Windows Phone Update 3 and the missing 3 column Live Tile option

Yes sugar coat it, makes it sweet as possible.....

Alright, alright.. Coat the $hit out of it.. Lol.

NOKIA's upcoming phones to feature 3D Touch with latest windows phone 8.1 .For more see here http://ow.ly/qRWLW

We have had consistent updates since 7.5. Typically every few months until 7.8 & 8.0. e.g. The disappearing keyboard issue was fixed in 3 months. 7.5 was released Sept 27 2011 and then the 7.5 'refresh', with the keyboard fix, came out January 4 2012. I know that I received the update in early-to-mid February 2012. In June 2012 we got tango, a few more updates after that and then 7.8 in Jan 2013. There's been 3-4 updates this year for 8.0. The point being that we get a lot of updates regularly between major releases.
AT&T simply don't care and released the updates much later, but that doesn't mean the WP update cycle is universally slow.

Who said that the cycle has been slow❔.. I'm saying that this time around its taking MS a long time to release the next major update for WP, and its true. WP8 was available in October of 2012, and we're looking at spring of 2014 for 8.1.. Some of you guys are so defensive when it comes to constructive criticism about WP, you miss the real point, and the reality, of the situation..
And, you totally missed my point with the problems that I mentioned.. You're way off.. I mentioned those issues because someone was talking about how MS takes a longer time to develop updates because the OS is more polished. But, my point was that even though we wait longer sometimes there still are big faults in the OS that have had to be address with future updates.. This is the reality of the situation, and just because I'm a huge WP fan, possibly the biggest in the world,, I'm not a sheep..

Fair enough - I read it as WP only gets updates once a year, which obviously isn't true, and now the updates are 16-17 months, which also isn't true. When you're only referring to "major releases" it's closer to the truth, but I would suggest we've always been on a 6 month update cycle. But it's a bit hard to say what a 'major release' is though... NoDo and Tango were both considered 'major' but didn't add much functionality. Also, pointing out something that I believed to be inaccurate (i.e. that we have had consistent update cycle) isn't defensive :P I'm not doubting there's still big faults with the releases... people have been crying out for certain features for 3 years, which is a long time to wait for anything. MS seem to only focus on what interests them though, and aren't particularly swayed by popular demand. Unfortunately their current priority is 'expanding the platform' rather than adding features and improving things.

Yep, yep, yep❕❕... Right, and I was referring to major releases like 7.0, 7.5, 8.0, 8.1.. Microkia has actually done a terrific job this year with the GDR updates, and I've been thoroughly satisfied in that department... FYI, and BTW.. Lol.. iOS7 has had 3 updates since it's release... I just think MS can move faster...

I agree with you.

Exactly what I brought up the other week when someone was eager about the 8.1 update. This is MS we're talking about, they are very used to rigorous testing of a huge OS (Windows) and that is exactly why windows phone itself is so stable. The procedures MS takes with finalizing software like an OS is so unique, reading the windows blog since the early days of Windows 7 you can tell by the way they research and use so many numbers and stats for features they want to implement or features they want to remove. Its hard to argue that the approach they take doesn't work, yes it can be slow but a consumer would appreciate the final software. We're just tech enthusiast who have no patience lol

That's true, but they've released every other WP version on a yearly basis.. What's taking 8.1 so long❔.. Excuses, excuses.. Lol❕

cant argue you with there mister Rodney. They'll have to make up for these excuses. We can only hope that WP 8.1 will get the same attention to detail and treatment that Windows 8.1 got after Windows 8. Talk about a quick turn around lol Windows 8 was awesome I upgraded for 30$ to Pro right away, but man did they get Windows 8.1 out the door rather quickly lol

Exactly❕ Its taking Microkia much longer to perfect WP8.1 vs. W8.1, so I'm expecting some really exciting things coming from them.

+920. MS has user telemetry like no other. Sure it sometimes might not please the enthusiast within us, but it sure does aim to bring in a cohesive user experience.

It does.. But, were not talking about personal preference here.. This is mathematics..

I'd believe this IF Apple weren't iterating yearly, on the dot, and with easily as polished and clean of releases as Microsoft. It's not like MS is Palm. It's not a gung-ho underdog with three engineers working round the clock and selling the gold from their teeth to fund the program. They have easily the amount of development and engineering talent as an Apple or Google so why are we seeing major feature sets released 16 - 17 months apart? Android caught up to iOS because of the insane release cadence and the crazy drive towards polish and feature parity. Microsoft would do well to do the same, if they want the OS to grow beyond where it is. When I click on an address link in my email, it brings up Bing Maps. THAT IS INSANE. Microsoft needs to fix what's broken and start moving more quickly to at least bring themselves up to feature parity, because without Nokia I think a lot of us have less of a reason to stay.

Lol. I don't believe iOS 7 is "polished and clean". It's obvious it was rushed.

Can you give us examples of why you say this @airedwin?

Anyone using it for more than a few minutes would understand that it is not completely polished. I have it on my iPad mini and ever since the update it feels just bleh. Little things like stuttering animations and stuff really throw away the feel. I was discussing it with my dad who has an iPhone 5, and he agreed. I just said "it's probably feels really laggy because I'm use to my windows phone, and everything bring so smooth" lol.

That's besides the point, and we don't need to start getting into what OS is more, or less, polished.. This is about MS, and why it's talking so long for WP8.1.. Nobody has come up with a logical explanation, or even an excuse that can't be knocked down when considering what other software companies are capable.

May be resources are scares since the department has lost money. If the department doesn't bring in money, may be the top dogs are not devoting enough resources/personnel to work on the platform? Belfiore may be doesn't have enough engineers in his department.

NMaybe so but who knows.. I think our frustration comes from the fact that we consider MS to be as resource rich, smart, together, and competent as Apple and Google.. Maybe we should admit that this just simply isn't the case,, I mean look at the evidence, and their actions over a long period of time.. I sure hope they prove this wrong with WP8.1..

Actually, we know WP has lost money - but that has nothing to do with "resources being scarce". Microsoft has scads of money to spend on WP8. Look at what they've been willing to throw at developers - we've heard six figures just for a single app before.   Additionally, Microsoft's approach with Xbox (remember those rumors about a 2bn loss?) shows that they're more than happy to throw money at a losing proposition to ensure dominance in the long game. They didn't have to fire any engineers because WP isn't selling as well as we'd all like, as easy as that would be to explain away current problems. Plus, Belfiore and Myerson are about as "top dog" as it gets.  

Exactly,... So we still have no answers.

I didn't say it was polished. I actually said AS polished AS, which isn't a semantic difference - its my whole point. Apple was able to pull off the most major redesign of iOS history RELATIVELY well in 12 months, and MS has us waiting at least 15 for what is by their own admission a .1 release.

Your argument is valid, but are we 100% sure they just worked on it for 12 months? lol I doubt it man. Apple is known for bringing ideas to the table and not implementing them till they think the whole package is ready or in some cases where technology (hardware) can catch up to w.e it is they want to do. Think about it, they refused to go to a bigger screen for years, just because they 'felt' it was inappropriate at the time. I am sure iOS7 has been in the making for 2 years give or take. I don't think it was as rushed as people claim it to be. I think Apple just tried a bit too hard to keep their image and release it to the old iPhone 4/4s and the phone lags every now and then. iOS7 just has too much animations and physics for that hardware. My brothers iPhone 5 handles it pretty nicely but man too much animation for things that don't really need to be animated lol

Great, so I'm sure Microsoft has been working on 8.1 for 2 years as well. My point isn't at all whether iOS7 is subjectively better or not. I'm just saying Apple has no advantage Microsoft doesn't. Both rich, both huge, both talented. If you want to assume Apple has been working on iOS7 in the background for years - probably rightfully so - let's assume MS has been doing the same with their updates, yeah?

Oh no of course they have lol that's what I am saying about both companies. Since you said "Apple was able to pull off the most major redesign of iOS history RELATIVELY well in 12 months" I was stating that I doubt it was that quick. Microsoft hmm maybe a year into WP 8.1 coding, probably as soon as WP8 got released they went to the drawing board with a select group of devs while other devs worked on the GDR's. So add in a year from now until Q1 2014, that is a long time for a .1 increment, you are right. I would imagine the new functions with the rumored notification center and supposedly the voice assistant and so on, those functions must be tough, especially with WP that has never had any sort of notification hub. and if there is anything Microsoft does well is vigorous testing on their OS's they use so many user telemetry that you can argue why they put themselves through that lol but a stable OS is a stable OS.

Thanks for staying on topic.. These guys just don't get it.. It's like I'm on Phone Arena..

Just because you're a WP fan doesn't mean you have to act like iDroid clones. Have you even used iOS 7❔ Because my friends love it.

⬆⬆⬆ This ⬆⬆⬆

Exactly❕

You are totally right. Hope they get their release cycles fixed. It's as if they don't want to support WP anymore - feels like at the end of the Zune era.  The only sign of life comes from Nokia.

We've had GDR2 and Update 3 this year, each with few but noticeable improvements. I don't feel like MS is about to leave us hanging at all. They are gearing up for WP8.1, and marketing wise it's better to do a major update like that which gets attention (see iOS7) and could bring in new users, rather than small updates for the existing users.

Actually we had Update 1,2, and 3 this year.. Update 1 came fast, and the others a little later, but that's fine, and was very much appreciated.. But, phones with 8.1 should've been ready for the holiday season.. They always have before.. Now, if 8.1 is going to be a huge leap over 8.0 then I can understand what the longer wait is for, but we need a jump like 7.0-7.5 was.. I mean, everything that's missing from the OS should be there.. Everything❕ But the reality is that we know that's not gonna happen.. That's why I say 8.1 is late.

8.1 is going to be a huge leap.

I hope so. That's what I've heard.

A big leap in what way??

The first big step in the WP8/RT convergence.

I really hope so ... but i just doné want to expect too much and get disappointed ...

I have been lucky enough to receive 7.8, update 1, 2 and parts of 3 (1020 camera fix and stability fixes) all in 2013, i think MS should aim for yearly as if i were to receive an update every 45 minutes or every fortnight.......I'd be proper sick haha

I want a update every 5 minutes.. The only problem is that I would never be able to use my phone because it would constantly be in the update process.. Lol❕

Those cogs do get me all giddy too mate.......but no! I shall not be lured by such rotational sexiness.....yearly is fine :P

Millisecond.

Microsoft really is far behind and very slowly working their way up. They don't have the luxury of being in first or second place where they can take their time. Once the features are up to par or past current market leaders they can slow down. Until then they need to act with a sense of urgency which they really are not doing.

I don't consider them "far behind" at all. There are a few functions like notifications that need some tweaking, but those are minor IMO. The hubs, rooms/groups, and the nice feel of the OS puts them ahead in other areas that more than make up for what they don't have in WP.

Remember when they, "Ran out of time" with the notification center back when WP 8 was released? Over a year later and that notification center is still no where close to being released. Slloooooooowww

Because it's not crucial to getting new customers. It's not a feature that works in ads. It's better to hide the fact that it's not there, and showcase the OS and other bits as a whole, and then add it later. I resisted this thinking, but looking at the big picture, I think it's the best way to go to build the user base.

That's another excuse.. Think about your statement, think about a company that's in need of being more competitive, then think about how important mobile is to Microkia... Now, think about the resources Microkia has.. BS❕
The problem is that someone is simply not making the right decisions.. Period❕

Yeah, that's ridiculous.. Especially when it was one of the mist requested features on users voice. Yet we have to wait, what, 2.5 years for the issue to be addressed❔.. 3.5 years❔

So... What you are saying is someone needs to get the zdev.xap.......lol

It's just a registry key, if there was an interop unlock for any other device than the ativ s it should even work on WVGA devices, even though it's not sure. But normal GDR3 includes the 3rd row for the 920 etc, it's just turned off.

ffs let us have the option to turn it on :D

They will find an option for that sooner or later, just give them some time. If that was possible on the Ativ S, then it will be available sooner or later on other devices too. The key, I think it "doesn't care" what kind of resolution the phone has. 

I hope so too!

Mentioned this in a thread on the forum but i think it would be good to have an option to switch between the two layouts. Having a 1020 it would be good to have a 2 row option for during the week when im at work so all pertinent tiles are where i need them but be able to change it on a weekend to 3 rows when im more likely to be out taking photos and have all the photo apps and lenses available on screen in easy reach.

I was going to say the same thing. If it works for you great, if you prefer less rows, no problem! They have the standard tile rows out of the box with the extra row option for the people who want it. Windows does well with a lot of older people, don't want to start to alienate them, or even the less tech savvy people in general!

How about using kids mode then. You can put all your favourites Camera app there and rename it to Camera mode :)

That's quite good idea actually...might try it! I love the way I can lay out my games in kids mode but the games have some access restrictions, understandably, although annoying. I don't like the way the games are laid out in the 'games' tile! At the very least a search function or the letter system like the main apps page would be nice. But if the extra feature was there, I would probably put more games on my start page.

The one downside is that the pictures folder is not sandboxed it would be nice if it was sand boxed to a separate folder also they need to the ability to have a different password on kids corner. So you have the option to use if or not. Kids are not dumb they are pretty sharp and smart as they pick up things really really quickly. For instance i unlocked my phone and gave it to my nephew, he didn't see the entire code (just the first 3 digits) but he saw the positioning of the taps and was actually figure out the 12 digit code!.. I was gobsmacked his only 8 lol. I have changed it to 5 digits now and make the habit of typing with both thumbs instead of using just my right index finger.

So you want profiles for the Home Screen. Did you suggest this on uservoice? I'd vote for it.

Prob look to squashed up anyways

Then turn it off. The key thing here is that it is optional, even though people who had it almost unanimously preferred it.

People are scared to buy windows phone because of this. They gave same treatment to windows phone 7 users... Learn from apple iPhone 4 which was launched by late Steve jobs still got ios 7... I hope they improve cause they wont get another chance now

So you're saying people are avoiding buying windows phone because the 4/4s didn't get the extra row of tiles that the iPhone 5/5c/5s got?

**falls off chair**
Nice comeback

Every client I have that's on a iPhone 4 with iOS 7 complain its slow and lags. Why give an update if it's going to work.

I have a  ipad 2 and it lags like hell with ios 7

This only makes sense if you don't think about it.  The iPhone 4, 4s, and 5 can run an OS named iOS7, but they don't get all of the functionality of iOS7 on the 5s.  This is mostly because of limitations of the older hardware, but some of it is probably intentional to make the latest iPhone more appealing.  Anyway, iOS7 on a iPhone 4 is not equal to iOS7 on an iPhone 5s.  This is no different than WP7.8 having some, but not all, of the functionality of WP8.  The only difference is the naming/versioning scheme.   The extra row of tiles is for the new large screen Windows Phones.  Some people may still find it useful on medium size screens, but on devices with smaller screens and lower resolution it probably doesn't make sense and could lead to support issues.

Apple has been great about making users of previous models FEEL like they get the latest updates, while in reality giving them a crippled version of it - and at the same time making them want to get that NEW version of it that they already think they have!

Actually it's not Apple, the media and tech bloggers who write nothing but positive articles make the users feel like everything is always great with each version of iOS. With Microsoft they are quick to point out that users on older devices are getting short changed on features.

Good point. It's not just Apple, but the whole cult around it.

7.8 has almost none of the new features of 8. Only the new start screen (which is appearance only, no new feature).
What about the SMS backup on skydrive? Or the lock screen notifications?
Maybe this things are not implementable because of the hardware? (sarcasm)

I agree completely and I also just now upgraded from 7.8 to 8 so I know better than most what the differences are.  However, my point was that this is not unique to Windows Phone.  Most of the "major" improvements to to iPhone/iPads over the years has not been shared with the previous models even when hardware is not an issue.  Siri is a good example, but there are lots of others.  Considering that Apple has barely improved iOS during its existense makes it even worse. MS completely rebuilt WP8 from the ground up.  To include the new features in WP7.x would have required a lot of additional resources since they are two completely different sets of source code.  It's not ideal, but I can understand why they made that move (hopefully a one time thing).  Apple doesn't have that excuse.  For them it's one OS and the same source code.  They just chose to disable certain functionality for previous models in order to make the new model seem like more of an improvement than it actually is. 

Personally would love to have the extra row. Main reason is due to the pinning of multiple inbox folders for work purposes. And that limits the amount of stuff I actually want to see above the fold. Third row on my 1020 would be perfect.

Dat first picture layout is horrible which is why I can see they removed it lol.

Agreed.

But if it is mostly used for 3 tiles across arrangement, it looks pretty good (see link): http://forums.wpcentral.com/attachments/windows-phone-gdr3-preview/47528d1382367924-gdr3screen.png   These medium tiles don't appear to be any different in size from WP7 tiles to me. I forgot that WP7 tiles were a different size from WP8 until I pulled our old Quantum out the other night and fired it up. (I can't speak for 7.8, as this phone was never updated).

Exactly. I assume they have to down render the 1080 screen to the smaller res, dropping lines. No thanks.

Agree 100%.  Way way way too busy.

We have to wait till spring 2014 for wp8.1 ? :o

For me that's the key information from that article. That will be 18 months before initial release, a joke (I don't consider GDR proper updates).

GDR updates are like maintenance updates to fix bugs. MS really is slow three years after WP release.

Wo, that's a lot more tiles than i expected. Does 1520 even have that much?

I would love the 3rd row on my 925, maybe with 8.1 or if by then T-mobile gets a 5 inch phone then I'll just get that one ☺

Absolutely it should be an option. Once I saw the 3 columns displays, it made me change my mind about an early upgrade and wait for a 1080p instead.

Thor almighty, they have to bring this feature back.

Not seeing how this would work? What about devices that have screens smaller than 4 inches? Would they have to resize all the tiles to make them fit?

If they can restrict it to devices with 5 inch displays or larger, they can restrict to 4.3" or larger too. Also: it's a toggle, not mandatory.

It should be available to all WP phones with 720p screens or higher resolution. What do you think?

The feature is in theory restricted to display size, not resolution.

More and more customization, sighs! Soon WP will be like Android. Keep it simple, that's y I'm using a WP right now. But then again options/choices is a good thing.

Android now has 80% market share. So I wouldn't cite Android as a reason to not do something. And like you said, options is a good thing, this doesn't have to be mandatory.

Exactly! Give us the option to customize our phone the way we want. Leave a default UI on how Microsoft believes it should look like but gives us the freedom to give it a personal touch. Simple things like this make customers less likely to return a device. What about a damn color wheel for theme options?

I still want the option of having a large tile span the whole width of the screen even on the larger phone. That's one of the main reasons I'm not getting the 1520.

Yeah, a 2x2 medium tile would be awesome.

Good point, a "large" tile atm i feel would look out of place you would have to put two small tiles on the left and two small on the right. A medium and a large tile don't look right..   Maybe 8.1 will be like w 8.1 as in extra large tile ;)

Yes

I want it for my 928. May not be for everyone so have a option to turn on and off.

Why does everyone keep referring to this as "3 rows???" It's a third COLUMN not a row! I've got 3 rows on my 920 running GDR2, hell I've got twice that many rows.

Rows and columns are interchangeable in the setting. There is no X or Y axis here. Still, I'll change if you stop complaining ;)

So... tell me, why do we call it horizontal scrolling and which axis is the horizontal one?  

Lmao... U better change it... He looks mad, that young man. Lol

I would agree with you if the home screen wasn't orientation locked.

OMG, this is getting out of hands!

Duly noted... :-) On the start screen the orientation is locked though... ;-) <stepping off soap box>

929???

Exactly!! COLUMNS, not rows. (Sorry, Daniel.)

It's nor 3 rows nor 3 columns. It's 3 colums if you use 3 medium tiles. If you use say ... only small tiles, you have 6 columns. Eh?

Shhhh!

I would love to have this on my Ativ S! I hope they get it working...

You sure can get it on the ATIV S right now: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2486387

Man, you have the ONLY PHONE now that CAN have it.

IM currently using it on my Ativ s, which is slightly larger than the average wp8 device, im sure the option was removed because of small font sizes being an issue for anyone with less than perfect vision, it is a great option but on a smaller screen you will have to struggle to read wpcentral live tile updates , but if your not using live tiles with info then its all good.

The three columns are great for larger devices, but on that Lumia 920 the tiles look ridiculously small. They miss the whole point of live tiles, which is probably the reason why they removed it.

I think it will make sense with the WP8.1 and the assumption that there will be a Large tile size, in addtion addition to the current Wide, Medium, and Small tiles.  You would probably want to limit the use of the Smail tiles on the 920, but it would be nice to have a Wide tile next to a Medium tile on the same row.

Exactly.

They would "find a way to make it work?" They already did, clearly, as it worked before. I've seen this crop up more and more as we go mobile, where devs act like enabling options is some kind of major technical hurdle. It always feels so transparent that the reason it's done is to make you want to get a new thing. "Hey guys, everybody's gonna love this, so let's make sure it's only on the new crap. We'll tell 'em that some tech BS prevents it somehow." What's sad is I know people who *actually believe* those BS reasons why things don't work. I guess folks think that these objects are somehow different from other computers just because they're small. Same people who think that smartphones were "a great invention."

There's more to working than actually just enabling an option. Usability is obviously a concern for them.

Wouldn't work well on displays that size anyway

In all honestly, it doesn't look good on 4.5" devices like the 920. On 4.8+, it should though.

I do really hope that the 3 column rows feature will be going to live! For all windows phone version is a must! It's awesome!

Columns!!!! Columns, not flipping rows!

I'd guess it helps give the 1080p phones coming out an advantage. After the release hype dies down it will probably show up in 8.1 for the other phones to put some life back in them.

Definetely YES, it´s very sad that Microsoft, dont give us the option :(

Why would I want a more crowded Start Screen?  Honestly, I think some people are on drugs.

If you do not want it... Do not enable it.
what is the problem with giving people choices ?

Because there is no notification center.

I NEED MORE TILES (scratching my neck like Dave Chappell ) :P

Haha.. I'm going to guess you also didn't just eat a powdered jelly donut before you said that.

+like for the Chappelle Show reference lol "Is this the 5'oclock free crack give away!? No Tyrone this is an intervention.." have a good laugh lol http://www.comedycentral.com/video-clips/ycjdk7/chappelle-s-show-tyrone-...

Why is the term "row" used for columns here? Confusing.   Personally, I think the 3 column option looks WAY too cluttered on smaller devices, and rather unattractive on larger ones too, though there it's understandable. I certainly hope it doesn't become standard - I really like the look of when the largest tile stretches from side to side, instead of being cut off.

I would really like having three rows on my Lumia 925!

You're not the only one. :) Count me too. I really am a strong supporter of the WP8 platform as are most people logged in at WPCentral. I hope the dev team considers the feature for our current phones! Still, it won't destroy my anticipation for GDR3 and Lumia Black.

One more reason my 1520 will rock! They should keep it on larger devices for a few month and then roll it out to the rest. That wold give the 1520 a nice boost, but not forget about everyone else.. and if you don't like 3 columns (not rows :) you can always just use two...

If there was technical/performance issues with 3 columns, then no, do not release it.  This may be a problem for cheaper phones so no, don't do anything to harm performance. If it is just a UI/preference issue, then give the power to the user to decide, however, to not sacrfice stability of the platform.  If it was pulled due to the merging of the Windows 8/Phone 8 APIs, then that sucks. Regardless, seems like there is enough interest that they should have the feature at least for phones where it makes sense.  At a minimum, they should tell us why.

Honestly, it looks too tiny and cluttered. I like itbut I think I will just invest in a bigger screen to get it.

I agree with you ultimately. But there should at least be the option. Something that has high demand that MS doesn't suggest should at least have an option. Then MS can make everyone happy. Which should be there focus....... Right?

Lets step back for a second. MS knows you want 3 Rows. Ok. They know. And they know it works on old phones. There only shortcuts anyways. So lets think about this... Why would they put them on next Gen and NOT the ones you ALREADY purchased? Bcoz they want you to buy the next Gen? Which is the ultimate functionality of the company... Push product? Lol. If they add 3 Row... It will definitely be after the new devices release. I hope they do. Or release a 5" device.

It is hard to imagine someone buying a new phone solely for this feature. The usability issue must be the reason, and for those saying, "Well just make it an option" don't understand that OEMs get to choose which options are on or off by default. So the scenario would exist that a device could be configured with this option On by default and provide a shit experience. We all know that your average moron does not change any settings and so would simply hate the phone and return it, never to consider WP ever again.

I agree. And as for the "Morons"... You were one at some point and so was I. Lol. I vote "Optional". A setting. Just so everyone wins. And ppl won't buy the new phone just for 3 rows. Its simply a bonus, an attraction. And it doesss look pretty damn attractive. Aka L1520.

I have a question. If I am a programmer, do I have to pay a subscription fee or something to put my apps in the Windows Phone Store?
I am no expert in programming, but I dabble :P And I wanna try out programming for Windows Phone.

You have to pay at the least $19. I believe you can only upload a few apps or less. Its more to be a full developer. Never free though. I have an app I made and I need to pay at least $19 to upgrade my acct to submit it.

$19.99 per year fixed. You can submit an unlimited number of apps.

Well poop! I was so excited to get a Windows Phone..greatly because of the app development I was expecting. Guess my apps are gonna have to be mine alone..or I can create a blog or something to post 'em. But it's never gonna be the same..!! :'( Question though. Do I have to pay subscription fee even if my apps are free in-store? :O 'Cause that's just nasty.

Well, $19 per year is not much. You can publish apps to both windows phone store and windows store with a single subscription. If you are a student, it's free through the DreamSpark program.

I AM A STUDENT! Now then...let's Bing DreamSpark program.
And yes..$19 per year isn't much..but I can think of a few better ways to spend that cash especially when I'm not gonna make money off my apps and I don't have a job yet.
And just to keep things real, I'm not even sure my apps are gonna be good enough for uploading. But thanks for the help man.

Also, No monthly subscription fees.

I can't tell if you are replying to me or to one of the guys who replied. But I guess my reply to your reply (reply-ception :P) is the same as my reply above..if you would be so kind as to scroll up and read it.
Thanks :D

I was wrong. Sorry. I didn't"Bing" for the info. I was right about the $19... But didn't know it was monthly. Kind of a downer for me actually.

$19 is not monthly. It's yearly. Big difference.

Jesus. I feel so misinformed. I see now though. I'll be doing this. Couple apps I want to upload. Thanks

Lol. You were helpful to me.
And..I just realised that you are the guy who replied first (I didn't notice that earlier)..and the "No monthly.." message is a continuation of your first reply.
I got confused by the replies-layout. Now I feel stupid D:

Thanks. I try to be helpful. Part of my work is helping people and teaching ppl.

Yes it would be nice to have the option to see how we could like it   And who cares about rows or columns, jeesh

What's wrong with Microsoft ?

And there we have the "elephant in the room" when it comes to x & y. What you say should be true, except that unfortunately our live tiles don't rotate with screen orientation. Thus, sadly, x & y and the accepted row & column thing is relevant. I also will stop complaining though and let you get back to the great writing and advocacy for Windows Phone! ;-)

If GDR3 doesn't give me the extra row on my Lumia 920, i will be very disappointed! They should release it for all WP8 devices, and let the users choose if they want to enable it or not!
The extra rows of tiles is one of my forthcoming favorites! Come on Microsoft!

You will be very disappointed.

And you know that for sure? 100%?
Since GDR3 isn't officially released yet, i cross my fingers and hope that MS change their opinion about this, and put the extra row back!
They tell us all the time not to get scroogled, but this isn't much better! I had bigger hopes for Microsoft than this!

GDR3 has been officially released. Phones are getting the update.

Damn! Disappointed!

"I told you so" =P (and they said it on the article: the developer version is the final build)

I know you told me DJCBS, but i still think its unbelievable that they removed this option on existing Lumia models in the GDR3 update.
I think its a stupid choice of Microsoft to use their resources to release the totally useless Glance backgrounds, instead of making something useful like an extra column on the start screen!
So still....i am disappointed! :-(

I have it on my 1020. No 3rd row and I'm just fine with that.

I would've prefer a third row, there are 28 apps that I use on a day to day basis and out of the 28, the 24 most used are pinned to my start screen (all small tiles so there is no scrolling needed). But some I would prefer to have as medium sized for example the WPCentral App and Weather app, I use the nokia reading app (it supports the small tile - images changes) which is linked to the WPCentral RSS feed along with the other sites like the nokia blog, microsoft news and wmpu.

Yeah I would like to see this as an option on my Lumia 920. Hopefully they come through with this for 8.1.

Will people with an HTC 8x get the option of 3 columns?

If I had to guess, I'd say that on screens below 5" the small tiles were simply too small. I think the current tile size is already at the ideal lower limit of usability, and any smaller would just result in unintentional presses. I imagine that the pin and resize controls would overwhelm the smallest of tiles. There's really no good solution for that other than to not implement it at all. I suppose some could argue that they should give the user the choice. But all that would happen is that is that people would try it and then complain that it doesn't work well.

I like it, though I fear tiles could be too small. In all, I guess they did make it work but are saving it for a bigger update, to get the most user impact out of the feature.

No, this is simply unusable. Any 3rd column of devices lower than 5" would imply a complete redesign of the current sizes to squash in a 3rd column. Such redesign would imply turning the small tiles unusable (many people already find them too small...well, guess what? To have 3 columns they would have to be even smaller).
There's no way to make this work.
Well...unless they redesign the way the tiles work and make it so that instead of 3 sizes we have free hand to resize them to the sizes we want, which means we could even manage to fit a 4th column.
To add such a feature would imply a severe redesign and recode on the OS...and that's never gona happen, given how lazy Microsoft is to fix smaller issues. They can toggle the option for this, of course...but only a few fanatics will end up using it. The general consumer will just find the screen cluttered and downright horrible to look at and unmanageable. And I'm with the second group. I don't want a 3rd column...not even on a 5" screen.

One of the many reasons I prefer my 920 to my 4S is that the screen is so small and hard to read on the 4S, which is not the case on the 920.  Adding a third row and squishing them down would not be something I'd use at all. If it's possible the option should be included, you'd just never see it used on my phone.  :)

if it is possible why not just let it in . if people dont find it any good they can switch back to the normal rows. so why keep software producers keep deciding what soncumers want.

They should give the option. If people activate it or not, thats another thing.

I'd like the option. People who think it's pointless never need to touch it. People who want it can have it. I don't see why it shouldn't be included in the future once they make it work without issue. I'm sure the tiles on my 3.7" Lumia 710 are the same size as they would be with three columns on my 4.5" 920.

Daniel, can we expect to have a Preview of 8.1 earlier than the Spring 2014 or Spring 2014 will be for the Preview with the broadly release only to Summer 2014?

I don't think an extra row of tiles is that good!! What we need (at least I do) and what I think is right, is an option for a smaller tile size!! ... From what we see in the pic above, the medium tile we have now is smaller here! What about, if you take this tiny tile as reference, I say we need, large tile (sized 3x6 tiny tiles), medium tile (sized 3x3 tiny tiles), small tile (sized 2x2 tiny tiles) and the tiny tile!

I think that users should be given the option of either not having the third column or having a third column for small icons only which would help in accessing certain aps quickly or having a third column with medium sized tiles.     I personally would use the third column of small icons as I have a few apps like email , sending text, the AAWP app etc that don't really need a live tile as I go into it so frequently but want it on the front screen for easy access.

I sure would like to have the option of switching between 2 or 3 rows. If i had to have only one of the options i don`t know which i`d chose. It´s hard to say whitout trying though i have to say the 3 rows looks appealing. (and cluttered?)

Probably wouldn't use it, but I see no reason why it shouldn't be available as an option...
As long as it doesn't loose the signature looks, customization is fine. Just leave 2 columns as default, 3 columns only if the user really wants it.
Should be ok for people who don't use the smallest tiles in small screened phones.

May I know when will a Nokia Lumia 820 get a GDR3 or Lumia Black Update?

I will wait for a stable version for smaller screens!

You'd just get users blaming app developers that their live tile images are too small and unreadable. They must be scaling the size to fit, since there's not enough resolution. I would prefer a landscape start screen, way cooler.

Now I am irked Microsoft it was going to be an option and you removed that grrr everybody we need to send feedback about in every spam this shit all over Nokia feed back and other place ap reviews!

Spring 2014 is just too late. I hope someone will find a way of completely hacking WP8 till then.

So there is no 1080p display coming for 920

Lol um no, never

We better have it in 8.1 I really want that 3 row column Microsoft I have Xbox windows 8 windows phone too windows 7 too windows XP all in perfect condition in good computers no viruses made software for them too Microsoft better start improving this shit here!

Upgrade release at Spring 2014? But I don't wanna wait for so long... :(

A little off topic: I wonder if you can have no tiles on the start screen. Can't be bothered to try it. :)

It will just show the app menu, no start screen, until you pin an app again :)

actually you can use one of the tile creation apps like wiztiles or skinery themes and make a static black tile.

They should bring it all the phones. Let the user choose between the two options

Absolutely, Microsoft, make it happen... at least as an option to turn on/off.

Yes, please include that extra 3rd column of tiles. Choice is good. For me, the ability to view more live tile info in one screen would be very handy. On top of that, I'd like to see the tiles rotate when the phone is put in landscape mode (ie if I'm using it in the car for music & Here Drive). Now that would be nice.

I would love to have this feature too! L920/Vodafone/Uk

Fking belfiore its his fault, I'm sure Rudy could patch something for us..... Sigh gdr3 was the biggest disappointment because of this missing

While 3 columns might have been enabled at one point for 900 series phones, it doesn't mean it meets Microsoft's usability standards.  So I can totally understand them disabling that option until "they can make it work".  Even though you could do it at one point, doesn't mean it "works".  If it breaks usability guidelines, then from a design perspective, it doesn't work.  As a former software designer and progammer, I totally understand why MS would hesitate in this.     I see a couple issues in enabling this.  They probably have a minimum landing area size for tiles and buttons in WP8.  The third column on a 4.5" screen may break that, especially on a narrower screen like the 8X.  Also, they probably have a minimum font size specification for tiles, and the third column would probably break that too.  So in order to stay within design guidelines like that, they'd have to create exceptions within the OS to detect that scenario to increase font size.  But now you'll have to create another specification, and then subsequently, change the SDK too.  Now all devs who have made apps with small tiles with text will have to revisit and recompile their apps and push an update.  This is fine if you are someone like Rudy who is super keen, but there are also a zillion apps that are on a poor maintenance cycle.  Most of these apps won't get updated to reflect the new design guideline.  Now all of a sudden, you might have the majority of apps in the store breaking design guidelines, and that would undermine the whole design principle of WP, which is: ultimate clarity and relevancy of delivered content.   So seriously guys, it's not as simple as flipping a switch as most of you seem to think.  A change like this goes much much deeper than what you see on the surface.  Something so simple can easily undermine your entire mission.  

+920...That was exactly what i thought about the feature.I look at that pic posted and i m lyk,where the hell is the clean design of windows,twil look totally messy with all that info in a screen less than 5 inches.When notification center comes in GDR3,it will solve many of the complaints on having an extra row for the majority i think..

Microsoft is like IBM in the 1980s. Slow and corporate, and other companies run circles around them. The best thing for WP would be to fire all the developers and transfer it to Nokia in Finland.  

Well, the thing is, nobody is forcing you to use MS.  All the ecosystems have their share of serious problems.  Android is compromised on usability.  They practically have no standards and any manufacturer can do whatever they wish.  You get totally inconsistent UI across apps and especially widgets, many of which are really compromised in the clairty of content delivery.  It's a clusterf__k.  Widgets of varying sizes, shapes, font size, colour, shading, background, opacity etc... it's like you are using a schizophrenic device.  That's what sucks.  What is great about it is how anyone can make anything for android and it can get published FAST.  But there is no curation or strong design guidelines and language to ensure that you get a great user experience that is consistent across apps and widgets.     iOS feels like a dinosaur in this day and age.  The pieces feel disjointed, and you have screens and screens of icons and folders.  Isn't that was MacOS System 1 looked like in 1984?  Yup.  And now it looks like they are trying to move to a more modern design, but are still stuck within their archaic framework.  They are stuck in a halfway place between old and modern, and it looks and feels that way IMO.     Windows phone is a very tightly controlled system with a priority on the Clarity and Relevancy of Delivered Content.  It achieves clarity through design guidelines and language, and while it's not strictly enforced, it's userbase has come to demand that devs follow the design language for best ratings.  This gives us a beautiful interface and makes it super duper easy for us get the information we want, as quickly as we can, in the clearest manner possible.  This is the beauty of WP.  It's downside is that any tightly controlled ship will be more difficult to change and update while not breaking their own design guidelines.     So pick your poison.  Nobody is perfect.  But in terms of OS design, I chose WP8 a year ago because the design is so far ahead of Android and iOS, making simple day to day usage as nice as it can be.     I graduated with a degree in computer science with a specialty in Interface design, and WP8 is definitely worlds ahead of the others IMHO.  Second place, honestly, is BB10.  But too little too late.  

"...it's like you are using a schizophrenic device."   Nah, Windows 8 is schizophrenic. Android is just messy. But a little messy never hurt anyone. It's not normal or healthy to be neat freak.  

Yes, because Nokia Finland was really great at making Symbian relevant...

Yep! You read my mind! It could be a cluster bleep if rushed!!

Don't you all think that the 3 columns is, for now, a selling feature for the larger phones that are soon to be released??? I think that allowing current phones the 3rd column option would most likely hurt sales of the new, large-screened devices on the horizon.

Yes, duh. The two column tiles are stupidly large even on a 4" screen.

Can I enable this extra column in GDR3 preview? If yes, how? I couldn't find anything about zdev on google :(

Maybe read the article before commenting?

I personally would find it awesome if they could figure it out!

Microsoft has no manners. You should at least wine and dine your consumer before you screw them.

Tiles are one thing, they need to push out the notification center. That is a very lacking feature for WP.

I was sooo pumped for this feature. Both me and my gf. We would both like more tiles on the screen at a time and we'd both be so pumped if they made it available! Please bring it back!!!

Y do u all need 3 columns. Yeah its tru dat i wil also love it. But more than that i hope if they can make a new tile size. It wil be perfect in small screen sizes.
Ryt now we have full. Half and the small sizes. Y cant they make 3/4 live tile? Is t possible or im just dreaming? Does any one have a thought about this?

Yes!!!!! I'd love to have 3 columns on my 928!

Give us the option if its not perfect update with improvements that make it better!

3 mid sized tile columns are too much for me. I hope they give the user an option to choose should they decide to give this "feature" to older Lumia devices. Personally, an extra row of icons on the iPhone 5 didn't make a difference to me, but this does. Microsoft, if u plan to give this to older Lumia devices, please give a toggle.

Does anyone else feel that Spring 2014 is a little too late for Microsoft to dish out Windows Phone 8.1 which may not have everything the uservoice feature list is asking for?

Just let Nokia handle it!!

The way I see it, Microsoft should do it like THIS: 4.5" and up => 3 medium tiles. 4.3" => 2 medium tiles + 1 small tile. <4.3 => 2 medium tiles (the as as it is now)   This change should come with a toggle option of course. MS, give us options ! As a proud owner of a L820, I wouldn't even mind 3 medium tiles on this 4.3 gorgeous device. If there is a toggle for it, why not?

Yes they should even for low end Lumias like the 520 and co

Yup. They really should. I would love to have that option. For some reason that i don't really know, they disabled it. For some reason too, i hope they will come out with solution and options soon! Those will look amazing on my 920. ;p

I just want the three row so I can use all wide and medium tiles. The layout would look really sleek.

Great, there goes another feature.

Tiles tiles tiles.. What would you do with it?? Just a cosmetic update. Tell them to incorporate some actual useful features.

For some (most of us), being on Windows Phone and all, more glanceable information on the Start Screen is a useful feature.

Nah, that would be too easy, actually making the OS more functional is overrated. Fluff all the way! /s

I'd like the option of having 3 columns on my 928.

I rather not know information like this. I LIKE my 920.

As soon as 8.1 computers gave the option to make smaller tiles, I jumped on that and made everything smaller. I love it! But I don't know how I'd feel about that option for my phone. I'd rather get different pages, like swiping to the left to have a whole different start screen.

This doesn't fuss me too much, three columns look far too cluttered in my opinion

I have to say its a bummer. And given that the last Update before bricked my L920, and the warrantee runs out Dec 31, it looks like I won't see three columns until I guy another phone.
I wouldn't mind trading a third column in for say, a working XBox Music client, but that is probably too much to ask. Over and over again MS is underperforming and lagging behind. This isnt good.

What a horrible application xboxmusic, even as a player is ridiculous....
If I could order to play a folder at list....

We have had consistent updates since 7.5. Typically every few months until 7.8 & 8.0. e.g. The disappearing keyboard issue was fixed in 3 months. 7.5 was released Sept 27 2011 and then them 7.5 'refresh', with the keyboard fix, came out January 4 2012. I know that I received the update in early-to-mid February 2012. In June 2012 we got tango, a few more updates after that and then 7.8 in Jan 2012.
AT&T simply don't care and released the updates much later, but that doesn't mean the WP update cycle is universally slow.

929 is a sexy looking bitch! haha cant wait.! needs to hurry up tho

this might be a dumb question... but why couldnt we have columns as part of our settings.  Meaning that we can chose to have 4, 5 or 6 columns.  I would imagine that 5 columns would be appropriate for a 920 screen.

I expect my freakin lumia1020 to get some interest in updates from Microsoft its a flagship i believe

Curse you microsoft... All i was waiting for my L920, and now you say it won't fit... If im driven to another disapointment because of microsoft, im going to change phone. This is ridiculous.

Looking at that 920 in the picture makes me realize that small tiles would be too small for the 4.5" screen. But those same small tiles are already too big on the Lumia 625. In my opinion, this 3 column thing should be an option for 4.7" phones and bigger. It just doesn't make any sense to lose resources creating compatibility for 3 columns on a Lumia 520 for example!

Personally, it's unlikely I would use 3 columns on my 920. But, they should give people the option.

I hope they bring this back, i hope they wont keep it as an exclusive thing for larger displays! I would love 3 rows -exciting

They will not add it, one more reason to buy 1520 !!
Att/msft/nokia $$$$$$$$$$$

This was removed for marketing purposes so ppl that love this feature are forced to buy another handset and a fking huge one at that. There is no other reason for it to be gone from 920 display. #applemove

More likely this was because the tiles are too small to accurately touch on smaller screens. On my HTC 8X with 4.3" screen, the small tiles are less than 0.5" in size. That's about the limit for accurate touch interaction.

Bring the basic notification center first..its a must..dont include it as a live tile..make it a swipe left..and also include smart dialing..these are the basic things that have to be developed..not the glance screen or three tiles a row..

I agree. But Nokia can't go beyond gimmicks like the glance screen. Microsoft in turn needed the three rows to make WP work on modern hardware. It was a feature they needed right away to even be considered an vallid alternative to Android by reviewers. So I can understand that notification centre and other standard software features would be added after the hardware demanded features. Otherwise Microsoft would put Nokia at a disadvantage and make Samsung and HTC shun WP even more then they do now. But I do expect them to deliver these software features in 8.1. If they cant then I seriously have to reconsider my chosen platform...

I don't care about the third row, really.

Does anyone know when is the release of GDR3 or Update 3 for Lumia 820? Thanks

Is 929 out on Verizon?

I don't have this problem in my Lumia 920

YES!

Personally I think the WP8 interface doesnt look as good with so many tiles. The contrast between the system colored tiles and the non-system colored tiles seems wrong. Personally I think the Windows 8 team was right that each tile should have a different color on larger screens.   However the more options the better. Windows 8.1 also offers the ability to change the amount of tiles visible. Personally I hope that WP8.1 offers the ability to switch the Windows 8's tile colors in addition to the option to add more tiles to my L920. Those things combined would allow me to create one look across my phone, tablet and PC.   I think Windows needs such advanced customization options to make the die-hard detractor reconsider the modern UI.

So, i think microsof can make three columns for all wp8 devices. However, some people may not like it. For this reason, i think microsoft must make a special place in "settings" where people can turn on and turn off three columns.

- Bring it back please. I've got enough stuff in my pockets and bags already in life to have the giant Lumias. I'm rocking 3 Lumia phones, 920, 925 & 1020, and they fit my world wide lifestyle. And furthermore, the more time I spend living my Lumias the more apps, live tiles and communication becomes important or rather crucial.
I need, no, I want a 3d column of tiles to keep my life checked at a glance.
Pretty please...

Agree, this needs to be on more phones and updates need to come quicker.

Disappointing. This was easily in the top 3 things I was looking forward to with GDR3. If it's already in the code, just make it an option for those of us that want it. I'd even download an app if someone could figure out how to unlock this. There is plenty of space on the 4.5 inch screens for 3 rows, and even the smallest tiles would still be huge compared to the keys on the standard onscreen keyboard. Seriously, why remove this feature? To what end Microsoft?   The other fix I'm hoping for, probably the only one that ranks above the tiles, is the mutually-exclusive Wi-Fi versus Bluetooth/MMS/Visual Voicemail that is at least present on T-Mobile Lumias, and causes similar errors on other brands and carriers.

Wonder that it works too on Lumia 620, it could have smaller tiles on the screen since it has a 3.8" screen size. I think it should be the standard for all manufacturers to make phones with at least of 4" screen size.

Exactly❕

yes and no Yes, because its an amazing feature that i would personally love to experience on my 920 No, because users should have control over whether they want 2 or 3 columns. Some people find it better to reach for their favorite tiles in the 2 column layout . 3 column layout was made for the bigger screens assuming that the size of each tile will still be easily reachable. Introducing 3 column layout for smaller screensized WP phones will be useless because you will literally take double the time to focus to hit the desired small tile that will be very small in the 3 column layout

any chance having this in 820?  4.3 screen

All I'm reading is about square tiles and more square tiles.... I'm using a 920.. a 3rd column would clutter up the screen with tiny squares. But how about implementing it with a variation of RECTANGULAR tiles, say the size of 1x2 small tiles (or 1x3, 2x1 etc )... These tiles wont be too small for fat fingers. Fonts within such tiles can be larger... etc There are apps like Header Tile (which I like a lot), that let me have "blank" spaces on my start screen which make the screen nice and tidy my 0.02

Seems like Microsoft is always against the users!

I would like to see landscape support of the start screen in update 3

It probably worked this way (often heard reason why cool features in upcoming MS products are canned):   One of the higher ranks in the WP group showed this function to one of his elder relatives who didn't like it too much. Maybe bad eyesight and clumsy fingers lead to a problem with correctly hitting the small icons. So the additional column was removed.   Thank you Microsoft, thank you very much. :-(

Soooo,sad...

Can L920 at&t owners who have the developer beta of GDR3 use the third column?? If so, how?

Yes please bring the third row back

Why doesn't MS make live tiles (for 6" devices) 1x1, 2x2 & 4x4 (versus current 1x1, 2x2 4x2) size so the home screen could "rotate" the live tiles to view in landscape.  Just got a 1520 and, honestly this thing would be unreal if home screen could be horizontal (don't be snarky and tell me to tilt my head).

I made a suggestion in the Uservoice part of Windows Phone websites. I don't know if you know what it is, but it's like a suggestion-box where all WP users can bring their ideas and let the admins know where to improve in building the next WP update. I really want the third row even on my Lumia 820 and I bet someone else is interested! Here is the link to the suggestion: https://windowsphone.uservoice.com/forums/101801-feature-suggestions/suggestions/5197440-enable-the-third-live-tiles-row-in-all-windows-pho Please give 1, 2 or 3 votes to this, so that it can grow and be visible to other people. Through this way, we obtained custom SMS tones in GDR3, and also the task manager. Take a look even to other suggestions, as they may be interesting for you!

Personally, I think on the 4.7" 920 screen shown, the text of the latest update on some of those Live Tiles is too small. But I agree it should have been left as an option. Also, about the speed of updates. I don't think you are comparing like with like. Think of the GDRs as 8.0.1, 8.0.2 and 8.0.3. You have to remember that these include bug fixes and new functionality. This is on top of "firmware/build updates" that fix some showstopper bugs. Apple have had 4 fix releases since iOS 7.0 came out in September, but they are only fixes, no new functions, and iOS 7 needed them, it might have looked good but on day one it was buggy as hell (and on closed hardware from the same company that makes the software, that really shouldn't have happened). Also, each "major release number" of iOS hasn't been all that different to the one before it, until iOS 7, and that was a graphical redesign, that again kept things under the covers quite static. WP7, 7.5 and 7.8 had the same level of fairly minor function changes that you get every year with iOS, but WP8 was a major reworking, a totally new OS under the covers with a new app development environment too (its no longer Silverlight only). I would say that the GDRs introduced less new features than say WP7 to 7.5, and iOS 5 to 6, but then they have released 3 of them in a year. What I'm clumsily saying is the two companies have a very different release schedules, and different ways of packaging new features (Apple bring out new features less often, but with more in each release, Microsoft have been drip feeding).

JUST BRING TO L625! 4.7 dude! Don't want to miss it with 0.3 inches!