The Surface Mini that we're expecting to see on May 20th. is likely to have a stylus, ARM processor (and therefor run Windows RT), and be announced by the new CEO, Satya Nadella, at the launch event.
Though a stand won't be built in according to anonymous sources, we should see a snap-on keyboard that can double as a stand. The stylus in question is expected to have tight integration with OneNote, while the screen itself should be in the 7 to 8 inch range. As cool as this all sounds, there very well may be a second device announced on May 20th. as well.
The Surface mini should be hitting shelves in June, but at this point everything is still squarely in the realm of rumors. What would you guys like to see from a smaller surface?
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Surface Mini likely to be available in June; Will include pen support and ARM processor
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Depending on the price I may sell my venue 8 pro for the mini. The only legacy app I ever really run on my venue is office and since RT has it I can live with RT. I hope the specs are atleast an 8in screen, a 64gb model (w/ microSD card support) and a 1080p screen would be nice. Just keep it at $299 and i will definitely buy one.
One more thing, surface mini pro
I'd be happy with RT as long as it had the new office suite, an excellent rear camera for high quality document scanning to use with Onenote and a stylus that would work with my Surface Pro as well.
Surface pro 3?
This meeting took place in redmond:
classic MS boss: "They guys, our ARM tablets are flopping, what should we do".
eager MSFT employee: "make more ARM tablets?".
boss: "I like your thinking".
A new tablet with WinRT? WHY? As a SurfaceRT user I really want a normal Win8.1, but with a battery life compared to my Surface. And it looks that nobody like RT, even Microsoft itself.
I must be in the minority here. I am looking to replace my Surface Pro 2 with something lighter and more portable, and which I can drop into a dock and use as a full desktop. The Thinkpad 8 is nearly perfect, but somehow I expect MS can do it better.
Hopefully they release both a Surface Mini and a Surface Mini Pro, with high end BayTrail processor, a stand and and a type cover.
The surface mini should be cheap enough so that it can compete with other android tablets especially in India..
Here's to hoping Microsoft will make a Surface Pro Mini
If it costs more than $200 it will not survive in the market. Too many other cheaper Android and RT tablet options.
Why no make two editions like his big brother one that runs Rt and one that runs pro.
why give people what they want?
I just hope the stylus is embedded in the device like on note devices, not like on the surface pro.
Why do I think the surprise device is the Surface Phone designed and built by Nokia that was ready by Build 2014. It could not be introduced at BUILD because the sell of Nokia was not finalized at that time.
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Please prioritize launch in Singapore. We always get out a few months later.i need it for my summer travels.
They should announce Office for touch by that time. Current Office with small screen will be disaster..
When I read this:
"there very well may be a second device announced on May 20th."
It felt as if my heart stopped.
The hook just sank in deeper and made me even more addicted than I already am to WPCentral. Well played Simon Sage, well played.
I'll be fine w RT. at this size I'm really looking for a good note taking device. Just so long that works I'll be ok. I miss my surface RT. Also have DVP8 but even tho its a "full PC" it's just to small to do anything. RT will be good enough. LTE unlocked from a carrier would seal the deal
They should make two versions. One ARM and another Intel baytrail.
My ThinkPad 8 destroys this rt toy. Just wish the sim version existed and the USB and hdmi were on top and not on sides.
The event sounds like it could be interesting. An 8" device would be a great addition to the Surface line up. If the stylus works as advertised, it could be a great device. My one issue with the stylus has been that most apps don't support it. The PDF reader allows annotations, but only in black ink, while other first party apps like Photos, Mail, etc offer absolutely no support. It's also annoying to use it in Office apps.
Under $300. Maybe higher if enough else about it is awesome, but that's probably the ceiling in light of other options like the Dell Venue Pro. That's basically the only factor that would stop me from buyng it.
Nobody buying an iPad/Nexus/Kindle is asking "can this run my x86 apps". Stop thinking like that. People want a safe, secure pure tablet experience where you install every app from an app store.
Exactly. I'm confused by all the RT bashing. It's a tablet OS, a reasonably good one, priced at the range of tablets. If you want a laptop, that's great, go ahead and pay more for it, but if I were to get an 8" device running full Windows, I can't really imagine using the desktop on it anyway.
Awesome, now they just need to make that Apple TV sized Xbox Mini that's been rumored for a couple of years...
For something that small, can we have swipe for typing?
Looking forward to this, be nice if there is a mini-pro as there are some apps I use that only in the x86 world.
Also not sure if there is one, but last time I checked there was no .epub and .mobi reader for RT?
Kimbie
Last I tried, probably a couple of months ago, there were a couple that were functional. Not amazing experiences, but functional. There are also Kobo and Kindle apps (probably Nook in the US), but neither let you sideload in files from elsewhere yet I don't think.
Again another device that HAD promise only to be cut off by RT instead of pro. I want the stylus and pro in the 8 inch form. Thanks.
I will buy if it has LTE with 64GB or LTE with MicroSD slot. I'm wondering if they'll put a full USB port on it, I hope so!
I'm one of those quite happy its coming with Windows RT. I personally do not need anything full Windows on a screen 8 inches big or only an Atom-based processor. Anything I do where full Windows 8.1 is necessary involves heavy processing, Pro Tools 11, Reason 6, Photoshop, bascially when its time for me to creeate. None of those prpograms are running remotely good on anything less than an i5 for my needs. To that end, this new Surface is perfect for quick consumption, note taking, battery life, lightweight, etc. Can't wait to see it!
Clearly a pro version to install whatever I want and, for sure, a smaller price like the tablet.
8" tablet, with long long battery life thanks to ARM, with a stylus, and a detachble connection for a keyboard or other accesories (like an E-Ink panel?)
Could this actually be The Courier?
GAHHHHHH
Windows RT.
No buy :(
A lime green cover me
It must have that iconic dual angle kick stand! It would be disappointing if it doesn't have a full size USB 3.0 port either.
only have interest if they announce any of the surface device for india, want to buy but ..
Mr. Satya Nadella come on send some love to ur country as well
I'm really interested to see how they're gonna price this Surface tablet compare to the iPad Mini. I expect a princing in the range of 349-399$. I really hope Microsoft doesn't make this mistake though!
I only just got my SP 2, dam it should waited till my birthday hahah, Should of not wanted that early birthday present.
I just have a feeling this thing is going to come in at $199! And at that price we are looking at a Fire and Air killer.
Knowing MS it could turn out to be a $399....hope this doesn't happen though.
Xellsama - That was the old Ballmer MSFT. This is the era of Nadella's MSFT, so let's hope he surprises us with pricepoints that are in line with the competition and will be market movers! Knockin on wood here...
Not interested. Will hope for a Surface Pro 3 announcement in the coming months, hopefully back to school or Xmas time.
From what I understand rt doesn't support ink services. That's why we're haven't seen an arm tablet with pen. Though handwriting is there, not sure about driver support. Guess since its Microsoft they can do it
I want it to be rt, but completely without the old desktop interface. And already with the new office touch friendly. Price range 300-400.
Hopefully they will launch metro office with this
I hope it has a USB port or even a micro USB port with OTG support so I could use the Corsair OG Flash Drive. Also I hope it has a micro HDMI output for full HD/Audio support.
Looking forward to this.
RT has potential in the marketplace for non-tech consumers who traditionally have bought Kindles and iPad Minis. They don't expect to run Photoshop and Visual Studio. They expect to read books, watch videos, keep up with Facebook, email, browse the internet with little fuss. They don't have to worry about viruses. Getting apps is easy from the store.
This is RTs strength. Don't compare it to a device a tech person would need, it isn't meant for you.
Just throwing this out there...keep the Surface line of product on ARM, but then release a Lumia 2520 Mini running Bay Trail. Let the consumers decide what they really want!!!
If they ever do this, it would probably be Surface on x86 and Lumias on Arm. Good idea though.
I'd like to see NFC and a high quality front-facing camera for video call and collaboration.
Any idea if we're also going to see an update to Windows? 8.1 update 2? Windows 9?
I want one!
Pricing will be the key here, it probably shouldn't be more than $300. I dont think a stylus warrants a price above for a mini tablet, they are not apple so they likely wont compete as well if they price it similar to an ipad mini.
Microsoft are going to keep pushing ARM, this is the ideal form factor for the OS as it is primarily a consumption device. If they were to use an Atom chip then it would essentially show the market that they are giving up on ARM which would be a mistake. It also leaves the x86/64 market to other OEMs to try and keep them happy.
I expect the 32GB Wifi version to be $299-349 and am also hoping they are coming up with a 12-13" laptop or hybrid at the event.
Well said. I fully agree.
I am hoping for 64 GB and 128 GB versions (WiFi and
LTE).
I want a 128 GB LTE Surface Mini with support for a 128 GB and higher sdcard.
It will be nice if it has a 64 bit arms processor with at least 2 GB of ram.
For this device with the specs listed, I am willing to pay $500 to $600.
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What else is expected to be presented?
Good question. The Mini seems like a sure bet... maybe a larger, 12-13" Surface Pro? Or a Smartwatch?
I hope smart watch, but I'm guessing it's probably just more Surface accessories/peripherals.
Maybe a Surface Phone.
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A surface mini rt with a pen and pricing between $179 and $199 would be deadly to the Galaxy Tab 7.0. It's all about price. If the mini rt comes in at $249, forget it.
Agreed. They need to make it super cheap, but also good quality. Its the only way to compete with Samsung & Apple
In other words, they should make it at a loss?
They're selling the Surface range at a loss anyway, so no biggy. Need to get ppl to buy into it, to get the numbers up, to get the devs and big companies to build apps
Co-sign. At that price point, even I could give it a second look but after my 3 Surface attempts, I'm a bit gun shy.
More apps?? That would be nice. Writing apps and art apps I'd suggest, considering the big thing about the Surface mini will be the stylus.
I think I've purchased my last Surface anything for now. I have two of them and I feel like I'm riding a VistaCycle. I can't afford it.
If this this going to be RT and priced above 300, it'll be a DOA for certain. While RT has potential, it really does not have that much value at the moment, and since other OEMs are offering full windows small tablets in the 200~400 dollar range, it gives people even less reason to purchase it with RT.
It has. Even when you cannot see it. I definitely prefer RT over 8 for small tablets. Only no x86 applications, but less prone to errors because of x86 applications, less prone to viruses, great battery life and still multi user, still IE with flash etc etc. Win win to me.
I lined up for the original Surface RT the night it came out, but now it just sort of sits there in the corner. In terms of power usage, my laptop has Windows 8.1 Pro and Office, bigger screen and better specs; in terms of mobile usage, my phone(L920, also got it the first week it was out) is easier to carry around, with more apps, and much better camera. I also bought a Nexus 7 last summer (also sits in the corner, though used slightly more than Surface RT).
The only time I used RT this year was when I was on a plane and wanted to watch a movie. Which, other than being able to store movies on sd card, isn't really better than iPad; and is inferior to Android. And if my trip was any longer, I would have brought my actual laptop to begin with, so I wouldnt need RT.
Windows Phone 8.1 has a much more established ecosystem than RT imo, more apps and a better touch interface overall, so if I want a mobile tablet that's not full Windows, I'd much rather it run WP8.1.
Not me. Multiuser, snapped apps, flash on websites, full USB port (usb stick and Xbox controller a.o.) kickstand and I can go on. ios and android are obviously inferior ;).
I'm good with it being RT. I hope it doesn't have the desktop and comes with a beta version of metro office. Oh, and a nice silo to store the pen.
Agree. I actually prefer RT for a small tablet.
I was thinking the same thing. Does Metro Office include Metro Outlook?
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I also like to have support for 128gb and higher sdcard.
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How about the Surface ME?
I Digress...
It's going to depend on the price point. If MS wants to lure consumers away from Android tablets, they are going to have to target a competitive price point. Around $150-$200.
F*ck Android, it's a mass of plastic sh*t. And I do mean sh*t. I'll take Vapor Mg Mini and pay $400 for it.
Has anyone heard whether the new 64bit ARM technology and whether MS is going to be maybe looking to use that? and if they are, will that mean winrt becomes more similar to the intel based windows? I'm not a OS designer, nor am I a processor designer, so i don't really know much about this...
I wonder what real benefits of using RTinstead of real windows 8 are? I mean, Surface 2 (32GB) costs around 450€ here in Finland while Acer iconia W4 costs around 300€ and it has a real windows 8.1 experience. Battery life with Iconia was around 8 hours compared to Surfaces' over 10h so that's one benefit but clearly not enough to compare pros of full Windows 8 with that price difference.
I think it's just to pressure Intel, but I have no basis for this other than a guess.
Windows RT is real Windows too. Just no x86 apps that hardly anybody uses anyway on a small tablet. A device is a lot more then just price and x86 compatibility.
Hmmm, I'd like to see a 3" Surface mini running full Windows 8.1
And the other device?
Can I get this in an Intel flavor?
Why would it need a stand? it's small enough to hold in one hand, and that's probably where it'll be if you're taking notes
Also, I hope they don't call it the "Surface Mini" or "Surface Note". Think of something original guys
Microsurface? lol
We have a winner!
Not having a stand is a big negative for me, can't live without it now after having a Surface for awhile.
True that it is small enough to hold in one hand, but the convenience of the built in stand is so hard to give up in many situations. It isn't a deal breaker yet, we will see what else they stripped/added to it.
Autodesk has just put a nail into Atom 32bit tablets.
They only support 64bit on 2015 design suites.
Why buy windows x86 tablet if you can't run desktop apps.
Defeats the purpose
HP Elitepad 1000 runs 64bit Windows on an atom chip. Atom lives on!
The point is, my Asus is now redundant as it was bought for Autodesk apps
Well that applies only to your current tablet and one program. Future tablets will have 64bit as an option at least so your statement "Why buy windows x86 tablet if you can't run desktop apps.Defeats the purpose" is incorrect.
It applies to every 32bit tablet on the market.
The future will also be 128bit but that's not the point.
Autodesk is the largest software maker by code and therefore we are not talking about one program.
Probably the most important developer in computing today
No one should buy a tablet to run any Autodesk program. Half of your screen would be taken up with toolbars. I'm pretty certain if you can afford to upgrade your Autodesk programs to the newer versions, you can afford to buy a new tablet/laptop/desktop to meet your needs.
@gwh34t.
I agree with you that you shouldn't be running (working) Autodesk on a tablet.
The tablet functions as a viewer to complement the printed model so that at least the client can interact with the model.
Autodesk is far from the largest software maker by code. Probably not even in the top five, maybe would squeak into the top ten.
Are you seriously saying because one software maker has a requirement for 64 bit all other tablets have to be 64 bit? Is Office also made by Autodesk? Photoshop, Turbotax? Think you're on the wrong track here, mate.
Adobe isn't a motivation for Windows.
Might as well buy iPad or android
Ref: Hiswona,
We need 64 bit tablets to give us flexibility and choices.
Inform yourself. You're lacking a lot of knowledge about Windows RT/8.
Just install 2014 version on your 32bit tablet. I have AutoCAD 2012 installed on my Dell Venue 8 Pro, and it runs great, just as good as on my laptop (5 year old Lenovo Thinkpad with Core2Duo)............hell - It will probaly run better. It seems, the more features that Autodesk packs into their software, the less performance you get out of it.
My issue with the 8" atom tablets, is that none of them hit the nail. The Dell has no HDMI out, and no integrated keyboard option, and you cant plug in a usb hub and charge at the same time without being a freaking electrician.
If MS gets their $hit together on this, and make a kickstand, and a cool full size keyboard that attaches, they could have a winner on their hands. Even better option to add, would be the ability to use the tablet as wacom trackpad when connected to 2nd display.
US only??
Unlikely. The same markets as Surface is currently available for.
Hmmm I know but atleast they should target cities like London,Mumbai,Delhi, Bejing
It's pretty damn time they pick up Nokia's supply chain and Priority stores across the world to bring the Surface family. Just tired of waiting and recommending Android to my friends.
Am hoping for a surface pro 3....was gonna buy 2 but waiting for that 4k screen
same here.
I haven't seen a single source I consider reputable to run that 4k story unless they said "take this with a heap of salt."
While I'm also waiting on a SP3 to replace my SP, I would probably prefer 1440/1600p. 4k will either be too power hungry or too expensive.
Perfect!
Waiting 20 May
This smaller rt should be $199 to better compete with the nexus and kindle fire and a surface mini pro should be around 299
Let me know when your nexus or kindle fire have pen support, Office, and VaporMag construction, then we'll talk.
Personally I would prefer free, but we can't have everything we want now can we?
Let the whinnying about it being an RT device commence!
It commenced above your comment so its funny to read yours here ;)
better luck next time :)
Will it have support for annotating PDF files?
Your best options in the modern environment currently are importing into OneNote (not really PDF annotation) and DrawboardPDF which is a very well done PDF annotation app. So, yes. I doubt this will change with these new product releases.
the regular modern version of adobe reader supports annotation. I just wish you could change the pen color from black.
RT is great.
I'd rather have a Mini Pro. This thing better be extremely cost effective. Hopefully that's the later model hinted.
If stylus is in so am I. Need good note support for work.
i couldnt care less about "small tablets" but im confident if they are indeed 2 devices one will be ARM and the other x86 running an i3 or something, just like current 10" versions, RT & PRO, i hoped they would release a bigger one instead, you know.. something different that the competency doesnt have yet.. like 13-15-17"
I hope to see a device dedicated to casual users. Some of us don't use tablets for work. I use mine for reading, surfing the web, gaming, and music. I don't even need office on it. It would be nice to have, but not necessary. RT is fine for me.
Ditto, but I do need Office.
But unless its cheaper than nexus 7 its a no buy
I agree. Cost is a big factor in casual use. I have a couple Kindle Fires for the family that work great.
So if you just took a Nexus 7 and add on an active digitizer, you wouldn't expect it to cost more?
Give me an 8" with a high res display (1080p), active digitizer, WinRT. I'd pay $400 for that, personally, though I'd certainly prefer free.
You can do all that on an atom powered device. Why do you think you need RT for those tasks?
Why do you think someone needs full Windows 8 on a small tablet. RT has his advantages in case you didn't know. Perfect setup in between ios/android and full Windows 8 tablets.
I've been using 8" full Windows tablets since November last year, can't see the value in a crippled RT device.
Why crippled? Depends the use you want to give it.
For me a 8´´ device to run full featured win apps doesnot make any sense, the screen is to small to work. Can you work in an Office or a Visual Studio in a 8 inch screen?
Agree, its about individual needs. My current Surface RT does the job thank you.
Guess this rumoured device will,be the same, for some it may be ideal, for others not so much,
Considering I got my venue 64gb refurb for 260 ill pass without full windows (hearthstone) and if its more than $180 it should die already
I love hearthstone on my surface pro. This is a significant source of disappointment (though niche, for me).
Also the desktop version of OneNote is way better.
I agree. RT is perfect for a small device. I can't imagine doing any office work on 8" tablet.
Though someone rightly said, he cant even install many web plugins for things to work..
I haven't had many problems with plugins. Most flash stuff works.
RT doesnt do anything better on an 8" device than a Dell Venue 8 Pro or Asus Vivotab Note 8. But the atom powered devices are infintely more useful. This is an example of what you can do with x86 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsgQQOqpn7A, and if 8" isnt useful for x86 then that opinion should apply to RT tablets as well.
Stupid RT is very limited. For example, it doesn't have all the pen support x86 and x64 has...
Actually looks like this one will
How narrow minded are you people? Full Windows 8 can function exactly like RT. You don't need to go to desktop.
With x86, you get the additional functionality of traditional programs should you need them on the fly. Don't forget, these tablets can use peripherals like mouse and keyboard. They can also be hooked up to a monitor. In this situations, Full Windows is a much better option.
Just as narrow minded as you apparently. May be hard to believe but not everyone wants x86 on their consumption tablet, I sure don't. You have plenty of choice when it comes to x86 8" tablets, can't we have our ONLY choice?
This.
And apart from Microsoft fans people will still buy ipads over RT devices when you dont have to compromise on apps and RT has no appreciable benefit eg Office.
Of course it has. Multi user is just one of the killer features. A must have for me and my family members. Windows RT delivers.
If you do not se a value, then just do not buy one. For myself ARM based devices have several advantages over their x86 siblings.
No! Was really hoping for x86. Looks like I'll be passing on this one.
Same here! x86 tablets need more focus IMO, because of their higher functionality compared to ARM.
ARM has the potential to be just as functional. It's the good ol' app situation that's stopping it. I will say I'm slightly disappointed too. The reason I want a stylus is for apps like ArtRage and SAI, not OneNote. And those apps don't run on ARM.
Oh man !!! I had been trying to remember the name of artrage since ages !! I had used it as a kid about 6-7 years back, when I was in class 2-3, and used to love it, but had forgotten its name totally and had failed to find it on the net even !
Thanks a ton ! ;)
Me too. Needs to be x86 to get M interested. Also needs a built in kickstand.
Me too. I really don't understand the RT thing. I love my surface pro. What I don't understand is that they have been optimizing Windows 8 to work with less resources and still with ARM. Why not just full Windows and use it as you like? You can be in Metro mode all the time, or well, use the desktop. I think it should be standardized as one offering. Less confusion.
Ref: Reebs Reebs,
I agree.
Surface mini and surface mini pro
I sure hope so... Come on MS!!!!
I don't understand why they are announcing the surface mini when they will announce the surface 3 and pro 3 a couple months later....
Hmmmmm......I wonder how it will stack up against my Dell Venue Pro 8?
Not that well considering the Dell Venue Pro 8 runs full Windows, while the Mini runs RT.
the dv8p also has a crappy stylus compared to a wacom stylus(even the new stylus). the miracast experience sucks, and it can't easily be hooked up to anything except for charging. the Dell update experience is disjointed from the windows update for hardware and driver updates, unlike a surface. If this can do at least 2 of these things better, then I'm selling my dv8p and getting it.
No miracast on RT, so cross that one out.
There is Miracast Support on RT.. If there wasn't the 2520 would not have been able to utilise Miracast on the snapdragon chip.
Bull. Windows RT has miracast. Not the Surface RT but the Surface 2 has and that of cours also runs Windows RT.
I don't think I could live without full windows. I run all kinds of console emulators and MAME on the DV8 Pro using an xbox 360 controller. Also run a couple desktop based games too. It's the ultimate portable gaming device, it's crazy.
Well can you run softwares well on it or are they heavy on it?I'm thinking of purchasing it for doing programing and project work.
Of course it depends on what you are running. Probably won't have a problem running project and office type of desktop apps, but a dev compiler is asking a but much of this tiny machine, mostly due to the limited ram
Nah, Visual Studio 2010 Pro runs quite well on my aging Atom-powered netbook. But then it does more drive space than most tablets.
Well then....
That too me would make it the better option. No need for legacy desktop, just bloat.
I agree with you completely. I like the ARM devices (have lumia 2520, and have had Surface 2). I have lenovo Mix 8, which has "full Windows", and for me, that adds no value.
Agreed. Windows RT gets a bad rap because of comparisons to Windows. It is a tablet OS, however and performs quite well as one.
I have a Dell Venue 8 Pro and I honestly don't utilize apps that are not available in the Windows ap store. I threw project and visio on there but I just play on them. I mostly use One Note and consume media and browse the interwebs. So on one hand I like having "real" Windows but I don't use it in that way. For a 10 inch tablet it has to be real Windows, RT won't cut it there but on a smaller companion device. I think its fine.
If it has LTE support, phone call ability (with Bluetooth), Miracast support, and wireless charging, then it would be WAY better than the Dell. Almost the perfect device.
Wireless charging? With LTE support it would be alot more expensive too.
I wonder how hard is it to run legacy desktop app in 8 inch screen.
Negative 9 inches hard.
Full windows is great on a Surface Pro, but i'm fine with RT too. I kind of miss having my Surface RT, battery life was great. I hope this new device is everything i want! (i'm sure it will be)
I have a V8P, and if I hadn't gotten it for $99 from the Microsoft store, I would be LIVID. The screen brightness is awful. Screen resolution is not sharp, and the desktop is useless. Sadly the 32gb memory is also way TOO small for full windows. Memory card is limited in appeal.
My NEW stylus refuses to work. Thank God I still have the old one. The keyboard is barely useable and the CASE is stupid. It won't hold the keyboard, and the tablet is hard to use in the case.
The Surface Mini MUST have NFC to share with my Nokia Icon, and great backlight, plus the industrial design of the Surface 2, would be critical
I had the Dell Venue Pro 8 for a while now. I found myself use it mostly for reading and browsing the web in Modern UI. The 8" screen is just not comfortable for running serious Desktop apps. RT will be just fine for its intended purpose. I just hope the Surface Mini is lighter in weight than the Dell Venue Pro 8 which is a bit tiring to hold with single hand for a long period of time. May be a 7" one with 0.5 lb will be ideal.
That depends very much on your needs. If the apps in the store are enough for you than RT or should I say ARM may be the better choice. Windows RT on a Tegra 4 runs smoother than full Windows on many of the Atom tablets. And I really wonder how many people actually run full Windows applications on their small x86 tablets for which there are no comparable apps in the Windows store...
I guess the issue with RT is you can't run ANY app that's not in the Store. I don't think people buy 8" tablets with full Windows to run a gaggle of legacy apps. But if there is one app or utility you want to run on an RT device, you can't. Period. It's all about options. For me, that one app is Access, or more specifically Access Runtime. I have put together an application to collect data from visitors to our booth at shows. Easy to implement with W8. Near impossible, w/o Web access on an RT machine. Note that I would never consider developing on an 8" tablet. That's plain silly. Note that RT tablets are still the preferred choice for people who tend to click on every link they see. Personally, I need the flexibility of full Win8.
+++ Better build quality. Better stylus support. Longer battery life.
- ARM -ARM -ARM
I havent touched my RT since I got the Venue. Got sick of nothing working on it. Can't even load a lot of web plugins for media that require an executable.
Hopefully preliminary specs are wrong and this will have x64 Atom chip
MS said a while ago that they're still going to push ARM and RT...
It appears that they wish to bring the world to ARM to kill the desktop UI except in offices. They still think that win8 is doing very good, while most people dont like it. (I'm not one of them though even though my laptop doesnt have a touchscreen)
Ugh. Most people do like it. Just most of you that don't, have far bigger mouths.
I'm quoting most forum posts etc I've read. I know only haters have bigger mouths, but 'you' wasn't necessary, i said i like it.
So true... I.T. admin here... been on W 8 since preview days. No way I would go back. Got 15 surfaces and a few mixed non-touchscreen laptops w/ windows 8 in my environment, and all my users love it.
I'm also an IT admin. I have a Surface pro and so does my boss. I like the hardware, but they have serious issues with the OS. The newest versions (8.1) force you tou log in with a Microsoft Account. Also, in a domain environment where end users do not have admin rights, and you have UAC turned off (as most do), the Metro apps don't work. Further, the Cryptolocker virus forced many of us to deploy group policy locking down executables from a user's AppData folder, which also breaks a lot of things. If you don't care about any of the Metro stuff (which is the main selling point and the only real functional chnage from W7) then it's okay. But I find in our domain it is enough of a headache that I'm glad I've only got 2 out of 43 computers running 8/8.1.
Ummm...... You can always log in without a microsoft account, that hasnt changed and why would you allow your users to disable UAC?........
Just a few weeks ago I set up a new personal laptop for an employee. There was no way to get through initial set up without using / using a Microsoft account. The small option that was present in 8.0 to set up a local account had been removed. Now, once you get passed that, you can set up a local account, but buy then you've been forced to create an MS account. In a Windows domain environment the default domain setting turn UAC off on client machines, and most admins,me included, leave it that way so users are not constantly disrupted and annoyed with the pop up warnings. I don't allow my users to turn it off. They have no admin rights.
No, most people do NOT like windows 8.
"Most" people haven't even tried it ;)
Disagree. RT means no concerns about virus software and simpler support and use. I hated the V8P for the constant kicks to the desktop for updates and inconsistent resume times. ARM just works and the apps list builds. I never want the executables that are the source of most malware. Since converting the wife to a surface RT, zero tech support time spent on her device. Before, it was constant virus scan updates and killing garbage from gossip sites.
I have a w8.1 pro laptop. I have no malware (even though i'm a power user, bur i'k cautious), it works consistently, and seamlessly integrates the metro and desktop experience (except that i'd like windowed metro apps soon). I find w8.1 better for me. Though for tablets it might not be that good, but... I have my wp8 for my portable needs ;)
Well at least they are try to distinguish the market. RT is more of a competitor to the iPad and Android tablets. This is the prime focus for Microsoft over here.
The virus excuse is overstated. Hearbleed affected all devices inc RT. The biggest threat now is phishing and social engineering, plus its not as though you get a virus just from turning on your PC, if you browse dodgy sites you get infected if you dont and use antivirus (which is now builtin and seamless) you wont be infected. The update experience is a valid point but that applies to the Surface Pro as well so its not an RT exclusive feature. An atom powered Surface would have the same update mechanism so no advantage there.
"The virus excuse needs to stop."
You must not have relatives or friends that you do any computer work for then.
I have many running on W8 and the ones that had issues with malware and viruses in WinXP still have issues in W8. Not near to the extent that they did prior, but they still require assistance. Two of those people have a desktop with W8 and a Surface RT. I have had to provide zero support on the RT devices (which they use 80% of the time) and there always seems to be something coming up on the desktops. So no, it should not stop until it is actually taken care of.
Personally I haven't had an antivirus program on my computer for years and I also have Windows Defender disabled on my computer. Smart users will rarely get malware or viruses.
RT does have its benefits and if people would stop trying to compare it to a full Windows machine (Microsofts fault), then they would be a lot more satisfied and understand its benefits. I would never complain that the iPad can't run Final Cut Pro or compare IOS7 vs OSX, that's just silly, they both have there place.
So how have billions of people managed to run Windows PCs all these years? And antivirus is built in to Windows 8, how are they still managing to get themselves infected?
And comparing RT to Windows is an obvious thing, RT looks, feels, and works like Windows 8 but is much less capable. Comparisons are expected especially when Windows has existed for years and is an established OS. Cant come in and throw all that away and expect people not to notice.
"And antivirus is built in to Windows 8, how are they still managing to get themselves infected?"
Not sure if serious, but antivirus built in or installed on a computer is in no way a guarantee of a virus/malware free computer.
"RT looks, feels, and works like Windows 8 but is much less capable."
Fair enough, RT looks and feels like Windows 8. So you can compare it if you would like, but to me that really doesn't matter. It is all based on what a person needs to do on any given device. For you and many other techies, it is less capable and not qualified to do what you want it to do. Thus the hate you seem to exude against the RT OS. For the average person that needs to browse the web, do e-mail, watch a movie, maybe do some document editing and play some pointless games to pass the time, RT devices are more than qualified to fit that bill.
Currently I am not happy with RT units being more expensive than full Windows devices and that is where my biggest struggle is in recommending an RT device. I also believe that is a big reason for the hate against it, besides the fact that much of the hate comes from the type of people that should never buy one because of what they need to do on a tablet/computer. If a cost effective RT device comes out that is less/similar in price to a full W8 machine, it will satisfy and exceed the needs of a lot of users and provide battery life and security benefits that the x86 system will not regardless what you say. I also hope they get rid of the desktop completely on RT.
It's pretty simple really. Don't buy it if it doesn't fit your needs.
It obviously does not fit yours, which makes you think that it will fit nobody's, but I personally don't want to dillute the potential of a device for a specific market because others that are not in that particular market are screaming louder than the rest.
Would you compare iOS and OSX? No, so why compare MS's tablet OS to their full desktop OS? They both have a place and viable use cases.
You can completely lock down software from running on an x86 Windows, so the virus/malware argument is invalid.
Furthermore, OSX is a dumb OS, iOS is even dumber, so the comparison to Windows is ridiculous.
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