free of skynet.
  • I dont use any google products... I dont give a shit...
  • I agree. MS is gonna be the determining factor on whether or not WP is successful. Regardless, I still want Google apps on my Lumia 920. I switch between Android, iOS and WP8 weekly. Oh yeah, I hate the way web pages look in IE. For those of you who think MetroTube is better than an official YouTube, you're crazy. Crazy in a nice way. :-)
  •   Google should be making their apps and services as easy to access on other platforms as possible. They are choosing not to, as they build their empire larger this looks to be the way they are going. They have managed to stay off Windows Phone for two years, do you think that will change anytime soon? It’s annoying but as I said, I don’t think they have much place on Microsoft mobile platform. RB
  • I said it elsewhere, but Google is actively using the Microsoft 1990's Operations Playbook.
    This is a company who has gained everything by copying and stealing from others, and now that they're the big dogs in the mobile market, they're using that dominance to STAY dominant. They see Microsoft as as the upcoming competitor that they haven't been able to beat elsewhere in the market (aside from search, which is waning). This is the absolutely textbook definition of anti-trust violations, and it's the same thing Microsoft got in trouble for back in the 1990's. The difference is, Google's actions are actually harming their customers (taking features away that once were free), and Microsoft only hurt competition for companies.
    Anyway, I have yet to see any evidence that MetroTube is inferior to YouTube on Android. People keep saying it, but they don't offer an explanation why. I think the only comment I've seen so far is about closed captioning.
  • So if MetroTube were to change its name to YouTube. Would that make it better?
  • I think that Microsoft should find some way to disrupt Google's ad revenue on Windows as a response.  Something like providing ad-blocking by default in IE.  Users have to explicitly opt-in to receive ads.  
  • Nice. Me likey. :)
  • They already send Do-Not-Track headers by default with IE10, which Google honors and disables ad targeting.
  • If Microsoft can get their head out of their ass and figure out how to execute, this would be good for them. Chances are though, that they won't.
    In Vancouver, Bing Maps provides better transit routing than Google Maps. On the desktop, I always choose Bing Maps for my transit directions. On Windows Phone, Bing Maps doesn't support transit directions. Why? Fuck if I know! Nokia Maps does, but Microsoft and Nokia are apparently not pooling their resources, so Nokia's solution doesn't have data for all the locations Bing Maps does. 
    Given how Apple Maps got panned, not only for just being crap, but also for not having transit directions, this is actually pretty important. I don't believe Microsoft will do anything to fix it. The worst is, if you try to visit the Bing Maps website with your phone, to be able to access the transit directions, it always shoves you back to the app. You don't have any kind of choice.
    For general search, one of the most common modifications I make for eliminating noise in search results is constraining the date. Bing Search still doesn't support this very basic feature.
    If Microsoft could make their services better, and improve the experience on Windows Phone, they could convert more people over to using them. As is, they're going to end up making Windows Phone look like a not as good platform.
  • Good point, there is a bit of an issue that myself and the team have noticed with Bing Maps and Nokia Maps. The mapping platform that Bing Maps uses is now provided by Nokia but there are obviously some disconnects at present. We hope they will be addressed sooner rather than later. Maps and Navigation are hugely important to Windows Phone and we report on much of what is happening. We will reach out to their Here team and see if we can get an update on this. I agree with you and say as much so in my article, Microsoft needs to continue to deliver on better integration with its eco system. But beyond that it must iterate its key services rapidly too, they have been rapidly improving their services but the client side features are sometimes behind. Currently their web services are good but of course they need to keep at it, the new Calendar is still not rolled out on the web. When it comes to Bing search, I agree it isn’t the most customisable engine but it provides great results and that is where they have aimed it rather that at the power user, I’d like to see that change too. If you have feedback for the Bing team , make yourself heard they have places to submit your ideas/thoughts. RB
  • Microsoft should buy HULU. And not have ads. Have a public video button and the movie/TV channel. Done.
  • You kill 2 birds with one stone.
  • Agree.... And maybe I don't need Google.
  • It all boils down to what environment you’re used to and you just can’t ignore the amount of people who work in the Windows environment. So given the chance to own a mobile device that sync without discrimination, everything you do, business & entertainment wise, WP8 is clearly the better choice in the long run. MS and Nokia did well when they introduced the 920. There is no denying that they raised the bar in what consumers should expect from a flagship cell phone OUT THE BOX. The only fault people can find is the lack of apps, and truthfully, how many of them are truly important & not fads? The FACT is, popular apps will populate the WP8 ecosystem as the platform matures. Will waiting on these apps stop my productivity? No, not one bit. Out The box, the Nokia 920 has everything I need due to its tight integration and AGGREGATION of mobile services. We can thank WP8 OS and Nokia apps for that. Neither Google nor Apple, who has top notch devices out there right now, can boast this accomplishment. Today, all they can tell you is that they have more apps. When all is said and done, I felt no loss by leaving Android behind.   
  • I'm really loving Windows Phone 8, but I doubt anyone I know would ever go with a Windows Phone. The newer Android devices and the Nexus devices are considerably smoother and faster than Windows Phone and Windows 8 in general. I just got myself a Nexus 7 and my before ultra-fast Lumia 920 now feels slow and some what visually unattractive. I get that some people can see the beauty of a clean and simple icon with no shadows or gradients, but no one I know seem interested in having these huge tiles and no real customization to make them feel at home when they're using their device. Most people just seem to feel like a background and some stunning app icons makes them feel at home and feel like they can just use their device without spending forever looking for something. Personally I couldn't care less about how many applications there's available, but there's no denying that current applications and future applications are no-where near as good as on other platforms.
  • I have a Nexus 7 and you claimed it is faster than Windows Phone 8? I like what you are smoking. Nexus 7 lags and guess what it already caught malware the funny thing is I don't know how I got it. The only thing I can think off is from the Android Market. I know Androids has more than half a million apps 2/3 of it is malware. Btw several of my friends has Nexus and Samsung galaxy tablets and Samsung SG3 when they played with my Nokia 810 everyone said it is so smooth.
  • There's no denying that future applications are nowhere near as good as on other platforms? Really?
  • Most of Microsoft's services are either lacking features, slow or just not as powerful as Google's alternatives. To me, Dropbox is simply better than Drive and SkyDrive, because it lets you share files so easily, and I have yet to see anyone using SkyDrive to share their files with the world (download links, add ?dl=1 to dropbox and you have a direct dl). Internet Explorer (even 10) is unstable and slow. Watching videos on my computer isn't possible without constant lag in IE, but everything seems perfectly fine when using Chrome or any other browser.
    Bing and other services such as voice and translation are behind Google's services so much that people at my school would rather go to all the time than use the URL bar to search for something with Bing. My problems with Hotmail/Outlook are so horrible that I've decided to go with Gmail so I wouldn't lose all of my purchases from the Windows Store, which almost happened a few weeks ago. It took me months to get Microsoft to change my email adress to something other than, which seemed to be bugged and even new emails I created didn't work at all.
    I know that Microsoft didn't actually make Skype (or at least I don't believe they did) but compared to other similar services it has never been good and unless you use Skype on ALL of your devices at the same time, don't expect Skype to be anything but lag when going between different devices.
  • I have a completely different experience
    1. I have both dropbox and skydrive. I don't find dropbox any better.
    2. IE10 is unstable and slow. I actually don't think you have used IE10.
    3. I'll give you that on translation. I like Google translation more than Bing translation. I use Google Voice because it is free, nothing else. When Google starts charging, I am out of Google Voice.
    4. Have you used If you say is horrible, then you are out of your mind.
    5. Does Google make Youtube either. Does it matter Microsoft makes Skype or not? Skype lags, Really? Everything you are spewing is either lies or half truth. My conclusion is that you are just a troll who is insecure about the choice of platform you are using.
  • So much nonsense from you all over here today. And your problems with Hotmail/Outlook are exactly that, your problems. When I was going to change my e-mail from to sometime else there were various warnings about how it would mess up my WP/Windows Store experience unless I reset my devices. Try paying a little attention and you'll run into fewer issues.
  • Damn saying anything intelligent ... all I really want to say is that I've been Scroogled!
  • Outside of YouTube there is nothing Google-related I use anyways. Not a big deal for me.
  • Google knows windows is a threat and they will shut down google and android
  • The only Google's app for Windows 8 - Google Search is already better than Microsoft's Bing Search app. So at least they are trying in some areas.
  • Hey, WP fanboys. What a lively dicussion! Per usual though, a lot of "us versus them" talk. Allow me to offer my experience...
    Former owner here of a Lumia 920, Lumia 900, Samsung Focus Flash and Samung Focus. Aside from the final straw of a bricked 920, the lack of Google apps on WP8 is in fact a big deal. I was saddened IE10 Mobile was still treated like a WAP-happy browser; Chrome for WP would have been wonderful. With my music in the Play cloud, a legit Play Music app for WP8 would have been great; not a 2-bit gooroovster app. My tags I set on my PC were not read well in Xbox Music when I tried going device-only for my tunes so you know.
    Probably one of the worst tragedies was Nokia Maps; just as bad as Apple Maps with missing or completely N/A public transit info I rely on here in Tampa. Even worse, the GPS did not locate me anywhere close to where I reside. The utlity of my all my collective Windows Phone experiences left me desiring for so much more. And I was soooo patient and hopeful! I stuck with Android from May 2010 - January 2011 with that same attitude before giving WP7 a shot. But now I can't reason to stay. Android has finally arrived and iOS of course is already there. I happily pushed WP despite my grievances -- but enough is enough.
    Back now on a used iPhone 4 (which I had Jan 2011 - May 2011 funny enough). Waiting to get the dough together for either an iPhone 5 or a Nexus 4; still deciding. I really liked the look and feel of my white Lumia 920; it's such a pretty thing and has other things going for it -- but the important deal-breaking utilities just killed it for me. It was like dating someone hot but with little content on the inside; just wasn't going to last!
  • Oh well. At least you tried.
  • Sorry your experience was a bad one unfortunately your experience is just that. I have no problem with my Lumia 920 at all. Nor do I need anything from Google at all. Don't hate google but definitely don't need them.
  • I've used Google Maps/Transit and Nokia's HERE Maps & Transit, and I find them to be easily comparable. They both work well for me.
  • The main reason that I'll keep my google account instead of moving it all to is that google/gmail is the only service (that I know of at least) that offers two-factor authentication. Does anyone know if MS plans to offer two-factor for at any point? 
  • The main rationale behind two-factor autho is security in public environments where your password may be sniffed, Microsoft DOES offer the option to sign in with a single use code at the bottom of the Microsoft Account signin page, it will send you a code to your mobile registered to your microsoft account in the security settings that you can login with instead of your password.
    Of course, it requires a concious effort to use this, but it addresses the same issue and provides roughly the same level of security assuming your account as a proper password.
  • "This is a company that matches Microsoft product-for-product in almost every category."
    Hmmm, not so much.  What Google has achieved in such a short space of time is immense, but Microsoft has at least a dozen billion dollar businesses:
    1. System Center - server management
    2. Visual Studio - software development
    3. Dynamics - CRM and ERP
    4. Skype - eponymous
    5. SharePoint - collaboration and intranet software
    6. Exchange - e-mail and communications
    7. Online advertising
    8. SQL Server - database software
    9. Windows Server - server operating systems
    10. XBox - gaming hardware and software
    11. Office - not including Office 365
    12. Windows (desktop)
    At the time the article linked below was written, Windows Phone and Office 365 were not big enough to be included, but perhaps they would be now.
    So when the muppet in the phone store tells you that Microsoft are going down the tubes, you can see that he is a clueless muppet of the highest order.
  • Funny and brilliant
  • Plus one
  • Sold my lumia 920 after a week, partially because of this. I will perhaps go back when windows phone 8 matures
  • That would assume you actually believe that google isn't developing due to not enough users lol.
  • If by mature you mean offer Google products, you will never be returning. Google doesn't want to be on it's biggest competitor's hardware and Microsoft has it's own equivalent services and products.
  • Great article, Robert! I've just finished removing myself completely from the Google environment (except youtube :( ) and am pretty glad to be out.
    I honestly don't see an alternative to YouTube coming anytime soon,since  YouTube has already established itself as the tube. If people decide they want to post videos somewhere, they go to YouTube. However, that and Calendar are all that Google has. Microsoft's other alternatives are all better, Imo. And Microsoft's Calendar will get better.
    Btw, Robert, I noticed a small (very small) mistake. "Google for the time being have a place on iOS because they can offer Apples users something which Apple cannot itself." "Apples" should be Apple's.
  • I have an Android phone for personal use, a Windows Phone for work, and an iPad. I can say without a doubt that SkyDrive is the best cloud service. And Metrotube is the best Youtube client no question.
  • I can personally say I only use one device, my Lumia 920, for all my daily needs. Don't need no digital camera, camcorder, iPod, iPad, android, etc. Though I do need a surface for the full tab/pc experience.
  • Ditto to lubbalots
  • This is a weird question and off the subject but am I seeing a lot of misspelled words lately in the articles? Chrome is spelled "Chome" in the little that I read. After taking journalism in college for a semester, I remember getting our asses chewed-out for typos...
  • Not really typos. Robert Brand is British and uses the British versions of words vs the American or other varied version many here are accustomed to. Like he said in another comments section a little while back, (paraphrase) they created the language so his usage is perfectly acceptable.
  • Wow, I love all the insightful posts to this article.  Clearly this is a polarizing topic.  The fact is, regardless of which of the services are better, people like Google services whether it is for regional, feature, aesthetics, performance or whatever.  I personally do not use Google services.  Ok, like everyone else, I use YouTube, but only for consumption.  The problem for those of us that use Windows Phone, Bing, Outlook, SkyDrive, Office, Windows 8, and all the other software and services that WP supports, we have lost one.  An important one.  One that many people considering moving to WP will want.  Now the barrier to entry for those users is higher.  This sucks for us on WP as fewer Google users(1) will move to WP.  This will keep the WP market share lower which leads to fewer apps which leads to the dark side.  Or is that anger leads to hate which leads to the dark side.  I always get confused about that.   From the Google perspective, why would you want to support a smart phone platform that, let’s face it, holds such a small market share and that, base on some of the disparaging remarks toward Google on this article's posts, consists primarily of non-Google users.  If that were not enough, Google does not want users moving to WP8, they want them buying Android where they can make more money off them.  I get the decision even if I don’t like it.  That explains why Google is backing away from WP.   But Windows 8?  A huge percentage of Google users access Google services on Windows.  With this decision, Google will be alienating a big portion of their user base.  This, IMHO, is a big mistake.  If I were a Google user, I’d be upset that Google is not going to support the platform I use to access the services they provide.  And, the decision appears to me to be based on noncompetitive reasoning. This might be just the thing to turn users off of Google products.  Maybe even in large numbers.   Full disclosure, I don’t use Google products (save YouTube) because I personally don’t want Google taking my personal information and selling it (even though it may be anonymised).  I find it a bit creepy when I get a personal email from a friend giving me advise on a TV tuner card for my PC and then having a Hauppauge WinTV ad on my web search.  No, I’m not blind to the fact that most companies incorporate this business model, but for Google this is their heart and soul.  That’s just me and my preference, my opinion.   (1) - As we all know Google customers are not those that use their services. Their users are their products.  Their customers are advertisers who buy all Google’s user data and advertise to them.  
  • Very well said.
  • If it wasn't for Microsoft Google wouldn't exist! So let them pull out and do their own thing! I personally think the Google Chrome OS is a joke and never see it going anywhere other being used for a browser... I am only saying that because I personally believe everything popular is driven by PC gamers... Google could find developers to build an empire of games but they would generate hate in the gaming world.. Exclusive gaming apps have always helped the PC and Gaming market! I probable would have jumped over to Apple years ago but their gaming support sucked! I am addicted to using Google for all my desktop searches but since I upgraded to my new Lumia 920 I been mainly using Bing without feeling like I was missing anything... I still use Chrome browser on my desktop because it has more features the IE still... And I use Chrome on my iPad3 just think if Anything Google should be proud because they do make an amazing browser experience.
  • I said it before and I'll say it again... Microsoft I will change to if you'll please let me edit my Primary account. I would change my primary account to from tomorrow. My accounts are linked why can't I do this?
  • Buh-bye google. I can live without your apple wannabe arrogance and your attempt to infiltrate my privacy. Take your crappy apps and your hipster attitude and go away.
  • Google is some garbage for real, I also, only like YouTube for the majority.
  • I don't think MS needs Google, but MS needs to get it's act together with Windows Phone. I use gmail for mostly business purposes and even after owning an Android device for years...I don't really use their ecosystem so I'm pretty flexible moving between both quite easily. BUT..MS has been slow to compete with Android on features. I don't understand why MS just hasn't bought MetroTube, it's a perfectly serviceable app for Youtube..even if google changes the API's..figure it out. Also, where in the heck is a competitive turn by turn offering? Bing maps can't hold a candle to google maps..and Nokia Drive isn't the solution. Plus MS needs to make whatever push it needs to get the most basic apps into it's ecosystem. Where's Pandora, where is Spotify, where is DropBox...we've been promised these forever and no dice.
  • I am making this to answer your inquiries.
    1. Metrotube seems to be doing just fine without big corporate ownership. Not hating on MS but it's okay for little guys to stay little guys. This said, we don't know if MS has given Lazyworm money for development or not. The app is far and beyond any other YouTube experience I have used and easier to navigate tuan the actual YouTube desktop version. I would also like to say YouTube was not created or improved by Google so they get props for buying properly, but not creation. Also if MS were to openly purchase MetroTube, Google would wage war and shut it down.
    2. Google Maps beats Bing Maps / Nokia Maps, Drive and Transport for only one reason to me - it comes in one single application and is integrated seamlessly. This is a gigantic reason and one many WP users have spoken on. The fact Nokia gives you 3 when they can give you one complete solution is madness to the end user.l, but may be they were included in that European Union antitrust case Microsoft felt the decade long sting of or at least want to avoid it ever happening. Also, Nokia Maps on WP8 doesn't allow multiple layers so I can't get satellite and traffic view together. I prefer Bing Maps. Drive works just find for me and gives me the same accuracy that Google Maps, Garmin, Navigon, etc.. Do and I am on the road a lot. I will say each one has an area it doesn't navigate well.
    3. Spotify, Pandora, etc... most of these are created by Apple or Google fan boys. As a user of Windows Mobile through the 6.5 version I experienced their wrath. We were constantly asking the developers to give us a version of their software and met with the we don't support Microsoft replies. This war has been brewing at the ground level for many years. There are great solutions that are alternative to those you mention. Even the Apple Centric and Google biased web community has said Xbox Music streaming is a top notch solution and the best value. Nokia Music is solid also. 3rd party options such as Slacker are available and they are cross platform. I don't understand if it has to be a common brand name for Windows Phone when none of the services were common brand names when created for Android or iOS. The idea is to have feature rich, stable and beautiful applications that integrate into the system you are using.
    4. Skydrive and the seamless integration of it has pretty much stopped Dropbox development for WP. Skydrive gives you more out of the box storage, is free, works well and you don't randomly have your files disappear like on Dropbox. Many 3rd party apps allow for you to access both applications, especially e-readers. In this case, the bigger developer and OS maker actually did a better job than a dedicated 3rd party. We should be applauding MS for a job well done and not stabbing it. Dropbox can give us an app and try to compete with Skydrive on WP8. The API is free and easy to find. The same for Pandora and Spotify. Red Bull had no problem finding it and creating a beautiful, in depth app with music, video and reading content.
  • BTW Google's rhetoric about Windows 8 is pure BS. They have support for Windows....Music upload, Google Drive, Google search's not like there isn't anything there. Once Windows 8/9 becomes the majority share they will be making apps for Windows just like they are falling over themselves to provide services to iOS.
  • Microsoft needs to drive people away from Google's services (i.e. GMail, Search, Maps, etc), and draw them to Microsoft. Having to take this direction (in order to strengthen Windows adoption in the mobile sphere) is a no-brainer, there is no other way given Google's refusal to open any of its services to Windows 8/RT/Phone. How this has to be done is going to be very difficult, and it is going to take some time, but I think it can be done provided Microsoft pushes through aggressively and competently.
    Natively baking Bing Search and Maps into Windows 8 and RT should be the first serious step, in addition to rapidly improving those services to better compete with Google Search and Maps. Sure, baking it natively and having people use it by default is great, but they'll need to ensure that Bing is improved upon both frequently, and noticeably.
    Secondly, is a superb service, Microsoft needs to push it further and wider. Have banners on popular websites (especially YouTube) with labels such as "Move your contacts from Gmail to the best free email service on the web, Outlook!" It'll take a few years, but this is one of the ways to really eat into Gmail's userbase of normal people looking for reliable and easy to use email.
    Enhance Office Web Apps further, leave no excuse for people to use Google Docs, and we enthusiast users should (where possible) push our colleagues to use OWA whenever Google Docs is brought up, be aggressive, say it sucks and OWA is just way better. If we do it, our colleagues might carry it further and so on, it can be contagious...
  • I agree...I don't think Google has the monopoly on services that people claim. The onus is really on MS to improve their own alternative services to be competitive. They have a head start in some (games, music) but lag far behind on some of the basics.
  • I have longed believed that Microsoft has done such a good job with it's core apps -- Bing, Maps, Mail, Browser, and Office -- that it hurts it's market place. Look at Android and iOS for instance. Yes, Safari on iOS is decent, but there are several features missing (and Apple knows this, they add them every year to make the list smaller). So iOS users go somewhere else to find the features they want. Same with the Android's original Browser, which I believe to be the worst browser known to man. Opera, Dolphin and even Google's Chrome are three browsers that have flown in and saved the day for Android users. WP7/WP8? IE9, and now IE10, are top notch. They are fast, they render pages great and are decent with HTML5 standard. Really, how can anyone improve on where MS has failed?
    Same goes with the other apps. Although the Mail app does miss some features -- but I don't even know what those are because I don't need them. And I suspect, most users don't. So I agree -- Microsoft doesn't need Google, but this is a sting none the less.
  • F%&k google
  • There is one major problem with thinking that these services don't matter. 
    MS wants new smartphone users but they also want to entice all the Android and iOS users over as well. 
    If I'm an Android user who really likes Gmail services on my phone would I move over to WP? probably not, google maps... probably not the list goes on and on. 
    Apple can say "Hey we have the offical Gmail app, and we just got the incredible Google Maps application as wel!" 
    Windows phone "If you buy the Lumia then you get the great Nokia Drive app, there is the integrated Nokia Maps as well.....I swear it's just as good as Google Maps...... really it is."
    This is really just more of the same problems that is wrong with WP in general the apps aren't fully there yet. I love that there are 3rd party developers that make up for this but people take comfort in the fact that they can just get the Youtube app, the Google Voice App, Google Maps, etc. 
    We can say that this doesn't matter but that really just means it doesn't matter to you.... Android owns over 70% of the market and if you don't think it matters you are the minority. 
    I love WP but Android is getting more fleshed out every year.... if Google keeps releasing subsidized phones for $200 off contract then it's really going to be hard for me to ignore that. 
    I hope, as we all do, the WP will succeed but MS needs to move fast. 
  • Please realize Apple is doing everything possible to move away from Google also. Apple Maps just failed, unlike Bing Maps or the Nokia solutions. Microsoft is better at software than Apple so they can get away from Google, where Apple is stuck for now. Apple has always used Google's hand me downs on the desktop and mobile platforms. Apple hates Google. Don't lump them together. The only common goal they share is the destruction of Microsoft. Still they would rather do it without the other. Microsoft makes so much money off Android based products on the commercial and consumer sides of business that they are an unowned subsidiary. Nothing like a company getting big off your patents and having to pay you for it!
  • My Google account are now deleted, evaporated, lost in space and forever gone...
  • Goodbye google!
    Come on now Microsoft.
    Bing just need some work with details like "search by date/country etc"
    On the youtube side you got some work to do. Google it's time to say goodbye!
  • Bing works fine for me. I just use google for uploading videos to or using search for fixes I've seen micro techs do this as well.
  • I don't give a fuck about google.
  • I think Microsoft will come out on top in the end, and apples gonna crash and burn.
  • Man the only thing I use for Google is Gmail and YouTube that's it. Doesn't matter for me if they makes apps for Windows Phone.
  • I just want to say that the placement of photos and graphics in this post particularly awesome. Love seeing your work WPC!
  • I wish Google continuing success with Android, but I won't blame Google for being scared when Microsoft become No. 2 lol.
  • I really would love to use skydrive....but it's just too f***ing slow!
    I don't know how it is in the USA, but  here in Luxembourg (Europe, google if you don't know) my download and upload speed is ~370kB/s. Dropbox and Google Drive are 10x+ faster. I have a 100Mbit/50Mbit connection at home and dual Gbit at University, so that shouldn't be the problem and there is no speed option in the application settings. 
  • Connecting to SkyDrive can be slow, but not navigating it or uploading / downloading from it. Dropbox seemed fast until I had to upload or download. This is what actually fueled me to move all my files from Dropbox to SkyDrive a year ago. Also, not having a dedicated app when it was clearly possible.
  • No as said upload/download is slow. On my 920 i don't mind but syncing multiple GBs on laptop/desktop is just too slow. After editing a 150mb Word document it takes ~7minutes to finish syncing. I compared it with GDrive/Dropbox  and both of them are way faster than skydrive. Client or webpage, it's the same...
    Are you from europe or USA? 
    edit: here is a 12 page thread about slow speeds on microsoft answers forum
    but got locked beacause "it's become too long and difficult to manage"
  • I'm from the US. I can only speak of my experiences here and I find the syncing, ul & dl faster than Dropbox. I have never used Google's Drive. Neither SkyDrive or Dropbox are fast enough to me, but SkyDrive is faster and easier to manipulate for file reorganization and retrieval.
  • Breaking sync was the straw that broke the camels back for me. I was a proud user of googles products and even have a grandfathered apps account, but I know where I have to stand in this war between competitors as a WP user who will likely never switch to Android. Aside from calendar, I enjoy using all of microsofts products more and i'm glad I'm making the switch in the long run.
    Though downloading a few years worth of my domain based email to my email client and then uploading back to outlook and re-sorting them is timeconsuming, but necessary due to the fact that google doesn't use folders and I had to switch over the MX record for the live domain to make it active. 
  • All this fuss over Google when Nike has a Kinect+ Training app on WP8? Let's be real here. Google can't touch Nike and Nike loves us!
  • just moved to, mail, contacts and calendar.
    I'm totally independent from Google now... and happy
  • Wow, there are a lot of people here in denial.  Its true, the fate of Windows Phone does not totally rest in Google's hands.  Mostly, its in the hands of 3rd party developers deciding to write apps for WP.  That being said, Google has tremendous influence over consumers, so not having Google services along side Microsoft's will slow adoption quite a bit.  Microsoft would be better served by working with Google, like Apple does.  Yes, Apple and Google are competitors, but they are also customers of each other.  A little known fact is, Apple and Google actually work together a good bit on maps, even though Apple tried their own map solution and failed.
    So, I wish Windows Phone good luck.  For anyone going for Windows Phone, you have to be willing to use all of Microsoft's ecosystem, and do without a good bit of third party support.
  • Most adults do use the majority of Microsoft's system at work and don't even know it. It's not the hard to use problem most people believe and has been. Because the ecosystem is so large, diverse and dare I say, flexible people, you actually have to read and study to learn new things in the Microsoft system and environment. Many people don't want that. I see it everyday!
  • The only part I don't like is the change to ActiveSync. If I can no longer sync up my contacts, calendar, and email on my WP8 with Google, then I'll have to drop it and go strictly with Outlook. I liked having the ability to sync up, but if they are taking that away, then they are going to lose a user.
  • YouTube should have bought Google. Since the only reason people want to use Google for is Youtube.
  • If Google doesn't support Windows 8 then how come Chrome has an option called "Relaunch Chrome in Windows 8 mode" in the main menu? And it actually works btw...
  • Meh.  I finally completed my migration away from Google this weekend. Good riddance, it was great while it lasted.
  • Bing is growing on me, and I have already switched back to outlook, but this doesn't help WP8 by any means.  People on the fence may not want to drop gmail or switch to skydrive, and my 8x doesn't have a good mapping solution like Nokia's.
    The real hope is that WP8 phone sales are strong enough and cause google to reassess.  Does that happen at 20 million devices?  30 million?  I can see the platform hitting 20mm by Q2 but to really move past that mark I think WP8 is going to need google.  Hard to imagine they wouldn't spend the time to make an app for 20mm customers, but this is already some seriously spiteful stuff so who knows.  Obviously they are trying to strangle the nascent platform in its infancy.  
  • I'm on Android, and I really want to move to WP8. The only down side is that Bing and other location services are not as well supported outside the US. Bing map needs much work!!
    Google seems faster at going international. They also offer people to help build and correct the maps (I'm a google mapmaker).
  • I love my windows phone but, I would love to see atleast Google Map with turn by turn navigation in Windows Phone. Bing/Nokia maps do not provide this facility to all the regions, especially in Japan.
  • I've been trying to switch away from google services.  It's not easy to do this if you have your own domain name registered to a MS account (originally done via I can sync mail being sent to a outlook alias setup under my MS domain account (to create a inbox). Does the MS account setup on your domain sync calendars, tasks, contacts... nope... 
    I have to go and create a seperate outlook account and link that to the MS domain registered  them but thats still pretty much like having two seperate accounts as far as windows mobile in concerned. So I have to use this 'linked' account or gmail to sync everything else bar e-mail which is painful. Can they not properly merege accounts? 
  • yes we have some apps that are better than google ones. but they are not labeled as google.. most people don't use metrotube, metrotalk etc. they want the official youtube app. they don't even look at it. it is not about the quality of the app itself,.. it is about the package and publisher. because of that i think WP or any other mobile OS does need support from google to climb up and get noticed (faster). look at androids market share. look at the stats of or any other mayor google app. everyone knows the youtube app, but they don't know metrotube. they don't want to know. one could write a youtube-app which is 10 times superior to what google offers, but for some people it would remain as an unofficial youtube app and they still would want an app from google instead.
    i think, it is way more difficult to go without google, but as a WP user since day one, i hope that MS will prove me wrong.
  • The situation we see with Google and its stance with Windows 8 and Windows Phone could at some point be mirrored when Apple does what Microsoft have and close the gaps in their services.
    I think we've already seen this begin when they dropped google's map platform on the iphone
  • As far as google apps go... I'm only really hurting for a G-Drive app.  Stupid 100mb upload limit isn't doing wonders for me.  Metrotube is epic.  Not sure what I'm really missing from Google. 
  • Fuck google Bing is better :) Lumia 900 Poland 
  • Mail, calendar, office, skydrive, bing, internet explorer - all better than google. but there is one thing microsoft cant replace: youtube. thats why they developed a youtube app on their own. and thats why google dumped it.
  • But i love those google stuff, the translation, the search engine, and the email.. I like what MS has, but those are cumbersome and not as user friendly as google's.. And i kinda still hate MS with Windows8 game UNcompatibility..
  • What if microsoft decides to remove all the google services from windows OS and windows phone. And add each and every support to BING search engine. Windows OS is the most used one in each and every term.
    Poeple will eventually change to BIng seach. After all service is important. And bing has it all to take the step. Every windows application manufacturer and others will turn away from google.
    How about that?????
    Is it possible??
  • Bye bye google!
  • I Know that ​skydrive is better than google doc Google search is better than Bing Gmail and outlook almost same Microsoft doesn't have YouTube alternative. (vimeo is good too) Google's android is open source, it means heavily customizable and less secure while Microsoft Windows Phone Platform is less customizable but more secure. so i decided to go with Microsoft (Windows phone, Windows 8.1 Desktop & Laptop, Xbox 360, Nokia Lumia 520)  and finally guys avoid my bad english.  
  • It is actually the developers and Nokia who raised sales of WP. Because of great nokia apps, like here maps, city lens and games that I had again upgraded my phone to a new nokia lumia. MS has been so slow ever since on new apps and talking to developers such as King who makes cand crush. They should look onto that and surely many will make a switch. FACT: I can't even remember using any google related services on my WP, don't need em.
  • I bought a Samsung WP 7.5 and exclusivity of Nokia apps really irked me during that time. One point is apps, the other point is Quality of apps. Im sure the quality of apps on Android when Jellybean was up, was far better than WP7.5 apps. WP always had a poor quality app eco system. WP7.5 was supposed to be a competitor, it failed. We all know, Androids sell more than WP. Thats all that matters in the end. People will always use Outlook in their office, gmail at home. People will always use whats better, they dont worry about who gives it. MS office is better than Google docs, people use it. Youtube is better, they will use it, Chrome browser is better, they will use it. Win7 is better, they will use it. What MS and Google need to do is just make their services better. Poaching users off each other wont really do much. I wonder how many of you use Chrome browser to access WP central? MS is going in the right direction, however, its taking too much time..people dont have time!
  • Well the only thing I really miss is a descent Gtalk app.. I mean 90% of my work relations are connected to gtalk service. I've bought IM+ on WIndows Phone but the experience is not even close to the official android app: - latency to connect to service - Unsynchronized notifications between desktop version and mobile app - no descent message history - unable to connect/chat over 2g network.. etc Otherwise, I've been able to quit all other google services easily.  
  • I don't need google's official apps on my WP. If I wan to watch youtube, I can still do that with metrotube or IE. If I need to create docs, I have Office. I don't need Dropbox since I have OneDrive. Google Maps, I have Nokia Drive and Maps with livesight. So yeah, I agree with the article.
  • Metro Tube is the BEST YT Client for WP. I think, MS should invite Developers to create a Mind Blowing app for Google docs and that should be way better than the Android App in UI and Performance. For Gmail, I love the Mail App by MS, its got everything, I will be using Docs daily, that's the problem for now. And MS should adopt the way Google's following now, like neglecting Android and give priority to WP. MS owns Skype and Office, but they released the advanced version of skype in Andro ahead of WP release. Days ago, someone rumoured that Touch Friendly Office made its way to iOS rather than Windows!! 
  • Microsoft fo great thing, but also google windows phone is almost perfect but it seems to be perfect if it has some Google apps. (but its not Necessary)
  • And dont forget! Microsoft has app support on Android. They have a good functional Outlook and Office app. I'm an Android user who, by choice, does'nt use Gmail (only have it to use Google Play, I dont use it for anything else!) or Google Docs. When Microsoft brings out a bingapp for Android I wil start using that to. So people on the Android platform have the option to choose Microsoft services over Google services. Making it for me less diffecult to jump ship and get on the Windows Phone train. People on Windows Phone wont be so eager to move to Android as they are so entrenched in the Microsoft ecosystem (Outlook [especially this one, locks with your Microsoft account, will you leave your mail to get an Google account?), Office, Bing etc.) In the long run Google is shooting it self in the legs, by refusing to suppor every consumer nomatter the platform its on, while Microsoft under Satya Nadella is changing in a company that embrases every consumer on any platform!
  • OK then, Windows. you want segregation, you can have segregation. then next time you go on Facebook or Youtube this message will pop up. FACEBOOK.COM is blocked due to copyright grounds against google. (YOUTUBE) (or at least until they get rid of all youtube mini vids) YOUTUBE.COM is blocked due to the fact that you have a windows device.
  • Though it is quite funny if you think about it. Apple and Google (and by extension Samsung and all the others) hate eachother yet they allow the comsumers to get the best experience popular (cross plaftform support/googple apps). While Microsoft and Google are still going at it. Though, you must admit, Androids great for devs and people who don't like to stick to rules and the crowd.
  • <p>Google, who needs them? Well, if Microsoft could market a business service, email, docs, web site with company domain name google apps, then I&#39;d swap.</p> <p>Music? In Scandinavia, imo, both iTunes and xbox music have met their match in Spotify.&nbsp; I&#39;m on WP8.x because it looked like a good system AND because I know NOKIA build great phones. With Lumia 930 I got everything a smartphone should be. There is no way back, because Android (lollipop and pussycat, ..) and iOS (&quot;answer your phone on your maaaaac..&quot;) .</p> <p>Video? On WP8.x you have MetroTube which imo is better than YT&#39;s own on ios/android. It is the service and add platform that is annoying. Adds on reviews and infotainment is a bad idea for those delivering reviews and infotainment. Perhaps there is room for another model in that space?</p> <p>Who is calling? Symbian did it and Android does it. Services like 1881,, and more give live access to name or company of the number calling. Even my Nokia N95 and E51 could do that and my HTC One.</p> <p>All my African business associates use BlackBerry and they all bought BB10 devices. Africa is/was one place Nokia that Nokia still has market share. Work your way back with stunning Office and business apps. Kill BB and take Africa. It&#39;s a consumer driven economy. Everybody are customers and supplyers of something. Give them the tools on their handsets.</p>
  • Well, at least I found out why google is doing this. *sigh*
  • To import YouTube to iTunes, we had better download and convert YouTube to iTunes more supported MP4 or MOV. Allavsoft can meet your need, it can directly download YouTube to iTunes video format, or convert already downloaded YouTube to iTunes MP4, MOV.
    Here is the simple guide at
  • To import YouTube to iTunes, we had better download and convert YouTube to iTunes more supported MP4 or MOV. Allavsoft can meet your need, it can directly download YouTube to iTunes video format, or convert already downloaded YouTube to iTunes MP4, MOV.