Pebble, Microsoft and what could have been with Windows Phone

Earlier today, Windows Central ran a story regarding a potential Pebble app coming to Windows Phone. Evidence for the claim comes via a Store listing for an internal app that demonstrates a Pebble watch syncing with Windows Phone 8.1 devices.

At the time, my position was that this app represents a proof-of-concept approach. If Pebble were pleased with the performance and feature-set, a contract to build the actual app and partnership would likely take place.

Speaking with various people familiar with the situation, I have been able to learn the full context of the Microsoft-Pebble state of affairs. The news is fascinating, but the outcome will cause some weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Time machine: Late 2013

Pebble and Microsoft began to discuss the potential for an app in the second half of 2013. Indeed, I was often dropping rather large hints that talks between Pebble and Microsoft were ongoing in various comments.

The plan was for Microsoft to build a demonstration app to prove to Pebble that their smartwatch would sync in all the right ways with Windows Phone. Pebble, like many companies, would prefer a consistent user experience for their products across devices. Requesting Microsoft verify that their OS can handle Pebble is a common and reasonable request before a partnership is signed.

In late 2013, only Windows Phone 8.0 was available on the market with the promise of 8.1 later that spring. Windows Phone 8.1 brought many new APIs to the table, including better Bluetooth Smart support (devices with 4.0 or higher specifications, low-energy support, and updatability). Pebble could not build an app for Windows Phone on their own, but with Microsoft taking control anything was possible.

Just a few months later in spring 2014, Microsoft did not deliver a barebones app that could sync as requested. Instead, we are told they designed an entire Pebble app themselves with nearly complete functionality. The only thing that was missing was the recently announced Pebble Store, but seeing as Microsoft could not have access to many of its components, it was an easy thing to overlook.

We hear that Microsoft made quite the impression by delivering a well-polished, entirely functional app so quickly. The only thing that remained between the two companies were the details of the partnership.

This was the plan, and we are told an official announcement for a Windows Phone Pebble app was being pushed for Build 2014 with the app due sometime later that year.

Management gets cold feet

My sources tell me that Microsoft was very cooperative with the Pebble group. Anyone who has worked with Windows Phone evangelists, their management and even – at the time – Nokia employees share the same impression. Redmond bends over backward to win over a company's business. This willingness to partner with Pebble was admirable, but in the end it failed for one main reason: Pebble's management.

As a company, Pebble was riding a lucky wave of positive press and an increasingly loyal fan base. The problem was Google and Apple were looming in the distance as both companies were preparing to jump in on the wearable market.

Pebble partnering up with Microsoft would seem like a safe bet should things get too heavy with Android and Apple. We are told that plans to help distribute Pebble in Microsoft Stores (online and physical), connecting with carriers to co-sell Windows Phones with new Pebble watches, and more were all being considered as strategies.

Cortana integration was even being looked at as a break though technology for Pebble and a way for Microsoft to get a foot in the door on iOS and Android.

The overarching angle being leveraged was Microsoft needed a smartwatch strategy, and Pebble needed a company with deep pockets to lean on.

Pebble would continue to work with Apple and its Android partners, but Microsoft and their Windows Phone would be more favored. To see a similar strategy in action, look no further than Microsoft fitness darling Fitbit. AT&T is continuing their promotion of bundling the Lumia 830 with a free Fitbit flex and Fitbit products are cross-promoted and sold in all Microsoft Stores.

To my mind, this all sounds like a brilliant plan. Pebble gets a resilient partner; Microsoft works with a spritely, "disruptive" tech company. Long term, Microsoft would even be in an ideal position to acquire Pebble, should the private company want to go down that path.

There is just one problem: Pebble founder and CEO Eric Migicovsky.

Despite Microsoft's attempts to win over Pebble, Migicovsky is reportedly not a fan of the company nor their mobile operating system. The young entrepreneur reportedly nixed any partnership.

Growing up in a world where Google and Apple have dominated the mobile scene, this perception that Microsoft is old and out of touch is seemingly more frequent these days. Particularly with those under 30 (see Snapchat's Evan Spiegel for a similar attitude). Even Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella was unable to persuade him personally.

Keep in mind, the plan I am told was for Microsoft to develop the app, including eating all costs associated within, and even to help Pebble keep Windows Phone app parity long-term with continued support. In exchange, Pebble owns the app. These kinds of deals are very familiar with Microsoft as the company knows it has to be aggressive when winning over clients.

A slow fizzle into 2015

Throughout 2014, discussions about the partnership including financing, reach, retail, and more slowly began to fizzle due to Pebble's lack of interest, not for Microsoft's lack of trying.

To my knowledge, as of February 2015, there is no longer any talks between the companies about a Pebble app, making the prospects for one looking bleak. Although this internal Microsoft app was updated last week, raising some eyebrows, this is likely just the developer continuing to tinker just in case Pebble decides to return Microsoft's phone calls.

In fact, Pebble even confirmed that there is no Windows Phone app today in a Reddit AMA. Pebble's Thomas Sarlandie, Head of Developer Relations flat out said so. He is telling the truth. However, he is also failing to mention how Microsoft made them an app and that they are choosing to ignore the platform.

For now, Pebble is set on forging their path without Microsoft at their side. This choice all comes just days after another successful Kickstarter to raise money for their new Pebble Time smartwatch, featuring an always-on color, e-paper display.

Maybe Migicovsky and Pebble  will change their mind, but in the interim, we do not expect to hear any more about Windows and Pebble.

Daniel Rubino

Daniel Rubino is the Editor-in-chief of Windows Central, head reviewer, podcast co-host, and analyst. He has been covering Microsoft since 2007 when this site was called WMExperts (and later Windows Phone Central). His interests include Windows, laptops, next-gen computing, and for some reason, watches. Before all this tech stuff, he worked on a Ph.D. in linguistics, watched people sleep (for medical purposes!), and ran the projectors at movie theaters because it was fun.

  • SMDH......
    As usual, I'm going to have to blame MS for this one. I know a lot of you don't like it when I say this, but that's my story, and I'm sticking with it...
    The bottom line is that it's MS's job to make sure their products are successful, and it's their job only.. PERIOD❗ Sure, they are doing things right now, but the attitude, drive, persistence, and vision, is what MS needed 7-8 years ago, coming into the WP/W8.0 era.. They just didn't do what was necessary to build awareness,and hype,, around their products, and that poor sense of urgency has gone on for years... Now we see the effects of the cause.....
  • Did you read the article at all?
  • He's blinded by hatred. As for Pebble, i really don't care. I don't like their products. I would like to see Jawbone support and their app before UP3 starts shipping.
  • Yeah, I watched the KickStarter video for this new watch and thought "what an ugly piece of shit.". I have zero interest in this thing. I will say, however, that the week long battery life and water resistance are two features the Band needs. If MSFT can slim down the next Band, give it a week long battery, waterproof it, and give it Gorilla Glass, game over on the wearable front.
  • He should just copy/paste this mantra he's so in love with.
  • The whole thing... Just not looking at the problem on the surface... There's more to why this keeps happening to MS than "These companies are just being mean""
    That's not business... This is business. And, this is what 5 years of horrible marketing, a poor sense of urgency, and just bad planning, will do for your platform... I mean, look at the reality of the situation....
    It's been 5 years since WP came out, and we don't even have a decent music player.... And, you expect for companies to have faith in WP? It doesn't work like that..
  • So what do you suggest rodneyej? Blame MS everyday for the rest of our lives until they make a time machine to chage what they did 7-8 years ago? I don't know where you're getting, obviously MS cant change the past, that is why they are doing their best with Pebble at present. That's all they can do. The more company supporting them, the more successful they could be. Do you think we (the "supporters") are supporting MS the right way by owning their products and then complain about them?
  • I can't make you do anything... But, until I see MS do the things that I think they need to do I will continue to blame them when these type of articles arise... When things change then I'll change... It's all relative.... Hope you don't hate me, but that's my opinion, and my right..
    You can call me ignorant, and stupid, but I'm onto something..... Hard work, and persistence, pays off, my friend... And, never let anyone throw you off course... That is my advice to you...
    Watch me do this... Lol.
  • And exactly which company do you run that is so successful today ? 
  • None! What I meant by "we (the supporters)" was we the consumers. Sorry about that Tim.
  • I was referring to Rodney.  He and I have a very different rembrance of things past relative to MSFT.  So I wanted to know from what he drew his expertise as a leader of a major corporation that is doing all things right, thus allowing him to suggest MSFT is not.
  • Tim... That's the worst question.. Wait.. That's the most sorriest excuse to prove someone is wrong.. Wow❗ Tim... Come on.. Really?
    Plenty of football fans have opinions and don't run teams... Please, man.. If you can't deal with it then move along... Now, ask me something serious.
  • Ahhhh .... you are giving major corporate advice, and it's bad to ask from what platform of experience you are able to direct a multi-billion dollar company ? As for football ... well I've watched some fans rip into critics who have no clue of how the game is to be played.  In fact, they've left some of those "loud and aggressive" fans speechless when they explain how the play was to be executed, and who missed their parts.  Oh ... and its especially fun to watch a woman take down some clueless guys ... So much for football.  Again, please share your platform of experience and expertise. 
  • You know what...
    All that you just typed would apply, but it doesn't... You know why??? Because I never claimed to be an expert... Where did I ❓
    As a matter of fact It's just my personal opinion, and a strong one of mine, in fact...
    You either deal with it, or not❗ I don't really care..... But, regardless of your begging me to change it,, it will not change! Deal with it!
    Now, is there something else I can help you with❓
  • You have given quite a lot of reasons for being unsuccessful for a company very successful!
  • Really, it's rather funny being in this thread since I'm happy with the Band, and have no interest in a Pebble, except to skip one across a tranquil pond. I responded because it's sad the critics are mostly those who have never built anything on their own.  In the old days Microsoft made (some) people angry because they bought up small companies with great ideas, and spent the funds to make those products available to everyone with great enhancements.  Now they receive potshots because they seek to innovate in a rapidly advancing market place.  So you are a critic, not a producer.  That's easy ... grab the donuts, sit on the couch, and pontificate about how someone didn't do the job the way you would ... except the critics never had to make the tough decisions, come up with true ideas, work through strategies, or even spend resources to get something done.  They only expend enough energy to walk their fingers over a keyboard. Supporters, like myself, however have actually built businesses and utilized the many wonderful tools and services offered by Microsoft.  We took the time to get involved, and move ahead, and we are thankful for what Microsoft has accomplished.  Are we worshippers, or saying they are perfect ?  No way.  But in my case, I take it to the decision makers and share realistic ideas for their consideration, done with the hope they can make enhancements and inroads that benefit the rest of us.  The difference ?  You are a consumer / critic.  I'm a producer and team member.   Nope, you can't help me, but you might actually help yourself !  Try taking some of that keyboard energy and see if you can actually create something that helps others.j   
  • well said my friend. I couldn't say it better myself. If there were ppl like you and I thinking this way, Microsoft would be in much better position WAY more than the Overrated CrApple, and Google imo. Unlike one trick pony EVIL CrApple that lies, mislead, pretends, COPIES EVERYTHING, fools,..........their customers, and Google that sells all your personal and private info for CASH$$$$$ since they are an advertising comp(which soooooooo many ppl don't even know for some freaking reason, and I can't figure out, as to how they get all their billions from), and make 96% of their rev from selling ads in anyway they can, by so call FREE prods they want ppl to use, and with extremely poor customer service and no phn, MS try's to be honest and upfront with their customers, with prods and services that are truly the best imo. Oh well, some ppl just never get it, and are too brainwashed to see the FACTS and TRUTH tight in their faces.
  • So Rodneyej: "Plenty of football fans have opinions and don't run teams... Please, man.. If you can't deal with it then move along... Now, ask me something serious." Means you're just another Monday morning quarterback. You have just dropped from my list of people worth listening to and that has just about everyone on it. :)
  • Perfect.. We both agree on something.. Cool.
  • From the course of events isnt that what MS is doing? They are doing the hard work and being persistent.... But that comment is talking about doing this over a large timeframe. So ? maybe you need to replace your impatience with your touted persistence.
  • You totally sidestepped the question, man. And then brought up summer deflection BS about people hating you for your opinion. When no one said such. They asked you for your opinion. And you refused to answer the question.
  • You and I had a long discursion on CrApple, MS, and Google. However, YOU, still refuse to see what i was telling you with FACTS, and TRUTH right in your face in black and white,(even when you get -57 thumbs down on your 1st comt here, you still dont get it for some reason). Now you still keep blaming MS for everything YOUR BLIND eyes cant see, and/or willing to accept. For the last time, MS is NOT and will NOT do evil practice, by fooling, misleading, pretending, brainwashing, LYING, CrApple does, or Google way of practice by listening and watching and selling your privet info to third party for CASH, to get ahead. Say what you want, i gave you ALL the FACTS to back up all what I'm saying about EVIL CrApple and how Google does with your personal and privet info using their so call free stuff. YES these Evil way of practice is working for one trick pony CrApple, and Google, but its is NOT right and it is NOT moral. I'm PROUD of MS by NOT doing what CrApple or Google does to get ahead. That is why i have switched EVERYTHING to MS prods and will continue to support them anyway i can. I can tell you this, if i would receive a free CrApple prods, i would absolutely refuse it and or get it and smash it with a hammer, and gave it back. the things CrApple is doing is WRONG and as WRONG as it gets. But if you don't have any morals, and believe anything this PURE EVIL CrApple comp tell and feeds you, and live for FAD, and don't give a crap about those 18 Chinese workers committed suicide making ONLY iJUNK phns, by working 14~16 hrs a day, 7 days a week,.................. then CrApple is for you. ( unfortunately a blinded and brainwashed iSHEEP will refuse to accept ANY FACTS and TRUTH you put right in front of them, their mind is made up cuz CrApple said so, or have some kinda BS, childish excuses...............) If you don't give a crap when you personal and privet infos are sold for CASH to third party for advertising purposes everywhere and  to everyone, when Google gathers all your info by listening, watching and monitoring you by your lovely android device, and their so called FREE prods they offer, since Google is an advertising comp and makes 96% of their revenue from advertising, and does whatever it can, to sell you an ad,............Google is for you. (90% of Android useres have NO IDEA Google is an advertising Company, and think all those FREE prods Google offers, is just free prods with no catch, and at no point they even think, how Google makes bilions of $$$$ every quarter, if they keep giving FREE stuff away, HELLLOOOOOO McFly..!!!!)  As i mentioned i do NOT want any of that crap from CrApple and Google, and i have morals. So i will stay with MS and will support them. i will also, pass those FACTS and TRUTH about their evil way of practice CrApple and Google does, to as many ppl as i can. its up to you to believe me or not. the Tuth and Facts are out there for ANYONE to see, its up to you to find them, and open your eyes, and say enough is enough.  
  • " Blame MS everyday for the rest of our lives"
    is there anyone else to blame!! "what they did 7-8 years ago"
    forget what they did 7 year ago, look at what they are now doing... look at the mess!! "that is why they are doing their best with Pebble at present. That's all they can do. "
    So they can doing their best with pebble, but not making a decent music player, and a decent os!! 'Do you think we (the "supporters") are supporting MS the right way by owning their products and then complain about them?"
    MS never gave us a decent app for music player, xbox video(which sucks outside of US), cortana/bing(which also sucks outside US), and a lots of US exclusive bullshit, give one reason to support them!
    I bought WP, because of their windows OS,(i thought it would be awesome), and also convince some of my friend also(they switched to android a month ago), and the horrible experience, crappy apps, no 3rd party support at all, awful notification centre implementation, and..... a resuming screen. windows 10 is on the horizon, i "HOPE" they will get their shit right, otherwise this is the probably their last chance. grrrr.... i am just so frustrated after seeing no improvement in windows 10 mobile and also the desktop, are they mocking us with those horrible desktop icons!! they should fire their UI designer asap.
  • Avik, I don't have to give you a reason to support MS, the moment you bought a windows phone, you already did have a reason. And I don't quite get you -  "I bought WP, because of their windows OS,(i thought it would be awesome), and also convince some of my friend also(they switched to android a month ago), and the horrible experience.." You bought a phone because you THINK it was awesome and convinced others to switch, why would you do that? Because in my case, I did a lot of research and thinkering BEFORE I BOUGHT my 1520, knowing full well of it's capabilities and short commings. And why would you recommend a phone if you're having a horrible experience with it? And by the way, Windows 10 for phone isn't final yet, it's not even on beta yet. How come you're getting frustrated and seeing "no improvement"? Jesus people, can we just think very carefully first before we bash and complain?
  • well where i live, there is no nokia centre so no demo unit, i saw ads on tv(i barely had a internet back then, so forget research) and got my first WP7.5 (later updated to 7.8, it was a sad day), and first few weeks i really loved it, the UI was just responsive. my friend also bought one just for the UI(his was WP8.1), but as i use it everyday, i simply starting to hate it. Only the start screen UI was good, other than that it is just uncomfortable to use it. Specially there was only one way to close an app...... pressing back until you reach the end. My sister got a lumia 520, and after updating it ..... the resuming screen is now so real. My friend already got a moto g. i still haven't decide whether to get rid off my old lumia and get a new one. I am waiting eagerly for 3 year for them to come up with a functional OS, " I did a lot of research and thinkering BEFORE I BOUGHT my 1520, knowing full well of it's capabilities and short commings"
    well we don't have internet in many places yet, i got broadband and i am barely getting 60KBps. so research was not available until last year for me. "And by the way, Windows 10 for phone isn't final yet, it's not even on beta yet. How come you're getting frustrated and seeing "no improvement"? Jesus people, can we just think very carefully first before we bash and complain?"
    3 Year, and no improvement so far, and now they are on the horizon of releasing the OS, and in the beta there is NO IMPROVEMENT AT ALL. Even though it is beta, people are frustrated, i only stick to WP, cause i thought maybe with windows OS and Windows phone, i can finally do cool stuff, like apple and iphone. .......... we all know what happened to that. I will wait till windows 10 release time, but after that if no improvement, i will get a one plus one, and if i switch, my family will also switch, and i won't even recommend it to my friends(well they are already on android). :| the fun thing is, windows phone user always say when windows phone 8 will come out, it was gonna be great, ....... when windows phone 8.1 will come out it's gonna make some difference, and now when windows 10 will come out, it's gonna kick apple and google's ass.
  • 1st of all not sure why you are complaining. There has been many improvements from 7.8 to 8 to 8.1 and 8.1 Denim updates, and incase you missed the Win10 for phn announcement here is a video of ""SOME"" of what MS has for us in the bag. 2ndly, do you have 8.1 Denim update on your phn yet? do you know what your 1520 can do with Denim Update, that no iJUNK6 or 6+ can do? Do you know, even though our 1520 is getting a little old, still far better than MANY phns out there, including iJUNK 6 and 6+? (I notice even CrApple is copying several features(as usual) from Nokia/MS). Do you know Google Android uses SEVERAL MS patents used on Android OS, and since its free to manufactures, the Android manufactures have to pay MS loyalties every quarter, which MS makes well over $2+ Billions just on Android devices sold? Did you know Nokia , Sony, and Philips Invented the NFC(Near Field Communication) used in MANY devices, and its been used on Nokia phns for YEARS and YEARS, and now finally is used on iJUNK6/6+ with limited use ONLY for CrApple Pay, after CrApple made fun of the NFC technology Over and Over in many occasions, in front of thousands of ppl, along with large screen phns? Did you know, HERE MAP is owned by Nokia and used by MANY MANY GPS NAV manufactures, Like Garmin, Many Car Nav system,.................(NavTeq is HERE Map, Ford, Mercedes, BMW,................all used NavTeq Maps which is Nokia HERE MAP on their NAV System), and come FREE in out Win phn?.................................. 3rd, although our 1520 is a little old now, lets see what it has compare to other ones on the market released "recently".   1. 20 pix pure view camera and its AWESOME software that is one of the BEST camera on a phn in the world(iJUNK6/6+ does NOT have or offers yet) 2. 4 microphones for noise cancelation and Surround Sound recording on Video (iJUNK6/6+ does NOT have or offers) 3. 6 inch screen (iJUNK6/6+ does NOT have or offers) 4. 3400 mAh battery (that is joke on iJUNK phns with 2200mAh battery, every iJUNK owner complains about their garbage batteries) 4. FULL NFC feature (after making fun of the NFC in many occasions iJUNK 6/6+ have ONLY limited use of NFC, and can NOT do what Our phns could do for years) 5. does NOT bend like aluminum foil ( just go on Twitter and search #Bendgate and see how many ppl posting iJUNK6/6+ with photos are bent in their pockets) 6. reinstalled Apps that comes already loaded in our phns(just look what you get compare to others) 7. Glance Screen/sensor(i see several phns now copying this feature we had for a while) 8. 8.1 Denim Update will allow you to take 4K Video Recording(ijunk still does NOT offer 4K recording) 9. MANY features/options in "settings" in 8.1 and 8.1 Denim that is NOT available on ANY phns out there to this date(too many to list here) 10. 1080p screen(after all these years CrApple iJUNK6+ is the ONLY phn they have that has 1080p screen, iJUNK 6 is at 750 res, and iJUNK5 or S is at 600 res). 11. Dedicated Camera Button on the outside of the screen( need i say more?????) 12. Tap to wake the screen/phn(with 8.1 Denim update, you can say ""Hey Cortana"" to 1520, 930 and iCon and it will turn on your phn) 13. Cortana (which is by far better and personable than SiRi crap and Google Now) 14. 2 LED flash lights(many phns still offer 1 to this date, Nokia 1020 is the ONLY phn in the world offers Xenon Flash on their 41 pix camera) well you get the picture, now as old as our 1520 is, how many phns its released ""recently"", can you name or list that has all these features i have listed??????? With Denim Update, you will even have way more features and options, and with 10 you will have A LOT more. Your 1520 can easily be used for many years to come with the hardware it has, however, waiting just a short few months using your 1520 is NOT going to kill you and/or the world will end. you have nothing to be ashamed of. your 1520 can do many things many NEW phns still cant. so be proud, till good thing to come soon. remember time will go by VERY FAST, its already getting close to March. next thing you know, its June, Sep,.......Nov, year again.  BTW next week in Spain is a HUGE Mobile Event, that you need to watch daily, its called 2015 MWC(Mobile World Congress). Many comp will release NEW phns at these events. I'm expecting to see LG Flex 2(FREAKING AWESOME phn i saw at 2015 CES show in Vegas), that comes in Android, will also come in Windows version as well. I'm sure MS will release some new models as well, but not sure they will be flagship or not. my guess not, since they are working on Win10 flagship phns to be released later this year(my guess 1530 with 4K screen, solar screen charging, 30+pix cam, 3D screen, Qualcomm 810 64 bit CPU or better................. name one. along with some smaller flagship phns, just a guess of course). So be patient and you will not be disappointed, and keep your eyes on 2015 MWC next week.     
  • 15.... Nobody knows about any if this because marketing is horrible.... So, it may as well not exist...
    Lol.... You guys live under rocks. Welcome to the real world. And, don't get mad at me because your device gets no recognition...... Get mad at MS❗ MS makes TERRIFIC products, but REFUSES to sell them to anyone... IDK why.
  • 1st of all there are marketing and BS, lying, fooling, pretending, misleading, brainwashing,, and honest, upfront, true, word of mouth, good, stating the FACTS, MS does marketing, about their prods, however there are so much money dedicated for every comp's marketing. I'm not sure if you have seen Surface ads, and how MS is trying to get TV shows to use Surface and windows products, used by lead actors and actresses(like Scorpion, Followers,........and few other shows). NFL teams are now using Surface tablets to help their team, and its an official NFL prods. Did you see MS TV commercials on super bowl? Have you seen Xbox tv commercials? Have you seen Xbox games, tv commercials? Have you seen MS Cloud Azure, tv commercials? Have you seen, win8 tv commercials? ........ and so many more windows prods commercials? Well, I have, along with millions of other ppl. As for the phns goes, I'm sure once the actual Microsoft brand Lumia with Windows 10, comes out, we will see those commercials too, in near future. Last, nothing works better than word of mouth. That is one of the best marketing ever. Like MS Band. I personally have not seen any TV commercials on it yet, however, it is selling like hot cake, and its flying of the shelves as soon as MS gets a new shipping. My wife's coworkers all want MS bands, ever sense they've seen hers, and seen in person what it does. If more ppl would take their time, and show others what MS prod can do, and offers compare to CrApple's one trick pony iJUNK prods, and open their eyes and educate them, about MS and its prods, that alone its the best marketing in the world. Not by lying, misleading, fooling, buying ppl and comps off by paying them cash under the table, to push and hype their prods, by posting bunch of misleading reviews,, and BS comparisons to other brands, what CrApple is doing. Sure its working for CrApple, but that's WRONG and its NOT moral.
  • " There has been many improvements from 7.8 to 8 to 8.1 and 8.1 Denim updates"
    and one of those improvements were MUSIC PLAYER!! RIGHT! damn you, i love zune. "2ndly, do you have 8.1 Denim update on your phn yet?"
    nope. still waiting......... waiting....... " do you know what your 1520 can do with Denim Update, that no iJUNK6 or 6+ can do?"
    sorry i don't own a 1520, so not excited about denim anyway! "(I notice even CrApple is copying several features(as usual) from Nokia/MS)"
    every os has feature from other OS, as for windows os's tile, it is not something that MS created from scratch, it was release before ms's OS, and failed like win8.1. "Do you know Google Android uses SEVERAL MS patents used on Android OS, and since its free to manufactures, the Android manufactures have to pay MS loyalties every quarter"
    yes i know, but what that has to do with WP!! It does not make WP better in any way. "Did you know Nokia , Sony, and Philips Invented the NFC(Near Field Communication) used in MANY devices, and its been used on Nokia phns for YEARS and YEARS, and now finally is used on iJUNK6/6+ with limited use ONLY for CrApple Pay"
    btw, we are talking about the OS not the hardware, iphone sucks for the price. "CrApple made fun of the NFC technology Over and Over in many occasions, in front of thousands of ppl, along with large screen phns?"
    yup, apple has a bad ego, but they have bigger market and a bigger fanbase, and also inline notification reply! "Did you know, HERE MAP is owned by Nokia and used by MANY MANY GPS NAV manufactures, Like Garmin, Many Car Nav system,.................(NavTeq is HERE Map, Ford, Mercedes, BMW,................all used NavTeq Maps which is Nokia HERE MAP on their NAV System), and come FREE in out Win phn?"
    ..... DID YOU KNOW, NOKIA MADE THOSE APPS FREE IN ANDRIOID!! seriously, what's with this fact check!! it has nothing to do with WP!! and why are you showing about Nokia hardware!! cause i know Nokia hardware is better! But we are talking about the OS, which killed the WP. "With Denim Update, you will even have way more features and options"
    on low end phone, the update does nothing. you don't expect people to buy a high end lumia, as WP's future is uncertain. "and with 10 you will have A LOT more. Your 1520 can easily be used for many years to come with the hardware it has, however, waiting just a short few months using your 1520 is NOT going to kill you and/or the world will end. you have nothing to be ashamed of"
    ...and windows 8 will have more,...... wait.... windows 8.1 will have more.... no.... it is now windows 10.!!
    I AM ASHAMED OF MY MUSIC PLAYER :| "till good thing to come soon"
    not again "come soon"!! i hate beta and "come soon" trademark. "So be patient and you will not be disappointed"
    i lost my hopes when i saw the recycle bin icon on the windows 10 leak!! seriously my whole point of argument was the software not hardware!
  •   You're delusional.    Half the problem is people couldn't even get Denim. My 8x stops at 8 ~ no easy way up, without registering as a dev. (not on verizon) You even mention 7.8 8 and 8.1 forgetting how horrible and how many devices were left behind with each. On some platforms, like the Android of old, that's ok, because you have an active community. Even tho cyanogen has abandoned my i747 (at&t gs3) i was still able to get a nearly fully working CM12 on there (can't record video is the only bug)  Meanwhile, the equivilent iOS phone that i have, the 5, is fully supported on the latest OS and runs it easily. Also, there are several iOS apps that can record 4k video natively. The experience just isn't good enough for apple to do it themsevles yet.  Camera's are an area i can't even wrap my head around, it's like if you're a WP user, suddenly shutter speed, and a whole other range of options don't matter, because resolution.  the 1520 wouldn't be useful for me for 1 day. Because i need my phone to VPN into multiple networks, VNC / RDP into computers, and actually do work; which in general WP does not have the software for. It's sick and sad i can't even administer Active Directory from my WP phone, but i can from Android and iOS. Let's not even get into IP camera setups with 2 way audio (which can be done, but is horrific) Seriously, your post is so outrageously without a clue i don't know where to begin. 
  • Exactly. i love my 1520, and with everything it offers, i can proudly say, it kills CrApple iJUNK 6+ and many android phns out there. I do NOT have ANY issues with Apps or LOVE all the software it comes already loaded on out phns. like Here Map, that is owned by Nokia, and used by MANY GPS Nav devices in cars and portable prods out there. Even my 2012 Ford F150 with Nav, uses Here Map, along with my Garmin GPS. Here Map comes on out Win phns and its AWESOME. Our Lumia Camera software is unlike any smart phn Camera software out there, and its awesome too. is like having a professional camera on a cell phn. ppl like Avik Biswas, just like to BooooHoooo and whine and complain about stupid stuff. I also enjoy my MS Office in out 1520 as well. Not to mention since 1520, 930, and iCon have 4 Microphones, it does surround sound when you record a Video. With Denim update we can do 4K Video recording as well(still waiting on Denim on my phn). As for Tiles, few weeks ago, i read here in WC, it is #1 request on Win10. yes the same ppl like Avik Biswas that BoooHoooed so much when Win8 came out about those tiles, and suddenly LOVE IT and want it on Win10. I personally LOVE IT ever since i got Win 8 when it came out, and i LOVE my LIVE TILES too.  
  •   no you can't:D  also, to add some reality here: ford has dropped MS in the car, but for the giant list of stuff you can't do, because of the app shortage, your posts are completely insane. 
  • Do you think we (the "supporters") are supporting MS the right way by owning their products and then complain about them?
      So to support MS products the right way, you have to own and love the product reguardless of how the product actually performs in comparison to it's competitors?  Seriously, the hive mind in these sites is disturbing.     
  • Exactly... Well, said...
    And, it's called constructive criticism...
  • So why would you buy a product knowing that it doesnt perform well compared to it's competitiors in the first place? Oh yes, to post complaints on websites.
  • I think you severely underestimate the attitudes of younger people today. And I say that as one. Yeah, I truly truly think in certain cases it is really just a middle finger to Microsoft and nothing more. In other cases, maybe not.
  • No. These little fucks really do have personal grudges against MSFT for whatever misguided reasons. There is absolutely no denying that. So fuck 'em. MSFT has bent over backwards to try to partner with them, only to be insulted. So now MSFT should just crush them with superior products of their own making. Time to kick the Band into overdrive in this case.
  • Regardless of what you say, what company wouldn't want to potentially have all their dev expenses paid for and release on a platform where smartwatches are not readily available? - They don't have to do anything, Microsoft has done the work for them already by creating a fully polished app that works. They are missing out on potential customers that could run into the millions, who in the right mind wouldn't want that extra revenue? - It just doesn't make sense and your comments regarding the MS not doing particularly well are true, but yet, they are still around and still have a 3% odd market share worldwide with devices sales going into the 10s of millions... If only a million of WP users would want a Pebble, that's still a heck of a lot of revenue for Pebble... Because it makes zero sense for a company not to release on WP when all their dev work is done for them, it makes me think there's something else going on that we at the low level are not aware of...
  • Or we just don't know what MS would ask of Pebble in the future. Maybe it's not the future the CEO wants for the company. What's wrong with that?
  • You claim to know all about business. There were no costs and plenty of benefits for Pebble. There was zero risk to Pebble. Microsoft developed the app for them. Microsoft was willing to retail shelf. It was an anti-MS bias from the CEO. No blame on Microsoft on this one. If anything it sites that this stuff is NOT about seems personal.
  • No way he read the article and posted such a long comment before anyone else. Troll confirmed.
  • I read the entire article.. That comment just looks flat.... I've been with WP since the beginning, but I'm not dumb enough to go around calling other members trolls.. Get real..
    Besides, you need to be coming up with more to support your opinion besides calling people trolls.... Now, be serious, and tell me why you don't like my point.... I'll be happy to hear you out.
  • Maybe they didn't like your point because it's their personal perception and to them it's an educated and very clear observation and they don't feel like doing the work for you. :)
  • Lol... IDK..
  • Maybe it's because it is so easy to cast blame rather than solutions.  Here is a very simple question.  What specific steps would you suggest MSFT try, that you can verify they have not tried, to improve the adoption of Win Phone ?  Here is another.  Do you believe that Verizon actually ever really tried to sell WinPhones before dropping the Lumia line completely ?   I'm not making assumptions.  I've spent a lot of time discussing this with people inside VZW and MSFT.  If VZW makes no effort to sell the phones, do you think anyone really knows what the device can, and cannot, do ?  
  • Your point is simply completely irrelevant to the last two years. What does it matter now if microsoft was too slow 8 years ago? What matters is that they have been doing the right thing lately (at least the last couple of years) and are doing everything possible to win over developers. Crying over what happened 8 years ago is just silly and pointless. What matters is the here and now and finding solutions. It's now clear that pebbles' CEO is a dick and Microsoft will be the one laughing matter when pebble goes under. Good thing they watches suck so either way we are not missing out on much.
  • No... I don't think I'm gonna think like that... Thanks for your opinion though, and keep supporting the platform❗
  • The condition WP is same as webOS. Only difference was Palm didn't have money and MS has cash to burn for decades on an absolutely failed product until it works. If today WP has 3% market share it's only because of Nokias good work and brand value. We Indians or probably Asians on a whole just love Nokias superior hardware quality so WP is quite popular here. WP is very beautiful but sorely, incomplete product. I completely agree with rod. Posted via the Windows Phone Central App for QWBASIC :|
  • "It's now clear that pebbles' CEO is a dick" Now that's a fast judgement.
  • He probably read the article. But Rod is just like that.
  • Ms ate all the costs developed the app even gave Cortana integration possible. Pebble just didn't want to. Pebble didn't spend a single dime on the app.
  • That's exactly my point....
    MS can do those things now, but it's what they haven't done in the past that's haunting them...
    Now, they want a piece of the pie, but developers, and companies, aren't willing to give any away...
    They are going to really have to figure out something special with W10 or the bleeding will continue..
  • Based on the article the whole reason for no WP support is because Migicovsky is a prick.    
  • He very well could be.....
    Microsoft better figure out what iDroid does to get on these pricks good side..... Lol.
    Because, lately it seems like they are being ignored by a lot of them..
  • Lol Rod
  • Market share drives it all. Like everything else in life ppl go where the money is. You have to admit that microsoft is making some good decisions lately and w10 is shaping up quite nicely.
  • You're exactly right in every single thing you say, my friend.. Can't argue with any of that, and the future looks bright...
    But, currently market share is low, so we must point out why it is still low after 5 years... IMO it's because of action not taken on MS's part.. So, when we see these types of articles we should point the finger at MS,, even though it's hard to at times...
  • There are instances where the auto blame Microsoft recordings don't fit. This is one of them.
  • As a software developer, I can tell you without a doubt MSFT has made substantial efforts since releasing Win 7 to attract people to create apps ... free training, free software, extensive modeling, and prototyping devices. It's gone on for years, not just the past year.   Why Android ?   Because the vast majority of smart phone buyers walk into a carrier's store and ask for recommendations.  Sales people get great bonuses for selling Droids ... so they actively steer buyers away from iPhone and WinPhone.   In fact they never even mention those. I've sent people into the stores to ask for WinPhones and the sales people do everything in their power to push them into a Droid.   It's not about quality, or what is appropriate for the consumer.  Its all about those $$$ commissions.  
  • So the problem is there right? So why doesn't MS up their commissions? I think this is what Rodney is also pointing towards. We know there is a problem of perception. So what is it that droid gives those salespeople? MS can give a better commission.
  • Maybe.. That could be a variable..
  • Verizon gives the commissions.  Go to a VZW store.  Of 55 phones on display, you will see 2 Apple, maybe 1 Win Phone hidden away, and all the rest are Droids.   Ask VZW why they pay spiffs on Android phones.  Ask why the store managers decline free sales training for their staff members from MSFT.   Ask the sales people what is going on.  In fact, see if any took the time to learn about any of the features in a win phone.  
  • It's about carrier relationships and 5 years ago Google hopped in bed with Verizon and gave them a smartphone to compete with the iPhone.
  • Shhhh, Tim. The know it alls don't care about reality. They seem to have secret MBA degrees and preach that this is all about "business", however they decide to define it. Apparently, Microsoft doesn't know business, nor does anyone who works with them. Only those avoiding Microsoft are business savvy. We've been hearing about the efforts of Microsoft for years, but that doesn't fit the know it all script. You'll be marked sheep fanbou because you don't hold Microsoft exclusively for the actions of other companies. Their fake MBA degrees don't know about anti-competitive practices. They probably thought it was "just business" when Microsoft targeted competing browsers and locked em out. They claim to be "fans", but it seems as though they will only be happy if they can turn as many people away from Microsoft, as possible. I wish more people would counter the hysteria with facts.
  • Bingo Rodney!   MS, IMHO is trying WAY too hard to not be like them, failing to understand that you can't beat them until you join THEIR game..
  • I kinda think that... There's just a lot they aren't doing....
    What a lot of people here fail to understand is that im not saying MS made some mistakes 8 years ago.....
    I'm saying that they've BEEN making mistakes for 8 years, or 5 depending how you look at it... It's an ongoing thing, and there's a big difference...
    The majority, though.... What can you expect.
  • The only way MS could get one these pricks' good side is to not be MS. Too many of these fools are basing their present day business decisions based on what they experienced when Ballmer was running MS, by what others in the industry are saying which are based on the past and by not being a "Hip" company simply because it's been in business so long. That's where its at. It's completely illogical way of thinking and I have first hand experience watching an organization spend significantly more money in hardware, development costs, and loss of functionality just so they can use Chromebooks instead of PCs running Windows. That's the new generation of pricks running companies now.
  • Lol! Pricks... You guys crack me up.. Pricks... Lol.
  • +1 Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
  • I speak from the heart...
  • That's a funny plus one coming from the Android app
  • Irony
  • Its easy to point fingers and say Migicovsky  was a prick - but thats oversimplification and may gratify your WP fanboyism a bit.   But RodneyJ is I think pretty accurate that this mess didnt happen overnight. MS lost the trust, lost the momentum, lost direction and still doesnt seem to show strong directional leadership for Windows Phone in particular. This is years in the making and Balmer's self-contained Microsoft vision was a big part of this mess. Maybe Satya is making some changes - but change comes slow. Just as it took many years for MS to lose the goodwill during the Antitrust years, it will take years to earn it back.  
  • If the foods laid on the table..What do you do..? Cook it again or eat it..? Why doesn't Pebble takes a bite then..????///
  • Exactly... It's just the reality of the situation... Looking at this article we need to address why, not just ignore it, and say, """well, we have Satya now, look at what they're doing now"...
    I've been saying that MS has poor awareness, and excitement, for WP caused by horrible Marketing... It's becoming extremely apparent now that we are actually witnessing WP failing... Heck, the name is even gone...
  • Self contained seems to be working for the current market leaders.
  • So sad. Some people are just plain mean.
  • I think it's time to show how we feel about that on his Twitter:  
  • Thank you. Prick and egghead describes him.
  • How do you know Microsoft haven't attempted such things in the past?!!!
    Microsoft was a corporate bully years ago. That angered people for a long time. So I think some of these young entrepreneurs enjoy being belligerent. They enjoy giving MS a bloody nose as recompense for all of the anti-competitive things MS used to do in the past.
    Microsoft are kind of reaping what they sowed. It's a real shame - because they are bringing so much positive stuff to the table these days.
  • Many here are to young to have seen how Microsoft used to be, they would force companies out and shut the down. It seems many in the tech circle aren't ready to forgive them yet. 
  • Apple has a history of screwing over its developers too. Hasn't seemed to hurt them all that much.
  • You know why❓❓❓ They are terrific salesman...
    Marketing is so critical...
  • You can't market to people who don't listen. There are grudges in the tech world against Microsoft and for some of them, no fancy commercials or print ads are going to erase that.
  • I can't really judge off the past as well since I wasn't in the tech world then, but I can look at it now and based off current events...I'd really call Google a bully as that's what they've been doing.  I fully expect in another few years Bing will have to pull down it's flight search due to Google purchasing the company which offered it to Kayak/Expedia/Orbitz/etc.  Waze I'm amazed is still on the wp platform after Google bought them.  I know Microsoft in the past did some anti-trust stuff, but I don't consider it so bad compared to Google nowadays.  I seriously expect Google to start trying to actively crash opponent's servers within a year with how they've been acting.  They already loudly publish zero day exploits before Microsoft can really look at it.
  • Google's been publishing exploits a month to a few weeks before they're patched, when the patch was already planned and in QA. Google's goal is to destroy Microsoft that much is certain based on their development strategy/priorities.
  • Bully ?  I've used MS products since 82, and as a developer for that same amount of time.  I've never had anything but great support. Ever heard of "King of the Mountain" ?  It's the ego game that many of the critics like to play ... trying to knock a leader off the hill.  In the 80's it happened to IBM.  .
  • So Rod, an apology from MS would be enough or what?
  • Dear developers and gadget makers, Microsoft has over $114 Billion in cash. Get off your fanboy high horse and work with them. -Consumers
  • That would be the smartest thing to do... Personally, I think the long term benefits would be great... But, I'm just convinced that developers are more concerned about market share, and I don't think that's gonna change...
  • But when you have sold only 1 million Pebble watches, even Microsoft's 40 million annual Lumia sales is nothing to scoff at.
  • True.... And, that argument has come up before.. I just don't understand it...
    It just leads me to believe that iDroid is so damn huge that to even bother with Windows is not worth the extra pocket change.... Maybe we as WP/Windows fans don't really understand the scope of how large iDroid really is compared to WP..... I pie chart might help... Lol.
  • Yes, but neither Apple nor Samsung were willing to shoulder the costs. Plus, both of them are now direct competitors to Pebble. Microsoft's Band is proof Windows Phone users will buy a smartwatch accessory that works with Windows Phone. Based on all this, I expect Pebble to change their mind soon and it'll probably be too late. Band is already the same price as Pebble's more expensive option and I FitBit is making inroads on Pebble's cheaper option. iFans will buy the Apple Watch and Android users will stick with Samsung's options.  Basically, Pebble's CEO's pride and bias probably cost Pebble its long-term viability.
  • I hope you're right... But at less than 5% world wide market share..... It's a huge uphill battle for MS..
  • So MS should give up because there is no hope in ever gaining more market share because "iDroid" as you say is "just too big"?
  • No.. Most definitely not... Android is big, but not too big.... Times change..
  • Fantastic point Bob. The problem with the decision that they made was that even though choosing to stick with Apple & Android exclusively they have a larger potential market share to work with they will not necessarily be as valued a client as they would have been with Microsoft. Getting into bed with giants like Apple, Samsung, HTC, & LG is dangerous because they can and WILL produce an equivalent product that will have a much more loyal and established base to pull from. They have basically inadvertently created an adversary from what could have been their most valued ally. All in all I don't think it will prove to be a smart decision on their part.
  • I agree but 40 million potential customers, well let's just say half that 20 million is a good chunk of change and a good way to add to your customer base. I think it was the simple pride of the Pebble CEO that lost them that potential customer base. I know android is a lofty size compared to WP but still, the fact that Microsoft was willing to cover nearly all the expenses of making the app, all they had to do was say Yes! Besides the Microsoft band, there isn't a whole lot of competition on WP in smartwatches. I understand Microsoft isn't a perfect company and clearly that was a reason why this potential partnership fell threw but you can also argue that the Pebble CEO needs to let the past rest in peace and look towards the future. I hope Pebble changes their mind and Microsoft still has this offer on the table otherwise I hope this decision costs Pebble money and potential customers. I for one will not be buying a Pebble unfortunately.
  • Ven diagram
  • That pie chart would look very similar to Mac vs Windows on desktops and laptops, but Macs still get software made. There is something deeper than market share going on. Market share is an excuse stat. Total users are still multiple millions. It's easier to get press and the ravenous fan base energized for word of mouth in the smaller Windows Store. A smaller developer can stand out and get noticed. The market share is everything myth is killing them, too.
  • Most of those devices costs less than the Pebble.  Nobody develops with the 300 low end derivations of Lumia in mind, they can't afford to buy Pebble's underlying product.  This market-share first strategy is a garbagey loser of an idea. 
  • Hey❗❗❗ Ding, Ding, Ding❗❗❗❗
    We have a winner, people❗
    That is a TERRIFIC point, and I never thought of that.... But, market share is important, just not indefinitely in every case...
    And, that's why it's important for MS to have strong marketing in areas like the US.. The reality is that they should be pushing high end just as strong as low end if they want to get somewhere....... Nevertheless, we can see something that MS is doing wrong that's not helping the situation...
    That's where I point my finger... But, great point❗
  • But what was the average price of these Lumia?...... Cheaper than the Pebble itself.
  • What they don't have is users and especially users with high disposable incomes.  The platform is devoted to non-US low end devices.
  • It's true, people with low end phones aren't likely to buy a watch that costs the same as their phone 
  • Note the "Even Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella was unable to persuade him personally." line. I bet that's why there's no app. If he's anything in direct talks like he's on stage (saying nothing at all with as many words as possible), I wouldn't be surprised that it alienated Pebble.
  • Seriously? Microsoft said they would make the app, eat all costs and pebble can own the app. The CEO said no cause Microsoft is old, out of date, & doesn't like the phone. Microsoft did everything they could.
  • Ya Rodney seriously? What are you smoking
  • What are you not getting?
    At what point are you going to start understanding that MS seriously dropped the ball in the past for too long... That's why this keeps happening...
    We can be fans of MS products, but we can still see the reality of the situation...
    Sure, just keep blaming everyone else. That's productive...
  • mate your patience is on point. it's impossible in these comments sections to raise any criticism against Microsoft. every point you've made thus far has been correct; it's really evident who is the fan and who is the fanboy. good stuff
  • He's not criticising, though, he's just continuing the vicious cycle of "Microsoft doesn't sell becuase Microsoft doesn't sell." The reality is that Microsoft has absolutely no power to decide anything in the mobile market. iOS and Samsung dominate the market, and Microsoft doesn't have the name or the mindshare to prove to the 1st world public that it's anything more than the Windows XP appliance that they still keep around for doing their taxes every year. In order for Microsoft to have reversed their fortunes, they would have had to bring out the iPhone before the iPhone or created Android before Google did. But even then, we can't say that The reason we love Windows Phone is because MS took some extra time to do it right. They could have had Windows Mobile 7 ready before Android became dominant, but they knew it was awful and needed to be redesigned. So they did. And we got Windows Phone 7, which was wonderful. And Windows Phone 8, and 8.1, and now 10, each iteration being better than the last. And here's the thing, even if they "did things different" and released an OS earlier, would it have mattered? Microsoft already had a shitty name. I have a feeling that the iPhone was ALWAYS going to streamroll Microosft. Same as Google's false open-ness message would ALWAYS steamroll Microsoft's public image. It's easy to look back and think "Oh they should have done this" but what's really hard is to make the right decisions now that create future success. And right now, from what I gather, it sounds like Microsoft is doing its damnedest to scrub its reputation little by little. Despite being consistently snubbed by elitist hipster CEOs or backhanded by other tech sites, or dismissed by OEMs, they still keep trying. They built a stellar app that blew away most of the company, even though they only had to create a bare bones one. They offered support, labor, money, everything. They did everything they could, and inevitably the CEO of Pebble rejected it for whatever reason. Fine. Oh well. Move on. And that's what they keep doing. They keep trying hard, listening to their users, changing things based on what the people want from them. More than any other time, Microsoft is showing that they care about their users, their developers, and their workers. They are doing the right things now, despite Windows Phone's shitty marketshare and lack of penetration in 1st world markets. I think that should at least be respected, and maybe even admired.
  • I guess you never heard of Photon..... In development earlier than the iPhone and very promising.... until MS high echelon cut the funds because WM was the king of the market. Same exact mistake made by Palm, a mistake that allowed MS to win by storm the PDA market.
  • Exactly, all he does is whine and moan like a little girl, never suggest anything actually useful.
  • With all due respect,,, that's the most brain washed, blind fan, sheepishly naive comment I've ever heard in my life.....
    But, I have to admit that I still like you because you support the platform....
    So, thanks for your opinion about me,, even though it's negative..... Whatever. I have extremely thick skin, my friend. Keep on keeping on❗❗❗
  • Taking neither side, every point he's made thus far has been only his opinion, not correct. Until, you hear it from the horse's mouth, as we did with Pebble's CEO, you don't know for sure why this happens. You have only speculation.
  • Thanks... There are some really true fans here..
  • People criticized Microsoft all the time. These oft repeated grudge mantras bring nothing new to the conversation and aren't backed by any data or sound business or economic theory other that quips like "3% market share lol", or "what aren't you getting?", or "this is business", followed with no business theory. It's baseless, non-productive, bashing that draws attacks.
  • Dude.... You are just replying to all my post saying to not believe, or post, what I believe...
    The only solution for you is to just ignore me if you can't handle my opinion... But, it's not going to change just because you counter it...
    Thanks for your opinion, but I've heard it enough.... You obviously don't like it when I post a comment, and it upsets you severally, so in the future just ignore it....
    I'm saying this because there's plenty of people who I was able to have a conversation with about what I sad without them whining about Rodney's opinion on every reply... That's pathetic... Get over it... But, mostly ignore me starting now... If not, then you're just here to argue, and I don't have time to for you emotional issues you have with me....
    Deal with it.....
  • You read an article and one point of view (Microsoft's) and you think that is eactly how is played out ? Really? Me thinks you are smoking some here believing in a simplistic viewpoint as this article. Maybe you do not understand how the market works and why new entrepreneurial companies hardly work with Microsoft. Just look at Dropbox, Box.Net etc - they all came out from nowhereand took on these big companies - till MS had to bend and now under Satya is regaining some working relationship a bit with these companies.  
  • @nilchak
    1)-Get a book on English learning.
    2)-Do you think that DropBox every caused a problem for OneDrive..? Compare their free and paid storages plus other service's integration.
    3)-Do you know how the market works..? 'Hardly works with Microsoft' I bet even without researching that Microsoft has ties with more companies that the total of it's competitor's. Microsoft earns from SourApple and FcukDroids even being their competitor--How..? Marketing strategies.
  • There's no reason to bash on someone's knowledge of a language. Especially when you made a few mistakes of your own. As long as the comment is coherent, there's no problem
  • @satrus08
    1)-I think you are new here cause folks have been bashing each other on OT, Bad Language, Irrelevant questions, and Racism nothing now I would say.
    2)-Quote and correct my lines if am wrong anywhere. Educate me please.
    3)-Coherent you say--He has written all BS.
    .....your point of point of marketing works.....Dropbox successful.....Microsoft had to bend.....
    You can keep the crap really.
  • Lmao! The fact that you don't see the mistakes in both your posts says enough. I am not going to drop down to your level and call you out on it. Looks to me like you are the only one giving people crap. Nobody else cared about his bad english just like they don't care about your bad english (your post was actually more annoying to read with all the.... ..... ..). What I'm trying to say is that, sure, you can argue against any points someone makes. There is no reason, however, to diss someone just because he/she doesn't know a language well. Lol. The more I think about it, the more lame you seem.
  • Your comment is clearly a 'save my ass comment' as-----------
    1)-Ye still didn't show me my bad English even on my asking you to do so.
    2)-Even I wouldn't've commented on his bad English had he not replied to my comment and said I was wrong and smoking, that too incorrectly and even now he's nowhere to be seen cause he knows he's made a mistake.
    3)-If you have problems reading my post and it hurts your eyes....
    Then please stop reading or keep on suffering in the pain cause I don't care.........!!!!!!!!!!
    4)-I had my points clear and I will say anything to him....Sue me if you can.
    5)-"Lol. The more I think about it, the more lame you seem."
    ^^This statement clearly shows a hysteria type of feeling and a person's state of mind when he has been proved wrong but he thinks that he can get his ass saved from whipping. Your LMFAO and ROLF are next to zero cause ye are sitting behind your screen sweating and pissing to get a comeback reply....Which by the most would be--"I don't reply to asses" "Am not dropping to your level" "I don't care as am on the top of this world".
  • If "ye" really insist on me pointing out one of your mistakes just look at the last sentence of your latest post. "I don't care as am on the top of this world". I think its time for "ye" to pick up a "book on English learning" and learn why that's wrong. If you want one more, as said in your first reply: "Do you think that DropBox every caused a problem..."   Huh? "Save my ass comment"? Save my ass from what? I don't see anything that warrants the necessity of saving my ass. You must really think you are all that. I wonder what makes you such a sour little kid.
  • 1)-Ye--That's a slang if ye don't know about it pick up a book or search the internet. Idiot.
    2)-Every--Meant to write 'ever'. And that is typo not bad English.
    3)-Save my ass--By it I mean to give a comeback reply and this line is generally used to depict a person saving himself/herself from a situation. Not what you are really thinking "You must really think you are all that." ^^This shows YOUR dirty and low-level thinking not mine. Ass.
    4)-Sour little kid--Well now I think you are one as you are fighting for some other person who isn't even bothered....And even getting beaten by a mere kid. Touché boy.
    Yours now----
    1)-Latest post--While it should've been 'last post'. Both are actually correct but you used 'last' in the same line and they don't go together. So you're wrong there.
  • No its not slang, idiot. Its an archaic form of "you" and an even more archaic form of "the".
    My sentence was correct, I said last SENTENCE of your latest POST. Seriously don't try to justify yourself if you have no clue what you are talking about. You didn't mention your sentence "I don't care as am on the top of this world. Why not, don't know what's wrong with it? My mistake if you are not a sour little kid. I just assumed that because: a)Someone argued against your points in a valid manner, you respond with "why don't you learn English first" b)As you said: "I think you are new here cause folks have been bashing each other on OT, Bad language, Irrelevant Questions, and racism nothing now I would say. -first of all, that is an incorrect sentence and it doesn't even make sense. Second, you try to justify yourself by saying people do worse stuff on the website!? Come on, seriously? Doesn't get any more sour, or childish then that.
  • Hey!!! Calm down... Why waste time talking about that when you could be telling us about how bad marketing is, and that it's all MS's fault❓❓ Tell us how you really feel... Lol.
  • Lol Rodney. Your comments.
  • Ye is the plural form of Thou. Thou=You, so Ye=You. And not related to 'the' by any means.
    Your sentence was wrong.
    1)-Don't manipulate my comment --It was just ONE of my points and I never emphasized on his English that much and really never meant to.
    2)-Empty brains that's a typo--Replace 'now' with 'new'. (and it's not bad English).
    3)-I didn't justify myself--What you are trying to doing is nothing less than of bashing itself and I meant to say that these things happen on a regular basis.
    4)-Am on top--Well yes the 'the' will not come. But-----Search-- Surprisingly it's correct. "I don't care as am on the top, of this world." Even I thought it's wrong.
    Last line of your comment is all wrong.
    Kid buy a sour candy and suck it.
    Even you haven't replied to all the points yet. STFU as am not gonna reply to you again. Ass.
  • Alright it was fun at first but now it's getting boring. Everything satrus said is right. Aman.... ye look like a fool, mate.   btw ye does also mean "the".   satrus, you didn't have to stoop down to his level and call him an idiot back.   EDIT: also satrus' sentence is correct. I know why you think its not correct, because I have been to India many times. Lots of people there use the word last in the wrong way. "the last sentence of your latest post" is correct
  • True, true... This is just MS's point of view... Good point.
  • This may be Microsoft's point of view, but that doesn't negate the fact that Microsoft put a lot of effort into this and Pebble backed out. The PR narrative was excluding the Microsoft point of view. I wouldn't expect Pebble to say "we just don't like them so we are saying no, no matter what". Hmmmm...q this some of that "marketing" and PR that people claim doesn't exist?
  • No.. That's not looking at the reality of the situation.....
    MS wants to redeem themselves now, when iDroid did what it takes in the past,, when it really matters... You're just looking at the problem on the surface... It's easy to feel sorry for MS on this one, but don't be Naive..
  • You can blame Balmer. But not this new MS. They are trying with what they get from that old and closed MS.
  • New MS!
    Chase leaving is NOW❗
    BOA leaving is NOW❗
    This Pebble situation is NOW❗❗
    Your new MS hasn't yet shown to be proven.. W10? That's the new MS you're talking about..
    Well, I news for you.. The market share doesn't reflect that W10 is strong enough for others to care yet...... Right now this stuff is happening because of what MS hasn't done, and we must understand, and address that..
    Therefore this is still MS's fault, and we must expect for them to take full responsibility... It's not the popular message, but the unpopular message is usually the hardest to except..
  • One year? Really, do you want the CEO makes magic in one year? MS has changed a LOT this first year, all tech-news website notice that. You're just crying like you always do. His is trying to fix that mess Balmer left behind.
  • No, nobody expects thing to change over night...
    But, that doesn't mean you don't look at the bad decisions that were made in the past... My point being that we tend to put the blame on the wrong party most of the time...
  • Oh, this new MS is proven alright. .NET on Linux and Office on Android is all non-brainless people would need to be convinced.
  • Lol... That's not exactly the idea..
  • Good to see you here dude. 
  • FFS Rodney. If you're so disillusioned with this platform, go elsewhere...
    Seriously, I keep scrolling down this thread just to see other comments - but it is just you, with your emoticons and ...........................
    If you can't get beyond Microsoft's errors in the past, then just go and buy an iPhone.
    They made mistakes. They are trying to remedy them.
  • That comment doesn't help... Look. If youre not going to respond to me with something I can have a conversation with you about then ignore me completely... But, don't ever tell me not to make a comment because YOU don't agree with it.......
    Do you see how im responding to others, and they are responding to me❓ They might not agree with me but they aren't coming at me like you are... Just totally ignore me from now on to avoid conflict.. Will that work for you❓
  • Ok...I'll say it again;
    "If you can't get beyond Microsoft's errors in the past, then just go and buy an iPhone".
    Seriously....I don't understand what you think you are achieving by relentlessly moaning about the missteps MS took under a different CEO!
    Quit being critical of MS when it comes to partnerships like Pebble. MS clearly did all they could. There's no accounting for the whims of an immature CEO of a startup!
  • Short reply... No..
    Blatantly telling people to quit thinking a certain way is not respecting their opinion.. If you don't agree with me, then fine.. But, express it in other ways... You seen upset, or angry... That's unnecessary, and I'm not dealing with that anymore... So, I'll tell YOU one more time..
    Either find another way to communicate with me, or ignore me... Can you do that? If not then we might have to go to WC for a solution.. It's your choice.
  • Tell us what MS should have done differently in this specific situation. And remember that they don't have a time machine to go back and erase previous mistakes with. Please, educate us.
  • See... That's what you don't understand.. I don't know if fans like you ever will, but it's fine.... It's because you see this as an isolated situation, and it's not about this specific situation... No offense, but you think MS's mistakes are in the past, well think again... No, I'm not worried about this specific situation, and talking about it will get us nowhere near the root cause... This specific situation, and many others like it, are just the catalyst for any criticism I give to MS... It's obvious that you don't get it.. It's so far away from what you're struggling to understand, and where my, and many others, idea about WHY THIS KEEPS HAPPENING is at... Root cause... And, I my opinion it's marketing.. Others may think it's something else... But, my comments are based on what I think MS has not yet improved on, and what they show no significant sign of improving on, because they haven't fixed it in five years...
    Maybe that's why you, and others, don't understand why some of us put the blame on MS... All I can tell you is stop looking at the surface.... Imagine a long line of dominos stacked up and knocking the next one down for five years strait... Maybe, you think MS's bad decisions, and bad days are behind them, and you're free to think that.... But, understand this.. When I say that 5 years of horrible marketing is WP's biggest issue, and the cause of all, and every problem, WP is still facing with market share,,, I mean it. And, nothing is going to change that until it's fixed.. That's my right, and you can question it all you want, believe it, not believe it, ignore it, or sit on it until you get it, but it will not stop being relayed until I see progress..... You know where I stand now... And, no.. I'm not about to get into what's technically wrong with marketing, because we've been there to many times already..... I'm on a different road now, and although it's the long stretch I'm in it for the long haul...... It'll pay off, so don't worry, just do what you have to do.....
    Thanks for hearing me, and thanks for being a Windows fan..... We might not agree with each other, but I'm sure we both hope for the same thing..
  • I think there is a disconnect between what I am writing, and what you are reading...
    People don't come to these threads to read your relentless commenting about the errors Microsoft made in the past. Perhaps if you were offering something constructive, it wouldn't be so frustrating to read all that you write!
    Also, it's very difficult to ignore you when your comments dominate these threads. & I personally don't want these threads to be full of negativity - because that negativity will become a self-fulfilling prophesy (and who wants a world where you only have a choice of Apple, or Google!!).
    Just remember, there are lots of app dev's that view these forums. This relentlessly negativity will eventually start changing the direction developers choose to take.
    So please, be positive, or be constructive. But don't just spin the same record about past errors.
  • No.. I will post what I want... No!
    I'm not here to please you..
    Please just ignore me... That's the last time I'm gonna ask you before I report you for harassment.. It's that simple..
    Im not willing to accommodate people like you because you don't know how to accept peoples opinions... Therefore Im asking you to completely ignore my post before it has to go any further.... Thanks for your cooperation.
  • Almost no one on these threads is supporting your position. Most people are like me; tired of hearing your utterly unconstructive commenting.
    Feel free to 'report' me to Windows Central. I am quite confident that any reasonable person would see I am offering constructive criticism that if you took heed would actually make you a more highly regarded commenter on here.
    As things stand, you are really annoying a lot of people on here.
    At the very least, if you are going to persist with your stance, just say things once on a thread. Don't spam it with a constant regurgitation of the same old tired comments.
    Take notice of all the people on this thread who are critical of you. & just try and be something positive instead of relentlessly negative.
  • .........................
  • missteps in an industry like this take awhile to clean over mate. all the shortcomings of every mobile windows iteration has really cost them. just because there company has a new CEO doesn't mean those previous mistakes aren't affecting them now
  • This is a variable of my point.... Although, many of my points are based around poor marketing, and that angle, the angle you mentioned is important to not forget.
  • Whatever Micrsoft might have done in the past, Pebble is still a startup that should use all the help it could grab at this point in time. By all indications, MS is providing that app free of charge! I really don't see how that shouldnt work for Pebble. It is not smart for Pebble or any other startup to give up such level of support because of ego and some outdated opinion about another tech company.  
  • See the violence inherent in the system...hark hark...Rodney's being repressed!!! Lol
  • Rodney, you sound like a bitter old woman..."oh look what MS did 10 years ago." Over and over and over. Please, get yourself out of the past and forget about it. This is now. And let's be makes absolutely no sense for Pebble to reject an app they paid nothing to develop, that would open them up to millions new users. Even in your world that makes no sense. Admit it.
  • If you think that it's still not happening today then you are truly delusional.....
    Are you not aware..... Nevermind. Your comment isn't even worth the time... Just ignore me..
  • People like you damage the Microsoft image and reputation with all your negative comments. Also, I have noticed if anyone dares to stand against you, then you have a go at them or belittle them or slag off their use of the English language or just say their opinion is worth nothing and to move on. Well everyone's opinion is just has valid as yours because it is that, their OPINION. Now I don't care if you tell me to do one or slag off my use of the English language. Finally, as many have said, if you are not happy with the Windows Phone ecosystem or where it can go from here, then buy a phone from a different platform.
  • Rodney, I feel your passion and I appreciate you adding a dissenting opinion to the conversation. But, that's just it. This is your opinion. You have a theory on why things are the way they are, and that's great. But, your posts are beginning to paint that theory as factual. Now, judging by your first few posts in which you did state that this was your opinion, failing to do so in later posts may be because you've responded to a ton of people, and writing this is my opinion every time becomes tedious.   So, that I understand. Carry on.
  • Lol!!! Nice. You carry on as well..
  • +1020
  • Damn, you are the king of crybabies. Wow, man... SMH
  • According to the article, this dates back to early 2013.
  • iDroid dates back to 2006-7.. IDK... But, 2013 is exactly what I'm talking about... It's just much later than the others...
    We must believe that MS could've done more to make WP more popular in 5 years.... It's not acceptable.... How many of these fails can you guys read until you start to see that MS has made some serious mistakes that they can't afford to keep making..... Lets stop making excuses, and address the issues❗
  • Agreed.
    WP 10 is the last shot for me. Otherwise I would've to become an iSheep.
  • Lol! Im hoping for the best..... I can only complain about marketing for another decade.
  • Lol Rod
  • You are so fixated on their past missteps but I have yet to hear a solution from you that trumps what they tried with Pebble. Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
  • I've spent years saying solutions... If you're new here im sorry... But, to sum it up,,, all things marketing.. Sorry if you don't agree.
  • Tottaly agree with you. MS needs more marketing.
  • Exactly. Rodney just moans incessantly, but adds nothing!
  • Rodney, im going to agree with you on MS and their image. I'm 38 and hated Microsoft from my late teens until I was in my early 30's and the xbox360 changed my opinion. Then I picked up a WP7...and I'm all about brand loyalty now. Basically I think my hatred was because everyone hated Microsoft so I followed along. I wanted the original Xbox to fail a miserable death, but Im glad it didn't. I grew up and realized how awesome they made gaming with live and the constant changes to the 360, that my second ps3 (first fried out)became a glorified bluray player. Point being they didn't change my mind with marketing, it changed by me testing the waters on a whim. Not many people have the income to do this though and im not their target audience anymore at my age. They have a long way to go, but whether its too late for WP is still the question...ill be using WP until they stop supporting it. Im officially a MS household now....
  • And when does Pebble date back to? You talk about MS not doing enough and failures, yet this article states that MS bends over backwards to court companies - in particular Pebble in this case - and their founder squashed the deal. What can MS do if they build the app, agree to promote it and help the company in every way and they still don't agree to it based on their own hang-ups? Your taking an assumptive generalization and applying it where it doesn't fit.
  • How would you go about addressing the issues???...does no good for us to talk about them here honestly...
  • Everyone knows they have. What does that have to do with this article? You're not making any sense, dude. And I usually agree with you!
  • Yes they are behind with WP but still I can't get why Pebble is backing out..!!
    The food's laid on the table..Why not fucking eat it..!! Bet their CEO is paid..!!
    And one more thing.......
    I think Microsoft shouldn't 've done the 21st Jan event. Maybe on the HoloLens and The Surface Hub but not about Windows 10 or WP 10..Cause it doesn't lure the consumers towards their products (which are still in development and to be released in the coming months) but rather makes em itchy about getting it in a day or two..!! Like we have seen now regarding the Preview....Folks are literally bashing Microsoft for results now. @GabeAul is poked and clubbed everyday for no good reason. Folks don't give feedback they rather question Microsoft. And (after accepting the T&C) experiencing problems and heating of devices folks are like-- 'This is crap. Microsoft die.' 'My iDroid is much better than this'
    And the hatred is gonna increase when features/builds are gonna take more time to roll over to the public..!! (In case of WP firmwares like Cyan and Denim)
    And Microsoft also delays releasing of it's products to a lot of markets and not to mention lack of flagships (fingers-crossed for next week).
    Did forget----Wen In.
  • Because for entrepreneurs who create (and you must give it to Pebble to have jumpstarted this category), you cant buy off creativity and drive with money  - "food on the table" as you call it. Pebble raised a million dollars in 5 hours - talk about food on the table. Dont delude yourself into thinking only MS and big comanies can give handouts and these small startups will come feeding from the hand.
  • Why do folks here always get me wrong.......
    By food I meant 'a readymade WP app' not 'money' idiot.
  • The problem with the Kickstarter model is raising money only goes so far. If they have to license everyone else's technology - as opposed to inventing their own - they will lose in the long run. Apple, Google, Samsung, LG, Microsoft will out-innovate Pebble. It is inevitable. Raising money won't change that, as those aforementioned companies have a lot of resources and a lot of their own R&D to build off of.
  • Pebble has already been out innovated. Competing smart watches offer much more than what Pebble offers, still though, they have a strong following.  It's mostly iPhone users though, they don't have the Apple watch yet, so the Pebble is their watch of choice. Once the Apple watch drops though, Pebble is fucked, and they'll probably regret turning down Microsofts deal.  Actually, they'll probably release a Windows Phone app once their fans abandon them. We Windows Phone users sometimes only get the apps when developers run out of money. 
  • Most insightful post so far.
  • It's terrific!!!
  • You seem to be blaming Microsoft for the lack of marketing their consumer products. That's fair enough. Apple has dominated when it comes to marketing. But the sky isn't falling. And lets face it, Microsoft has historically been a company for the enterprise, not the consumer. Although many consumers perceive Microsoft as a company that's "lost touch", that very same company is the backbone of many services we use daily on any OS including the competitors of Microsoft's consumer products and services. Microsoft is just as relevant today as it ever was because they have demonstrated just how quickly they can dominate an industry... That industry is cloud computing and Microsoft's Azure is likely hosting many of services used on the iOS and Android devices. How many of micro's businesses pull in a billion dollars annually? 17... Just think about that for a minute... Microsoft is earning regardless if they are providing the product or service directly to the customer. They seem to be very much in touch with reality to me...
  • Oh, yeah.. Im just pointing out the reason why these things happen... Now, personally the things that MS is doing now give me plenty of faith.... But, that doesn't mean that I'm going to go around blaming others for MS's mishaps....
    I agree the sky isn't falling..... Just MS fans can't accept the reality of their favorite company without getting their feathers ruffled..... But, of course there's still plenty of hope.. MS is huge❗
  • Rodney: here to ruffle feathers since 2013
  • Ummmm, probably longer than 2013.. Give credit where credit is due....
    This conversation is getting somewhere..
  • First you make it sound like the sky is it's not. You go back and forth agreeing with some and not with others it seems.....
  • No.. You perceive that's my tone... Which its not.. I even mentioned there's hope in the very first comment of this post, but your filter won't allow you to see that.... I'm just being FRANK as usual.. Get used to it.. And, we need more people like that, if you ask me...
    And, of course I'm gonna give credit where credit is due.. What are you suggesting that I nit be reasonable???? Huuhh❓❓ You lost me on that one..
  • Listen to yourself: "MS fans can't accept the reality of their favorite company" What reality? That they were blindsighted by the iPhone? Everyone was blindsighted by the iPhone. If you asked anyone who used a smartphone back before the iPhone whether touch was the future of computing, they'd say you're crazy. Nobody believed in capacitive screens. NOBODY. Funny enough, styluses are now starting to come back with the Galaxy Note and Surface Pro. Hmm. Funny how that works. Let's see, what else? Marketing? Do you honestly believe that if Microsoft released an WinPhone that was EXACTLY the same as the iPhone and then Apple released the iPhone the next month, that anyone would have given a damn about Micorosft's product? No, absolutely not. Microsoft's image has been associated with dull appliances for decades, it's pretty damn hard to scrub that. Now, if you take that from a marketing perspective, you'll see how much of a mountain Microsoft needs to climb to get their name above Apples and eventually Googles. Oh and by the way, Google's been blatantly lying about being "open-source friendly" for years now, but nobody cares. Why? Because Google picked an anti-Microsoft platform just in time for Microsoft to start losing relevance. How far do we have to go back in time before Microsoft's image is positive? Pretty far. Nothing they can do about it now but keep trying. And speaking of which, your "accept the reality" talk is nothing but defeatist. Microsoft's not willing to admit defeat, why should it's fans? I'm going to keep supporting the platform I love because I love it. Part of being a fan is taking the good in with the bad. I mean, hell, talk to any sports fan. I will not dispute reality, I absolutely understand that Microsoft made missteps, but its really easy to attack the past, because hindsight. What impresses me is that Microsoft is doing the right thing NOW. They are listening to users, implementing our feedback, catering to developers, bending over backwards to capture businesses. They are doing everything they can do and not giving up, despite all the negativity and all the press and all the commenters telling fans to "accept the reality." So when I see that, I want to root for them. I'm not giving up because they won't. It's not that we're not willing to accept reality, it's that we're not willing to let the mistakes of the past define us.
  • Agreed with all of this. I LOVE my Lumia Icon after the Denim update, but the lack of quality popular apps is starting to kill even me, and I don't even really care about apps!
    I really have no idea how MS will fix it, but I'll hang in until the bitter end.
  • True... But you have to face the reality.. And these aren't exactly mistakes of the past....
    Has MARKETING improved yet❓ ..... You better not say yes... Lol.
  • Quite a fat troll you are.
  • What❓
  • 100% in agreement. I like the platform because it has everything I need and the interface in dynamic. I am often confused by those that get upset over the 1-2 apps that get away but don't celebrate the 4-5 that join. Maybe I haven't been a windows user long enough (1yr now) but I will say I can't see myself gong anywhere else. Not only that but my family is slowly joining my (my sister convinced me). I also like the community very passionate with a love of technology. I've learned so much from little things here and there in the forums. So MS has acquired a "ride or die" chick and I think that W10 will make a difference. They are doing a few things "keeping their name on many lips" some good some bad. Continuing to listen to user feedback. If you don't have a office 365 account for business you should get one and start playing with SharePoint. You will find that you can pretty much build whatever you would want in an app (as long as the info is online). Put your money where your mouth is and become a MS partner. The goal for he software is to be everywhere and working on MS devices have a distinct competitive advantage over others because it is more than a glorified file storage program. (I shall get off my soap box now)
  • AND we don't know nothing about such huge company's business plan. We know nothing about Msoft's strategies and some users keep writing all over internet they know what is going on. I mean, really? What if nothing is wrong (which is probably the case)? What if royalties are a big deal (and they are, surely)? I feel like these guys need some remedy (maybe study more) to get to see what goes behind curtains with those giants. Main thing is: we (consumers) know nothing (we can demand everything which is different of pretending to know answers to issues). Start humble, then, maybe, we start seeing some of the cycles of niches and products' life cycles. But no, they need to write anything without compromise. Ok, once we get it (any guy will always be wrong at a given time). But everywhere talking bullshit about a company that has 90% of PCs? Tell me something else because this will never persuade me. I'm with you on this W_Bard.
  • Do you have the same opinion with the car company you buy from? That is a big investment, but I don't think you have any idea whatsoever about the companys business plan nor anything else you put in your pathetic post. Stay with whatever your using, and leave us alone.  
  • Absolutelly. The exact same opinion. I don't have any idea and I buy them as I buy my phones. The difference is I don't write about things I imagine as being arguments which support my thesis. AND, that is IF I would care enough about the car market. Have you heard anything about the word "speculation"? One can speculate, but to confirm without any knowledge on facts is ridiculous. On the contrary, I love the smartphone wars... And.. If you read carefully, I don't call anything as being "pathetic". And the "leave us alone" for me sounds like ..... nothing. Be happy man. Pro tip: read more. Your arguments are yeah, pathetic. Sorry about my english. Not my first language.
  • Microsoft was an enterprise company but now it's a consumer company..!!
    Now don't say that--WP, The Band, Surface and Xbox are enterprise.
    And if they are a consumer company..Then your comment from the first line is wrong.
  • Now if the same energy they out into cloud computing was out into Windows Phone especially on the marketing front then we can see some real improvements. I think though a more nuclear option may be in order to straighten up the attitudes of some of these Silicon Valley types. They have billions in cash, repatriate some of those billions, take the tax hit and go shopping up and down Silicon Valley. Buy apps, devices, websites, journalists, engineers, marketing, mindshare, do whatever it takes to win because right now Cloud First, Mobile First is only working for Cloud.
  • See... I like your comment because you actually addressed the fact that MS could do much more.. You understand that it's up to them, and this situation is in their hands....
    That's attacking the root cause... Great point.
  • I see your point Rodney :/ sad but true...i still love my Windows phone, hopefully Windows 10 will change all that, what developer will ignore a market of hundreds of millions, right?
  • But that's what the article of Pebble proves.. They will ignore WP not because of profit or marketshare but personal bias and ignorance. When WP does take off let's make sure all these companies get the same cold shoulder they displayed us.. Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
  • Yeah.. It's just my honest, but sad, opinion about what MS has failed at... And WP was another failed project... Still think MS products are the best, but it's just been poorly managed...
    Still lots of hope though...
  • I been saying through my multitude of bans and reincarnations, 10 won't do anything. People are entrenched and invested.
  • So no matter what, everything is MS's fault and they can't do anything about it. So is your only solution to just shudder the shop and cash out?
  • Look further than pebble to understand WP's issues... It goes much deeper than this, and what MS has done here.... This incident just adds to the frustration..
    But, technically, yes this is MS's fault because of cause, and effect.... It just is.
  • I completely agree.  I'm sure MS's response will be to release 15 more low end devices under exclusive carrier deals in third world countries. 
  • Lol
  • MSFT should just buy Pebble and be done with it. They already have the app and could have the first truly cross platform smart watch. Plus it would irk the immature CEO to no end that his former company was now owned by a "non-hip" company like MSFT.
  • @madonato Ya and have a Pebble in the left and The Band in the right hand.......!!
  • Lol!
  • They should❗ that's what Apple, and Google, are doing right now... Heck, once they own everything MS is really good to be in trouble.
  • I'm going to guess that as founder of the private company, the CEO owns more than 50% of the company, and thus any decision to sell the company would need his approval to go through.
  • He's right. Unless he had to sell some ownership during startup.
  • Please enlighten us with your genius business plan that clearly all of the minds at Microsoft couldn't think of. If your answer is "throw money at them" then I shall call you Jon Snow from here on out.
  • I'm talking about the things they've done in the past that are causing these problems today.... Don't need to come up with an elaborate business plan for MS that's dumb, and they seem to be on track for the future.. But, we're talking about now... If you don't agree with the mishaps I've stated then fine.. Everyone is entitled to their opinion..
  • Past aside, you're commenting on what they're doing now is somehow their fault. How is going out of their way to build full featured app, footing bill, helping bolster distribution channels, marketing,etc. somehow wrong? You have a right to an opinion,I have the right to tell you you're wrong here.
  • Look... If you steal from your parents for most of your childhood, and now you're an adult, and want to redeem yourself,, your parents may still be hesitant to let you move back in with them... They aren't going to trust you overnight, and it's gonna take time... Time, and trust here is like market share... MS still hasn't "proven" themselves.... To someone on the outside looking in (a WP fan) your parents might appear to be just being mean... But, the finger is being pointed in the wrong direction...
    So, building a full featured app might sound like a lot to you, but it's just a start to me... They still have a long way to go in gaining trust... So, when I see these articles I immediately say that it's still MS's fault because of what they didn't do in the past.... In this case what they are doing now is irrelevant to the argument because it's not bearing any fruit yet...... They aren't showing any tangible improvement yet.... The TP to W10 isn't improvement.... Increasing market share later this year is.... Or hopefully will be... So, the reality to the developers is that they are still doing horrible... Not that there's not hope, but we didn't make it to the playoffs for the 5th year straight.... You guys shouldn't be so relaxed on that idea..
    Thanks for hearing me out.
  • One right doesn't correct years of wrong.
  • Exactly...
  • Yes, but Google seems to be getting away with more monopolistic abuse than Microsoft ever did. YouTube definitely has that power. Google Maps is close. Gmail is pretty dominant. They use all of that power to determine who stays in the market. They are worse than Microsoft ever was, but they get the "it's just business" pass from MS critics.
  • Okay re reading your original response and I get what you're trying to say now. Thing is even back then Microsoft was probably doing same thing, just not as aggressive as they are today (which I think is point you're trying to make). The new regime has a very clear vision and I can tell you from working there, there is so much going on internally to align to this vision. I want working for MS under Ballmer so I can't speak to what they did our didn't do then. It just sucks when snotty CEOs who think it's cooler to snub Microsoft than make sensible business deals.
  • Yep.. I agree... Lets see what the future brings..
  • If you think they are on track for the future, then why moan so interminably about the past and the present?! Seriously, you're becoming a real bore on these threads.
  • I have my reasons, but I don't care to explain them to you.. So, I'm asking you to please stop harassing me..
  • You never cease to amaze me with your constant "Microsoft doesn't try" rabble. Did you read the article, AT ALL?!?!?!?!
  • I thought we agreed you would ignore my comments.. Do you need a reminder❓❓
  • It's hard to ignore stupidity on this scale, it shines like a beacon.
  • Are you calling me stupid?
  • Wrong person rod, that was spinzero, or some shit like that.
  • Now I'm confused... Lol.
  • Rod is talking about the 'past mistakes'.
    The article is different from em.
  • Great: Microsoft screwed up in the past. Awesome. Sitting around bitching about it won't do anything, though. And I've yet to see rod offer any suggestions on how to move forward. It's always, "Microsoft is doomed, they can't do anything, they screwed up too much in the past, it's over *insert excess emojis here*."
  • just ignore his posts like he said if you can't stop yourself from being upset. 
  • EXACTLY! & he feels like I am harassing him when I question why he NEVER adds anything positive.
    Windows Central is great....but he is single-handedly destroying the comments threads.
    Rodders - stop being such a misery!
  • Tell me if what he said was wrong. Microsoft does need to improve.
    And does anyone of you folks have any suggestions as to how Microsoft can improve..??
    Even most of you all folks can just blabber and nothing else. WC's reputation is many a times dirtied by fights, racist remarks, hurting jokes, getting back at the writers and negative suggestions instead to talks on WP/Microsoft and related tech.
    Even now.....
  • Rodney was/is wrong. He has been carping on about how Microsoft made errors in the past....and that it is Microsoft's fault for why the Pebble deal fell through. I can't see how Microsoft could have made a more attractive package, or helped Pebble any more than they did do. Microsoft are trying to court as many app developer's as they can. Unfortunately, when you come up against beligerence in the form of cock sure CEO bosses such as those at Pebble/Snapchat, it really doesn't matter how much effort Microsoft puts in. They just won't support Windows Phone. So given that Microsoft is doing EVERYTHING they can with companies like Pebble, I just don't see why Rodney keeps on saying that it is Microsoft's fault that the deal fell through. YES, of course Microsoft made lots of mistakes in the past. But are we really going to hold a rod across their collective backs -- or are we instead going to try and seek out positives?!! Personally, I don't come to these threads to read relentless doom and gloom from just a few commenters. It'll just become a self fulfilling prophecy. My suggestion for Microsoft. Give power users what they need in the corporate arena (Bluetooth HID / HDMI / USB OTG as just a start). Corner the enterprise market...and then let the power users force the hand of app developers. Focusing entirely on the budget sector means there is less incentive for developers to build apps. Nokia had the right strategy via their various app initiatives. They did a remarkable job given what they were up against...AND they consistently delivered high end handsets to us power users --- which helps us advocate the platform. Word of mouth is a far more powerful way of getting people on to this platform. If we have THE best cameraphone at every price point, & THE best top end handset, then every one of us will have a halo device that attracts people from other platforms. Microsoft is certainly going some way to doing that by releasing all phones with 1GB of RAM, and giving them all FFC's. However, the 1520/930 are old phones now....and it has been a huge error to not replace them with something that gives the platform real brand cachet. The 1020 may have the best camera - but it is too slow now... So yes, focus on delivering class leading devices at every price point (burn through some cash if necessary). QUIT releasing so many similar devices. Work on delivering software updates faster (ideally, all at one time ala Apple). & give us a halo device that allow us to claim that we indisputably have THE best cameraphone, or whatever else. Deliver great products, and you don't need to do what Rodney advocates. Or to put it another way, it isn't a marketing issue. It is a vision issue. Fewer devices, quicker updates, & a focus on the high end to satiate the needs of us advocates.
  • I couldn't agree with you more. It's always too little, too late Microsoft. I see Windows 10 failing in the near future if something has yet to be changed.
  • If they give WP/Lumia the Surface treatment, as far as marketing goes,, then we might see something happen... But, it's gonna have to be huge..
  • Dude. Really? Microsoft did all of this for the Facebook app on Zune and Windows Phone. They kiss ass, dump investments into Facebook back when it was basically Ello, and write and maintain the apps. Facebook's name is only on the Windows PC app. Pebble had a free app, free retail placement, free app maintance, and probably even some cash too, in exchange for allowing MS to get new Pebble features a little before iOS and Android.
  • Microsoft is paying Gameloft a ton of money as well. 
  • Yeah, they do all that....
    ....... Doesn't seem to work..
    It keeps the platform afloat, but afloat definitely isn't getting the job done..
    If they only put as much effort into marketing.
  • Just wanted to add to this and say that it sounds like Microsoft was asking a lot from Pebble. Even though it wasn't dev and cost, it was management attention. This same team was apparently trying to finish up all of there product development and prepare marketing a brand new product. Attention needs to be on that product that will align more with strategic vision with the company than a deal with MS. Its easy to get out the pitchforks for shifting attention to the new product than the partnership but I think it makes sense for the small company. Having said that, the product is out now and its a great time to start up those talks again. The Windows phone market is small but we're loud and willing to put our money where are mouths are.
  • Well said. For a small startup, concentrating on a new product, all eyes and minds have to be on that focus. There must have been too much dememned by the ongoing negotiations for which reason Pebble didnt find it worthwhile. Juat saying the Pebble CEO was a idiot or a dick is just too simplistic. Much as we want to support MS's overtures to Pebble, therenis always 2 sides to a coin. This article lays out the one side only.
  • There are three sides to a story. Your version, my version, and the truth somewhere in the middle.
  • When it comes to putting your money where your mouth is, you don't speak for everybody. Like I said earlier, a majority of WP users are on devices that cost not much more than the Pebble watch itself does. These people who spend $100 bucks or less on a phone aren't like to buy a smart watch to go with it. 
  • That is a good point...
    That really is a market share issue if you think about it... Just not enough high end device users...
  • You clearly didn't read the article.your comment reads like a lunatics rantings
  • Whoever your talking to, that's funny!
  • All companies made major mistakes that cost them something the only thing is that Microsoft was late to the game and still misses crucial points require to push their products into the right direction. They turned around surface and xbox. Made office 365 and azure into billion dollar businesses. But because of their history unfortunately Microsoft cant catch a break with devs
  • True... It doesn't mean that it's over with, it they can't turn things around, they are just going to have to go a very long, consistent, time of doing things right.... Now, looking at the current XBM app for WP,,, makes you wonder..... The problem is that after WP has been on the market for five years we're still wondering if a new software version will finally give us a decent music app.. After five years❗ .... The problems with the platform are well from being fixed, and right now is the exact time that EVERYONE needs to continue to keep putting pressure on MS to do better.... Much better..
  • WTF??? A company gets the app developed and maintained for FREE and even picks up a new sales channel through the deal, but when they so no it's Microsoft's fault? In what alternate reality is that even remotely the case?
  • Things aren't always as simple as it seems in even this reality... This is the reality you should be worrying about... Because, it's nit really about Pebble, or Chase... This isn't an isolated incident as some of you would like me to act... This is a huge issue that MS has yet to overcome... And, that, sir, is Microsoft's fault❗❗❗❗ lol. Lets be honest here.
  • Rodney is actually spot on. Most of you probably haven't been around long enough to know that he's not a "hater" but is a huge MS fan, he's just tired of everyone sticking up for MS lack of competency in many areas ( did I get that right, Rodney? Lol)
    Here's where is spot on: First, he did mention that MS seems to be getting things right lately BUT once again, they are late to the game! I firmly believe it comes from basically having a monopoly for so many years. In the pc age, for the average consumer, you had Windows on your computer and nothing else (yes, there was Apple & others but I'm talking about the average user...when they went to Wal mart, best buy, etc, every computer available had Windows). MS had no motivation to "get things right" because they were basically the only option and consumers had to put up with them. Then came the mobile/tablet world with iPhone & Google products who were innovating and offering customer service (something that is foreign to MS). It has been very difficult for MS to adapt because of the monopoly culture developed over the years. I love MS & almost always defend them but sometimes I wonder why and I can completely relate to Rodney's frustrations because there are so many things that Apple & Google get right but it feels like MS refuses to and it's mind boggling as to why bcuz mostly their products/software are much better than the competition on the whole if they would just listen to us users! As Rodney mentioned, they finally seem to be doing this but time will tell if it was "too little, too late"
  • You know what❓
    You just said EVERYTHING that DANIEL RUBINO wish he could say in an editorial....
    We need an honest editorial from all the editors on the situation...
    Nevertheless, even if Daniel would disagree with me I still would hold my ground because I KNOW IT❗ Lol.
  • Agreed.
  •  I own the Lumia 928, Microsoft Band, and Surface pro 3. The only feature Microsoft Band lacked when I acquired the hardware was the tracker for my biking which has been added yesterday alongside the keyboard. Pebble watch??????? Seriously????? I don't give a rats a$$ about such device more less their incompetent, so-called CEO! The ongoing hatetred for Microsoft will inevitably come to an end. I believe Apple, and Google has been paying certain companies to stray away from the Windows platform because the only chance they have at competition is "Lack of apps." Lately, the innovation has come out of Microsoft's labs. So many times I have red comments where a prospective customer is willing to give Windows Phone a try, but are in fear of the "App Gap." Windows Phone is in its own class and rightfully so. It's different, fast and fluid on low spec'd hardware, and doesn't resemble the alternatives. I firmly believe if the app gap wasn't an issue for Windows Phone the Market Share and Mind Share would be on par with the other two, eventually taking the lead. Bank of America along with Chase decided to to pull their apps from the store and opt to end support. All of this despite the fact that Windows 10 is due to bring a unified store amongst all of their devices. Microsoft may lag behind in the mobile market, however, they are ahead in the PC division. With that said the two banks' actions are not justified. This is their way of promoting Apple Pay. I'll support Microsoft all the way. Their isn't an app out there that can persuade my preference! Microsoft for the win!!!!
  • Hey, dude... We stand by every single thing you just said.... We all love MS products.. The whole idea of it being a success.... And, I could personally care less about pebble..
    These stories just explain the state of the platform.. They really show how far WP has come, and what's really going on... Frankly, it's not very good... That is something to be concerned about...
    Nevertheless, I like your passion.. Thanks for supporting Windows.
  • please uh... read?  Maybe even process what you read?  Then think, then write?  Then read what you wrote and ask yourself "Does it seem like I read this item before posting".  It may help you in the future to read before running your mouth
  • If you don't think I read the article then instead of commenting on that prove your point about what I actually wrote....
    Whose really running their mouth here? At least I have valid points... What's yours again?
    Counter me sensibly,, or ignore me.. Can you get to that❓
  • Guess you haven't noticed microsoft's work to bring a lot of apps to the Windows Ecosystem?  They tied in twitter, linkedIn, Gmail support (until google killed it), yahoo mail, and many others all into the OS.  They made a Facebook app for Facebook, they made a youtube app for Google.  They helped lots of other companies when they released apps on the windows ecosystem. I mean with your logic, I guess you blame Microsoft for not having any google apps?  Then again, you didn't read the part of the article where it said the CEO of Pebble killed the app?  Are you going to blame Softcard closing their windows phone app on Microsoft also?  Clearly Microsoft isn't trying hard enough... They lose money every year handing out their developer licenses for free.  Cloud services for online connected apps? Offered for free.  BizTalk offering with over $10K+ in the software? Offered for free.  Devices? often handed out for free.  Developer incentives?  Yeah, it's called DVLUP where devlopers get rewarded for making apps and making them good and constnatly updated..  Oh wait, Microsoft even took the high road and don't require folks to use their devices for their services anymore.  After all they put their apps on Windows, IPhone, & Android to offer feature parity.  I guess if my valid points aren't enough for you... well, *shrug* not my job to teach people who are unteachable.  You can lead a horse to water....
  • Guess you haven't noticed that WP hasn't broken 5% market share in 5 years....... Lol.
    Ummmmmmm, you're calling someone unteachable... Oh, ok....
    And, no I didn't know MS did any of those thing.. Thanks for delighting me with those tips.... Now that changes everything❗ Nevermind, I was wrong.. MS is doing just fine... Sorry, dude...
    Can you rest now❓
  • Lol
  • Hahaha.... These people,,, I love everyone here..
  • Do know whether to laugh or cry on em....
  • Macs haven't broken 8%. So?
  • The key is cross platform, whoever build an attractive inexpensive watch that works with iOS, android, and windows will win. I wonder if google could add iOS and Windows support to android wear... Well I could see iOS but no one likes to support Windows phone. Which is why I stick with android, I feel sorry for y'all. Microsoft updates other platforms with apps before there own. Really raising the bar high Posted via the Windows Central App for Android on my Oneplus One
  • You're delusional dude. I'm really beggining to think you get shitty drunk before you post here because you are making less and less sense everytime I see anything from you.
    If that's not the case then maybe it's time for you to abandon WP and go be happy elsewhere. This constant wet blanket routine is old and played the hell out.
  • Then why don't you ignore me starting now.. It would help avoid much conflict.. Please do that... Because, if you don't that means that you're just here to argue... Im not here to argue with you, so I you don't have anything logical to add then just ignore me... Does that make sense to you?
  • Rather than asking EVERYONE not to engage with about you just stop commenting yourself?! We're all sick and tired of hearing you spinning the same old yarn.
    Just dial things down...mesh some positivity with your negativity.
  • This entire article, and several other like this are littered with your "the sky is falling cuz MS doesn't know what teir doing" bull shit. You offer nothing but pointless, and aimless finger pointing and complaining. Yet you say I'm here to argue? See, that's what I mean by 'delusional'. There has been plenty of "logic" here, but none of it has come from you at all.
    Ignoring you is the easy part... but when will you learn that maybe you should just keep this unproven BS to yourself?
  • I have to say you're not right. If Microsoft needed the mobile vision 7-8 years ago, Pebble now act like MS years ago - blinded by success and without a true vision. I hate, Apple, Microsoft and Google for not working together for better user experience.
  • Apple, Google, and MS, are in competition with each other.... That's kinda a big deal.
  • You are quite right, but LUCKILY MS have changed theirs ways and seen the light. This is going to be a problem in years to come. Gates, Ballmer and the lot were flying on an imaginative cloud of disillusion of complete marked control.
    The biggest problem now being that Google and Apple are capitalizing on younger people thinking of MS as a dinosaur, and that makes no one lift an eyebrow over them pulling all strings to attack MS.
    Now Google is finally facing charges about competition. A thing that only MS have had to deal with in the past.
    The fact is that in some aspect MS is a dinosaur but in the mobile scene they are certainly the new smart guy on the block. Who has the most innovative, fastest and consumer oriented OS. Well lets just say it isn't Google or Apple...
  • True, true... That's why we're all with Windows...
    But, none of these great new ideas, and products will matter if.... Guess what❓❓❓❓
    If marketing tanks as usual....
    If I were you I'd start asking MS to seriously improve marketing worldwide... That's the best thing you can do for your platform... You'd be a hero, dude❗❗❗
  • Yes they really really need to up their marketing. I'm 31 and have NEVER seen a single MS commercial here in Denmark. Not even a Nokia one... And for some reason retailers aren't bothered with advertising WP either. I wrote a letter to all of the biggest in the retail business here, and of those who answered, the only answer I got was that they were sorry I didn't approve of their advertisement...
  • It's really not rocket science... Apple, and Samsung, do a terrific job with marketing, and they are doing great...
    MS does a horrible job with marketing, and they are doing horrible....
    Now, I'm obviously not a nuclear physicist,, but it's kind easy to add up a few things here...
    It's just weird that so many people here struggle with such a simple concept...
    It's MS's job to make sure everything works, and it's not working.... So who's fault is it❓❓❓❓❓
    Seriously... Seriously awnswer that❗
  • Well, MS of course :)
  • Naaaa... I blame Google.
  • You can't really blame a company for capitalizing on the publics crazy ideas that Google and Apple are the small-garage-startup-hippies that need support to get a foot in on the old nasty T-Rex that is MS ;)
  • You know I was joking, right??... Lol.
  • Hence the ;) at the end of my text ;)
  • You are beyond stupid. I've seen some foolish posts by you in the past, but this one takes the cake. The CEO of Pebble is a MS hater, and decided he wasn't going to let it happen no matter what. Please just leave the forum and OS so we can be rid of you forever.
  • That's what people like you will never understand....
    You're going on, and on, about pebble.... Screw pebble❗ Who cares about that❗
    You're calling me stupid❓ Ok... Maybe you're not using your brain.. IDK.... But, you better start paying attention more, and open your eyes wider........ Pebble.... Are you joking with me?
  • What more attention do I have to pay. Microsoft attempted to cater to Pebble, Pebble blocked the app from happening. That's what the article is about, that is what should be commented on. Maybe it's time you get banned from here.
  • No... I am commenting on why this happened to MS again.... If you don't like it then please ignore it... But, I will not cater to you...
    Now.. I don't like your attitude, so I'm ignoring you. Please don't harass me any further.
  • Your comment is off topic then, and I hate to break it to you,if you comment on a forum, you have to expect other points of view, that's not harassment.
  • No.. Once I say that I don't agree, and you keep replying back then it is.. Better yet... How about I'm ignoring you... Now, lets see what you look like having a conversation to yourself.
    So, here it is.. Please stop.. Ignoring you now.
  • Rodneyej blames Microsoft for everything. Shock and awe! News at 11. You are an idiot. Why don't you shut the f*ck up and go hang out on the Android and iPhone sites. I'm sure you would enjoy it much more.
  • You got to be fucking kidding me! They did all the work for Pebble, they paid everything for developing the app and where fully willing to pay for supporting and further developing the app and Pebble was the one owning it. Pebble got a fully functional app that would have let them tap in to a market with around 80/90 million users for free! And Pebble says no because they 'don't like Microsoft'?!?! The knew there feelings long before they started working with Microsoft, so why cancel it in the end? That CEO is insane! And I for one will never buy an Pebble smartwatch ever again! They just dont want to sell their smartwatches to tens of millions of Windows Phone users, what kind of business decision is that?!?!?
  • First of all, it's not about pebble, and pebble isn't the reason why this keeps happening to Windows... Second, I don't have to find ways to turn anything around when the root cause of the issue is quite obvious.... Well, at least to some of us... But, you can never depend on the majority to think realistically with their minds.
    If you choose to just look at the surface of the issue everytime one of these articles happens that's fine.... You keep doing that... You just keep NOT looking deeper...... But, don't expect me too..
    And, next time read all the comments, especially if you're going to reply this late... A thousand other people already wrote the same basic, elementary defense you just did... So, go back though the comments because I'm not, and shouldn't for reasons that should be obvious, going to repeat myself.
  • It's been 8 months and your comment still makes me laugh at its ignorance.
  • Time to sell my new pebble... Hopefully MS band will be available to our country...
  • I wish it was available in the USA
  • So is this article saying that WP users won't get to use that ugly outdated looking watch?
  • Selling your Pebble(if you really have one) won't hurt them, they already got your money. 
  • smash it to pieces and put it on youtube.
  • So damn stupid
  • All I can say is DON'T COME BACK CRAWLING!!!!
  • Band is better anyway
  • I do think the band is way better :)
  • Lies hope for a version two..
  • Letting personal feelings get in the way of business? This guy is young!
  • Seriously. Immature move on his part.
  • Second that. Blind and week decision. I see the long google arm here...
  • Let's be perfectly clear here, nobody is losing money by not developing for WP.  It barely registers on the mobile reports and its users are almost entirely low end consumers with small disposable incomes that own one of the 200 or so fragmented, confusing low-end devices.  That is the sad state of affairs for WP enthusiasts.  While I wrote this, MS released another low end lumia exclusive to Tonga.
  • 74% of androids are low end androids. Only 7 apps are ever installed on a vast majority of phones for android. Your reasoning is delusional that simple.
  • 26% are not and Android represents 20x the market share of WP each quarter. 
  • closer to 10x in usa but sure.  now once more realize 7 apps per phone.  there are probably more wp users than total pebble users.  but we can do stats all day.
  • Let's see your source for the Android stats. 
  • To be fair, Jack didn't specifically mention money. He has a great point that letting personal feelings that seen really superficial get in the way of lucrative business is a bad look. You're right too, though, he's not losing any money at all
  • Yes, but he is not making any either.
  • But considering that Microsoft was willing to absorb ALL COSTS for this partnership, Pebble literally had nothing to lose. They declined because they have personal resentment for Microsoft, period.
  • You don't get it do you? the Mobile Market especially in the Gadget sector is all about opportunities as it is growing in an enormously fast pace. The wider your reach, the better your market position. The only factor that is in a position to actually cut through this, is cost. Microsoft gave Pebble a big opportunity by making them clear to (a) heavily promote their smartwatches (b) reserving them a spot in every single of their stores and (c) which in my opinion is the biggest opportunity-factor for them, "having a multibillion giant as one of their close partners". Microsoft also decimated the cost factor for Pebble by guaranteeing them to absorb any resulting developement costs of the App. You have to be really dumb not to grab this opportunity by its feet, which I don't believe as I am more than sure that pebble has some really good and intelligent market strategyst. Think about it for a sec, no impact on your budget and a foothold in a non crowded young and growing ecosystem basically over night and you still insist not to support it? There has to be some personal grudge.
  • If I could give you a thousand thumbs up or more I would. The rationale from the Pebble CEO makes no sense. Clearly he has resentment issues and is living too much on past decisions. Lost a huge window of opportunity the way I see it.
  • Sad but true. And the last line made me LOL
  • Exactly.... It's amazing how the minority gets what the real issue here is, and the rest continue to blame everyone but MS... Wow.
  • Yup, far too green to be a CEO.
  • Arrogance plain and simple. Same deal with snapchat. The apps aren't there because they are petty and don't want them to be. These jerks need to be exposed for what they are with more articles like this.
  • Let's not forget that this is just an interpretation of one side of the story. There is likely more to this. The point made above about the clash of immediate interests is valid; they need to focus on their new product and making sure it works perfectly on the more popular platforms. The talks with MS might continue after that is released.
  • This is awful! How can they choose not to support WP when they would not even have to invest into the development of an app. This just makes no sense. The CEO can't possibly hate Microsoft that much, can he?
  • Of course he can. And let's face it, with WPs market share there was little to lose by giving in to the hatred.
  • OMG, That's so ridiculous. Disgusting. I don't have words to express how I see this.
  • MS can't publish a "third-part" app? They could build their own Pebble app like these others devs does.
  • Of course not man.
  • Not their style. They prefer to have permission because it just avoids headaches. Now, I wouldn't be surprised if Rudy were to get ahold of the code...
  • Exactly. MS should send the code to a good dev like Rudy, and let him make his magic.
  • Then have it 'tinned' /s\
  • There's a Pebble app in the store - but it don't use the Wearables APIs properly, so the watch only works correctly when the app is pulled up. And naturally, not everything works as it does on Android and iOS. Mind you, it's a 3rd party app, of course.
  • What they could do is see about API and bake support for various devices into their Microsoft Health app. That was my understanding. Plus, the current partnership with Fitbit seems to be thriving despite all the reasons people cite for Pebble pulling away. They need to stop viewing these things as us vs them and realize it is their own customers they are screwing, not Microsoft.
  • Yeah, but how much is Fitbit really getting out of it? MS is probably paying every single dime of Fitbit's costs, just to be able to use their cachet to sell WPs. I bet Fitbit barely sees a blip in their sales from WP users.
  • They can't because the Pebble is not an open source project. Some stuff is only available to companies like Google, Apple, and Microsoft. If MS published that app, Pebble would sue, and win.
  • Something it's not right. Eric said on Reddit that they are helping and supporting devs with a Pebble third-party app for Windows Phone. Why thafuck they don't do the same thing but with MS?
  • Came here to say the same thing. MWC is next week, so why not use 1 minute of the presentation to congratulate pebble on another successful kickstarter and announce a universal app that will be ready in the summer?
  • Plebbe app?
  • Too bad...
  • Well, guess I'll just continue to use Band.
  • The only people this hurts is end users. <sarcasm>Thanks Pebble for supporting anyone who would like to buy your product.</sarcasm>
  • Yet have the audacity to use kickstarter to fund their products... Seriously, they didn't have to pay a dime let alone spend time developing the app.
  • I didn't realise that the Snapchat debacle was as bad as that. Shame to see Satya rebuffed.
  • I'm picturing the scene in my mind but with Ballmer instead. You can't say no to that guy
  • That is one sweet thought! Him, the sweat laden blue shirt, bouncing off of the walls.
  • I have no idea how someone gets cold feet about partnering with a company when they literally don't have to do anything to make it work, and just get to reap the rewards of a big wallet.
  • I'm staying away from Pebble products and I hope someone from this company gets to read our comments.. And to that CEO.. This is not about what YOU like, you should be trying to win US over. It's your damn job but apparently, there are hidden interests involved somewhere.
  • I really liked Pebble,and would have bought one in a second if there was a Windows Phone app. Now I hope they finish 2015 with Apples tire tracks across their back. Short sighted stupidity.
  • Who needs a crappy pebble watch anyway, partnering up with MS may have helped the survive apple watch and android wear. I doubt anyone will be talking about pebble a year from now...
  • Sad. I like pebble but will have to buy a competitor.
    On another note, I'd buy an 830 for 299 if they got rid of the fitbit, they just don't seem that robust...
  • Typo for Satya though nicely written Danny boy....!!
    A lotta hardwork done by Microsoft shouldn't go in vain..And I bet the CEO is paid by Google..!!
  • Fixed, thanks!
  • No problem. Happens in a long article.
  • Pebble done messed up now.
  • Well not surprising. WP just never really gained traction and is slipping into nothingness.
  • Yeah, but it's a chicken-egg thing. WP doesn't pick up because of no apps, there are no apps because WP hasn't picked up. It has nothing to do with the quality of the OS or hardware experience, which by most reviews is solid. Here is a company rebuffing Microsoft more from a personal reason than business. After all, what was the risk? None, as far as I can see. Not even for costs, as they managed to get Microsoft to foot the bill.
  • It's going in a circle I think.
  • Do you know what the situation with instagram is? Assume it is along the same lines as this. Also Snapchat?
  • That is my impression too with those companies, correct.
  • Dan - have you tried to get Pebble's side of this? I mean, did the CEO really make this decision for no better reason that he just doesn't like Microsoft? It sounds really short-sighted.
  • Well I'll tell ya an inside thing....
    The CEO is paid. Hmm.
    Don't tell it to anyone.
  • I don't want to say who I spoke with, but the people who I did talk to are not all Microsoft people. Far from it.
  • Seems like Eric is rebuffing you regarding the article. But I don't think you would have published the article without substantial evidence or testimony from multiple sources. It would be interesting to hear Pebble's side of this.
  • Thanks Dan. I didn't necessarily want you to 'name names'. But I was curious if the CEO agreed with your interpretation of his actions, or if he characterized them differently. In any case, this is a great, if disheartening, article.
  • Daniel, to which part of premium 1's comment are you saying yeah?
  • This is the same reason sales people in carrier stores turn people away from WP. You would think they want the sale. They don't because their PERSONAL preference is anti-WP.
  • When shopping for my Windows Phone, I went to many carrier stores, nobody tried to talk me out of buying a Windows Phone. 
  • If these yuppie hipster CEOs ould stop dick riding Apple for one minute, they would have seen that it's stupid to not take the deal MS was giving them.
  • I'm sorry to say this, but these two CEOs are immature. How can they possibly refuse to make their services available on the platform when Microsoft takes everything in charge for free? I hope they have other reasons for rejecting such offers, because otherwise it sounds like plain nonsense.
    And IMO, Microsoft has made humongous efforts to change the company's image, it looks like it's slowly starting to pay off, especially with HoloLens and Windows 10 around the corner. Marketing can still improve a lot, though, by highlighting unique features of their products.
  • Pebble can trip off a cliff. #TeamMSBand
  • I can see exactly the same history for Instagram except by the fact that the MS build Instagram app came to the store and after Instagram broke the agreement and prevented further updates.
  • Except that Instagram it's a Facebook company now.
  • I'm pretty sure eventually we'll get a pebble app just not anytime soon.
  • Hopefully Microsoft will release a new set of bands maybe even a watch.
  • That'd would be swell. The only thing keeping me from buying a band is because the form's not really fitting for me. Would much rather get it as a watch.
  • Daniel said the objective of Microsoft wasn't to necessarily sell the band, but to use it as a show piece for the platform. It's the platform that Microsoft cares most about. I'm not expecting multiple bands out of them. 
  • This is horrible, I almost feel sorry for Microsoft. Microsoft is like the nerdy kid in high school which the beautiful girl flirts with just for fun.
  • more like the rich asshole who is now acting nicely, the girl denies him based on her pride, that would be socially ok, businesswise? oh dear you better move out
  • Far from it. They are waaaay more robust than pebble. IMHO pebble is the party going to lose out eventually. MS will survive these setbacks. Only a matter of time.
  • Oh without a doubt. MS is a timeless company, they're a company described as 'too big to fail' and time tells everything. When the iWatch and Samsung smart watches take of or even smart bands from fitbit, and Pebble is still relying on startup money they will regret not taking this deal. Look up the CEO of pebble and you will not be surprised by his move. A douchebag sums it up just about right.
  • I really don't get this. Even if you think MS is an old and outdated company, take advantage of teh offer. They are doing everything and this will cost them nothing. They get access to millions of windows phone users. Later on they will get access to windows 10 users as well. Even if the marketshare for WP is too small, they can still make money with out any risk. Stupidest business decision I've ever heard off.
  • I hope this story is true and Pebble starts to feel pressure from their customers. I haven't owned a windows mobile phone (I like Android, sorry) since the 8125 and BlackJack II and this news is still frustrating. Posted via the Windows Central App for Android
  • You can see how unfair many people here feel, with Google basically doing the same thing to this platform. When I had an Evo LTE I used microsofts services along side googles, when I left because I couldn't deal with Spring anymore and got the lumia925 on Tmobile, it was a terrible awakening. I stopped using gmail, google maps (which I loved SO much) and you can see why some users here feel so strong about Google. Some of us were forced to stop using their products simply because we wanted to try a competitors phone.
  • So further build out the Microsoft Band. Add a second form factor.
  • A Ms band with colour eink always on and excellent battery would get my money. Yes, I would love a band like that.
  • "Everybody knows, that the world is full of stupid people..." That's the song that's playing in my head with today's windows central news. First softcard now pebble. With the apple watch coming, hopefully this will mean the death of pebble and a huge lesson to the stupid CEO.
  • Maybe they heard that MSFT was making their own smartband?  
  • That's a good theory, but they were briefed about the Band well ahead of any public announcement. They were also told that it was a fitness device, not a smartwatch like Pebble. Microsoft was very forthright about that.
  • But isn't the MS Band really covering both classifications? It is a smart watch as well, yes?
  • I personally see the Microsoft Band and feel it's 75% fitness wearable, and 25% smartwatch. It definitely has lots of smartwatch features, but its primary focus is still fitness tracking, and is marketed as such.
  • Yup. Bigger point though: Microsoft was very clear that Band is a demonstration app for their Microsoft Health platform, not competition for Pebble and Fitbit. Had Pebble worked with MS, they would not promote against them, and they could have likely gotten some good deals on MS Health platform tech.
  • Who cares about Pebble after we saw what Microsoft can do with The Band; and after reading about the pebble ceo attitude towards microsoft and windows phone, even if pebble come around I want nothing to do with them or their products.    
  • wtf??? I've never heard of pebble until this article. I don't think I care much either way.
  • Satay chicken nadella
  • I wanted a SMARTWATCH! Not a FITNESS BAND, a SMARTWATCH! This is the type of crap that makes me wish I had an android!
  • Well go buy a fucking shitdroid!
  • For the first time, seriously considering it. We keep losing and losing. Sick of seeing advertisements and no windows phone support.
  • Don't consider it do it we don't need any whiners and complainers!
  • Don't be a prick.
  • What makes you think you need a Smartwatch.... Nobody really needs one actually.
  • I just like how Droid works with everything. So much 3rd party support.
    ...ugh, maybe I'll just get a band. I like my 925, just wish we had more people backing us. I hear it might change with Windows 10. BUT of I switch carriers I'm getting Droid. Won't be able to pass it up.
  • Just get a Droid if you want to man. No need to stress yourself over this, no one says you can't have a WP and a Droid right, even an iPhone too? Just have fun and enjoy yourself, life's too short for pettiness!
  • IPhones not that open. I like the freedom of a Droid. I'll keep my 925. My first smartphone and I really like it. Just hope we get some better support soon.
  • Spam pebble. At least we can let them know there is demand for Pebble on Windows phone. Yes there is MS band. But that is more a fitness tracker. Pebble is unique among smartwatches with its 7 day battery life. Which imo is compelling.
    ...feel free to chime in people.
  • I will send them an email. Let them know how passionate the windows phone community is.
  • It's ok, really. The Band is all you need. Daniel, I've given you some stick these past few weeks. But you dig deep and deliver quality articles and information, so, thank you Sir.
  • I have my moments, pro and con ;) And thanks.
  • Bigot: A person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. Apple, Google, and Microsoft: Their money is all the same color.
  • Slip, sliding away...
  • Smh!
  • Microsoft needs to get Band going. I expect a Band 2 at this point. Pebble will fail long run anyway with all the competition in this.
  • Nadella should have looked Eric Migicovsky in the eye picked up a Pebble and throw it out the window. Pebble out the window. HA
  • You need to start reading more comments ;)
  • Im sure that Jobs had done that
  • If were not good enough customers, then your not a good enough company. I hope your company gets irrelevant real fast just because of it.
  • Gets or stays...?
  • Dan hit the nail on the head with the comment that the 'young CEOs' favour Apple and Google. I'm sure they still see MS as an enterprise focused company and a bit of noise on the mobile scene. Satya has a tough job ahead of him to get the mobile side of "Cloud First, Mobile First" strategy understood by the Apple & Android fans aka MS-haters.
  • They are just stupid. Companies like Netflix and Pandora are successful in part because their apps are everywhere. It is dumb for them to ignore 30m+ users, or whatever the number is. Just 1% of WP users buying Pebble would be 300,000 sales, or $60m. Dumb, just dumb.
  • I think if Microsoft develops the universal app for Pebble app, it would be pushed 100+ millions users. Yes, it is really dumb.
  • The Netflix CEO feels the same bias towards BlackBerry 10. He's stated this very fact in an interview in Canada back in 2013. Luckily, the Android app now ports flawlessly. 
  • Microsoft should publish it anyway... Publish it as unofficial app and remove mention to any data that is a copyright violation
  • Yep Nadella is going to have to work so hard to get these companies on board, think how hard this must be for blackberry??!
  • It's sad, this. What is so wrong about making a product that as many people as possible can buy and enjoy?! Never look a gift horse in the mouth, etc... Not that Pebble need much help it seems. They wont be getting my money though. E-ink Microsoft Band 2, anyone?!
  • Great read. Glad to have the Band!
  • good thing i will be getting 6 bands to replace the pebble.  and to think i almost joined their kickstarter
  • I guess I don't have to worry about getting a Pebble anything.
  • Wonder if Samsung will ever add support
  • Absolutely ridiculous. Never was a fan of the pebble watch anyway so now definitely looking forward to the next Microsoft SmartBand
  • Who wants an ugly crap watch anyways. I'd rather spend my money on something better than this.
  • A CEO like that? Lol no thx
  • So Google bought Pebble? Lol.
  • This is why I was leary of the company: "management" is far too childish and unprofessional and has always been.
    Shame on the idiots who hate MS but love the evil Google and dispicable Apple. What hypocrisy!
  • I have a Band, but I'll also buy a Fitbit... As for Pebble, I hope the Apple Watch and Android Wear sink them.
  • They definitely will, the Apple watch, though ugly for me, it's way better than the pebble...
  • Clearly, like Daniel puts it, Pebble had nothing to lose and lost nothing, but still chose to ignore WP. Well, Pebble will not get my business. I choose to ignore it.
  • Puck Febble
  • See what u did there
  • Utter madness.  If that's the standard of business Pebble does then they're not long for this world.  You can only run a business on Kickstarters for so long.
  • Is there going to be any good news for windows phone soon?
  • Huh... That's a whole bunch of crap. I like the Pebble and would have bought one but not now. Its all business and I get that so hopefully there is a big change of mind on Pebble's side because its not about companies, its about people. Windows Phone might be small in market size but its got a loud and dedicated following that is still bigger than Pebbles. Change your mind Pebble, we'll make it worth it.
  • Then why is Microsoft slacking with the Band?
  • As I have said before (and it has never been invalidated by any publication), the Microsoft Band is a demonstration platform for Microsoft Health. It was never meant to compete on the open market. Problem is, people like it a lot.
  • Perhaps Microsoft will see they're onto a good thing with it.  Maybe they'll convince Fitbit to start using the Microsoft Health platform.  Maybe MS and Fitbit will collaborate on something awesome.  Maybe aye, maybe no.
  • Thank God Silicon Valley is a meritcracy, where the best ideas are advanced on their own merits and thrive unfettered by prejudices or confirmation bias.
  • I'm disappointed at the lack of conspiracy theories about how Google is actually behind all of this. Come on, people...I know you can find a way to blame Google for this!
  • I know, me too.  At least we're getting a good dose of "tech CEOs are overly-emotional adolescents just like me", though.
  • This sucks. It drives a wedge between me and Apple and Android. I love the MS OS and I dont care if I dont have some of the same apps. As long as they support their phone thats what I will use. Screw the others, Windows Phone is the most beautiful with customization.
  • Phew this article saved me from buying into the kickstarter fund. No pebble for me. But please MS, release Band for more markets!!
  • Daniel would u prefer this over Band?
  • No, Band is certainly more interesting as a device than the Pebble. The Pebble is neat, you can see the future in it, but it's not ready for mainstream...yet. Longterm Pebble will fail and be acquired. They cannot invent technology like Samsung, Apple, Microsoft. They have to license everyone else's.
  • Harsh truth, I second, I was amazed that they dared to promote the second product. And by the way, its difficult to find some designers without tastes these days...
  • Exactly, which makes the CEO of Pebble's comments and actions against MS a joke. He must not realize that those companies' smartphone OS's are the ones that are actually responsible for his watches doing anything functional besides tell the time.
    One would think a startup would want to be in as many places as possible... I guess his ego is getting in the way, and that never ends well.
  • Yep. Ego does not make good business.
  • Microsoft should buy Pebble and re-purpose it as a low-end smartwatch line for the Lumia 4xx, 5xx and 6xxx.
  • Bye bye Pebble
  • now with apple and google watch they will come because they will lose market. Now too late for me, Im not going to buy it.
  • WP platform needs to survive the next 20 years. Down that stretch, the smart kids of now will grow up hating Apple and Android just like the kids of 90s hating MS. Who knows what will happen then.
  • Ha, nice!
  • I'll never buy a pebble watch, especially seeing how ugly the new Time is. Something wrong with this under 30 people, I am under 30... By I found MSFT is the more innovating one recently and thus bought lots of their stocks....
  • The new pebble watch is pretty nice. And will be actually avail for people to buy.
  • I've only run a very small business but isn't having more customers better?...I don't get Pebble's thinking on this.
  • Maybe he is hoping to cash out and run. Become popular enough to sell off the company and let buyer worry about getting new customers.
  • The Band is better.
  • That's fine. They're still a niche. I. Sure everyone is somewhat jaded, but truth is MS is the new Apple and Google is the new Microsoft.
  • Wow , shots fired pebble.. AMA and twitter have been linked back accordingly.
  • Hi there,
    I've recently have chosen to use WP by purchasing and updating a new HTC 8s 602e to The 8.1 update to see how the OS worked.
    I can say that I have been impressed to date. I still use 2 HTC Android phones and a iPhone, however my preferred daily is my little 8s. IT strikes me as peculiar that only the 930 from MICROSOFT has the internals to match equivalent devices using different platforms. INITIALLY I was distressed by the lack of suitable WP applications however I've seem to have found what's needed. LOOK what I'm saying is this having used the WP 8.1 update which includes DENIM I really think if only the number of applications could be improved then and only then will The WP phones really take off. AUSTRALIA.
  • Just wanted to say thanks for giving WP a chance and I'm glad you like it. I'm satisfied with the apps I have but more choice is always good.
  • And thanks for your reply, a real breath of fresh air!
  • In the same thinking I have the 8X and I'm not changing it gets all updates and still has power
  • I put Preview for Developers on my HTC 8s and it did improve everything. Totally stable too.
  • Who needs Pebble? We have MS Band... I'm only waiting for it to be sold outside the US (I live in Europe, Portugal)...
  • MS should come out with a band2 and destroy pebble. They are playing too nice with with these immature companies. Surface wear bundle it as a companion device with surface pro done!
  • Bottom line, Windows Phone always get screwed left, right and center. There is no love for windows phones from lots of giant companies. Sooner or later, WP will just be EOL by MS. Let's see.
  • Pebble will surely EOL before WP, that's for sure!
  • Oh well he even likes pebble why we have other better alternatives
  • Like agent watch LOL
  • MS. Just create a pebble competetor and let them burn.
  • Band?
  • Band is not a smartwatch and MS is not interested to sell it en-masse, it was only a demo product for their health vault.
  • The Band is probably "smarter" than the pebble
  • Would it be sweet revenge if Samsung gear support for WP came out of the recent lawsuit settlement?
    I would take gear over pebble. The new one is rather ugly.... Unless you like a giant bezel. - original pebble backer
  • Can't say I'm disappointed, as of now anyway. IMO Pebble's products are very underwhelming, both the original and the new one look like kids watches, very toy like (the color epaper doesn't help in that regard either, GBC anyone). Only decent one is the Steel, yet its bulky and heavy. Not a fan of the UI at all.
    I have a feeling that if they had just made the app, without all the other stuff, they probably would have accepted (anyone with a brain would think anyway). Then they could have possibly looked into close ties. However that didn't tie into what MS was thinking, they wanted the deeper tie in to begin with. It's obvious by that guys comments what he thinks about MS and the extra talk probably dissuaded him because of that. A pretty lame attitude for a CEO of a smartwatch company, a company whose products needs other companies smartphone OS's for their watch to do anything at all besides tell the time.
  •  they got +10M for the first watch as an startup and now they are asking for more? come on. you dont need money anymore.
  • Not sure you understand how business works.
  • They are basically using it as a pre-order platform, and simultaneously giving early adopters a discount. It's a good strategy assuming their products deliver.
  • I like Pebble's designs for their watches and it's a shame I won't be able to support the company and sport one with my phone. Full-expense ride and development and they still said no? Odd.
  • Pebble is crap compared to Fitbit anyway. They won't be around long.
  • Eric is being an ass on twitter now. Too. Go follow. @ErocMigi
  • Why would you follow an ass?
  • So then we can be an ass with him too!
  • Not following. Just tell him he is a douche-bag. One of my best skills.
  • @Ericmigi
  • Lol pebble. Never seen anyone with one. Never heard a single person say 'Check out my pebble!'
  • Same here seriously!
  • Seriously, the same here. Have seen Samsung and Sony only.
  • I haven't even seen those two and I live in the silicon valley.
  • Just one more piece of tech I don't have to worry about supporting... Widen distribution of Microsoft Band, please.
  • lol I might sound biased saying this, but I think this new company is doomed if they keep that way of thinking, the sole reason for not having a partnership here is the founder doesn't like the partner, I don't have to say how wrong that decision is, making business decisions based on personal bias is just flat out dumbness, a very good example of an advantage public companies have over private ones, but I wish they all the best, now they will have to fight apple and google, and possibly even Microsoft if they decide to make a smartwatch because of this, and don't forget about Samsung, oh yes they WILL need a truckload of luck and loyal fans
  • Not liking a partner is actually a completely valid reason to not work together. Companies can be more than money making machines, and if the values of your company are at odds with the other company, it's perfectly reasonable to not work together with them. Not saying that that is actually what happened here though.
  • What sad story :/ but what a fucking good article. I read this in a second, it's easy to read and polite. Nice Mr. Rubino.
  • Damn I had high hopes for the small private company pebble. Really dnt like Google on watches but with no plans on supporting windows for those reasons I have changed my mind and pebble can drown.
  • Hey, this can be a great story line for a novel.
    Title of the novel "Pebble through the WINDOWS-The WCentral depiction"
  • All seems totally dumb to me.
    Pebble would sell more devices if a WP app existed. Microsoft wrote one.
    Ship it. While they don't, there won't be any Pebble sales to the 10's of millions of Windows phones. Pebbles loss in the end as users will buy other supported devices. Like the Band.
  • So tired of these petulant child-CEOs.  One of the biggest tech companies in the world has made an app at no cost to you and you still reject it because of your childish perceptions of a company that no longer exists in the form you remember it.  As far Snapchat, no loss for me.  Couldn't care less about their app.  For Pebble, it's their loss because I won't be purchasing their product.
  • Totally
  • +925
  • ...Wow that article is shocking. I dont understand why any company would basically give up free revenue like this. If you are a small-medium business like Pebble and a company like Microsoft is bending over backwards, building you an app... eating all the costs, offering you Retail Space in stores, exclusive features and marketing deals... You do not give that up. Thats literally a situation which has no downsides and can net you a couple extra users you never had a chance of getting before.   Shocking.
  • I would've been all over it and Microsoft doing it one of my favorite companies.
  • Screw Pebble. And all they stand for.
  • Their watch designs are terrible. People actually want these things? F them. Plenty happy with my Band and don't want to replace my watch.
  • You may not want them but I'm sure there are people willing to pay for them. Still their loss and I for sure will not be buying one. BTW you a corvette fan? Me too! (fist ✊ bump)
  • What killer rin said. Mindboggling.
  • All I read is that Pebble doesn't want my money, or a lot of peoples.
  • The portrayal of Pebble clearly isn't a good one here. The offer from Microsoft just seems too good to be true and anyone with half a brain would be all over this like a fat kid would be all over cake lol. From the sounds of it I think there is more to this than just the CEO's resentment of Microsoft, which is understandable given Microsoft's past but that's in the past and they clearly didn't want to look ahead into the future and what could have been of this opportunity. I think another competitor may be lining their pockets and that could merit why they turned down such a lucrative offer. In the end, I won't be buying any Pebble products that's for sure.
  • Pebble + Cortana, would have been AWESOME!!! Its like Power Rangers! :D I'm keeping my hopes up!
    Be sure to let them know how you feel.
  • i am so disappointed to read this. pebble you have really let me down. and to think i was going to get the pebble time on kickstarter! im sticking with android wear (main phone is LG G3, but i have a Lumia 920)
  • I am just disappointed.  I bought a Pebble when I was on Android, and incorporated it into my daily life.  I came back to my HD2 roots when I bought a One M8 with Windows.  I kept the Pebble because they seemed pretty cross platform, I figured it was just a matter of time before Pebble supported WP.  I have it linked to my iPad for some functionality, but obviously it's kind of pointless.  I really enjoy WP, hate the idea of switching.  In the end, you should buy an accessory because it supports your phone, not buy a phone to support your accessory.  I would buy a band today if I could actually catch it in stock.
  • Wow! Microsoft just won my respects there was nothing MS could've done if pebble CEO himself is so naïve, mean no disrespect to pebble CEO but this was a sweet deal for pebble as well.
  • It's ok. When his company tanks, he will end up working with google or apple.
  • I find it odd that many CEO's see Microsoft as antiquated and old but just a fun fact. A Microsoft recruiter told me the average age of a Microsoft employee is 25 years old. Not so antiquated now is it? Just thought I'd share...
  • Someone just needs to say that this is just a well written news article. It is a great example of old school journalism. It presents facts and let's me make my own conclusions.
  • You can say that again.
  • LOL, it's just what people on one side of the story told the writer and has editorializing all over it.
  • Maybe that pebble guy is waiting for something. But waiting for a long time.
  • Pebble can riot and die while others in the industry make better products. Having the head of a company full of spite is only negative for the company.
  • To mean the problem seems to lie with WP's limited public APIs.  Pebble is not able to build an app themselves and so they would be left with an app that has their name on it but over which they have no direct control.  Any problems or missing features would cause customer complaints against them and all they could do is hope that Microsoft gets around to fixing them at some point.  I don't know that I would have taken that deal either especially when Microsoft has pretty much zero marketshare leverage.
  • That is actually a great point.
  • Ok, adding pebble to my black list of companies I will never do business with... Ever...
  • It's a shame, but Microsoft is partially responsible. Their strategy concerning WP was terrible, they made bunch of terrible choices and this is the result. I think that now they are on the right path, but it will take time for people to realize that. And for Pebble, they acted very unprofessional on this one, and I think that made the wrong choice. But it doesn't really matter for me because only werable that interested me was Microsoft band and Moto 360.
  • sorry for pebble they will act when it is late! as a developer i can say windows 10 platform is amazing! do not miss it!!!
  • And another company goes on my shitlist :) great article!
  • As usual who cares if pebble is at fault or Microsoft is at fault. Same with Google apps, don't care if it's Google fault. May be Microsoft has to bend over backwards more for these companies, beg them since it is kind of a irrelevant position in mobile.
  • So
    Pebble is ignorant. Great.
  • All this makes me want to do, is not buy a damn Pebble. The arrogance of these people is incredible, and to me, it seems like they want to see Microsoft fail. I already thought the guy was an arrogant prick (but was willing to let that slide because the Pebble is a good device), now even more so... I was excited about the Pebble Time and sat waiting for the countdown the other day, but this completely turns around my view of this company's CEO and am no longer willing to buy into it, now, or in the future. MS have no fault in this as Daniel points out, they have done everything they could have done and were let down once again in the end. Just because you don't like an operating system or company, doesn't mean you can't work together with them. The approach they're taking now basically tells us, the customers, that we are not important enough because of the CEO's preference of operating systems. The financial side of things confuses me even more, why on earth wouldn't you potentially want another lot of millions of customers and be the (just about) sole provider of smartwatches on a platform rather than only competing with Google and Apple on their operating systems? This Eric guy clearly has no business accumen and his company will likely fail once Apple launches their watches and Google and co release their new iterations of smartwatches. Because the way I see it, the battery life on Google Wear can only improve with advances in technology, and then Pebble's last advantage will be gone. If they had gone with Microsoft, at least they would have had more of a chance... Just my two penneth.
  • Pebble watches like most smartwatches are just disposable trash. Not worth spending much on. I have a Garmin cycle GPS from 2007 still going strong so why does a watch have a vastly weakening battery after under a year? My fitbit flex died after 10 months too. All glued shut with no chance of repair.
  • I have a feeling that circumstances will force me to ditch MS at least for phones by the end of 2015.
  • It is not, "Microsoft needs Peeble. Its the other way around".
  • Looks like I'm cancelling my pledge for their Kickstarter.
    Not that it will make a difference to them, but knowing the background to this situation, I wouldn't want to wear the damn thing. Even with third parties making the valiant effort to add support.
    Bring the 2nd generation Band to international markets, Microsoft. Show them how the cross-platform approach is supposed to be done.
  • This type of attitude is the reason windows phone struggles to get apps. Its really worrying, especially as wp as an OS if flat out brilliant (bar a few weird kinks, like lack of native printing)
  • Eric denies on Twitter
  • It's seems that someone mannaged to install the app and make it work, and it's the real app. I just hope that microsoft will make it public although it is not an oficcial app, as they did with the facebook app. That way they will make the windowsphone os more relevant to other users, especialy that the pebble watch is very popular.
  • From the ergonomics point of view Pebble is much better than MS Band. But features wise MS Band (my humble opinion) is better than any of its competitors like Google, etc.
  • theres images of the app installed on a device and notification that was received on the watch. lets hope microsoft will make it public.
  • Kids...
  • Hey can somebody tell me what's the app at the top right corner of the phone? You know, the one with the date live tile...
  • Wait, "microsoft isn't cool"? The whole reason 12 year old girls would cringe over having a wp is exactly why I support the brand.
  • Pebble will fail with an attitude like this. It's not like this segment isn't wildly competitive.  
  • Is the Pebble CEO a moron ? Not because that I am a Windows Phone fan but, one would think with all the other "smartwatch" options out there right now, the Pebble could be one fading away in a few years. Look at all the Androidwear devices and the up coming iWatch, They are worlds better in tech than the Pebble even the new Pebble, the screen are full color with details, all the fitness features you can dream of. The ONLY downfall on these top watches is their battery life and if you dont mind charging once a day, it's not a problem for most people. As someone in buisness, I would think it would be in the best interest to get your product in as many hands as possable. Even though WIndows Phone has a low marketshare, it's possable millions of watches sold as an EXCLUSIVE smartwatch besides the Band. In a business sense, it does not make sence at all, espically if Microsoft is doing 95% of the work, even a phone call go for it, the only downside to it would be they would sell MORE watches and I am not sure that is a down side.... Never could understand the logic of some people.... I gave up trying to figure out women myself... :/
  • I have a very unprofessional guesture for Pebble's CEO. He is just as bad as Steve Jobs, forcing everyone to comply with his own biased opinions. Look at the Apple II computer....extremely outdated...but Mac grew and grew and constantly resurfaced to enhance itself throughout the years. MS does the very same. What was tomorrow is outdated by today. By pushing MS away, you are nothing but another variable contributing to MS being "out of date". Developers complain that Windows doesn't have as many apps or customers, which is why they won't develop an app for that market. Of course...Windows doesn't have as many apps or customers BECAUSE people like them WON'T develop the frackin app. So who's fault is it really? It goes both ways for success to be truly possible. A market poisened by bias and blind/poor strategie. People aren't thinking outside of the box.  In my "opinion", I think it is smart to choose then to install my own bias towards my purchase decisions. They wan't to be stubbern, then so shall I. I will not *ever* buy a pebble device. I will not recommend one, nor would I ever praise one for any reason. Why? Because it "looks out of date", and "we have moved past such midevil devices". Just look at the pixeled screen when you have watches like the Gear 2 and the Moto 360 that make the pebble look like the Tomoguchi someone tried to buy me when I was "14" (18 years ago). Two can play at this game....and Microsoft should justifiably respond by releasing theiw own watch,. that puts Pebble into the unemployment line. 
  • I apologize for the many typos there...I was typing on a small screen pretty quickly to pump that out and failed to proofread it before submitting. It won't let me edit it as clicking edit says "you are not authorized to access this page" haha...well then. 
  • I have never heard of Pebble.   I'd get a Microsoft Band if I had a choice.
  • Don't care about pebble watches, do care about the Band but I can't buy one... Because I don't live in the states...
  • I want a smartwatch so badly, but there's none in NZ with full WP functionality.
  • I won't say I know everything about either company's management, but I have heard stories about Microsoft that don't necessarily paint it as a "stellar" partner. At least NOT like how this article does....
  • You got to be fucking kidding me! You found a way to turn this around and blame Microsoft? They did all the work for Pebble, they paid everything for developing the app and where fully willing to pay for supporting and further developing the app and Pebble was the one owning it. Pebble got a fully functional app that would have let them tap in to a market with around 80/90 million users for free! And Pebble says no because they 'don't like Microsoft'?!?!
    The knew there feelings long before they started working with Microsoft, so why cancel it in the end? That CEO is insane! And I for one will never buy an Pebble smartwatch ever again! They just dont want to sell their smartwatches to tens of millions of Windows Phone users, what kind of business decision is that?!?!?
  • people running companies can be just as petty and foolish as everyone else.  The dude running pebble might well have been raised to hate MSFT,  it really was the thing to hate 10 years ago, and many people about 30 still cling to that out dated crap. 
  • Why is this becoming a thing? Pompous freaking Millennial CEOs and their "I don't like that 'uncool' thing, so I'll screw over potential customers before I let my product work with their stuff" garbage. Apple is now a fashion brand and Google, well... I honestly don't have a freaking clue why these people like El Goog so much, they're just MS with touchy-feely California vibes. Maybe it's just that these guys are Millennials, which means that they're overprivileged kids who still act like they're twelve. Any way it goes, if I were on their board, I'd want a douchebag like that gone.
  • Pebble would continue to work with Apple and its Android partners, but Microsoft and their Windows Phone would be more favored.
    I'll bet you a silk pajama that's what soured talks of a partnership. That runs counter to Pebble's philosophy to be the SmartWatch that plays nice with everyone, as equals (as much as possible given OS API limitations.)  I like the new Microsoft. That part of the deal? That's old Microsoft. 
  • <p><span style="line-height: 1.6em;">Further, from ITProPortal:</span></p> <blockquote>
    <p style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verb, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 15px; line-height: 21px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">Microsoft only allows <strong>OEM partners, contracted parties</strong> and Microsoft to use RPAL SDK, <strong>which the Bluetooth notification API is filed under</strong>.</p> <p style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verb, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 15px; line-height: 21px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">That means Pebble would need to go through a partnership with Microsoft in order to get its application accepted onto Windows Phone.</p> <p style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verb, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 15px; line-height: 21px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">It is a rather big hassle.</p> <p style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verb, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 15px; line-height: 21px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;">&nbsp;</p>