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Treo 800w: 30+ Days Later, a Second Look

So it's been a bit over 30 days with the Treo 800w released exclusively on Sprint (see our full review here) and we're here to go over the good, the bad and even some ugly.

Interested in knowing whether the Treo 800w stands up as a plausible option for you as your next smarthphone? Check out this experience guide for some answers.

Read on for Malatesta's experience with the Treo 800w, some tips and tricks and a few kinks that need to be worked out yet.

Going back to mid-2007, rumors of the follow up to the popular Sprint 700wx were circulating and we were hearing things like "GPS", WiFi" and "320x320 resolution".

Fast forward one long and exciting year (for smarthpone users, not necessarily for Palm) and the 800w finally launched with little fanfare on Sprint. To say the device was "delayed" would be an understatement and unfortunately it shows quite a bit, especially in stark contrast to the much newer and hipper Treo Pro.

But how does it stand on its own? In short, it's probably the best CDMA Treo and one of the most efficient WM devices on the market. By efficient we mean it's direct and fast in what it needs to do. Here function over form wins (sorry Apple). This is partially achieved with Palm's "one touch" system.

The Good

One-Touch: With Palm's one-touch approach, users can quickly

  • turn on/off Wifi
  • access your email inbox
  • toggle the ringer
  • check your calendar

Other things like toggling the phone radio and Bluetooth (2.0x + EDR) is also done with very few steps. In fact this is probably one of the major differences between the 800w and "other" WM devices and smartphones and it really helps.

Even on a BlackBerry, getting to the inbox is not as direct as just hitting a single, dedicated hardware button. Sure it might not seem like a big deal at first, but when you are accessing the same functions over and over, day in, day out, these little shortcuts are a big help.

In short, well thought out dedicated buttons rock.

Build Quality: As always, Palm Treos just feel great in terms of build quality and "in the hand". The 800w is no exception. But don't take my word, listen to what a Sprint service technician (Muffnician) recently said (and see the device internal pics here):

...it is very well built, the best Treo by far hardware wise IMHO. Built like A FREAKIN tank. The keyboard has an aluminum frame and all the ribbons and connectors are tucked away, preventing failures from drops and such. Im excited. Very few returned, very few in for service with issues, mostly ID 10 T errors. I think Palm did very well.

Hardware: The hardware on the 800w is right at the level of smartphones in 2008--so it's nothing extraordinary but it's also no slouch. To recap:

  • 333mhz processor
  • 256mb ROM/128mb RAM
  • WiFi
  • aGPS
  • BT 2.0
  • 320x320 resolution screen
  • 2.0mp camera
  • Hardware graphic acceleration
  • microSD expansion

While the processor seems underspec'd for such a device, in fact it holds up very well with almost any software thrown at it, including things like Core Player and the Skyfire browser. This is in part do to the choice by Palm to include hardware graphic acceleration which takes some of the work load off the CPU. The decision to include those graphic drivers was a good one as Mobile Internet Explorer scrolls much easier and all the programs just flow much better i.e. no choppiness or stuttering.

Somewhat ironically, Dieter thinks the 800w is faster (by a hair) than the Treo Pro, which has a faster processor. So yeah, for a WM device it's zippy.

Memory (both storage and RAM) are more than enough for the average and power user. No more wondering if you have enough RAM or having to routinely close out applications as running with 10 or 12 programs in the background has little to no effect on overall system performance.

The WiFi on the device aided by the dedicated toggle switch is a real joy to use. For years, using WiFi on a WM device was a bit of a chore as you had to navigate many menus to actually turn it on and then find a network to connect too. It was more work than it was usually worth. Other solutions, like HTC's slider switch (found on the Sprint Mogul) often resulted in users accidentally turning it on when sliding it in or out of their pocket.

With the Palm dedicated button though, you just turn it on by holding it down (no accidental enabling) and then a little screen pops up showing you the available networks to connect to. Had you connected to the same network previously, it'll just directly connect without any intervention from the user, making it a snap to use.

Interestingly, speeds in comparison to the device's 3g EvDO RevA are not much greater, making WiFi an option out of necessity (i.e. no signal or 3g) rather than just pure speed. If you have RevA coverage where you are, you can expect 1,000kbps+ speeds from our experience.

The camera on the device is also adequate--not bad, but not great either. It would have been of course nice to see a 3.2mp camera which appears to be the new standard for 2008, but since this is more like a 2007 device, that's what we get.

The aGPS functions very well, acquiring your location within about 10 seconds outside. The system is also "unlocked" meaning 3rd party programs (Google Maps, Live Search, GPSToday, etc.) can all access the hardware with usually zero configuration. This is probably my most used feature and it's just fantastic.

In regards to Bluetooth, the 800w holds it own against any other competitive device out on the market. With full A2DP on board (as it should), the BT has paired with many headsets without any hiccups. In short, it just plain works and for a Palm device, that's saying something.

Although we have not tried it in our Lexus (WMExperts doesn't pay that much), reports from the forums have been positive for in-car BT systems, including the Prius.

Reception and call quality are above average for the former and average for the latter. In comparison to the Treo 700wx, reception is much improved and the addition of Rev A speeds (where available) ensures a speedy connection even when reception is minimal.

Finally, the keyboard is pretty fantastic. Sure some of us were a little miffed at loosing one shift key (the left one), but the quality of the thumb board here is Palm's best yet. It's spaced well, they keys are nice and flat and the response is very good.

The Bad & the Ugly

Of course no device on the market is perfect, especially WM, and the Treo 800w is no exception. So here are a list of known issues, limitations or possible problems that are currently known:

GPS or aGPS?: One big controversy right now in the forums is in regards to the aGPS. Specifically, some promotional material for the 800w stated that the device had GPS which was both "assisted" (aGPS) and "standalone" (GPS). In other words if you are on the Sprint network, you'd get the arguably superior aGPS which is faster and more accurate, but if you had the phone radio turned off or were off-network, the device would fall back to the more traditional GPS system, which while slower is still at least usable without the Sprint network.

Alas the 800w does not function like this (much like the Sprint Blackberry 8830), so if you do not have any network connectivity, the GPS is hosed. Palm's engineers are aware of the issue and it appears to be a programming one, so a fix may be possible but no guarantees from them.

Does it matter? Technically, Palm is in the wrong here since the feature is advertised but the function is missing, so we'd like some clarification on that matter soon. But, unless you are using your device for somewhat non-traditional uses (off shore fishing, hiking, remote scavenger hunts) this probably won't have much of an effect on your daily usage--in fact being in the Northeast where coverage is fairly abundant, this "limitation" is not noticed at all.

Then again, if you were planning on using it on that trip to Europe, look elsewhere for now

So judge accordingly and determine how important this is to you before you commit.

Battery: The 800w has an 1150mah battery and while it's nice to think that this is coincidentally the same battery as the Centro, that would be wishful thinking. Instead it appears to have been a accounting department decision and not based on engineering or real-world usage. This has become especially evident with the release of the Treo Pro which is significantly thinner yet has a much larger, WM-friendly 1500mah battery.

For our usage here at WMExperts, the 1150mah battery has been fine for our needs and it does recharge very quickly (e.g. a 20min wall-charge will add 17% back; an hour recharge nearly 60%), so the hurt is not felt as much. Plus with a mild 333mhz processor, smaller chipset and power tweaks to WM 6.1, an 1150mah battery goes further today than last year.

Having said that there is no argument that having a 1500mah battery (and a thinner device) would have been obviously better. And for some users who do use their phone a lot for all the various things WM 6.1 can do these days, 1150mah is just too little.

Does it matter? Once again, it will depend on your current usage. The 800w won't blow anyone away in terms of power longevity and for others it won't last more than a 6hrs with heavy usage. If you are away from a wall charger all day or use it heavily, this 1150mah battery may be more trouble than its worth. On the other hand, if you are in the car or at the office and can remember to plug it in for "10 mins here, 10m mins there" you won't have much of a problem.

Still, lets not beat around the bush here: Blackberry still wins over any WM device in this area.

Volume/Speaker: Lets just say the 800w's volume settings are sensitive. When using the speakerphone, if you go over 4 ticks on the volume slider, the speaker will crackle. Now for some quieter environments, 4 ticks or lower is actually loud enough--but come on, the speaker should never crackle.

Earpiece volume is also lower than what many would prefer and it seems to reset to a default position (even on BT) with every call.

Speaking of BT, VoiceCommand while now patched to work over BT is very quiet over a headset...way too quiet. Are these hardware limitations or software glitches? Who knows but volume can be finicky.

Stylus: While personally here at WMExperts we feel this is a silly point, for some the plastic stylus is just too wimpy. For us, it's fine but if you are a styli fetishist, you may want to look somewhere else as the plastic one included is not inspiring.

Things Missing?

Regarding some hardware, while the main aspects of the device are solid (both in terms of specs and build quality, which is excellent), there are few things that would have made the 800w much better:

  • Thumb scroll wheel: when going through long documents or web pages, there is no doubt that having a thumb wheel on the side (the kind with the spring ala Moto Q) is a great alternative to the d-pad
  • Ambient Light Sensor: why not have the screen auto-adjust to lightening conditions? Moto Q9 does this as do some BlackBerries and the iPhone. It not only can save power but it's one less thing for the user to manage
  • Proximity Sensor: once again, have the back light/screen turn off when on a call and manage that via the Proximity sensor
  • Bigger battery (see above)
  • microUSB-to-3.5mm converter: lets forget that it's nearly impossible to find a 3rd party one, this should have been included in the box (and a case would have been a nice touch too)

Tips, Tricks and Hacks

What would a WM device be without the community of volunteers to customize every aspect of the darn OS? Here are few great ways to fill in those gaps that either MS, Palm or Sprint left:

  • TreoAlerts: want blinking LEDs and notifications for missed calls, sms, email, etc? Look now further than this freeware app developed in our forums
  • GPS Tool: the best way to turn off GPS is close-out (not minimize) any program that tracks your location, but one way to absolutey make sure that GPS is off is the freeware app by Hannip that allows you toggle the GPS radio on/off
  • Ebag's Massive Registry Tweak: wanna turn on or off the largest collection of registry tweaks with one-click? Here ya go
  • Registry thread: if you're a manual kinda person, then pay attention to this thread
  • What does your Today Screen look like?: this thread will give you an idea of what people are doing to make their devies cooler looking and more efficient to use

Conclusion/Overall Thoughts

The Palm Treo 800w is not the best smartphone out there but it's a darn good one. Where there are bugs, Palm seems to be taking each one on head first and releasing "patches" along the way (see the latest one here), which is a much better approach to the "one big ROM update" that usually comes much later on. We welcome this change and hope that the pesky volume and GPS issues get addressed next.

It is unfortunate that the Treo Pro had to come around and steal its thunder, but there is no denying that the Treo Pro excels in some areas (battery, size, design, headphone jack) and is where Palm needs to be going. Also, no doubt the HTC Touch Diamond and eventually the Pro will be appearing on Sprint. While those devices will be killer, they just don't seem to be as dedicated to messaging/PIM/phone as this one. YMMV.

But if you are looking for a powerful messenger device on Sprint and want one of the most efficient (though far from glamorous) WM devices out on the market, this is probably your best bet. If interested, you should definitely take it out for a 30-day spin and give it a fair shake.

My final opinion after 30 days? Its basically what I've been wanting in a WM device in 2008. Not perfect, but close. With Palm hopefully patching up some of those flaws along the way, it'll only get better.

Hopefully this guide helped you decide if it's the right phone for you.

67 Comments
  • Where is the screen brightness issue addressed in this article? I didn't think it was too bad but others think it is unacceptable....
  • Should have mentioned the bad call quality most phones have. It's muffled sometimes.
  • I'm just glad to see the phone exists after reading about it for so long. I'll enjoy it even more when it makes it to the Verizon Wireless network to allow me to upgrade to a nicer phone.
  • Should have mentioned the bad call quality most phones have. It's muffled sometimes.
    I simply don't experience this and think the call quality is fine.
    An associate with the same phone (who is returning to the WM flock after giving up with the 6700 years ago) also has no problems or complaints in this regard.Where is the screen brightness issue addressed in this article? I didn't think it was too bad but others think it is unacceptable....
    Yeah I thought about throwing it in there but I personally think it's bollocks.
    While not the brightest screen out there I just don't see anything to complain about. Once again I'm going on my own opinion there and an associate's.
    It seemed that there were only a few who considered this a problem but I just don't see it as a "bug" or design flaw.
  • The "display brightness issue" is just a crappy chosen theme by Palm. Change your theme and it makes a *HUGE* difference.
  • I don't know for sure, but I think at this point I'll be taking a closer look at the Touch Pro when it debuts. I guess I'll lose a boat load of money, but I think that the Treo has too many problems.
  • Thanks Mal for the "Second Look," I have had my 800w for over a month and enjoy it immensely. The major portion of my screen is black so the white letters pop-out at me. I agree with hannip that the original theme is the only problem with the brightness. As far as call quality, this phone is much better than the other treos I have owned (600, 650, 700p and 755) and I have fewer disconnects than I had with my Mogul. I know that the touch pro will have a newer processor than the Treo, but with Palms 'tweaks' the 800w will prove to be a better device.
  • I guess I'm o e of the few to get a perfect 800w.
    Screen Brightess??? - Turned it up. All's fine. I don't need it any brighter. If I dd, then I guess there is a brightness issue or a problem with my eyes.
    Call volume - Though a little low compared to my 700wx, it's just fine. I can hear the caller and they can hear me.
    Other than the 800w requiring a Sprint network to acquire a GPS lock, it's practically perfect.
    My only really gripe, as I metioned before, I wuld have preferred a 240x320 screen resolution.
  • I simply don't experience this and think the call quality is fine.
    An associate with the same phone (who is returning to the WM flock after giving up with the 6700 years ago) also has no problems or complaints in this regard.Odd, when it was first out many on this forum complained of muffled sound quality even after multiple exchanges compared to other phones.
    I'll admit it's not too bad but it's definitely not as clear as my Mogul.
  • this article pretty much sums up what i've been going through but i'm still within the 30 day trial period.
  • "The best CDMA Treo ever." You must be getting a kick back from Palm. You should have quoted real power users in the "Bad and the Ugly" section. Not a bad article but please read the threads for research.
  • The "display brightness issue" is just a crappy chosen theme by Palm. Change your theme and it makes a *HUGE* difference.
    How does a theme affect brightness in standard WM apps like calendar, contacts, and 3rd party apps like Resco Explorer? Dim is dim ...
  • How does a theme affect brightness in standard WM apps like calendar, contacts, and 3rd party apps like Resco Explorer? Dim is dim ...
    Have you tried it? It made a huge difference for me in all of the apps you mention. One of the themes I have it even adds pinstripping to calendar, contacts and mail.
  • Have you tried it? It made a huge difference for me in all of the apps you mention. One of the themes I have it even adds pinstripping to calendar, contacts and mail.
    The pinstripping makes it even harder to read.
  • The pinstripping makes it even harder to read.
    Yeah, I didn't say I liked it, was just making a point. :)
  • Too bad that the article wasn't written by someone with at least a modicum of objectivity.
  • "The best CDMA Treo ever." You must be getting a kick back from Palm. You should have quoted real power users in the "Bad and the Ugly" section. Not a bad article but please read the threads for research.
    I think I'm, by most estimations, a power user. I've also had virtually all CDMA Treos. It is EASILY the best one so far, IMO. This review sums up my feelings as well.
    I also haven't had the crackling issues, nor have a concern about screen brightness... I keep it at 50% brightness and it looks fine to me.
  • It'd be nice to be quoted accurately:...it's probably the best CDMA Treo
    notThe best CDMA Treo ever
  • I also used them all and best CDMA Treo ever in my opinion. I love this phone and guess I am lucky as I have none of the issue mentioned except I cant watch movies all day as the battery will never make it but other than that its the BOMB! ( in a good way)
  • It'd be nice to be quoted accurately:
    not
    However you want to state it, sounds the same to me. At least the 700wx worked out of the box without having to cripple it. To me the 700wx is probably the best Treo ever. Not going by the feature list but stability, battery life and performance.Too bad that the article wasn't written by someone with at least a modicum of objectivity.
    Exactly. WMExperts.com:thumbsdn: I always wondered why everything on the site mostly give rave reviews. It's all about the Benjamins.
  • Too bad that the article wasn't written by someone with at least a modicum of objectivity.
    well ill give you i agree but in less words. As Vibrant said theres no difference in the 2 statements. You would HOPE its better than the 700wx with the hardware it has (and older treo's), thats kind of a "duh" statement its the best CDMA treo so far, the most recent one was 2 years old! I cant see how itd be possibly worse.
    The IMPORTANT factor is compared to other WM ppcs on the market and its mediocre at best. It falls way behind the new HTC line, the Xperia, and those new models on the verge of US releases at a HIGHER price point (diamond is selling at $550 and the pro at $570, and the treo at $600?!?). Its already needed 2 patches to fix huge bug sets in the phone, and theres still many more bugs/kwirks left to address.
    I have to agree reviews are written on huge biases most of the time, and reflect the author's interests. Youll always have the fanboys/die-hards.
    Best CDMA treo (pending no CDMA Treo Pro) so far, duh, best WM device, far from.
  • Mal, personally I thought it was a pretty fair review. To be honest, I expected all of the problems to be played off as "not a big deal" statements, but you didn't do that. You addressed the GPS, and what you said is true...it's not going to be an issue if you don't do unusual things with it. You also mentioned the battery life and the volume issues.
    I don't want to ruin this thread as well by starting yet another argument, but it's very clear that there are three people who seem to just not want to let people enjoy their 800ws. They always want to find a reason to bash it, or call anybody who loves it a fanboy. Not mentioning any names, because like I said...no need to start a fight, but it should be pretty obvious who I'm talking about.
  • Actually, Mal, you should have said it's the best CDMA Treo ever, cause it is by far the best CDMA Treo EVER. Forget about the fact that the last one was two years ago, the 800w is better now than the 700wx was then.
    I agree, it was a very fair review. I for one enjoy reading your reviews and appreciate your opinion. I'm not saying I always agree 100% with your opinion on everything, far from that. But, I appreciate it none the less. I think anyone who's been around the WM Forum world for any length of time would be lacking some basic intelligence not to recognize you as a true expert in this field.
  • Mal, personally I thought it was a pretty fair review. To be honest, I expected all of the problems to be played off as "not a big deal" statements, but you didn't do that. You addressed the GPS, and what you said is true...it's not going to be an issue if you don't do unusual things with it. You also mentioned the battery life and the volume issues.
    I don't want to ruin this thread as well by starting yet another argument, but it's very clear that there are three people who seem to just not want to let people enjoy their 800ws. They always want to find a reason to bash it, or call anybody who loves it a fanboy. Not mentioning any names, because like I said...no need to start a fight, but it should be pretty obvious who I'm talking about.
    Last time i checked we did live in the United States and not a dictatorship. No one agrees 100% of the time with what people say, and are free to express their opinions. Do you agree with everything, and the manner in which things are reported in the newspaper or on tv news? People have differences of opinion, thats human.
    My die-hard/fanboy reference was a general reviewer sentiment, not specific to this particular situation (Apple reviewers never saying anything bad no matter what, for example). Reviews are one particular view on a "thing," not an overall consensus. And they often do reflect the writers feelings and bias- but that's just how it is.
    I guess the main point here was it was simply an "expected" review. It'd be like asking the most right-winged Republican their view on abortion- its an obvious answer (Or good ole Walt about the iphone). Mal loves his Treos, and thats great, theres nothing wrong with that. The point being made I believe was maybe a more objective 3rd party should have written the article to have more value as a review (maybe someone who's never used a Treo who could read the board over the issues and play with it and give impressions and what they found good or bad or are the gripes legit).
  • Mal, personally I thought it was a pretty fair review. To be honest, I expected all of the problems to be played off as "not a big deal" statements, but you didn't do that. You addressed the GPS, and what you said is true...it's not going to be an issue if you don't do unusual things with it. You also mentioned the battery life and the volume issues.
    I don't want to ruin this thread as well by starting yet another argument, but it's very clear that there are three people who seem to just not want to let people enjoy their 800ws. They always want to find a reason to bash it, or call anybody who loves it a fanboy. Not mentioning any names, because like I said...no need to start a fight, but it should be pretty obvious who I'm talking about.
    Funny enough, I thought it was a fair review as well. I agree with you.
    I don't understand some people on this forum... odd behavior.
    I'll mention this one more time and be done.... but I'm not thinking the 800 is worth the cash over the 700wx. The 800 is a nice device but not a great device. Earlier tonight I took it out to test the gps only to have to stop due to battery life (had a call while out).
    I've not said much about the 800, but I think it is safe to say that I fall in the category of those who wish palm would have put a bit more thought into the device and released something people could use out of the box. I'm not disappointed, but I'm not jumping with joy either (if that makes any sense).
    One of the biggest things I was disappointed in was how the treo (windows 6.1) handles html email... not to mention the web browser is less than stellar. Think I'll wait for winmob 7... or at least that is my thinking right now... I could very well keep my 800...
    Good job mal... I don't think some even read your review... it was not hot, but not cold either (edit: the treo 800... not your review.... your review is right on...). lol
  • Dang, here goes another thread lost to some bickering...
  • agree I havemt seen a treo yet to cause so much of an uproar.and agree its the same 3-4 people who enter any thread that says anything positive about the 800 and bash it. anyways teriffic and fair review.
  • I've resisted putting those ridiculous 3-4 people on my ignore list, but it really is affecting my ability to enjoy coming here.
    I'm really tired of the "it's America, so I have a right to come here, troll in every thread, act like an ***, and disrupt every conversation" attitude.
    So to the ignore list with them! ;)
  • The point being made I believe was maybe a more objective 3rd party should have written the article to have more value as a review.But....but...it's America! Are you trying to repress Mal's ability to express his opinion of the Treo? Are you advocating restricting freedom of expression? Have we become a communist country? Are we spelling Amerika with a "k" now? :)
    I've resisted putting those ridiculous 3-4 people on my ignore list, but it really is affecting my ability to enjoy coming here.
    I'm really tired of the "it's America, so I have a right to come here, troll in every thread, act like an ***, and disrupt every conversation" attitude. If constantly complaining in every thread makes some people feel they have some sort of control over their lives, have fun - but you won't impact me anymore.
    So to the ignore list with them! ;)
  • agree I havemt seen a treo yet to cause so much of an uproar.and agree its the same 3-4 people who enter any thread that says anything positive about the 800 and bash it. anyways teriffic and fair review.
    To be clear, are you saying that release of all Treos cause an uproar, or that you haven't seen any cause this type of uproar? Because the same "tempest in a teapot" happened when people complained about memory issues with the 650, delay with the 700p, etc. Not that there weren't some issues with the prior Treos, but the conversation was very similar: most were happy, and a very vocal minority were apoplectic.
  • I'm sorry I said anything...I won't be responding to any comments about my post, simply to avoid further argument, which is not what this thread was designed for.
  • I meant the fighting and arguing amongst members here. I had and remeber the Memory issues with the 650 , delays with the 700P and there was alot of uproar BUT not the in fighting like there is over the 800W. my explanation for it is that some folks got the 800W , returned it becasue of the battery issue etc and now that the battery issue has some fixes are sorry they returned it and want to make themselves feel better about giving up too quick on a terriffic device by bashing it. I am not talking about anyone in particular thats just my honest assesment. and also if you dont like the 800W start a thread about your dislikes , its a right we all have but stop popping into every positive 800W thread and bashing it. Its not right to pop into every thread and keep saying the 800W sucks. Especially the people who dont even own a 800W. Ridiculous. To be clear, are you saying that release of all Treos cause an uproar, or that you haven't seen any cause this type of uproar? Because the same "tempest in a teapot" happened when people complained about memory issues with the 650, delay with the 700p, etc. Not that there weren't some issues with the prior Treos, but the conversation was very similar: most were happy, and a very vocal minority were apoplectic.
  • I meant the fighting and arguing amongst members here. I had and remeber the Memory issues with the 650 , delays with the 700P and there was alot of uproar BUT not the in fighting like there is over the 800W. my explanation for it is that some folks got the 800W , returned it becasue of the battery issue etc and now that the battery issue has some fixes are sorry they returned it and want to make themselves feel better about giving up too quick on a terriffic device by bashing it. I am not talking about anyone in particular thats just my honest assesment. and also if you dont like the 800W start a thread about your dislikes , its a right we all have but stop popping into every positive 800W thread and bashing it. Its not right to pop into every thread and keep saying the 800W sucks. Especially the people who dont even own a 800W. Ridiculous.
    Idk i see all, well most, of the comments here being about the objectivity of the article not the device itself. I own the device, and i guess I'm considered a "basher" here, so my opinion is not valid to be vocalized? I cant see where I even really talked about the device other than saying there are better device coming out soon here, and saying its the best cdma treo yet was kinda silly because it in fact should be the best treo, but comparing it to other PPCs on the market would have been a better comparison to make. I think my main point was a 3rd party reviewer would have made a more useful objective review, not that Mal's was bad but it had his own "writer's view/bias" in it. Its the same as Walt reviewing the iphone, you know how his story is going to be skewed even if he tried to be objective. Its not meant to be any kind of burn towards Mal, just a suggestion to let someone not so connected to Treos write it or give their feedback to include
  • I didnt mean you in particular klmsu19 I kjnow you have the device and agree you make good points. I was explaing how this thread is starting to resemble the others , not quite the bashing the 800w yet but a few folks popped in and it has begun to head in that direction. Lets all bring it back to topic . the 800w is sure a devisive device. And I muist add I appreciate all opinions good and bad but theres a place for them. I was one who complained about the delays in the 700P but there was a thread for it and thats where I vented. not popping into every 700P thread to bash the delays. again lets carry on with the topic at hand.
  • I don't believe anyone said the "800 sucks". We mostly are saying that the review was very biased. Welcome to an open forum. Opinions is what happens here.
  • I don't believe anyone said the "800 sucks". We mostly are saying that the review was very biased. Welcome to an open forum. Opinions is what happens here.
    Having an opinion and being a troll are two different things. Dang, here goes another thread lost to some bickering...
    Not if you complain to the mods... if enough people complain then something will happen.
    Seems to me that this thread is a follow to the thread where Mal was attacked and put some members on his "ignore" list. While I love a good side argument every now and again, some are taking this much too far... but a mod will eventually step in.
    No reason for someone to get attacked for writing a (fair) review on a product... and having unfair and unsubstantiated accusations lobbed at them. Even from some who don't even own a 800w. It is ridiculous.
  • "The best CDMA Treo ever." You must be getting a kick back from Palm. You should have quoted real power users in the "Bad and the Ugly" section. Not a bad article but please read the threads for research.
    So let me get this straight. You're flat out accusing Maletesta of taking a bribe to write a good review? Is that what you're actually saying? Because I think that's libel, and actionable in a court of law.
    You "real power users" are just trolls, and I really wish you'd just go away if you hate the 800w so much. The rest of us would like to discuss the device without your bashing. Shoo! Quit wasting your time and ours, or is your life really so empty?
  • How does a theme affect brightness in standard WM apps like calendar, contacts, and 3rd party apps like Resco Explorer? Dim is dim ...
    How bright do you need it to be? Seriously, I really want to know. Can you give me an example of when the screen is too dim? If you're talking about outdoors, try turning the device to face the sun straight on. The 800w is more reflective than most transflective screens, and looks amazing in direct sunlight with no backlight at all.
  • Too bad that the article wasn't written by someone with at least a modicum of objectivity.
    Seriously, dude, why are you still here? You hate the 800w. You love the Treo Pro and think it's the best thing since sliced Jesus. So what could you possibly hope to accomplish by posting in this forum? Why do you keep wasting all of our time, your own included?
  • I find the device very usable when looking at the other WM devices I have had. I long ago stopped using the regular theme and fancy screens and screen brightness no longer became a factor. My complaints are: the Bluetooth volume, but it is an issue that I can live with and the alarm inconsistency. Otherwise, as a business device, it survives well with heavy (hours) usage of the spread sheet function, email (FlexMail with 2 IMAP servers), HanDBase (Windows & POS releases at same time) and phone calls. Its ability to switch between screens is great as long as I am not receiving a large email, then it slows up for a moment. The Bluetooth is stable, does not shut down. The voice clarity with and without Bluetooth is good. The keyboard is great and the spread sheet bites.
  • So let me get this straight. You're flat out accusing Maletesta of taking a bribe to write a good review? Is that what you're actually saying? Because I think that's libel, and actionable in a court of law.
    You "real power users" are just trolls, and I really wish you'd just go away if you hate the 800w so much. The rest of us would like to discuss the device without your bashing. Shoo! Quit wasting your time and ours, or is your life really so empty?
    Relax Jeff, nobody is bashing your device. Go update your "God Complex" blog. Nobody is bashing Mal either. I wrote that the article was not bad just biased. No harm there. I believe Mal is a big boy. As a writer you have to take critisism (you should know this). The article is out there for everyone to read. You take the lumps and you take the praise.
  • Mal, personally I thought it was a pretty fair review. To be honest, I expected all of the problems to be played off as "not a big deal" statements, but you didn't do that. You addressed the GPS, and what you said is true...it's not going to be an issue if you don't do unusual things with it. You also mentioned the battery life and the volume issues.
    I don't want to ruin this thread as well by starting yet another argument, but it's very clear that there are three people who seem to just not want to let people enjoy their 800ws. They always want to find a reason to bash it, or call anybody who loves it a fanboy. Not mentioning any names, because like I said...no need to start a fight, but it should be pretty obvious who I'm talking about.
    Actually, i think it's the reverse as well. I find that there are some folks who do not want to see absolutely anything wrong with the 800w. They come up with reasons why the faults don't really matter "IMHO", want you to drag along bags full of spare batteries (yeah i'm exaggerating this one a bit :) ), have spare chargers in strategic parts of the world (starbucks/work/mistress' pad/shag pad ;) ) just to get some decent battery life and so on.
    Those who like it will fight for it and those who don't will piss on it just as much.
  • I agree with that also. Yes there is a battery issue on the 800w. Its a small battery for such a powerfull device and yes the GPS is not stand alone as advertised. But there not as bad as folks make them out to be. I get as much battery time as the Centro which was also the same battery. I loved the Centro and I love the 800W .My wife has a Razr and it needs to be charged every day. She can go 2 days but thats about it. I get 2 days on my 800W on a charge (after the changes made to put phone in power conserve mode) . Thats pretty much in line with what I expect and I do keep a spare in my pocket ( Because I am traveling to work into NY and I do it for emergancy purposes . Dont carry a spare otherwise. Actually, i think it's the reverse as well. I find that there are some folks who do not want to see absolutely anything wrong with the 800w. They come up with reasons why the faults don't really matter "IMHO", want you to drag along bags full of spare batteries (yeah i'm exaggerating this one a bit :) ), have spare chargers in strategic parts of the world (starbucks/work/mistress' pad/shag pad ;) ) just to get some decent battery life and so on.
    Those who like it will fight for it and those who don't will piss on it just as much.
  • Actually, i think it's the reverse as well. I find that there are some folks who do not want to see absolutely anything wrong with the 800w. They come up with reasons why the faults don't really matter "IMHO", want you to drag along bags full of spare batteries (yeah i'm exaggerating this one a bit :) ), have spare chargers in strategic parts of the world (starbucks/work/mistress' pad/shag pad ;) ) just to get some decent battery life and so on.
    Those who like it will fight for it and those who don't will piss on it just as much.
    Actually, the issue isn't whether folks are trashing the 800w inappropriately, or whether others are defending it inappropriately. Its about whether that same argument has to occur in every single thread, over and over and over.
    If everyone can stipulate that (a) some folks don't like the battery life, (b) GPS isn't standalone, (c) others have issues with crackling and/or BT, and STOP complaining in every thread, I think we'd have a much more pleasant board.
  • AMEN!!!!Actually, the issue isn't whether folks are trashing the 800w inappropriately, or whether others are defending it inappropriately. Its about whether that same argument has to occur in every single thread, over and over and over.
    If everyone can stipulate that (a) some folks don't like the battery life, (b) GPS isn't standalone, (c) others have issues with crackling and/or BT, and STOP complaining in every thread, I think we'd have a much more pleasant board.
  • Actually, i think it's the reverse as well. I find that there are some folks who do not want to see absolutely anything wrong with the 800w. They come up with reasons why the faults don't really matter "IMHO", want you to drag along bags full of spare batteries (yeah i'm exaggerating this one a bit :) ), have spare chargers in strategic parts of the world (starbucks/work/mistress' pad/shag pad ;) ) just to get some decent battery life and so on.
    Those who like it will fight for it and those who don't will piss on it just as much.
    Quoted for truth.
  • I think it is a good and balanced review and brings a lot of context and packs a lot of helpful information.
    Here is my critique of a 98% perfect review by Mal, and sorry of anyone considers it trolling. It isnt. IO actually think he voiced all the features and any issues extremely well and fairly. Here is my Point of View on two two major issues, battery life and gps where I think he also did a good job but on which I would add the following:
    1) I disagree with the condition term "unusual" on the issue of usage of off CDMA GPS. In another discussion of this someone made a dismissive crack to the effect of it won't work in the Amazon. Nice response.
    These are multi function devices. We could all l trivialize functions and features users expected if we did not have a use in our own habits and expectations. I've been told users who want gps should get a dedicated unit. Excuse me, but if MP3 playback were not working as promoted, this is akin to me asking why the person just didn't by an iPod.
    Mal says the needed coverage for aGPS is excellent on the northeast. true. But really the same could be said of wifi. There are comments from serious users all over this board and other boards, when wifi on smart phones come up, questioning the need for WiFi since there is evdo.
    I also appeared repetitive on this, but please do look back in threads and you will see that each time the missing Standalone GPS functionality was mentioned several posters would chime in saying theirs was working, when they were referring to the aGPS and not the Standalone feature.
    Friends, consider this, this device has impliict value and explicit off network functions, whether we are traveling outside of CDMA, or even even we decide to replace it as our phone and choose to have it around as a device disconnected from Sprint. It has wifi without Sprint. I has mp3 without sprint. it has a camera without sprint. etc. Standalone GPS means it should have GPS without Sprint.
    Enough said. It is important to me, and the 30 day return does not ameliorate this since Palm itself still does NOT have a specific official answer either way and all of this was very unclear during the original 30 days.
    2) I think in his review his discussion of my other concern, battery life is actually a resaonble and fair reflection of the dicussions here.
    That is very different than GPS which users are not going to find about until after 30 days. Users were able to see battery life in the first 30 days. And fortunately thanks to this site, amelorate some of the problem.
    I think Mal did also address the way I see it, that this was a poor marketing decision and the impacts of going to a much more reasonable 1500 would have had negligible effect on the product's size and cost.
    3. I do not agree with some of the intonations by others further up on the thread as to Mal's motives. He did piss me off with the you had t30 days on the GPS and I did think that is a wrong positon to ttake.
    But when I mentioned the point of view of reviewers, really what I was thinking of was the cadence of their acquisition of handsets effects their point of view. I mentioned reviewers often do get product at discount and for free because I used to work flacking and pitching and we did it all the time.I did not state ever that he was shaping his opinion do to favor from Palm. Never. My comment specifically noted that the fact that reviewers have new handsets all the time means they may not see the commitment and true cost other buyers are incurring.
    My point was for most of us this is a two year thing which is part of a phone purchase price + contract costs -- which is likely thousands of dollars even if the phone is free.
    Mal clarified that he did not receive a review or promotional 800w but bought it like the rest of, including singing a new contract. So he is in the same boat as all of us.
    On short, despite not agreeing with the way I feel he dismissed my legitimate concerns on the board, I am going to strongly recommend this 30 day review by Mal to anyone considering buying the 800W. It is really very well done.
  • Actually, the issue isn't whether folks are trashing the 800w inappropriately, or whether others are defending it inappropriately. Its about whether that same argument has to occur in every single thread, over and over and over.
    If everyone can stipulate that (a) some folks don't like the battery life, (b) GPS isn't standalone, (c) others have issues with crackling and/or BT, and STOP complaining in every thread, I think we'd have a much more pleasant board.
    You make a good point. I agree. But the repetion occured in both directions. I and others would mention the GPS standalone thread that it was not function as standalone as the term is properly used, and we would get people saying to the effect : "it's working" "I tested it this way and that and it works", "I tried google maps and it works great" and confusing themselves and others when the fact is those of us who know the terminology and function know it doesn't. The title of the thread was about 800w gps independent of sprint's cdma and those of us trying to express concern over this and get some pressure on palm kept having people who were not accurately testing saying there was not problem. Then we had people saying to the affect: "well you should have returned it when you could" when the point was to clarify the situation hnd pres palm to issue a fix.
    The battery is a subjective issue. but when people expressed dismay at their real world results, some of the discussions were about helpful fixes, and others were dismissive and still are.
  • Everyone, agree to disagree!
    A review is someone's opinion about what they experienced or see. If you can do a better review, send an application to T/C's editor.
    When a poster points to the review and questions the review, it is fine. Discuss the merits of the review not the poster. If you choose to say the poster is bias or even imply or suggest, you are attacking the poster. If you say the review is bias, I will leave you alone but be able to prove your point as other users will get back to your point.
    I will closed this thread on the next mention of another poster's name.
  • [COLOR=black]Back to the issue folks. It's good but not perfect. I've stayed with my 700wx based on form, style, keyboard, and battery life. Palm dropped the ball in 2 of these areas. A. the battery life which is just a dream on the 700wx, and style. When the 700w(x) came out my friends would comment "That's a nice looking phone." Let's face it the new treo looks ok, but really in comparison to what's out there, is just plain fugly. I mean if they had even come close to the image leaked in Bill Gates key not speech it would have at least passed in this department. Or at least slapped a little silver cap where the carrier logo is. I?m even thinking about making a do-it-yourself-kit (silver cap, uber thin silver frame around screen). Other than the software bugs getting fixed, at least Palm should come out with the Charcoal Black (originally though to be) or the Dark Blue that was seen in the leaked slide show images. Either would be a step up IMHO. I would have bought one by now, but am actually waiting / hoping Palm will offer some color choices before the end of the year. The grey is just too ugly for me for a $500+ device. But technically (other than battery and stand alone GPS), keyboard, and spec wise meets my needs. Ah, looks like it's going to be me and the future X. Shhhh..., don't tell my treo 700wx I just gave her some visual improvements to the eyes (via software upgrades), she thinks she's sticking around for a while ;) [/COLOR]
  • The lack of battery life and the horrible earpiece clarity were two big reasons why all of mine got returned. Sprint keeps swapping them out and they keep not being worth keeping.
  • Haha...that's odd...most of us weren't fond of the leaked pictures.
    I would love a black one, though.
    You realize it's not gray, though, right? It's blue. The 700wx was sort of a grayish blue, but the 800w is straight up blue.
  • If you're talking about outdoors, try turning the device to face the sun straight on. The 800w is more reflective than most transflective screens, and looks amazing in direct sunlight with no backlight at all.
    I think Jeff makes an excellent point here. The intuitive thing to do is shield the screen from the sun with your body or hand. I don't know about anyone else's habits, but I was doing that in the bright sun with poor results. But the reflective characteristics of the 800w screen, as Jeff points out, make it better to let the sun hit the screen.
  • ok. i sucked in by the blackberry curve. the treo was a very good windows device but the curve fit my needs a lot more than the 800w did.