Yesterday we reported on Universal Emulator one of the first game emulators built on the Windows 10 platform. The app let users load ROMs, often illegally, from Nintendo and Sega, to play on Windows 10 PCs and phones. It even supports the new Bluetooth wireless Xbox One S controller, HoloLens and Microsoft's Continuum for phone.
Those trying to find the app today are unlikely to be successful. The app was indeed pulled from the Store, but there is some good news and bad news here.
The bad news is the app was pulled because it was also submitted as an app for Xbox One. Many people wondered if Microsoft would let a full-fledged game emulator on to the Xbox gaming console potentially ruffling feathers at Nintendo. We now have our answer as Microsoft does not want the app on the console. The developer behind Universal Emulator tweeted the explanation:
Microsoft says: "Your product was unpublished globally or from specific markets". They want me to remove xbox platform support and republish
— nesbox.com (@nesboxcom) September 10, 2016
Microsoft has also stated in the rules to applying for validation on the Xbox that games need to go through the ID@Xbox program and not the app store. Microsoft appears to be claiming that Universal Emulator falls into the games category and not apps. In fact, looking at Microsoft's own app guidelines and it is clear that emulators could be flagged:
Apps that are targeted to Xbox One and are primarily gaming experiences must be approved through the ID@Xbox Program.
The key phrasing there is "primarily gaming experiences" and not "games". Certainly, an emulator falls under that definition.
The good news is that the app should come back for Windows 10 PC, Mobile, and HoloLens once the Xbox feature is removed. In fact, there are quite a few Windows 8.1 emulators on the Store and Microsoft's policy was always laxer for the PC. With the new Universal Windows Platform, however, devs can just check a box for submission to the Store with support for Xbox. After being tested it appears Microsoft, for the time being, is going to be a little more controlling.
Nonetheless, earlier in the week we demoed the BitTorrent app Torrex as running on the Xbox One too. It is not clear if that app will be allowed to go public in the coming weeks or if Microsoft will also block that release.
Interestingly, Nesbox is considering a workaround on the Xbox front. A user suggested using an emulator hosted through the Edge browser and let users upload ROMs by using USB storage on the console. Nesbox replied, "will try to make a prototype on Monday".
Legal issues surround emulators as the apps themselves are not illegal, but how they are used, and the ROMs people acquire often violate copyright law (yes, even if you previously owned the cartridge). While Nintendo has no claims against Microsoft for letting emulators on the Store, it is likely frowned upon by the industry. By allowing an emulator on the Xbox users could turn Microsoft's gaming console into a modern Nintendo Entertainment System.
We'll keep you posted on any further changes and if Universal Emulator returns to the Store.
Reader comments
Microsoft unpublishes Nintendo emulator due to attempt at Xbox validation
Not surprised.
I got the app before it was pulled. It works in Continuum. It is still a work in progress. You cannot simply add your rom folder location and it scans your roms. You have to open each rom individually and then it shows up on the apps front page.I tried several games.
NES: FF1
SNES: FF2 (FF4 ***), Street Fighter II Turbo, Super Metroid, Zelda a Link to the Past.
I do not think there is a ability to save games nor snapshot (save state) games at this time. I tried saving my Metroid and FF1 progress in-game. It saves, but when I open the game again, it's starts all over. Saved games were gone. Some of the games glitched and have A/V glitches. Some games had audio, but no video.
It works with the XBOX ONE (I do not have an XBOX ONE S to test) controller via hardwired usb into the dock. I have the 950XL. Could not pair via bluetooth. Does not even show up on the phone to pair. Probably needs the special wireless receive for it. I think the XBOX ONE S controller will sync to the phone wirelessly.
I hope its gets developed further.
EDIT: The emulator also now has save state working after a reboot. But in-game saves still not working (aka save points throughout the game like Super Metroid or Final Fantasy). Found a local store with an XBOX ONE S controller that has Bluetooth. It works with the Lumia 950XL via wired USB through the dock OR Bluetooth. WOOT!
I was able to do a save game state for Super Mario RPG. If you hit the back button, it should bring up the toolbar. The floppy disk saves the state, the floppy disk with the down arrow is to load a saved state. You can also select a saved state from default screen.
Microsoft has no balls anymore. :(
If Ms block It, the dev can distribuite the appx so we can sideload It (like we could have done with the SnapChat clone but that dev wasn t so smart to do It)
I thought Snapchat blocked all third party application for "security reasons"
You can't really sideload an app on xbox, the dev mode install an secondary OS on your xbox and you need to reboot every times you want to use it; it takes 3-4 minutes to reboot and you need to reinstall everything, so almost impossible to use for a consumer
UWP will never overcome WINAPI with this racist treatment (winapi devs can do all they want and uwp devs are treated like criminals )
Developer have invested a lot of time and recources into this thing and MS's NO should cost them money.
I think Torrex will be fine as it's not meant to be primarily a gaming experience.
And there it is, nice job MS in killing any kind of buzz or interest in xbox uwp apps.
Google will eventually one day move into the AAA console space and bring with it it's apps and MS will get smoked by them leaving Playstation/Steam to divy up the remainder.
Xbox will get smoked by Google in consoles because of an emulator app that's probably illegal interesting
Yeah sure...then you woke up
Where do you get the Super Mario Bros rom?
Funny thing. Just today I was experimenting with my roommate: Open Universal Emulator on Surface Pro 3, connect Xbox One S's (bluetooth) controller to it. Great, playing Final Fantasy V perfectly in the emulator! .... use Miracast to cast my display to the Xbox One via the Wireless Display (preview) app. BAM, SNES on my 4k tv hahahah.
where is this Wireless Display app? I'm in the Xbox Preview program, but can't find it...
How do some people not understand that Microsoft has a rule the guy tried a loop hole. It was clever but still against the rules so Microsoft blocked it. On top of Nintendo would have a field day in court over it. I'm sure Nintendo CEO was on the phone with Microsoft the second he heard about it
*** them Microsoft
I'm a long time visitor, but I felt like registering just to comment. I can't comprehend the way people have taken this and especially comment on Rubino without knowing anything about his stance.
This is long. I'm sorry for not coming across with my point inn fewer paragraphs, but I also want to be very clear in what I say.
To me, it feels like everyone is reading too much into what the word "universal" means. I remember Apple launching Universal Binary apps during their transition from PowerPC to Intel architecture in the mid-2000s. The idea was to have a single executable compatible across different products. Of course, in Apple's case the product lines were similar, only differing in internal architecture. However, I see the Universal Windows Platform as something akin to Apple's Universal Binary apps. To have a single executable across different products.
I'm a developer, although I have not published on PC or Xbox One yet. From what I've followed, and I try to do so closely as being a developer professionally wouldn't work out for me if I wasn't keeping up with the news, Microsoft has only ever promised to make it easier for developers to publish apps across their product range. Instead of having to make a separate PC, phone, tablet, Xbox One or HoloLens app, I could instead make a single app that is compatible with all the aforementioned products.
However, I say compatible because that's all what it means. I don't believe Microsoft has ever promised that we could run any app as we liked to. There is, however, the Dev Mode on every retail Xbox One that can be turned on. It should be simple enough for any interested user to get compatible apps running without going through the Windows Store. Again, the keyword is compatible. What Microsoft did today was fully understandable. It's not about a "universal" platform as in "I can choose what to do however I want", but rather a universal platform as in "developers have it easier now and that hopefully translates into more apps I'll find on my favorite Windows 10 product".
Much like Apple wanted to make it easier for developers to make a single executable that worked both on legacy PowerPC and new Intel Macs at the time, Microsoft is doing the same for developers today trying to cater to all the possible products that run Windows 10 today. However, I would never expect e.g. the new Halo 5 Forge to be released on Windows HPC Server as well. It would make no sense to even try to imagine a data center PC running a UWP game. It would likewise make no sense for an Arduino connector to be released on Xbox One, as the use case for that is likely to be found on a product that runs Windows 10 IoT Core instead. So it's definitely not about the capability to run the apps. It's about what apps make sense for each product.
The platform is there to cater to all products, but the apps must cater to each individual product as well. I don't think an unofficial emulator not sanctioned by Nintendo has any place ever to be on the Xbox One. Keep in mind that there is an actual, official implementation of an NES emulator on the Xbox One and that's included in Rare Replay. Some of the collection's games such as Battletoads are actually ROMs running inside a sandboxed emulator. This is the only ever form of an NES emulator that we'll see on Xbox One, for good reason.
I also do not understand the comments directed at Rubino. I think it's great we have someone like him reporting all the findings to us, good or bad. That doesn't constitute whether he personally endorses something or not. There's an awful amount of noise here based on false beliefs. I think that's, for lack of a better word, improper behavior.
To sum it up, there is a way to emulate NES games on the Xbox One. There is in fact a way for (almost) everything, but Microsoft is not responsible to deliver that. Disregarding the actual purpose of the Universal Windows Platform to perpetuate a personal agenda is plain wrong. If nothing else it can even push away developers who are seeking to improve the ecosystem for everyone.
Kind wishes,
Hoping to publish my first UWP app this year.
Well said.
Yup, I wondered when this would happen. They pitch Windows 10 on everything, but will start making exceptions like this because it conflicts with their Xbox console business. How can an app be fine on my phone and desktop, but not on an Xbox I could own?
Not surprised that this happened. Nintendo fans are by far the most fanatical about company IP and, even though emulators are perfectly legal, they were already gearing up with the pitchforks to storm "evil" MS for letting this on the store. The nice thing is that people can still play the emulator on the big screen via Continuum with the controller (confirmed by Killazray) or even a PC stick, so even though MS has covered their butt on the Xbox front they've left a gaping hole (deliberately I think) for other devices to use it and get a similar experience.
Now, on the Xbox one... that WOULD be nice. Just pop on the Xbox one, got to your apps/games and select the emulator, grab your controller and go....
As for the PC, I already have some of the best Emulators out there, so I can play most classic systesm with out a problem...
Would be funny for supporters of this if Nintendo made an iOS and Android only emulator that played 3 generations of XBox games.
That's just plain stupid.
This is why u don't use it as a demo, Daniel. There are others out there like Cherry app that plays GBA games.
That's not how this works.
So will it be published if it was XboxID?
Highly unlikely. Can you see Microsoft endorsing a product that Nintendo would go crazy over?
But they're endorsing it by allowing it on the other platforms.
Right, but there may be such thing as crossing a line too. Emulators on PC are as old as PCs. Emulators running on a gaming console...I can see that as being a threshold.
Also, it may not be the emulator part per se, but as others mention, that this could be classified as "gaming" therefore needs to go under ID@Xbox. Microsoft is keeping games out of the app store on Xbox so as to not dilute the brand. Now, is that nitpicking with an emulator? Totally, but they could - and likely are - making that argument here.
ID@Xbox supported products are a direct endorsement. Allowing stuff in the store on PC and Mobile isn't the same. It doesn't have Microsoft's badge on it for one.
>Can you see Microsoft endorsing a product that Nintendo would go crazy over?
FIne line. An emulator itself is not aginst the law, it's the ROMS. There are plenty of free roms out there, that are public domain or free.
If the software DOES Not come with any Nintendo/Sega roms on it, there is nothing wrong with it being in the store.
It's when people start dumping roms in it where the questionable side comes along..
meh i dont need it got enough minecraft to play!
Wouldn't have gotten achievements anyway. =P
While disheartening, imo it's quite reasonable actually.
I just downloaded VBA10 one week ago, really good stuff with continuum support. I thought it was fun there are news about emulator few day after I choose to install one on my phone xD. But I'll stay with VBA10.
Same happened with the one for Nintendo 64 but the developer didn't take it nicely.
How so?
He won't develop for Microsoft's platform anymore due them no publishing the emulator.
Haha, do you have a tweet or other communication from this dev to share?
For some reason his posts are being down voted but here is one: https://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/520vzm/n64_emulator_has_been_u...
I remember the thread being more sour yesterday night.
Thanks. Should offer some good laughs later ;)
Rightfully so, MS has just killed the "Universal" Windows Platform in one move. If it's allowed on PC and mobile, as it should be, there is no valid reason to block it on console. UWP is a lie.
My, such drama.
I remember the thread over Reddit much more dramatic yesterday night. Now that I read it again it is not that much.
If I were the developer I would be mad too but I think that enough Xbox users at Reddit didn't behave as they should. Kind of toxic if you ask me.
Reddit .. Toxic? Who'd have thunk it :D
I've read thru the thread and IMO this dev has made the same assumption others have, that an emulator is an app and not a game. I spoke to some other dev last week and he said point blank that he was publishing it as an app as a kind of loophole, didn't work out for him either.
I am confident that a NES emulator would be allowed thru the ID channel if framed correctly.
The cake is a lie.
Universal means that one code CAN run on all platforms. Not that it SHOULD ignore legal complications and run on every platform. "no valid reason to block it on Console" its an app that's allows emulation of possible illegal roms of Nintendo games. Especially when nintendo plan to soon release the classic NES. How is this not a valid reason?
I am sure his application leads the layers at Microsoft go crazy, and basically decided it is better to reject the app for the XBox One, and not have to deal with the lawsuits that will most likelly follow by Nintendo and Sega.
English ************, do you speak it?
How many other languages do you speak?
Fluently, three not including English. I can also make myself somewhat understood in another handful languages, how so?
My reply is a quote from a famous movie and I thought it rather fitting because your autocorrect ****** your initial post. I wasn't having a go as such.
Well.. I can't edit a post. But I should give it a good read before posting. Next time. Appologies.
Playing NES, SNES, Sega, etc., classics on the Xbox One would have been epic.
Still can, kinda, through Continuum.
Nesbox doesn't support Continuum though? Unless there's an update I missed along the way.
I think this is a new app called "Universal Emulator" from the same Nesbox dev? Not 100% suer but seems that way and sounds like it's the one called "Universal Emulator" that supports Continuum.
I didn't know about it until this article but will try it out on my 950 w/ Continuum when it's back in the store. Will be cool for a quick game at lunch in the office even (if I get time!)
Yeah, that works for ME, but having it on the Xbox would be easier for the less 'techie' - like my friends wife would flip out to be able to play old school Tetris on her TV. They don't even have a single Windows device in the house so Continuum doesn't help.
I'd love to play multi-player N64 Goldeneye on the Xbox.
Goldeneye was classic, playing tag with no weaps was pretty fun.
How does one use Continuum on the Xbox One? I'm in the Xbox Preview program but can't seem to find this "Wireless Display" app that keeps getting mentioned.
...you would have thought that a universal meant exactly that, seems Microsoft is confused with it's own platform definition... Rather people get their nostalgic kick on Xbox than crapple
I disagree. Microsoft has said it can and will curate the Store. Emulators are at their discretion and it is not an 'anything goes' situation.
Exactly. Emulators definitely open up a can of legal worms, and with the Retro NES slated for this year I'm sure Nintendo voiced their opinion on the matter.
Besides, Microsoft has always stated that platforms would be currated to ensure that apps make sense for the paltform. As Xbox lacks mouse and keyboard support, it doesn't really make sense to have Excel or PowerPoint (maybe viewers, but not editors). Ultimately, they don't want the Windows Store to be like the Android Play Store; wild west dumpster fire.
Powerpoint viewer on the Xbox would be a killer app IMO.
Google Play has a lot of Nintendo emulator though. None getting trouble with Nintendo.
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
The issue here is having emulator on console, not on mobile devices. If that was the case, Google can even removed these apps from Google Play or Nintendo can file a lawsuit.
Ouya is a console with emulators.
There is Android device as console gaming device though
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
No where near as large of an audience as the Xbox, it's running os not made for gaming, and it does not have it's own specific curated store. How are you not seeing the differences?
Maybe you should actually browse the Windows store, and you'll find a lot of Nintendo emulators. But the one small similarity on all of them, are none of them are on Xbox one. See the pattern. But since you're on Android, the argument is kind of biased with no knowledge of the platform that the article is about. Go figure
Would be professional of you guys to ridicule Tim Sweeney some more
He deserves ridicule for his claims.
And those journalists who've maintained their integrity? What do they deserve?
A punch in the face.
Integrity like morals are relative and are more your opinion than any objective fact. Let's not pretend 'surmisation' is the judge of all in this world or this job. I sure don't.
Butthurt?
Curating on only one platform is the antithesis of a Universal software platform. It doesn't matter if it's their right to do so, it undermines UWP and is deserving of all the scorn we can muster. It's a couple emulators now, but Tim Sweeny was right. MS only cares about control. Defend this til you're blue in the face, it's bullshit nonetheless.
It's not on only one platform. We've seen this on EVERY platform. Some apps are on mobile but not PC, and vice versa. We've also seen this with apps on Hololens.
Universal does mean universal, but this emulates games. Something Microsoft was VERY clear about not being allowed on the Xbox via the app store. If you wanted to release a game you'd still have to go thru ID@Xbox and have the project vetted beforehand.
Really, can you post a source please?
Of course.
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/xbox-apps/frequently-asked-...
MS can say whatever they want, if they are arbitrarily blocking apps from one of the supported platforms, it isn't universal. Period.
They are not arbitrarily blocking them, they are asking you to go thru the ID@Xbox channel for Game releases on their Game console.
Apps are free for all, games are being curated as to not diminish the Xbox brand.
Smurf, I think you should look up the meaning of arbitrarily.
+SmarmySmurf So you're saying, even though this app allows people to play (possibly illegally downloaded) classic nintendo ROMS, and can cause a law suit if MS was to say "Yeah sure we'll allow this on our console", MS are obliged to put it on the Xbox store anyways, just so people can continue to misunderstand the meaning of "Universal" apps? Universal means "that one piece if code, CAN run on all win10 platforms." Not that "oh its aloud on mobile and PC so they have to allow it on a lead competitor console which conflicts with Nintendo's console they are releasing soon this year" Think about the legal complications that it could cause. This isn't just another emulator on the mobile store, this is a app that is practically a kick in the teeth to Nintendo if it was aloud on the XboxOne.
What, we are down voting a link which exactly answers a question? Are you guys for real. Geez.
Facts are stubborn things.
Just ignore the salty downvoters...
Some cant take criticism.
Thanks, I guess that makes sense :), makes it easier for them to push their XBox brand as well. Time to google for ID@Xbox rules against emulators xD.
Universal does not equal "zomg everything automatically should be on everything."
Universal means everything can be on everything. BIG difference.
I can see both points on this issue. Forgetting the fact of legal issues, I think I'm leaning more on the side that the developer should be allowed to post on all devices so long as the app is legitimate and actually works on the device. As a believer in the UWP dream, I would expect any app to be available on all my devices and synch seemlessly across them with little effort on my part. I understand that MS can do what they want (and always will), but that doesn't make it less frustrating.
No. You guys need to stop. Just stop. It's embarrassing whenever you guys try to change the English language. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/universal.
How is saying that the app should be on all devices , changing the language? Look at 2 and 5 on that page.
Good on MS. Anyone else buying the new NES system this holiday season?
I'm sure that definitely played a role in this too. I'd be pissed if I were Nintendo and this were allowed to happen. It'd totally kneecap that release.
Changed your mind Daniel? :-)
Changed my mind? You folks confuse me reporting on something with me endorsing it personally. I actually find this offensive that you cannot distinguish between the two.
No one has yet asked me how I feel about this stuff, yet because I do stories on it or play devil's advocate, you assume you know my position. You don't.
So tell us how you REALLY feel? :D
Just as an aside, I never assumed you were for, against, or otherwise in the initial article, it was merely that the information shown didn't illicit the same level of legalities the later ones have.
Which in and of itself isn't a bad thing the problem comes from when you start discussing this stuff in articles you start getting people asking where to get ROMs and the like in comments and I have seen sites receive cease and desist letters or worse, not for hosting ROMs themselves but for providing a means to find them.
So yeah, all good.
Can't seem to delete double post in app.
Yeah. It isn't a very good idea to ruffle more feathers on the console market. Nintendo has very devoted fans and they can probably start a media campaign to ruin things for Microsoft.
I wonder why emulator on Android seem flourish from free to paid and not only Nintendo stuff? MS need to let loose little bit..
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
Because Google has no shame. Emulators have existed on PC since they became a thing though.
Really, emulators don't really seem to be the issue, its emulators on a console app store that is like a punch to said company. For example, why would someone buy a Nintendo console, if they can buy the XboxOne, and get both Nintendo games (possibly free), and Xbox games for the same price, which MS allowed on their store and console. Even though it's still a similar situation for Mobile, it is also different as the mobile isn't made primarily for gaming (so really, comparing to android can't really be done haha). MS's response to the app is extremely reasonable if they want to avoid a law suit. Only reason its been taken off Win10m and other devices too is because its a UWP. So obviously it's one app on all platforms (and also the since the store is the same store on win10m, PC etc). They just want the dev to remove Xbox support from the app, and hopefully will then accept it :p
What bout emulator for handheld Nintendo eg Gameboy? Those emulator available on Google Play.. I don't see Nintendo run after them either.
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
And there are great Gameboy emulators on windows store that hasn't hit legal issues. It's when them emulators are on a MS branded console that it becomes a legal matter. Thats why i said the only reason its been taken off of the mobile store too, is because, a "mobile store" does not exist. Its one store that works on all platforms. So if a UWP is removed from one platform, its removed from all through the exact same store. Microsoft only wants the developer to remove Xbox support. Then, if its republished, it should be approved, but just won't be on Xbox One. Also I don't see google having a console, never mind an emulator on said console, so can the Google Play store actually be put under comparison with an app that had been removed due to Xbox support?
Because Android is open source. Google can't control it.
That is really funny :) people still believing Android is open source and Google has no control or whatsoever. HINT: Play store access
Android is open source but not Google Play Store..
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
Regarding the Classic Nes release. Its a much better alternative to buy a Raspberry Pi and install Retropie and buy a couple of Nes/Snes usb controllers. It cost about the same but you wont be limited to 30 NES games. You can emulate nes, snes, n64, sega genesis and much more.
I don't have the time to bother with all that. Neither do parents buying for kids.
My 2 year old will have a blast on the little NES. Because lord knows when I finally get hold of a real one again he won't be touching it.
I've never owned an NES and would rather give Nintendo my money for creating wonderful games than go the freeloader route.
Thinking of getting one but its really a bummer that you can't use your old cartridges and will have to settle on the 30 classic games that are built-in. But what the hell, 30 of may favorite childhood games for 60 bucks is already a bargain.
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
I have one on preorder, but having played thru some of these games on the big screen lately I may cancel it.
Games are still good, but not as good as I remember them from back in the day. My 5-yr old thought some of them were cool, but ultimately he went back to his modern titles. What he lacked, specifically, was cooperative two-player games. Perhaps I showed him the wrong titles, but I can't for the life of me remember any great coop titles from back then.
Contra? Battletoads? Double Dragon? Any TMNT title? You must have not though very hard. =P
Double dragon ftw =D just bought it on steam
Streets of Fury - NEC X)
Final fight 3... Is also decent one.
Maybe most of the games on nes didn't aged well aside from their RPG titles but I'm sure I'll still enjoy some of the games included here like balloon fight, ice climber, donkey kong, pacman, kirby, zelda, the mario bros, adventure island and gradius. I just wish they have bomberman and contra as that will be a real time waster for me. I'm not really looking for this to replace any game console it will mostly be a weekend thing.
Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
Awe was swaying me towards getting Xbox, I'll just have to make do on continuum with exactly the same experience :s
Wait wait wait. Continuum is supported? :O
So I've heard! My 950XL is eagerly waiting for it to return to store.
Well I'll be waiting for the app as well.
Told you!
Didn't even read the article did you?
The dev said he will remove the infringing feature and return the app to the store(hopefully it passes validation). I have the app and its amazing, very well made. Hopefully it return so others can enjoy this great app.
I just installed it last night on my 950 and was about download it on my 650.. But now will have to wait, hopefully not to long.
Done the same on my 950xl(got notified about it via Apprasin prior to WC article). Had some MD roms old times, currently SoR3, Fifa99 and RoadRash3 aren't loading but still at least SoR2 and Shinobi works and im very happy with that.
Well at least not ALL is lost!