If you've been hoping to see the HP Elite x3 come to Verizon, you may be in luck.
The HP Elite x3, which initially launched with support for only GSM carriers in 2016, may be on its way to Verizon. That's according to a certification document filed by HP with the Bluetooth SIG (via MSPU), which explicitly mentions Verizon as part of its description.
In addition to the filing with Bluetooth SIG, HP also has recent filings related to the Elite x3 with the FCC and WiFi Org. It isn't clear from these certifications when Verizon support might be expected in full, but we can derive at least a hint at its progress based on the current firmware.
Adding a Verizon SIM to the current HP Elite x3 with the latest July firmware results in the network and data connection becoming visible, but quickly disappearing. The latest July firmware does note "Fix power off issue when CDMA SIM is inserted as 2nd SIM", which strongly suggests that indeed CDMA support is slowly being unlocked on the Elite x3, but it is not quite here just yet.
Combined with developments in Windows 10 Mobile for "enterprise focused work" as noted by Microsoft's Dona Sarkar in May we may be finally seeing the OS get official CDMA support. Proper drivers and certifications standards for Windows 10 Mobile have been missing since its launch nearly two years ago, but Microsoft may finally be fixing that as Windows 10 moves to the cellular PC age later this year.
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The HP Elite x3 may soon be headed to Verizon
Is it too late ? Come on even if your a HUGE Windows Mobile fan, it's still a year almost 2 year old phone, No NFC support and slow compared to modern phones. As everyone here is crying for a Surface phone, do we think this will be good thing ?
I guess if I could get one of these used for $200..and update the firmware, then use it on Verizon, I might do it to play with it but, Windows Mobile cant be my primary phone any more, just too many limits due to Microsoft not really giving a ton of support for 3rd pay options...
I do not think HP would spend a dime making a Windows 10 mobile smart phone for Verizon's network unless it got word from Microsoft that microsoft would supprt and improve Windows 10 mobile OS. HP knows Windows smart phones have low sales so I do not think they would bet on something microsoft has killed. Something tells me they KNOW THE Surface smart phone or Surface smart phone dual screen Mini Tablet hybrid device is coming to the market place
I still use my 640XL and no plans on changing to another OS (which would only be Android). If a good enough deal came along, I would actually get an Elite x3, while I wait to see what/if anything, comes out of Redmond regarding the mobile space.
My patience ran out about 4 months ago, gave up my HTC M8 (no W10m) and bought the X3 meaning I had to leave VZ. From a business standpoint this had to happen for HP. VZ is the primary carrier for many companies especially in the east. HP needs them to sell enterprise solutions. For example, my company has been with VZ for at least a decade. We can even get an employee discount to use them. Company provided mobile phones have always been blackberry. We had the original one and now the Z3. Since we are a windows shop (system wise) we might be receptive to HP, but only through VZ. We are probably typical of many customers.
Ditto
Wonder how huge of a sales boost this will show for the X3 and W10M?
Great news!
Accoding online documentation, existing americas version does support verizon.
When (if?) this phone comes to Verizon, I'll be there to get mine on day 1! I've loved my Icon, but the battery is just worn out...
If it does come to Verizon, I'll get it! My Icon needs a suitable replacement, and this would be it.
Have to wonder if HP may be rolling out maybe a new Gen2 X3 model, maybe with the SD835 chipset?
A model that would allow Win on ARM, with the C Shell interface looking like Win10M does at present, to be installed at a later date, and get it in the hands of corporate people now? Would be a way to roll out Win on ARM to a pretty large user segment at once.
Also a major gambit, since any issues/bugs would be felt through an entire company.
W10A is not for phones according to Belfiore's recent statement. He said they have W10M for phone experiences.
That doesn't seem to stop people from continuously posting about it though.
My entire family will upgrade from our 928s and Icons if the Elite x3 comes to Verizon.
What's wrong with the 735? I took the plunge and it's better than a 928, as it at least runs WM10.
Zzzzzzzzzz
I hope this phone gets traction and gets the Windows on ARM treatment. And we see further iterations.
Dual Sim - could double as my work and home phone....
Same with the Alcatel phone....hope it finds a home in the future world....
Would the CDMA radio ever be turned on to allow any unlocked x5x Lumia phones to go to Verizon? Not sure its worth it, but some folks might appreciate it. Doesn't matter for me as I have a GSM carrier.
If so, that would be great. From what I've read, I think I'd rather have a 950 than an X3 for Glance and the better camera, but I doubt it. I suspect it's time and money that MS would deem not worth it for the benefit.
Considering that those phones don't have CDMA radios and they've been discontinued I'd say the odds are not great.
I thought the radios were there but disabled in firmware, but that's what I read a couple if years back. Don't really know.
@Fandangarino, I believe that's right. I think Microsoft just never obtain certification to use the CDMA and Verizon LTE bands, but the radio hardware is all there to the best of my knowledge.
CDMA needs to die already.
The fact that you (and many of us) want it to die doesn't mean it needs to die. It won't die in fact anytime soon, nor will Verizon network lockdowns. Dealing with reality is beter than living in a false reality if you want actual solutions.
It is ancient tech, I'm amazed any company actually still uses that crud.
The sooner everyone gets their LTE networks in more locations the better. Even GSM is getting long in the tooth.
@Sin Ogaris, Verizon does use LTE for the data. CDMA is their voice network and other background services (probably including text and 911, but I speculate on those). There is no discernable downside to users from their hybrid network. Biggest downside with Verizon is lack of support for Windows mobile devices since the Icon. Looks like Microsoft may finally be correcting that.
Yeah, sorry, the LTE comment was stupid.
End users couldn't care less what wireless protocol their device uses, as long as it has apps and works.
Until VoLTE becomes more commonplace and reliable, that's not going to happen.
Then i have a good phone and a good OS
Nokia 8 is the way to go. Even for businesses. I sudgest to MS to kill the w10m and make android roms available for my lumia 950xl
I would love nougat on my 950xl. I think w10m is just lagging too much now in many aspects. The OS looks nice and feels nice but it still lacks feature parity let alone app problem.
Seriously, there is NO reason for MS to build, develop, support, Android on their hardware. MSs hardware is to put Windows on. If they aren't going to have a mobile (phone) OS, they don't need to mess with the hardware. There are plenty of Android running options, a lot of which are as capable as the 950/950XL, on which to run MS apps and services. MS can let others struggle to make any money on Android hardware. If you really want Android on your 950/XL, lobby XDA Developers, not MS.
Why? The only benefit to your suggestion would be availability of apps, but there are already Android phones that provide that experience. What would be the benefit for MS to build an Android phone? There are skins that mimic WP, but fail because the apps on Android don't have code to allow live tiles to operate. Also the app quality situation on Android is random and aesthetically not appealing. Although we don't have the amount of apps or even official apps, the quality, functionality, and aesthetics of the WP apps like 4castr, MyTube, Tblog, etc. are more consistent with the OS experience than what you experience with Android apps.
Wow, I know they're not concerned about the consumer space with this, but if this comes out later this year on Verizon, I'll have to choose: grab it as the best Windows phone available on Verizon or wait until 2018 for an ultra-mobile Windows 10 PC with telephony support... I guess it's a question on timing.
Currently running a Lumia Icon, which actually still runs great with Windows 10 Creators Update, except I really miss Glance, that I had on my 928. Does the X3 support Glance?
I'd certainly prefer a newer, faster, better phone. I love the concept of Continuum, but probably wouldn't use it personally often enough for it be a factor. Maybe I grab the X3 if it comes to Verizon, and then then pass it on to a family member and upgrade to the hopeful Surface ultramobile PC if it really does come out next year...
Any suggestions from other WC users? And I'm not yet willing to move to an iPhone or Android phone as long as I can use Windows. I'd stick with my Lumia Icon and wait another year for the ultramobile Surface phone/mini/whatever before doing that.
X3 does not support glabce screen
@robert1312, thanks. That's a bummer. I guess it wouldn't be a downgrade to go to the X3 (since the Icon also lacks Glance), but that was something I was hoping to get back. Now that you point it out, I recall HP had their own special software that's a little like Glance. I think it worked based on motion detection (rather than the capacitive touch) for the double tap to wake. I have no idea what it would display when locked. Do you know anything more about it?
That's double tap to wake not glance using gyroscope on elite x3
Are you sure that you got the Creators Update update on your Icon? Were you in the Insider program all along? I had mine in the Insider program last year, but had too many problems. I wanted to update to the Creators Update, but the Icon got cut off from the official update. I am still on version 1607. I signed back up to the Insider program and selected the Release Preview, as I thought I read that the Icon would get the Creators Update that way, but still nothing.
Definitely have Creators Update on my Icon. Just checking the About Info right now, says:
Version 1703
OS build: 10.0.015063.483
That's on the Release Preview ring. I think I had to put it on Fast or Slow to jump from AU to CU version of the OS, but then immediately put it back into Release Preview.
The X3 is an ok phone, great fingerscanner. Screen is illegible with the slightest bit of sun, break the screen and HP will make you buy a new phone to get it fixed and the camera is so so. In comparison to my old 1520 there is only two things better, the chip and the fingerscanner. Overall the 1520 is still today a better phone, in my opinion.
@adbolleman, thanks for the feedback. I know the 1520 was a great phone. I think it would outperform my Icon (930), but not sure on that. Do you think I have a better camera now (in my Icon) than I would if I went to the X3?
I think the 930 camera is better. I was travelling with a friend who owns the iphone 6, pictures on the iphone were wayyyyyy better. Actually, i think the pictures on my daughters 735 and 640 are way better than my X3. Its a really mediocre camera.
And double tap to wake does not work properly on the X3, I have disabled it as it would work when it was not supposed to and the other way around. Dont forget you will also lose all lumia apps on the X3.
there weren't many Lumia apps that are still working today. Most of them have been discontinued.
950!
@user-774, I wish the 950 were also coming to Verizon. I suppose it's possible -- if the X3 is approved for Verizon's CDMA, mabye that would include all phones with the same radio hardware, which may include the 950 and 950XL, I'm not sure. I suspect, however, that this is something HP is pushing through with just support from MS, rather than something MS is primarily driving. If that's the case, it may be limited to just the X3.
So just to clarify. Is this article telling us that W10M will soon support CDMA, and therefore will work on Verizon's network, or is this article saying that Verizon may actually start selling this phone in their stores?
I don't think it's telling us either of those things. I use W10M on CDMA right now (Icon and 735 on Verizon). And I'm not convinced that if the X3 starts working on Verizon that Verizon will actually carry it. What's more likely happening is that whatever certfication process is needed to enable the X3 to work on Verizon is happening, pushed by HP so they can get their devices working on the network. If it goes through and a customer, like me, wants to jump on board, I'd probably have to pick up the X3 from someone other than Verizon. Which is fine with me, I just want it to work on the network.
Great, just another Windows phone for Verizon to kick to the curb in 2 months. The Lumia Icon should never have been a Verizon exclusive. Such a great phone hindered by that choice.
Been holding on to this Lumia 735 (which is still awesome) but would like an upgrade. Definitely getting this
Too little too late! Dont fall for this! VERIZON has horrible support for anything Windows related!
HP and MSFT are the ones supporting this device!
I think the carrier still needs to approve the firmware updates but OS updates aren't locked by them any more and come from.MS
That sort of depends on whether this is a Verizon device, or a device that works on Verizon. That's just like there are devices that work on AT&T/T-Mobile that get their firmware directly from MS, as opposed to those 'branded' devices that are subject to carrier whims. That's different than unlocked. An unlocked AT&T branded phone still is in the AT&T channel for updates. Clearly Verizon needs to 'authorize' the device on their network, but I believe they would have to justify not allowing it. Not sure who has the burdon of proof as to whether it won't harm their network (MS), or that it would harm their network (Verizon, if they don't want this to happen). The relationship between MS and Verizon has always been interesting, and not always amiable. It will also depend on what the FCC requires/allows. Currently they seem a bit more carrier friendly.
This really surprises me. Why on earth would Verizon decide to support this now???
It's not clear to me...is this a hardware fix that Verizon is making? Or is this going to be a totally separate version of the X3 for their network? I'm asking because I want to know if I will be able to pick up a used one from an AT&T user.
Why not, they don't need to necessarily push it hard in their stores and I'm sure they wouldn't buy in a ridiculous number of handsets or anything. Would also mean an existing user could bring their phone to Verizon I would assume
Also, it is doubtful that Verizon will even put them in its stores. It is HP that wants to sell them and getting access to Verizon's network lets them market to a much wider US audience.
It's more of a Windows 10 Mobile supporting CDMA than Verizon. I doubt Verizon will sell in stores the Elite x3. Like AT&T they will likely certify it for their network so that users can bring it to Verizon and Verizon knows it works, but that's about it.
That would help in our area as Big Red has better covearage than AT&T. I would love to have my 950XL on Verizon but that wont happen. Thanks.
Daniel, can you comment more on Windows (mobile/arm) horrid CDMA support since day one? And how exactly it's improving as Win10arm requires cellular radios for calls & data.
It's amazing that windows sights never dug into this serious issue which contributed to WP7/8 doom in the USA.
All I heard is they over-fired their dev teams for Mobile (shock) and lost CDMA engineers, that and CDMA was not a priority for them because W10M was already retrenching when it launched.
All the knowledge/experience/features that W10M brings for cellular is going to be brought to W10oA. They're not going to reinvent the wheel, so to speak when they have been working on the tech for years now. That's why Mobile is still supported/developed at all as they need the experience/data/tech/drivers/OS bits to go forward with any cellular PC plans.
CDMA cert is very difficult to get and is not cheap to develop, support, or apply for certification (Verizon makes OEMs pay for it to get on their network). It's unlike GSM in that regard and much more tricky with less in return since CDMA is definitely waning.
Thank you so much for the information. It's like politics--I like hearing the details about something, not just the rah rah or boo hiss. There are so many things that go on (or don't!) behind the scenes that we consumers have no idea about, and we are so quick to take a little sound bite or rumor or misinformation and base our entire outlook on it. (again like politics).
I personally think CDMA should disappear because US is one of the few countries that actually use it. Majority of world uses GSM so it would make sense for all countries to use the same standard.
Thanks Daniel, good insight. That explains things much more than the high cost of testing. Verizon testing is documented & expensive but not going away.
I just never understood since the WP 7 Series days the thumbing your nose at about 35% or so of (highly loyal) USA prepaid cellular customers. Glad to see CDMA radio support is at least possibly improving cause win10 arm needs 100% USA carrier support to have positive press.
Didn't Microsoft already get cellular support working in regular Windows 10 with the Surface 3 LTE model?
It's good if they are fixing CDMA stuff but the end of article doesn't make complete sense to me. Why would they fix it in W10M now if there's a move into the cellular PC age.
I suppose it's good for the people who opted for the Elite X3 in their business but numbers for that must be pretty low. I know first hand HP are still trying to sell them as a solution to enterprise in the UK, along with the lapdock, I'm just not sure who'd take the risk at this stage. I personally really like the X3 as a phone but I'm one of the few that gets what they need from W10M just fine
(1) Elite x3 exists and is being pushed/supported by HP regardless if anyone here thinks Windows phone is dead or alive (2) The telephony stack for Windows 10 on ARM doesn't happen by magic, it's literally taken from the Mobile build, which - as we have been saying for awhile - is why Microsoft keeps Mobile alive, updated, and tweaked.
You just don't flick a switch in Windows 10 and add cellular support like Mobile has; this work for CDMA always had to get done at some point. HP definitely pressured Microsoft for this as it is critical for devices like the Elite x3 for businesses.
True, I actually think it's alive personally for now and I'm no optimist my phone just does what it did 6 months ago, and what it did 12 months ago and has had 46 bug fixes since CU.
Until I stop getting updates to Outlook Mail I'm golden lol. By then there will probably be another device in some form that runs the same UWP Outlook Mail that can replace my 950. Main things I want in a future MS device are
UWP apps (guaranteed)
Better BT Stack (Likely)
Size of a phone or slightly bigger (I'm hopeful)
Outlook on W10M still has the most integrated experience IMO. For the core functions of email and calendar I love it. Also still think Groove is best on Windows 10 having used it on iOS a lot on my wife's phone over time it's never felt as polished there
I agree with Groove. It's slow and not as polished on Android. Outlook not sure I agree, but been awhile on W10 so ...
Outlook definitely have more features on Android, but the corbitts work best on Windows 10 IMO.
"Outlook on W10M still has the most integrated experience IMO."
IMO also and boy, has two months trying every possible Android email app, including the Outlook for Android app, confirmed for me that right now Outlook on W10M is unsurpassed on any platform. And it is particulalry good on the big Elite x3 which is a terrific, solid, dependable, capable device, whose limitations mostly arise out of W10M's limitations. It isn't the brightest or the lightest device out there, but x3 is a real workhorse and I am glad that Verizon customers will have the choice.
Have you tried Bluemail or Nine? Both are excellent mail clients for Android.
'Have you tried Bluemail or Nine? Both are excellent mail clients for Android.'
This is the problem with Android - lots of options - all of them rubbish!
Why don't you just flick a switch and include it? This has been advertised as one OS, one core. The module that provides cell capability into the desktop version should be as easy to drop in, as the modules that support Linux and HyperV are to leave out of mobile. Are you suggesting that the mobile builds and the 'regular' builds are so divergent to be essentially different OSs? Just sayin'. Of course if we start talking about running the 'x86' OS on ARM as well as on x86/64 architecture then we are back to 'one' OS. Again not making that one OS modular so you can mix and match, cell, VR, Enterprise, IoT, focused capabilities would be silly.
hence the reason why there are actually rs3 builds of mobile inside microsoft walls.
Windows 10 mobile is as alive as macOS (in my opinion). The macOS store is a desert (try looking for a youtube client in there?), Mac devices are very slow to upgrade with minor speed bumps at best (MacBook finally got an update) and macOS itself gets minor updates every year. I don't see how this is different to Windows 10 mobile. That being said - both macOS and Windows 10 mobile are great to use.
However, both MS and Apple need Windows 10 mobile / macOS respectively and simply can't kill them off due to their future potential. It's not always about this quarters bottom line.
I know. It is good to know that W10M now as a platform can support CDMA, atleast on the 820 SoC. That is a huge step even if HP pressured it.
Great news for those on Verizon. On a side note, is anyone else no longer able to.load comments on the Windows Central app? It has been like this for weeks and I've reinstalled it.
you push the refresh button
I usually select the "Newest First" from the drop down menu at the top of comments section, or the refresh icon works.
I don't have problems loading the comments on the app, I just can't reply to any comments on the app which is super annoying when somebody says something .... uninformed.
Comments on the app haven't worked for me for weeks. I've reported it via the Help feature in the app, but no response from anyone. I've uninstalled/reinstalled a couple of times. When I swipe to the comments in any article, nothing loads and I just get the dots at the top, scroll, scroll, scroll... The refresh button has no effect. And just to clarify, I'm talking about the app on the phone, not the PC.
That's exactly what I get, swipe to comments and the dots scrolling to load comments, which never happens. It looks as though even Windows Central has given up on updating their app for W10M.
Please, please, please let this happen soon.
Too late now, everyone abandoned them like me. I never thought I'd say that, but in all honesty, its not even worth coming back now. I waited years for Verizon to get a good, high end Windows Phone
HP Elite x3 was really never meant for you though, was it? It's a tool for enterprise.
Also, if you don't see how this important for Windows 10 on ARM and cellular PCs down the road, then I don't know what to tell you.
This is not some last-ditch ever to "save" Windows phone for consumers. That is literally the most superficial and uniformed view of this move, which is something that always needed to happen at some point if Microsoft is serious about Windows 10 on ARM or making the Elite x3 viable for businesses.
Daniel, I think he was referring to the fact that he abandoned Verizon for lack of support of windows mobile. It seems like you read into that he abandoned win mobile because of Verizon's lack of support. I could be wrong though, wouldn't be a first.
I think so too.
Daniel, maybe you know. Is this article telling us that Verizon may actually start selling this phone in their stores? It's a little unclear.
I have no idea about that. I doubt it. My hunch is like AT&T they will "certify" it for the network, but that's it.
Yeah, they have a specialized Enterprise Solutions group that I would imagine is the landing spot for the X3. I wouldn't hold my breath to see it make it to a consumer facing outlet.
i think it will be pushed thru verizons enterprise channel, this has nothing to do with a consumer release.
There is a whole new FCC ID for the cdma model.
Are you seeing any real traction with Windows 10 Mobile in enterprise? It's somewhat short on enterprise features and makes a hard sell to management. So far none of my colleagues are even considering it an option. They don't feel confident without a consumer presence or MS backing.
X3 is just a WP nothing more or special that would seperate it from any othe phone like the 950's or the Alcatel. If MS is going to make a phone type device with full Windows on ARM then either the X3 will be able to run it or this move makes no sense at all.
not everyone wants full W10 on a phone, we just need polished UWP apps
Don't attempt to speak for everyone. Your comments are disingenuous. At the end of the day you're a follower like everyone else, if you got a new job and they gave you this phone (or a future hybrid Windows 10 mobile device) for work you would use it. Depending upon how well Windows 10 on ARM and Continuum progress over the next few years you might even come to love it.
I think you're referring to leaving Verizon, not leaving Windows Phone/Mobile, right?
VZ is my only option, if I want cell phone service while I'm taking walks in my neighborhood. So if VZ approves the X3 I might consider buying one ... since I still like being a "maverick" and going with a non-iOS / non-android phone. What I don't get, and what I don't like, is that VZ can legally block a particular cell phone model from using their network. It is my understanding that this is not the case in (most of) the rest the world, with regards to phones that pass a standard set of compliance tests.
Last good Windows Phone Verizon carried was the 928. I absolutely LOVED that phone. The camera on that thing still holds up to today's phones.
Actually I would say the 929, aka Icon, was a bit better...
Source - Owned both and still using my 3 5 year old Icon as my daily driver... I am using it now to reply to this ;)
It's amazing how, in the US, people's first choice is the carrier and not the device you want to use. It seems the key to US mobile penetration is get the carrier on board and you're good to go. Without the carrier- you are dead. What happened to competition? Couldn't the federal government force all carriers to share their infrastructure to other carriers (for a fair price) to aid competition?