Surface Mini likely to be available in June; Will include pen support and ARM processor

There is Miracast Support on RT.. If there wasn't the 2520 would not have been able to utilise Miracast on the snapdragon chip.

Bull. Windows RT has miracast. Not the Surface RT but the Surface 2 has and that of cours also runs Windows RT.

I don't think I could live without full windows.  I run all kinds of console emulators and MAME on the DV8 Pro using an xbox 360 controller.  Also run a couple desktop based games too.  It's the ultimate portable gaming device, it's crazy. 

Well can you run softwares well on it or are they heavy on it?I'm thinking of purchasing it for doing programing and project work.

Of course it depends on what you are running. Probably won't have a problem running project and office type of desktop apps, but a dev compiler is asking a but much of this tiny machine, mostly due to the limited ram

Nah, Visual Studio 2010 Pro runs quite well on my aging Atom-powered netbook. But then it does more drive space than most tablets.

Well then....

That too me would make it the better option. No need for legacy desktop, just bloat.

I agree with you completely. I like the ARM devices (have lumia 2520, and have had Surface 2).  I have lenovo Mix 8, which has "full Windows", and for me, that adds no value. 

Agreed. Windows RT gets a bad rap because of comparisons to Windows. It is a tablet OS, however and performs quite well as one.

I have a Dell Venue 8 Pro and I honestly don't utilize apps that are not available in the Windows ap store. I threw project and visio on there but I just play on them. I mostly use One Note and consume media and browse the interwebs. So on one hand I like having "real" Windows but I don't use it in that way. For a 10 inch tablet it has to be real Windows, RT won't cut it there but on a smaller companion device. I think its fine.

If it has LTE support, phone call ability (with Bluetooth), Miracast support, and wireless charging, then it would be WAY better than the Dell. Almost the perfect device.

Wireless charging? With LTE support it would be alot more expensive too.

I wonder how hard is it to run legacy desktop app in 8 inch screen.

Negative 9 inches hard.

Full windows is great on a Surface Pro, but i'm fine with RT too. I kind of miss having my Surface RT, battery life was great. I hope this new device is everything i want! (i'm sure it will be)

I have a V8P, and if I hadn't gotten it for $99 from the Microsoft store, I would be LIVID.  The screen brightness is awful.  Screen resolution is not sharp, and the desktop is useless.  Sadly the 32gb memory is also way TOO small for full windows.  Memory card is limited in appeal. My NEW stylus refuses to work.  Thank God I still have the old one.  The keyboard is barely useable and the CASE is stupid.  It won't hold the keyboard, and the tablet is hard to use in the case. The Surface Mini MUST have NFC to share with my Nokia Icon, and great backlight, plus the industrial design of the Surface 2, would be critical

I had the Dell Venue Pro 8 for a while now.  I found myself use it mostly for reading and browsing the web in Modern UI.  The 8" screen is just not comfortable for running serious Desktop apps.  RT will be just fine for its intended purpose.  I just hope the Surface Mini is lighter in weight than the Dell Venue Pro 8 which is a bit tiring to hold with single hand for a long period of time.  May be a 7" one with 0.5 lb will be ideal.

That depends very much on your needs. If the apps in the store are enough for you than RT or should I say ARM may be the better choice. Windows RT on a Tegra 4 runs smoother than full Windows on many of the Atom tablets. And I really wonder how many people actually run full Windows applications on their small x86 tablets for which there are no comparable apps in the Windows store...

I guess the issue with RT is you can't run ANY app that's not in the Store. I don't think people buy 8" tablets with full Windows to run a gaggle of legacy apps. But if there is one app or utility you want to run on an RT device, you can't. Period. It's all about options. For me, that one app is Access, or more specifically Access Runtime. I have put together an application to collect data from visitors to our booth at shows. Easy to implement with W8. Near impossible, w/o Web access on an RT machine. Note that I would never consider developing on an 8" tablet. That's plain silly. Note that RT tablets are still the preferred choice for people who tend to click on every link they see. Personally, I need the flexibility of full Win8.

+++ Better build quality. Better stylus support. Longer battery life. - ARM -ARM -ARM I havent touched my RT since I got the Venue. Got sick of nothing working on it. Can't even load a lot of web plugins for media that require an executable. Hopefully preliminary specs are wrong and this will have x64 Atom chip

MS said a while ago that they're still going to push ARM and RT... It appears that they wish to bring the world to ARM to kill the desktop UI except in offices. They still think that win8 is doing very good, while most people dont like it. (I'm not one of them though even though my laptop doesnt have a touchscreen)

Ugh. Most people do like it. Just most of you that don't, have far bigger mouths.

I'm quoting most forum posts etc I've read. I know only haters have bigger mouths, but 'you' wasn't necessary, i said i like it.

So true... I.T. admin here... been on W 8 since preview days.  No way I would go back.  Got 15 surfaces and a few mixed non-touchscreen laptops w/ windows 8 in my environment, and all my users love it.  

I'm also an IT admin.  I have a Surface pro and so does my boss.  I like the hardware, but they have serious issues with the OS.  The newest versions (8.1) force you tou log in with a Microsoft Account.  Also, in a domain environment where end users do not have admin rights, and you have UAC turned off (as most do), the Metro apps don't work.  Further, the Cryptolocker virus forced many of us to deploy group policy locking down executables from a user's AppData folder, which also breaks a lot of things.  If you don't care about any of the Metro stuff (which is the main selling point and the only real functional chnage from W7) then it's okay.  But I find in our domain it is enough of a headache that I'm glad I've only got 2 out of 43 computers running 8/8.1.

Ummm...... You can always log in without a microsoft account, that hasnt changed and why would you allow your users to disable UAC?........

Just a few weeks ago I set up a new personal laptop for an employee. There was no way to get through initial set up without using / using a Microsoft account. The small option that was present in 8.0 to set up a local account had been removed. Now, once you get passed that, you can set up a local account, but buy then you've been forced to create an MS account. In a Windows domain environment the default domain setting turn UAC off on client machines, and most admins,me included, leave it that way so users are not constantly disrupted and annoyed with the pop up warnings. I don't allow my users to turn it off. They have no admin rights.

No, most people do NOT like windows 8. 

"Most" people haven't even tried it ;)

Disagree. RT means no concerns about virus software and simpler support and use. I hated the V8P for the constant kicks to the desktop for updates and inconsistent resume times. ARM just works and the apps list builds. I never want the executables that are the source of most malware. Since converting the wife to a surface RT, zero tech support time spent on her device. Before, it was constant virus scan updates and killing garbage from gossip sites.

I have a w8.1 pro laptop. I have no malware (even though i'm a power user, bur i'k cautious), it works consistently, and seamlessly integrates the metro and desktop experience (except that i'd like windowed metro apps soon). I find w8.1 better for me. Though for tablets it might not be that good, but... I have my wp8 for my portable needs ;)

Well at least they are try to distinguish the market. RT is more of a competitor to the iPad and Android tablets. This is the prime focus for Microsoft over here.

The virus excuse is overstated. Hearbleed affected all devices inc RT. The biggest threat now is phishing and social engineering, plus its not as though you get a virus just from turning on your PC, if you browse dodgy sites you get infected if you dont and use antivirus (which is now builtin and seamless) you wont be infected. The update experience is a valid point but that applies to the Surface Pro as well so its not an RT exclusive feature. An atom powered Surface would have the same update mechanism so no advantage there.

"The virus excuse needs to stop." You must not have relatives or friends that you do any computer work for then. I have many running on W8 and the ones that had issues with malware and viruses in WinXP still have issues in W8. Not near to the extent that they did prior, but they still require assistance. Two of those people have a desktop with W8 and a Surface RT. I have had to provide zero support on the RT devices (which they use 80% of the time) and there always seems to be something coming up on the desktops. So no, it should not stop until it is actually taken care of. Personally I haven't had an antivirus program on my computer for years and I also have Windows Defender disabled on my computer. Smart users will rarely get malware or viruses. RT does have its benefits and if people would stop trying to compare it to a full Windows machine (Microsofts fault), then they would be a lot more satisfied and understand its benefits. I would never complain that the iPad can't run Final Cut Pro or compare IOS7 vs OSX, that's just silly, they both have there place.

So how have billions of people managed to run Windows PCs all these years? And antivirus is built in to Windows 8, how are they still managing to get themselves infected?
And comparing RT to Windows is an obvious thing, RT looks, feels, and works like Windows 8 but is much less capable. Comparisons are expected especially when Windows has existed for years and is an established OS. Cant come in and throw all that away and expect people not to notice.

"And antivirus is built in to Windows 8, how are they still managing to get themselves infected?" Not sure if serious, but antivirus built in or installed on a computer is in no way a guarantee of a virus/malware free computer. "RT looks, feels, and works like Windows 8 but is much less capable." Fair enough, RT looks and feels like Windows 8. So you can compare it if you would like, but to me that really doesn't matter. It is all based on what a person needs to do on any given device. For you and many other techies, it is less capable and not qualified to do what you want it to do. Thus the hate you seem to exude against the RT OS. For the average person that needs to browse the web, do e-mail, watch a movie, maybe do some document editing and play some pointless games to pass the time, RT devices are more than qualified to fit that bill. Currently I am not happy with RT units being more expensive than full Windows devices and that is where my biggest struggle is in recommending an RT device. I also believe that is a big reason for the hate against it, besides the fact that much of the hate comes from the type of people that should never buy one because of what they need to do on a tablet/computer. If a cost effective RT device comes out that is less/similar in price to a full W8 machine, it will satisfy and exceed the needs of a lot of users and provide battery life and security benefits that the x86 system will not regardless what you say. I also hope they get rid of the desktop completely on RT.   It's pretty simple really. Don't buy it if it doesn't fit your needs. It obviously does not fit yours, which makes you think that it will fit nobody's, but I personally don't want to dillute the potential of a device for a specific market because others that are not in that particular market are screaming louder than the rest.

Would you compare iOS and OSX? No, so why compare MS's tablet OS to their full desktop OS? They both have a place and viable use cases.

You can completely lock down software from running on an x86 Windows, so the virus/malware argument is invalid. Furthermore, OSX is a dumb OS, iOS is even dumber, so the comparison to Windows is ridiculous.

Heartbleed did not affect RT because it doesn't run OpenSSL and it can't be installed. However it could affect Windows 8 x86 if someone installed OpenSSL on it.

Please ignore the "submit" button on any future forum posts. Heartbleed is a server side issue, not a client side one. You do not install OpenSSL on your desktop or tablet. I presume you're not being so painfully ignorant as to imply that one would run a web server on an RT machine. If so, double up on my first statement. Advice - follow it: http://www.snopes.com/humor/business/wordperfect.asp  

Exactly, I work in IT and I can't remember the last time I had a virus on my home computer but it doesn't change the fact that it is just another thing to manage especially if someone else uses it. The other advantage to the Surface RT is backups, in that you don't need it, just make sure you save all your documents on a network drive or the cloud and you're set. If you have to reset your device you get it back exatcly where you left it in tact. In full Windows 8 you then have to deal with image restores because you want your applications and their settings back, it's just a waste of time. I already work in IT, I don't need to continue that after work as well. The only thing I want from that Mini is Modern Office so I don't have to deal with legacy desktop anymore.

The battery life on my DVP is god like though. I haven't had one bad experience in terms of battery. I do want a better USB support though. Full USB3.0>dual MicroUSB 3.0>dual MicroUSB 2.0. A single MicroUSB port will not make me a happy camper.

Don't really care, my DV8P serves a different purpose. I could go for an 8" in 4:3 AR to do nothing but note taking, safe surfing, read ebooks, and pay bills on. If I get rid of anything it'll be my Asus Note 8.

My problem with the Dell is the memory. I installed a memory card for music, pics, and videos. Since apps can't install on memory card and Windows takes up so much room I can't hardly use it much.

I agree on that front, but I don't think a surface mini will assuage that complaint unfortunately.

Hey quick question if you have details. Microsoft said Update 1 to Windows 8.1 had some under the hood memory improvements to cut back on memory taken by the OS files. How much of that improvement did you notice, if any?

Surface mini and surface mini pro

I sure hope so... Come on MS!!!!

I don't understand why they are announcing the surface mini when they will announce the surface 3 and pro 3 a couple months later....

No! Was really hoping for x86. Looks like I'll be passing on this one.

Same here! x86 tablets need more focus IMO, because of their higher functionality compared to ARM.

ARM has the potential to be just as functional. It's the good ol' app situation that's stopping it. I will say I'm slightly disappointed too. The reason I want a stylus is for apps like ArtRage and SAI, not OneNote. And those apps don't run on ARM.

Oh man !!! I had been trying to remember the name of artrage since ages !! I had used it as a kid about 6-7 years back, when I was in class 2-3, and used to love it, but had forgotten its name totally and had failed to find it on the net even !
Thanks a ton ! ;)

Me too. Needs to be x86 to get M interested. Also needs a built in kickstand.

Me too. I really don't understand the RT thing.  I love my surface pro.  What I don't understand is that they have been optimizing Windows 8 to work with less resources and still with ARM.  Why not just full Windows and use it as you like? You can be in Metro mode all the time, or well, use the desktop.  I think it should be standardized as one offering. Less confusion.

Ref: Reebs Reebs,
I agree.

I've been using 8" full Windows tablets since November last year, can't see the value in a crippled RT device.

Why crippled? Depends the use you want to give it. For me a 8´´ device to run full featured win apps doesnot make any sense, the screen is to small to work. Can you work in an Office or a Visual Studio in a 8 inch screen?

Agree, its about individual needs. My current Surface RT does the job thank you. Guess this rumoured device will,be the same, for some it may be ideal, for others not so much,

Considering I got my venue 64gb refurb for 260 ill pass without full windows (hearthstone) and if its more than $180 it should die already

I love hearthstone on my surface pro. This is a significant source of disappointment (though niche, for me). Also the desktop version of OneNote is way better.

I agree. RT is perfect for a small device. I can't imagine doing any office work on 8" tablet.

Though someone rightly said, he cant even install many web plugins for things to work..

I haven't had many problems with plugins. Most flash stuff works.

RT doesnt do anything better on an 8" device than a Dell Venue 8 Pro or Asus Vivotab Note 8. But the atom powered devices are infintely more useful. This is an example of what you can do with x86 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsgQQOqpn7A, and if 8" isnt useful for x86 then that opinion should apply to RT tablets as well.

Stupid RT is very limited. For example, it doesn't have all the pen support x86 and x64 has...

Actually looks like this one will

How narrow minded are you people? Full Windows 8 can function exactly like RT. You don't need to go to desktop. With x86, you get the additional functionality of traditional programs should you need them on the fly. Don't forget, these tablets can use peripherals like mouse and keyboard. They can also be hooked up to a monitor. In this situations, Full Windows is a much better option.

Just as narrow minded as you apparently. May be hard to believe but not everyone wants x86 on their consumption tablet, I sure don't. You have plenty of choice when it comes to x86 8" tablets, can't we have our ONLY choice?

This.

And apart from Microsoft fans people will still buy ipads over RT devices when you dont  have to compromise on apps and RT has no appreciable benefit eg Office.

Of course it has. Multi user is just one of the killer features. A must have for me and my family members. Windows RT delivers.

If you do not se a value, then just do not buy one. For myself ARM based devices have several advantages over their x86 siblings.

I hope to see a device dedicated to casual users. Some of us don't use tablets for work. I use mine for reading, surfing the web, gaming, and music. I don't even need office on it. It would be nice to have, but not necessary. RT is fine for me.

Ditto, but I do need Office.

But unless its cheaper than nexus 7 its a no buy

I agree. Cost is a big factor in casual use. I have a couple Kindle Fires for the family that work great.

So if you just took a Nexus 7 and add on an active digitizer, you wouldn't expect it to cost more?   Give me an 8" with a high res display (1080p), active digitizer, WinRT.  I'd pay $400 for that, personally, though I'd certainly prefer free.

You can do all that on an atom powered device. Why do you think you need RT for those tasks?

Why do you think someone needs full Windows 8 on a small tablet. RT has his advantages in case you didn't know. Perfect setup in between ios/android and full Windows 8 tablets.

i couldnt care less about "small tablets" but im confident if they are indeed 2 devices one will be ARM and the other x86 running an i3 or something, just like current 10" versions, RT & PRO, i hoped they would release a bigger one instead, you know.. something different that the competency doesnt have yet.. like 13-15-17"

If stylus is in so am I. Need good note support for work.

I'd rather have a Mini Pro. This thing better be extremely cost effective. Hopefully that's the later model hinted.

RT is great.

Will it have support for annotating PDF files?

Your best options in the modern environment currently are importing into OneNote (not really PDF annotation) and DrawboardPDF which is a very well done PDF annotation app. So, yes. I doubt this will change with these new product releases.

the regular modern version of adobe reader supports annotation. I just wish you could change the pen color from black.  

Let the whinnying about it being an RT device commence!

It commenced above your comment so its funny to read yours here ;)
better luck next time :)

This smaller rt should be $199 to better compete with the nexus and kindle fire and a surface mini pro should be around 299

Let me know when your nexus or kindle fire have pen support, Office, and VaporMag construction, then we'll talk. Personally I would prefer free, but we can't have everything we want now can we?

Waiting 20 May

Perfect!

Am hoping for a surface pro 3....was gonna buy 2 but waiting for that 4k screen

same here.

I haven't seen a single source I consider reputable to run that 4k story unless they said "take this with a heap of salt." While I'm also waiting on a SP3 to replace my SP, I would probably prefer 1440/1600p. 4k will either be too power hungry or too expensive.

US only??

Unlikely. The same markets as Surface is currently available for.

Hmmm I know but atleast they should target cities like London,Mumbai,Delhi, Bejing

It's pretty damn time they pick up Nokia's supply chain and Priority stores across the world to bring the Surface family. Just tired of waiting and recommending Android to my friends.

Autodesk has just put a nail into Atom 32bit tablets.
They only support 64bit on 2015 design suites.
Why buy windows x86 tablet if you can't run desktop apps.
Defeats the purpose

HP Elitepad 1000 runs 64bit Windows on an atom chip. Atom lives on!

The point is, my Asus is now redundant as it was bought for Autodesk apps

Well that applies only to your current tablet and one program. Future tablets will have 64bit as an option at least so your statement "Why buy windows x86 tablet if you can't run desktop apps.Defeats the purpose" is incorrect.

It applies to every 32bit tablet on the market.
The future will also be 128bit but that's not the point.
Autodesk is the largest software maker by code and therefore we are not talking about one program.
Probably the most important developer in computing today

No one should buy a tablet to run any Autodesk program.  Half of your screen would be taken up with toolbars.  I'm pretty certain if you can afford to upgrade your Autodesk programs to the newer versions, you can afford to buy a new tablet/laptop/desktop to meet your needs.

@gwh34t.
I agree with you that you shouldn't be running (working) Autodesk on a tablet.
The tablet functions as a viewer to complement the printed model so that at least the client can interact with the model.

Autodesk is far from the largest software maker by code.  Probably not even in the top five, maybe would squeak into the top ten.
 

Are you seriously saying because one software maker has a requirement for 64 bit all other tablets have to be 64 bit? Is Office also made by Autodesk? Photoshop, Turbotax? Think you're on the wrong track here, mate.

Adobe isn't a motivation for Windows.
Might as well buy iPad or android

Ref: Hiswona,
We need 64 bit tablets to give us flexibility and choices.

Inform yourself. You're lacking a lot of knowledge about Windows RT/8.

Just install 2014 version on your 32bit tablet.  I have AutoCAD 2012 installed on my Dell Venue 8 Pro, and it runs great, just as good as on my laptop (5 year old Lenovo Thinkpad with Core2Duo)............hell - It will probaly run better.  It seems, the more features that Autodesk packs into their software, the less performance you get out of it. My issue with the 8" atom tablets, is that none of them hit the nail.  The Dell has no HDMI out, and no integrated keyboard option, and you cant plug in a usb hub and charge at the same time without being a freaking electrician. If MS gets their $hit together on this, and make a kickstand, and a cool full size keyboard that attaches, they could have a winner on their hands.  Even better option to add, would be the ability to use the tablet as wacom trackpad when connected to 2nd display.

Why would it need a stand? it's small enough to hold in one hand, and that's probably where it'll be if you're taking notes
Also, I hope they don't call it the "Surface Mini" or "Surface Note". Think of something original guys

Microsurface? lol

We have a winner!

Not having a stand is a big negative for me, can't live without it now after having a Surface for awhile. True that it is small enough to hold in one hand, but the convenience of the built in stand is so hard to give up in many situations. It isn't a deal breaker yet, we will see what else they stripped/added to it.

Can I get this in an Intel flavor?

And the other device?

Hmmm, I'd like to see a 3" Surface mini running full Windows 8.1

I wonder what real benefits of using RTinstead of real windows 8 are? I mean, Surface 2 (32GB) costs around 450€ here in Finland while Acer iconia W4 costs around 300€ and it has a real windows 8.1 experience. Battery life with Iconia was around 8 hours compared to Surfaces' over 10h so that's one benefit but clearly not enough to compare pros of full Windows 8 with that price difference. 

I think it's just to pressure Intel, but I have no basis for this other than a guess.

Windows RT is real Windows too. Just no x86 apps that hardly anybody uses anyway on a small tablet. A device is a lot more then just price and x86 compatibility.

Has anyone heard whether the new 64bit ARM technology and whether MS is going to be maybe looking to use that? and if they are, will that mean winrt becomes more similar to the intel based windows? I'm not a OS designer, nor am I a processor designer, so i don't really know much about this...

It's going to depend on the price point. If MS wants to lure consumers away from Android tablets, they are going to have to target a competitive price point. Around $150-$200.

F*ck Android, it's a mass of plastic sh*t. And I do mean sh*t. I'll take Vapor Mg Mini and pay $400 for it.

How about the Surface ME?
I Digress...

I'm good with it being RT. I hope it doesn't have the desktop and comes with a beta version of metro office. Oh, and a nice silo to store the pen.

Agree. I actually prefer RT for a small tablet.

I was thinking the same thing. Does Metro Office include Metro Outlook? Posted via the WPC App for Android!

I also like to have support for 128gb and higher sdcard. Posted via the WPC App for Android!

If this this going to be RT and priced above 300, it'll be a DOA for certain. While RT has potential, it really does not have that much value at the moment, and since other OEMs are offering full windows small tablets in the 200~400 dollar range, it gives people even less reason to purchase it with RT.

It has. Even when you cannot see it. I definitely prefer RT over 8 for small tablets. Only no x86 applications, but less prone to errors because of x86 applications, less prone to viruses, great battery life and still multi user, still IE with flash etc etc. Win win to me.

I lined up for the original Surface RT the night it came out, but now it just sort of sits there in the corner. In terms of power usage, my laptop has Windows 8.1 Pro and Office, bigger screen and better specs; in terms of mobile usage, my phone(L920, also got it the first week it was out) is easier to carry around, with more apps, and much better camera. I also bought a Nexus 7 last summer (also sits in the corner, though used slightly more than Surface RT).  The only time I used RT this year was when I was on a plane and wanted to watch a movie. Which, other than being able to store movies on sd card, isn't really better than iPad; and is inferior to Android. And if my trip was any longer, I would have brought my actual laptop to begin with, so I wouldnt need RT.  Windows Phone 8.1 has a much more established ecosystem than RT imo, more apps and a better touch interface overall, so if I want a mobile tablet that's not full Windows, I'd much rather it run WP8.1.   

Not me. Multiuser, snapped apps, flash on websites, full USB port (usb stick and Xbox controller a.o.) kickstand and I can go on. ios and android are obviously inferior ;).

I think I've purchased my last Surface anything for now. I have two of them and I feel like I'm riding a VistaCycle. I can't afford it.

More apps?? That would be nice. Writing apps and art apps I'd suggest, considering the big thing about the Surface mini will be the stylus.

A surface mini rt with a pen and pricing between $179 and $199 would be deadly to the Galaxy Tab 7.0. It's all about price. If the mini rt comes in at $249, forget it.

Agreed. They need to make it super cheap, but also good quality. Its the only way to compete with Samsung & Apple

In other words, they should make it at a loss?

They're selling the Surface range at a loss anyway, so no biggy. Need to get ppl to buy into it, to get the