Trekstor WinPhone 5.0 is a well built mid-range smartphone with Windows 10 Mobile

Are you still interested in new Windows phones? If so, Trekstor is now crowdfunding the WinPhone 5.0 for release next year. This is our pre-release review.

If there's one thing Windows 10 Mobile hasn't ever really had, it's good, premium mid-range hardware. More often than not, you'd only ever find Windows 10 Mobile on either extremely low-end devices, or high-end flagship smartphones. There hasn't ever been a comfortable middle ground, and that's a real shame. For a lot of people, mid-range smartphones are more than enough, usually being cheap while not sacrificing much in performance.

The lack of mid-range Windows 10 Mobile hardware may soon change, however, as German manufacturer Trekstor is hoping to release its own mid-range Windows phone early next year. The WinPhone 5.0 is a €249 Windows 10 Mobile handset that's smack-bang in the mid-range tier, packing a run-of-the-mill Snapdragon 617 along with 3GB RAM. This is a device that's as mid-range as you can get, that to me that's incredibly exciting.

Unfortunately, the availability of the WinPhone 5.0 LTE is going to depend heavily on you as this device is a crowdfunded project. If it doesn't reach its goal of €500,000 before the end of this week, the device will not be funded and as such; won't go on sale. We've been using a pre-release model of this device over the last week, and wanted to give our early impressions before you decide to put your hard-earned cash down for one.

See WinPhone 5.0 at Indiegogo

WinPhone 5.0 specifications

Swipe to scroll horizontally
Display5.0-inch 1280x720 IPS Gorilla Glass 3 Display
ProcessorQualcomm Snapdragon 617
Memory3GB RAM
Internal Storage32GB
Camera13MP rear-facing camera
5MP front-facing camera
Ports3.5mm headphone jack
MicroUSB port
Dimensions71.6 x7.6 x 142.4 mm

WinPhone 5.0 design

I really like the design and build quality of this phone. It's your typical glass sandwich, with an aluminum frame around the sides keeping everything together. I wouldn't say this phone pushes any boundaries when it comes to appearance, but it certainly isn't a bad looking phone. In fact, it looks and feels a lot like the iPhone 4, which is a compliment amongst itself. I was a huge fan of the iPhone 4's design back in 2010, and I'm still a huge fan now.

This is a phone that will cost just €249, so this design is more than fine for what you're paying for. It looks and feels more premium than the Lumia 550, 650 or 950 series, thanks to the glass and aluminum combination that so many people love. I appreciate these materials over plastic, which so many mid-range phones often go for to save on cost. Now, since it is glass, it does pick up fingerprints fairly easy. It's not as slippery as other glass-phones, however.

It looks and feels a lot like an iPhone 4, which is a compliment amongst itself.

On the back, we find a couple of logos, along with the camera module in the top left that sits flush with the glass. So many phones these days often have a camera module that protrudes slightly, which I loathe. So I'm delighted with the all-smooth back on this device. I will say there does appear to be an abnormal amount of logos and marking on the back, however. Very noticeable FCC markings, and writing along the bottom which would look better if they were better hidden.

Moving around to the sides, we're rocking an all-metal frame which feels and looks great. It's silver and cold to the touch, which I'm a huge fan of. It also has clicky buttons, but the buttons themselves are a little loose sitting in the frame. What I mean by this is if I shake the device, you can hear the metal buttons bumping against the metal frame. Keep in mind we are using a pre-release model, and even so, it doesn't affect usage in any way. The buttons still feel great to press down on, which is all I care about.

On the front, we're rocking a 5-inch 720p IPS LCD, which is fine. It's nothing spectacular by any means, and since it's not OLED, blacks aren't true blacks and colors don't pop as much. It's not a bad display, however, and still looks crisp enough thanks to its small screen size. The biggest problem I have with the front of this device is the screen-to-body ratio, which is just absurd. It has a huge chin and forehead, which are wasted space. There's so much room, Trekstor could've put capacitive buttons below the display, but they didn't. It's just an empty space, used for absolutely nothing.

I'm not asking for an 18:9 display, since I don't think Windows 10 Mobile even supports that aspect ratio, but at least minimize the bottom and top bezels a bit. It makes this phone feel way bigger than it actually is, which is never good. It's about the same size as my Lumia 950, but equipped with a smaller display.

In addition to the poor use of space, the touch-screen itself will sometimes miss taps. It doesn't happen all the time, but sometimes the sensitivity of the touch-sensor will drop and will cause me to have to press down harder on a button or when I'm typing something on the keyboard for the touch sensor to pick it up. Again, this could just be due to this device being pre-release, but it must be noted.

WinPhone 5.0 Windows 10 Mobile

There's not much to say about Windows 10 Mobile in 2017. It exists, but it isn't exactly doing anything. Microsoft has already confirmed it is no longer focused on building new features or functions for Windows 10 Mobile, and will only continue supporting the platform with bug fixes and security updates. This means there will be no more big features or innovations coming to Windows phone. What we've already got is all we're going to get.

This means that over time, Windows 10 Mobile will be left behind. As Windows 10 on PC continues development, Windows 10 Mobile will remain on an older release, and as such will eventually begin missing out on new apps and existing app updates. Microsoft will continue to support native apps, but there's no guarantee any new features or designs will make their way to Windows 10 Mobile.

Microsoft has abandoned this platform, and that's a real shame.

Unfortunately, Windows 10 Mobile is one of this phone's biggest let downs, but that's not Trekstor's fault. Microsoft has abandoned this platform, and that's a real shame. However, if you're more than fine with Windows 10 Mobile today, and don't mind the fact that Microsoft won't be releasing any new features or big updates, then Microsoft's lack of focus on here should be a non-issue for you.

There is also no double-tap to wake option, and there isn't even an "extras" area in Settings for additional options. There's no Glance screen and no real hardware specific customization. The double-tap to wake thing is not of much concern to me, and a lack of Glance is obvious considering Glance is exclusive to Lumia devices. Trekstor could release a firmware update down the line with support for double-tap to wake, however, so not all is lost.

Outside of those issues, the software on the WinPhone 5.0 LTE is relatively stock. In fact, it's the most stock version of Windows 10 Mobile I've ever seen, with no 3rd party apps installed by default. That was a nice surprise, and one I hope remains if the device ever does ship publicly.

The Start screen is easily still the best home screen experience on any smartphone; it's just so customizable and good looking. I also really love the Notification Center on Windows 10 Mobile. To me, it's better than the notification center experiences on Android and iOS, which says a lot. And that keyboard. Hands down, the Windows 10 Mobile keyboard is still the best in the business.

WinPhone 5.0 performance and battery life

In my time using the WinPhone 5.0 LTE, I've had no real issues when it comes to performance. The Snapdragon 617 is a very capable processor, and as such handles Windows 10 Mobile with ease. App load times are fast, animations are smooth, and everything performs without much of a hitch. The addition of 3GB of RAM helps when it comes to multitasking and keeping apps in memory too, which means apps resume from sleep quickly. I'm glad Trekstor opted for 3GB over 2GB or 1GB like you find on most other Windows phones, and the difference is really apparent.

The Snapdragon 617 also supports Continuum too, which means you can wirelessly project your phone up to a TV or monitor, connected a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and use your phone like a PC. Of course, Continuum isn't as fully fledged as a real desktop experience, but it's still handy for when you need to edit a Word document or Excel spreadsheet on the go. The experience performed well. While not as fast as a Snapdragon 810 or 820, there wasn't any real performance issues that I encountered.

Gaming is a bit of a different story. Some games would operate just fine, but others would see noticeable framerate drops. I wouldn't buy this phone if you're planning to play any heavy mobile games, which is fine because this phone is aimed at businesses and as such isn't equipped for big, demanding games anyway.

Battery life is fine. It's nothing spectacular for 2017, getting me through a full day with a relatively average amount of use throughout; checking Twitter, Instagram, GroupMe, Reddit, and listening to a bit of music. I've used phones with better battery life, but as long as you're home in time for bed every day, you should be just fine.

The worst part about the battery is the fact that it doesn't support any form of quick-charge, meaning it takes hours to charge from 0% to 100%. If you forget to charge your phone before you head to bed, you're going to be in a spot of bother the next day. I'd go so far to say quick-charge is a necessity for all phones in 2017, and unfortunately, the WinPhone 5.0 LTE doesn't have it. Also, it uses MicroUSB, gross.

WinPhone 5.0 camera and sound quality

I'll be brief; don't buy this phone for its 13MP camera. It's not good. In fact, it's easily the worst thing about this phone. The camera itself is pretty slow, and low-light photographs are nothing but offensive to the eyes. Photos in well-lit scenarios are passable, but they're definitely not great. The front-facing camera is also rubbish. The camera can only do 720p video at 30fps, and there's no optical image stabilization to keep your video nice and steady either.

The down-firing single speaker is nothing to be excited about either. It's tinny, and sounds bad when the volume is turned up. You'll want to use a pair of headphones with this device, which is lucky because it does include a 3.5mm headphone jack. Overall, the sound and camera quality on this phone isn't great. If the camera on a smartphone an important feature to you, I'd look elsewhere.

WinPhone 5.0 final thoughts

I really like the WinPhone 5.0 LTE. I'm not a huge fan of smartphone photography anyway, so the terrible camera is a non-issue to me. I like this phones build quality and design, and the Snapdragon 617 along with 3GB of RAM is also an excellent addition to a phone that costs just €249. Unfortunately, since this is running Windows 10 Mobile, I can't recommend this phone to any normal consumer.

However, that doesn't mean I can't recommend this phone at all. I absolutely recommend this phone to Windows phone users who are still using a device with a Snapdragon 2xx and aren't planning to switch to a rival platform. If you must remain on Windows 10 Mobile and aren't bothered much about the camera, the WinPhone 5.0 LTE is probably the best new Windows phone you can go for without breaking the bank.

A good mid-range phone for those who have decided to remain on Windows 10 Mobile.

The only people who I expect will want this phone is business users with specific needs, and Windows phone enthusiasts who won't let Windows 10 Mobile go. If you fit into any of these groups, then I recommend you give the WinPhone 5.0 LTE a shot. For the price, you're getting a phone that feels great in hand with good performance. The camera still sucks though.

As a reminder, the WinPhone 5.0 will only go on sale if it reaches its crowdfund goal of €500,000. So if you do want to grab one of these, you better get your order in before December 15.

See WinPhone 5.0 at Indiegogo


  • Premium build quality.
  • Good amount of RAM.
  • Great performance.


  • Terrible camera.
  • No quick-charge.
  • Abandoned platform.
Zac Bowden
Senior Editor

Zac Bowden is a Senior Editor at Windows Central. Bringing you exclusive coverage into the world of Windows on PCs, tablets, phones, and more. Also an avid collector of rare Microsoft prototype devices! Keep in touch on Twitter: @zacbowden.

  • I don't understand how it can be profitable to release a phone like this after the OS has been put out to pasture
  • I don't understand either, I'm staring to think that maybe there's something to it that we don't know, yet. Why these companies aren't giving up?...
  • That's quite easy to understand actually. The phone was for the B2B sector, but since the company how was interested didn't want it anymore the phone wasn't produced. At IFA the phone cought some attention so Trekstor thought "why not make a kickstarter compaign". If they reach their goal they will produce it, if not they won't. So there is no risk at all for the company.
  • One of the problems with it is they said Kickstarter and then released the campaign on Indigogo. 1) They state one place then put it on another. 2) Indigogo has proven to be a much riskier choice for people than Kickstarter (not that either gaurantees it will get produced)
  • One explanation could be that W10 mobile OS is being sold to a company that will develop it further...
  • No.
  • I try to not sound rude, but that would be a very absurd idea. If that becomes true, then Microsoft has lost it's way.
  • netmann was obviously speaking tongue-in-cheek! :) Taking off from the NOKIA Buy-Sell drama enacted by MS!
  • Sell to me for a cheap price.  I'll take it and run with it! ;-)
  • You can't sell Windows Mobile without selling Windows. You can't sell iOS without selling OSX, you can't sell OS X without selling BSD. Derivative works: you give away the code of one and you are giving away the code of the others as they all heavily borrow from each other.
  • Most like they were in the planning stages which depending on if your starting from scratch can take a while and in the mean time Microsoft shutdown WM. I do recall though that Microsoft had many companies in the WM bandwagon a few years ago. I think the execs at Microsoft was and is close minded to Mobile to the point of leaving  major customers like HP a global company and New York Police one of the largest if not the largest in this country without a mobile platform compatible that has compatible with their other platforms. If Balmer was still there we'd have a WP market right now which is why I think he was forced out.
  • The answer is crowd funding. The company is passing the risk on to the crowd instead of investing like a normal comapny would do.
  • it's being Crowdfunded so my not even come out
  • Paul Thurrott was very quick to say the device is not a premium mid-range phone. I just found it all humorous.
  • Paul also seems to think this device is made of plastic. It is not.
  • It is mid-range for 2015. In 2018 it is low end for sure. They need to price this around €99.
  • Why don't you go there and troll as a typical lagdroid fanboy or just go hang out with your friends on lagdroid central.
  • He wants it priced at $99 so he can afford it on his hotdog stand check.
  • Wow a Windows phone review haven't seen this in a while over here lol
  • That's because there are no new Windows phones to review.
  • And the likelihood of this one ever making it into production are slim. Another prototype for Zac's drawer of forgotten things.
  • Another exhibit for the Dr Bowden Museum of Microsoft Curios
  • At least he's not reviewing this one 8 years later. =P
  • How about Freetel Katana?
  • I would gladly buy any WM10 capable device featuring Continuum and Dual SIM support. What makes this phone attractive is its lower resolution. I use my phone in wireless Continuum a lot, however the Lumia 950 DS fails to deliver the performance I'd expect in wireless, due to its superb resolution. (way unnecessary imho, and has trouble delivering on its own display as well in some cases) I'd love to see how a mid-range phone performs in wireless Continuum with much lower resolution, such as Trekstor's 720p. And the reason why I would still change for any WM10 device is that it is still in support, still does what I need, I still love it more than any other alternative OS on mobile platform, and even if the Courier device would be released, it will take more time to become a good-enough replacement. I'd be happy to join that once it's done with all the public production testing phase.
  • 6 days to go and they are only at almost 50 grand...  I don't see how they will raise 450,000 in 6 days... especially since Microsoft killed all momentum on WM10. It's a crying shame that Microsoft is not doing more with their own UWP platform as it just doesn't impacts Windows 10 Mobile but it also impacts Windows 10 on ARM devices as they are shipping with Windows 10s so only store apps (although they come with a free upgrade to W10 pro - as of date it's the novago and envy x2 that have been announced - these are premium devices over 500 bucks or so).  Microsoft could easily update the all their apps with UWP across the board, come Spring 2018 we'll see if Microsoft continues to be short sighted by solely focusing on ios and android. If that is the case, very tough questions will need to be asked of management.
  • The way I see it, UWP or Sets + PWA.
  • Fair enough but UWP + Sets -> PWA makes more sense :). The failing in either scenario is that Microsoft is not really focused on their own UWP platform....
  • "Unfortunately, Windows 10 Mobile is one of this phone's biggest let downs, but that's not Trekstor's fault. Microsoft has abandoned this platform, and that's a real shame." Can we please stop saying "Microsoft"? Failure has two legs and a fugly face (hint: S.N.)
  • Satya is 'responsible'for Microsoft dropping w10M?
  • As the current CEO, therefore in simplest sense - Yes. The buck stops with the CEO, just like people blamed Ballmer for past failings. Satya Nadella will also be blamed for failings. I won't extrapolate any further, I have already typed to much about the matter. Never the less Spring 2018, that's when novago and envy x2 WoA devices are supposed to ship. Microsoft will either have very tough questions to answer or they will be lauded for the steps they took.
  • Surely the latter - lauded for the patient steps they took, despite being flamed everywhere for dropping the Lumia Phones! :) I'm talking about after the next W10 Mobile is released from the MS Stable! :P
  • Hate Windows 10 phone. Love Android Phone.
  • Good for you! 
  • Nice bit of editing there ;-)
  • I can't really say I love W10 Mobile... W10M never went anywhere...
    Now, I did absolutely love the days of terrific Lumia hardware, like my 920, and 1520. And, I did love the WP 7.0-8.1 days where every passing week the platform was getting better, and better. Sad that momentum couldn't have kept up, because the platform would've been that much better in December 2017.
  • It's an acquired taste : ).  
  • 10? Yes... Although, if it originally released in it's current state things would've been way better.. Might even still be around, for the most part.
  • Trekstor makes great products, but too late to the party. My favorite Mp3 player ever (Rio Karma) was absorbed into Trekstor which then released the Vibez. However, by then, competitors overtook the market and there was no point in the Vibez.
  • Yeah, like 3 years late.....
  • What makes this device different at €209 ($250) while much higher specs phone - Alcatel Idol not being sold at $170?
  • To start, it is a smaller phone. Trying the Idol has been a nonstarter for me because it's so big. I hate big phones. Knowing that this is around the size of the Lumia 950, I'm curious.
  • Nice.After so many months i see review of windows phone 😍
  • Snapdragons 617 and 3gb ram not a mid-range anymore.
  • In WM10 world I guess.
  • yes, it is. 
  • The idea of this phone is interesting. If I was to buy it, I'll probably never use the cameras lol. Hearing about the power of this phone, I might be interested in giving it a try.
  • The power of a mid-range processor from 2015?
  • It has enough power to run Continuum. Additionally, it sounds better (specs wise) over the Lumia that I currently own, so yes the power.
  • I remember reading when W10M came out that Continuum required at least a Snapdragon 808 (the one found in the Lumia 950). They might have changed the specs over time.
  • Continuum struggles with the 808/810. The 617 isn't going to be a great experience at all. Especially since it is wireless Continuum only.
  • Trolls always talk about how devices aren't adequate enough for them, and talk about how they don't stack up to the competition..... Yet, trolls always have the lowest end, knock off, Android devices... Trolls feel bad about the only phones their broke asses can afford, so they go to WP articles, and rag on lowly midrange WP devices.... Wow! Makes them look real cool talking about out of order WP; not really saying much. Lol. How pathetic is that? And, it's true!😂😂😂😂😂
    You gotta be a real dumb ass to not see how pathetic that makes you look before you post a trolling comment. I guess some just don't think that "far" ahead. Really sad.
  • I guarantee this won't make it to production
  • Probably not.
  • LOL I'm just here to watch this flop just like ALL the other crowdfunded Windows Phones.
  • Are you in the Google or iOS camp? Rooting for a Windows 10M enabled device fail...
  • Well... Technically I'm in both since I also have an iPhone SE. That said, I wouldn't use iOS as a daily driver unless Apple paid me with 10 Apple shares a day for it.
    I would use the SE if it ran Android though. Android does with iOS what Windows does with MacOS: picks it up, beats it into a pulp, throws it on the flor and spits on it lol Also, rooting for a phone with a dead OS to fail is not rooting. It WILL fail. I'm just stating a fact and enjoying the upcoming crash.
    Because no one actually wants a W10M phone. There's a reason why Microsoft killed the platform you know? ;)
  • You're gonna get this device, aren't you? This is your next phone.
  • Maybe I'm alone in this Universe... I want a Windows Phone - or an Andromeda Phone, whatever it will be called... one with Live Tiles... with the silky-smooth Touch... where the UI and the UX merge seamlessly into one exhilarating experience... where 'Lack of Apps' isn't ever remembered... where customization makes each Phone look worlds different from another of the same ilk... Do I have to carry on??
  • Why micro USB and not USB-C? I would fully support this project and contribute to the crowdfunding if it had USB-C. Micro USB is a deal breaker and I can't support this phone.
  • Because this is just a rebadged device. Same one that Wharton Brooks was peddling. It isn't really new.
  • just ordered an Alcatel Idol 4s with Windows 10 Mobile from Microsoft Store. They're on clearance sale (at least in Canada). Paid 200$CAD and regular price is 630$CAD. And that one's got a Snapdragon 820 and 21MP camera and 4GB RAM. I wanted to get a spare in case my 950xl broke but it's got better specs than my 950xl, might become my daily driver.
  • Where did you buy it in Canada?
  • Thanks for the write-up.  Hopefully this will actually get produced.  If available and a reasonable price I'll get it.  Just in case Microsoft doesn't build anymore phones I'll have another spare Windows Phone.  I don't need any fancy apps.  So that's not a problem. 
  • Windows mobile still has support until 2019, so let's quit the windows mobile is dead thing,  I would still like to see news about mobile on this site, app reviews and updates and future speculations on the next thing. Aren't we killing off Windows mobile faster by constantly yelling windows mobile is dead and pushing people to switch now?  It may be dying but not dead yet. I personally would not go for a mid to low end phone, but I would have participated in crowdfunding a Windows mobile tablet 10- 13 inch with at least 1520 or 950 specs , how can get that started?
  • Only the trolls are so sad about thier free on contract low end Android devices to where they have to call WM dead to make themselves feel better about thier $300 a week Burger King pay checks.... Once they grow up, and get some cool Android hardware, they will dissipate... SMDH
  • Support yes. Active development no.
  • Lol.
  • I find the screen of the Alcatel Idol 4 to be the perfect size for me. Funny just a couple of years ago when I had my 925 I had no problem with the 4.5" screen. Now that would be too small for me.
  • Yeah, just like all the other blockheads that complained about the 1520 being too big.. Now, look.. SMD what???.. HEAD, MAN! SHAKING MY DAMN HEAD!😂😂
  • Great to see interest in Windows Phones still. If i was Microsoft I would be helping crowd fund this to make it happen. This probably benifits Microsoft more than anyone else. Highly underrated OS. Fingers crossed that this happens.
  • Does Microsoft need to crowd fund anything at all? Quite the opposite - how many Billions did they lose over the Purchase-Sale of NOKIA???
  • I'm not gonn say anything postive or negative cause all the android trolls here, including the other kinds of trolls who have nothing else than to hate on other peoples preferences cause deep inside they know how incomplete the system they use is(cause i've used the latest version of android as well), jealousy is their life..then again do they have a life? beyond trolling on websites with entirely unrelated topics?. 
  • Nadella kileed Microsoft's entry into the smart phone world only a new Microsoft CEO may have a hance to bring  new Microsoft smart phone to the market place and it would probably have to be an Android one. Microsoft  could revive Windows 10 if MS CEO Nadella has Microsoft just make the software and let it's OEM partners make the hardware like Ballmer did.before he bought Nokia assets. but folks the phone Microsoft I think will make will be a simple 4G cell phone that's ibuilt into the case of one of the "Surface Mobiles"- 2 screen Mini Tablets I think Microsoft will introduce in 2018.this" Surface Mobile"- 2  screen Mini Tablet probably will run "Windows 10 on ARM, have "Continuum with C-Sheel software so it can connect up to a large monitor screen.  it will be a very Usefu "Surfacel Mini Talbet" because it will run Win 32 X86 PC Programs and run all the Apps in the Windows 10 "Mirosoft store. I think enough People will purcahse it on a world wide basis for Microsoft to justify making it and selling it.
  • Unless MS CEO Nadella officially Publically says That Microsoft will once again support Windows 10 mobile. I think it is best for MS OEMs to make a an Android smart phone with a Microsoft tiles Lancher and filled to the brim with Microsoft Apps. the device would look like a Windows smart phone have tiiles ect but run an Android OS and apps.I would not buy it I will use my Windows smart phone until it dies then get an Apple Iphone
  • I agree with you Gregory, on all but your last statement - I would rather spend my money on a cheap Chinese Android, waiting for the Andromeda/ nexr Windows SmartPhone! Coz the next one will be real expensive, from what one reads on the Net...!
  • Like me they know that Iphones have been getting worse since Steve Jobs passed on and Android is naff
  • Huh?   iPhones have never been better.   If you think this “new” Windows phone is better than any iPhone, then dream on.  This would have been a mediocre phone 2 years ago.  In 2018 - assuming it ever gets released - it is bottom of the barrel.   But it will never be released because no one is interested. 
  • I feel just because iPhones sold like hot cakes during Job's life doesn't make it a great device. Where were the features updates, changes in Hardware looks, etc., even then? Naw, those iPhones weren't perfect, requiring no tinkering!! At least, the Jobs iPhones were a lot cheaper than today's bigger, buggier iPhones!! P.S: I wouldn't use an iPhone - any model, past or present - even if I get it as a Christmas gift or something!!
  • It's YOU'RE typical glass sandwich? Really?
  • who edited this piece? those grammar and spelling errors! 
  • i have no word to say about windowsphone
  • Sadly, this won't be funded.
  • For me to buy the mobile it needs to have a smaller screen and a top-notch camera. Primarily as it would be a good purchase for my wife or mother, who don't care about apps at all, but use their phone to take pictures. They prefer smaller phones, with 4.5" around the maximum. I am loathe to suggest they buy an Android next, but that's the way it looks like it'll be. Crapple products aren't even an option if they expect me to provide tech support for it.
  • Why not snapdrgon 625? Look good with old lumia cameras, forget that old ipon 4 design